Soil - Hydro - 2400w Led - 2000w HPS - 8 Strains - 1 GPW+

[Graham Perwat]

Re: Blue Planet Nutrients-Soil-Hydro-2400w Led-2000w Hps-8 Strains-1 GPW+

Looking great Jon. I wouldn't write off the led's yet:

1. The name of the game for you is weight. The led's may look smaller but their density might make up some of the difference at harvest time.
2. Each led panel only uses 60% of the power that a 1000w hps uses. Factoring in the extra cost of cooling a room full of hps bulbs might negate some of the yield gains.
3. Might it be possible that the position of the hps plants is contributing to the size differences? Perhaps they're getting a slightly larger volume of nutes or are draining faster?

Just a few thoughts to consider...

 

[jon705]

Re: Blue Planet Nutrients-Soil-Hydro-2400w Led-2000w Hps-8 Strains-1 GPW+

Hey Bass thanks for stopping by bro, im not sure what im doing yet, how much water would a 24 bucket system use, ive read its somewhere around 150-200 gallons.im on a well here, its a good one but between a system like that and a 4 x 8 table with a 60 gallon res I think I might be pushing my luck lol..My system runs on 45 gallons right now and if I make it a 24 site maybe 65-70 gallons.

 

[ronnie6690]

Re: Blue Planet Nutrients-Soil-Hydro-2400w Led-2000w Hps-8 Strains-1 GPW+

how far from the canopy are your led's? it looks to me like the hps's are closer to the canopy than the led's. i know your led manufacture said to start a 48" and let the plants grow up to the lights. did you get any par ratings of your lights at different distances? most 3w diode grow lights sweet spot is 18". i've noticed that the colas in my grow that are closest to my new light with the 10w cree diodes are much bigger that the others. i think the difference has to do with light intensity. a 1000w hps par rating is about 1200-1400 um/s at 24" above the canopy. my leds need to be 18" to match that. curious to know the par ratings of your led's.

looking great as always

 

[jon705]

Re: Blue Planet Nutrients-Soil-Hydro-2400w Led-2000w Hps-8 Strains-1 GPW+

Looking great Jon. I wouldn't write off the led's yet:

1. The name of the game for you is weight. The led's may look smaller but their density might make up some of the difference at harvest time.
2. Each led panel only uses 60% of the power that a 1000w hps uses. Factoring in the extra cost of cooling a room full of hps bulbs might negate some of the yield gains.
3. Might it be possible that the position of the hps plants is contributing to the size differences? Perhaps they're getting a slightly larger volume of nutes or are draining faster?

Just a few thoughts to consider...

yep, like I said in the vid I wont know for sure until harvest. Im not having any drainage issues at all this round, i went back to continuous drip this round and even the last buckets on each string only have a couple of inches of solution in them.Its not just yield either, I have been catering to the led side for the whole grow, you use less nutes with led's than hps, the hps plants could take more nutes so in theory they could be even bigger than they are right now, also they are alot easier to keep happy, they arent showing the calcium def the led plants are. adding those 2 1000w lights has only raised my hydro bill 90 bucks a month, at 1gpw thats almost 4.5 pds, well worth the extra hydro imo.When i bought these lights I bought into the descrition that said they were direct replacements for 1000w hps, so far im not seeing it, im sure they will do better once I have the ro system but then again so will the hps plants.I dont hate them I think they work great, but for a larger scale comercial set up I dont think the extra savings in hydro will make up for what you loose in yield...but we shall see

 

[mcloadie]

Re: Blue Planet Nutrients-Soil-Hydro-2400w Led-2000w Hps-8 Strains-1 GPW+

Thanks Mc, I spend alot of time in there just walking around inspecting nugs lol...I cant seem to keep my eyes off of them

IMHO, all that energy is goin in your stuff too, energy is a trip, so much unpublished info, we just have to learn to use it, AND rely on it!

 

[jon705]

Re: Blue Planet Nutrients-Soil-Hydro-2400w Led-2000w Hps-8 Strains-1 GPW+

how far from the canopy are your led's? it looks to me like the hps's are closer to the canopy than the led's. i know your led manufacture said to start a 48" and let the plants grow up to the lights. did you get any par ratings of your lights at different distances? most 3w diode grow lights sweet spot is 18". i've noticed that the colas in my grow that are closest to my new light with the 10w cree diodes are much bigger that the others. i think the difference has to do with light intensity. a 1000w hps par rating is about 1200-1400 um/s at 24" above the canopy. my leds need to be 18" to match that. curious to know the par ratings of your led's.They are right where they are suposed to be

looking great as always

these are helios diodes bro, next best thing to cree.These lights put out 800 umols at 28 inches and cover a 52 x 52 area, so they have a bigger core footprint than a 1000w hps. a 1000w hps has a 4x4 core footprint at 14 inches from the canopy with 1200 umols. The ideal umols for a flowering plant is 800-1000 umols.My led's are 24 inches from the canopy so right around 1000 umols.

 

[ronnie6690]

Re: Blue Planet Nutrients-Soil-Hydro-2400w Led-2000w Hps-8 Strains-1 GPW+

i would lower the leds to 18" . the sun can actually register at 2000 um/s in some areas , during certain times of year. and sunlight is what we strive to recreate inside our grow rooms. if your hps plants are getting 1200um/s and led's are only a 1000um/s it only makes sense that the plants getting the higher par rates has the bigger buds. with led's we try to match hps par ratings using less energy. i guess a true test would be hps and led at distances to match par ratings.

love your journal cutting edge stuff here, always very interesting stuff.

 

[jon705]

Re: Blue Planet Nutrients-Soil-Hydro-2400w Led-2000w Hps-8 Strains-1 GPW+

Thanks Ronnie,my hps are 16 inches from the canopy give or take so they are all getting pretty close to the same par..I think lol...

 

[ronnie6690]

Re: Blue Planet Nutrients-Soil-Hydro-2400w Led-2000w Hps-8 Strains-1 GPW+

Thanks Ronnie,my hps are 16 inches from the canopy give or take so they are all getting pretty close to the same par..I think lol...

you could lower one led panel to 18" and see if you get a growth rate increase. i know i say this not even knowing what you have to go through to move one of those lights lol. i guess i just dont want to see the led's get their butts kicked. someone send jon a par meter cause i dont think a 1000w hps at 16" is the same par as 3w leds at 24".

so glad you take the time to share all this wonderful info with all of us. +reps your the man!

 

[jon705]

Re: Blue Planet Nutrients-Soil-Hydro-2400w Led-2000w Hps-8 Strains-1 GPW+

heres a good comparison Ronnie, its a different brand but gives us a good idea.That light has 5 w chips but its a much smaller fixture than mine.It blows away Mh and HPS for output
LED Grow Light Testing GrowLight Versus a 400 & 600 Watt HPS LED Grow Lights Lamps LED Garden - YouTube

 

[fish cake]

Re: Blue Planet Nutrients-Soil-Hydro-2400w Led-2000w Hps-8 Strains-1 GPW+

Howdy jon and good weed to you sir!
had a dog awhile back. it would just lay by me all the time.
Man one day it started to smell so I gave it a bath. the next day he was there lying by me and geeze I thought whats that smell.
the dog of course. man for a week straight I would give that dog a bath, Everyday!
so finally I took him to the vets and asked "whats wrong with him?"
the vet said "he was dead"

 

[jon705]

Re: Blue Planet Nutrients-Soil-Hydro-2400w Led-2000w Hps-8 Strains-1 GPW+

Lmao Fishy! thanks bro I needed a good laugh

 

[ronnie6690]

Re: Blue Planet Nutrients-Soil-Hydro-2400w Led-2000w Hps-8 Strains-1 GPW+

this led light has 3w diodes but also each diodes has a lens to multiply par output and light intensity.

 

[jon705]

Re: Blue Planet Nutrients-Soil-Hydro-2400w Led-2000w Hps-8 Strains-1 GPW+

this led light has 3w diodes but also each diodes has a lens to multiply par output and light intensity.

Yep pretty much every led light manufacture puts out stuff like that claiming they compare including mine but other than sponspored vids have you found ones that actually do compare? maybe I just havent gotten the hang of growing with them, who knows bro.ive grown with hps for years so I really know what im doing with them, these led's are still very new to me

 

[ronnie6690]

Re: Blue Planet Nutrients-Soil-Hydro-2400w Led-2000w Hps-8 Strains-1 GPW+

i have faith in you. if anyone can figure it out i think you can. i just think its hard to compare any two lights at different distances.

 

[Green Knight]

Re: Blue Planet Nutrients-Soil-Hydro-2400w Led-2000w Hps-8 Strains-1 GPW+

Wicked video Jon.... sad about the led though man!! You're getting my cfl v led experience, but with the led the KO! Will be great to see the bb led vs hps though!

What I'm finding really interesting is the led plants having browner pistils, whilst the hps' are all still white, and the led seems to get more deficiencies like calmag etc. Why?
The cfl thing seems obvious now, they're just energy saving lightbulbs really, and they're just a bit flacid. (I don't know about Canada and the rest of the world, but in the UK we've had this massive shift away from proper lightbulbs to energy saving.... you walk into a room and turn the light on, and then have to stand still for 5 minutes whilst it warms up before you can see..... there's almost a black market in proper old school lightbulbs).
It seems like the led plants are ageing faster and using more nutes than the hps; they seem to metabolise faster. The overall power / light intensity / umol / lumens etc etc seems to be much of a muchness in terms of growth rates, size etc with the led and hps, but the led manufacturers talk a lot about how the wavelengths are perfectly tailored to what the plants need, so are they just too efficient and the plant metabolises faster and has a shorter life? It will be really interesting to see how the trichs / harvest times compare.

I'm with Ronnie on the umol thing though and possibly getting the lights a bit closer. I read an article a couple of weeks ago which was really interesting- comparing different umol, temps and CO2. Ultimately 30C and 1500umol was the sweet spot (just veg admittedly), but you might be able to drop a few inches. I originally found the full PDF of the study and stupidly didn't save it. Haven't been able to access the full article tonight so here's a link to the abstract on PubMed, which you might be able to find a link to the Full Text article for the details (abstracts normally do the job though!) Photosynthetic response of Cannabis ... [Physiol Mol Biol Plants. 2008] - PubMed - NCBI

 

[Green Knight]

Re: Blue Planet Nutrients-Soil-Hydro-2400w Led-2000w Hps-8 Strains-1 GPW+

heres a good comparison Ronnie, its a different brand but gives us a good idea.That light has 5 w chips but its a much smaller fixture than mine.It blows away Mh and HPS for output
LED Grow Light Testing GrowLight Versus a 400 & 600 Watt HPS LED Grow Lights Lamps LED Garden - YouTube

Best video ever! Great comparison (and I love the attention to detail with the empty grow tents).

I never realised basil was such a big market though. I'm feeling very behind the curve and as much as I love 420 I'm now sold on basil, and I'm off to find some good vegetable/basil threads. That's where it's at apparently. Thanks for everything 420..... Baaaassssiiiiiiiilllll!!

 

[jon705]

Re: Blue Planet Nutrients-Soil-Hydro-2400w Led-2000w Hps-8 Strains-1 GPW+

Thanks for the link GK I ll check it out.I ll try the lights a little closewr next round, its not a small job to ajust the led's right now.The led plants use less nutes than the hps bro,I cant run the nutes full strength 75% seems to be the sweet spot but I keep getting defficiencies.Im just getting frustrated with them, maybe they arent as full spectrum as they claim. I rarely had deficiencies growing with hps, Im getting sick of always trying to figure out whats missing, seems like its one thing after another and yet the hps plants are doing great?

 

[Green Knight]

Re: Blue Planet Nutrients-Soil-Hydro-2400w Led-2000w Hps-8 Strains-1 GPW+

That seems weird; why do LEDs get deficiencies but also need less nutes?
If the hps are all good, but the led is showing deficiencies and they're on the same nutes, then the LEDs are using more of, or not taking up, that particular element/s. If they're using more of that particular element, then the led is potentially way better than the hps? Why's it using more of that nute, and can you supplement/increase? Sorry, just thinking out loud! Soggy....

 

[mcloadie]

Re: Blue Planet Nutrients-Soil-Hydro-2400w Led-2000w Hps-8 Strains-1 GPW+

That seems weird; why do LEDs get deficiencies but also need less nutes?
If the hps are all good, but the led is showing deficiencies and they're on the same nutes, then the LEDs are using more of, or not taking up, that particular element/s. If they're using more of that particular element, then the led is potentially way better than the hps? Why's it using more of that nute, and can you supplement/increase? Sorry, just thinking out loud! Soggy....

It's just a matter of fine tuning IMHO, and you jon are the master of fine tuning. I'll tell you one thing jon, The way you do things, if you DO come to conclusions about anything you use or used....I TRUST your judgement, I have watched you work this cannabis with passion, don't ever stop...+reps