Grape Ape & Golden Tiger Hit the Shower - DBHBB & 600W HPS - Winter 2016

[Major PITA]

Did I ever tell you guys how much you all ROCK!?
Sorry for the late replies. End-of-month is a little bit of hell for me. I have business interests that pull me away from when I have to close out the month.

Great recovery major.......yeah u will smoke all that GASS be those GTs are even finished..........it's good to see totally different strains run together....looking terrific....,

I think you are right. With the size of the Apes and the slow ride with the Tigers, it could happen. Mixing heavily dominant Indicas with pure Sativas is fun and interesting but probably not the best idea for efficient growing. Different heights, different feeding, different photoperiods, different veg and bloom cycles become difficult or impossible.

Damn. you're plants had a great week, Major.

The cage/pot it spot on. That'll keep the gophers out for sure. Looks ideal.

They really did PJ! Thanks for the comments. It means a lot.

Major, i'd do it soon.

TY Ziggy! It feels weird doing Cat after such a short time, but they do appear to be approaching that "Cat window".

Thanks for the photos and hope to see more as you post them.

Hi again CBD. Stick around. Plenty more pictures as things develop.

Major....do they "ship" well????.... the brownies my brotha! They look sooo good right now!
Oh , and about the CD with GASS...hold off , it won't be too late.It's far too early right now.
I like your outdoor pot idea...but i have some concerns/ideas/questions. Excellent idea for the cage.
Your plants have come along really nicely ...like all those very colour rich , lower small fans. Looking very healthy overall and will reward your patience. Cheers to ya Major.

Thanks, bro! I'm interested in your feedback. Lay it on me.

I just read back through the past month and got a nice perspective/timeline on how everything went - pretty cool! It's almost like a primer for a future grower with bum soil. I've been through the same thing a few times - just a bad batch for unknown reasons - but you get them into more soil and get a good shot of Transplant/Tea into them, and they straighten right out.

In your case, it worked out half great! Those Tigers are gonna be about as big as you'd want them! The Apes'll be small but they'll be potent.

Are you sure the Apes need Energy? They're pretty dark. Seeing the last pics, my instinct was to Brix the crap out them in this window. They're dark green and spiky and busy growing trichs. This would be a good time to get as much photosynthesis as possible out of the leaves. It' be doing 1/2 strength Brix every 4 days for a week or two, while watching for leaf fatigue. Then I'd give them Energy to help with that, and look for the Cat window. I've had some interesting results from going straight from Energy to Cat/Cat without the in between rest. Then I'll flush with the 1/4 Trans, and alternate with Energy/Tea til chop.

At least think about Brixing the Apes more often than weekly at this phase - they look like they're kinda explosive right now.

Wow Gray! You have no idea how much I appreciate you taking the time to give me such a detailed response!
You are spot on with your overview. I was a little bummed I didn't get to veg an extra couple of weeks, but now that I've seen the Tigers go crazy, I'm glad they were flipped when they were. The Apes would have loved that extra week or two, but...meh.

I think the GE they finally received (once only) 4 days ago, is responsible for the dark green of the Apes and some of the growth of the Tigers. They both get Brix when the lights come on tonight. I was going to do the full strength Brix once per week, but I'll take your advice and double up the sprays at 1/2 strength. I really need your understanding of what each kit ingredient does and when to use it to the best advantage. You should write a compendium for the HB Kit instructions.

Tigers for the Win! I don't know why I like that name so much, Golden Tiger. But the plant looks great too. As big as you could want it to be.
All the best, Cheers!

Edit: meant to add. Really great pictures fresh out of the shower. I love the deep green-bushy-ness of the Apes and the thin leaves on the Golden Tiger really sweet.

Thanks Keltic! It is an amazing contrast. I'd like to try one of each this summer to see what "big" really looks like for them.

 

[Duggan]

Mornin Major...ya with your outside pot idea. Think about building bottoms for them and then sitting them on 3/4 inch plywood (same size as cage) then bolt 4-6 larger casters on the bottom of the plywood....makes it pretty cool to be able to move them around if you choose cuz as ya know , after the soil goes in them , your out of luck for moving them AT ALL! Another thought too. the cages are very unstable with out stiff sides and may have a tendancy to warp and or get all mis shapen once all the weight gets in them...I would prolly put wire supports across the tops in two spots,...know what I mean? just to hold them in a circle a little better. You should also line the cages with landscaping cloth to keep everything in place and to block out the light.That's it Major....just a few thoughts for ya ...hope that's OK pal! Cheers eh!

 

[Major PITA]

Hey dugg-
I won't be moving these once the soil goes in. I want to leave the bottoms unobstructed so they drain completely and so the roots can keep on growing if they need/want.
To keep them stable, my plan is to use scrap rebar pieces, or wooden stakes. I think if I pound 4 pieces into the ground, around the outside of each cage, it will hold them. I'll tie the cages to the stakes with tie wire to fully lock them into shape and position.
Thanks & cheers, bro!

 

[NematodeNate]

Hey major, so those big pots aren't going in the ground? Like last year?

 

[Duggan]

Hey dugg-
I won't be moving these once the soil goes in. I want to leave the bottoms unobstructed so they drain completely and so the roots can keep on growing if they need/want.
To keep them stable, my plan is to use scrap rebar pieces, or wooden stakes. I think if I pound 4 pieces into the ground, around the outside of each cage, it will hold them. I'll tie the cages to the stakes with tie wire to fully lock them into shape and position.
Thanks & cheers, bro!

Ya Major....OK...now i know your plan....it sounds very good and you've put some good thought into it and should work just fine. It'l be cool to see just how far the roots exit the pots eh!! At 75 gal's each i suspect your plant size and yield will be fantastic....i envy you my brotha....i would love to be able to grow some monsters outside....will they be in "Kit" soil pal? or your own blend?

 

[Major PITA]

Hey major, so those big pots aren't going in the ground? Like last year?

Excellent question. Honestly, I'm not sure. I've thought about doing it both ways. Being the lazy SOB I am, I'd rather not dig them in - at least not completely. If anyone has feedback on leaving them mostly "up" or mostly "down", I'd love the feedback. The roots could extend farther out if buried them, but I also think this might be enough soil to keep the plants very happy and would allow for better drainage and aeration if they were above ground - like a raised bed. Any thoughts either way?

Ya Major....OK...now i know your plan....it sounds very good and you've put some good thought into it and should work just fine. It'l be cool to see just how far the roots exit the pots eh!! At 75 gal's each i suspect your plant size and yield will be fantastic....i envy you my brotha....i would love to be able to grow some monsters outside....will they be in "Kit" soil pal? or your own blend?

This will be the amended soil I've been cooking ... I hope. I love "the Kit", but don't want to buy enough bulk to build 300-400 gallons of soil. I also enjoy the challenge and the learning that comes from DIY.

This could be a total fail. If so, I'll learn and do better next time. This is the way I've always worked. I don't like being reliant on others for anything - and that includes growing. I built our bridge over the creek, and did a full frame-off restoration on my wife's '40 French car. I built our house and garage and I built a lot of our furniture. Do and learn. It is not necessarily better, or cheaper, but the experience is invaluable, and I love it.

I want to be able to grow, understand what is happening, and why. I think building my own soil and making mistakes is the best path to knowledge (for me). I'll still use the high brix method for growing but after checking into getting our summer garden "brixed", I decided to go another direction. It might be a great decision. It might be a disaster.

 

[Graytail]

Excellent question. Honestly, I'm not sure. I've thought about doing it both ways. Being the lazy SOB I am, I'd rather not dig them in - at least not completely. If anyone has feedback on leaving them mostly "up" or mostly "down", I'd love the feedback. The roots could extend farther out if buried them, but I also think this might be enough soil to keep the plants very happy and would allow for better drainage and aeration if they were above ground - like a raised bed. Any thoughts either way?

I bet there's a difference in lateral roots and deep roots, and what they uptake. It would make sense that lateral roots would be getting the most nutrition, wouldn't it, since in nature the first few inches of soil are the most fertile ... ?

So, if you keep them raised, you can control the nutrient uptake better, and the bottom roots can invade the native soil for moisture.

 

[Major PITA]

I bet there's a difference in lateral roots and deep roots, and what they uptake. It would make sense that lateral roots would be getting the most nutrition, wouldn't it, since in nature the first few inches of soil are the most fertile ... ?

So, if you keep them raised, you can control the nutrient uptake better, and the bottom roots can invade the native soil for moisture.

You bet. I could see the difference in the roots from last summer's grow. The laterals look to me like they do the heavy lifting for feeding. They also tend to stay mostly in the top 12", or so. On the other hand, they like to grow as big as the canopy. Even after fighting through a softpot, and into unamended soil that didn't receive a drench or nutrients (or even consistent watering), some of the lateral roots were about 4' long. It comes down to the compromise of size vs. control.

 

[Duggan]

Excellent question. Honestly, I'm not sure. I've thought about doing it both ways. Being the lazy SOB I am, I'd rather not dig them in - at least not completely. If anyone has feedback on leaving them mostly "up" or mostly "down", I'd love the feedback. The roots could extend farther out if buried them, but I also think this might be enough soil to keep the plants very happy and would allow for better drainage and aeration if they were above ground - like a raised bed. Any thoughts either way?


This will be the amended soil I've been cooking ... I hope. I love "the Kit", but don't want to buy enough bulk to build 300-400 gallons of soil. I also enjoy the challenge and the learning that comes from DIY.

This could be a total fail. If so, I'll learn and do better next time. This is the way I've always worked. I don't like being reliant on others for anything - and that includes growing. I built our bridge over the creek, and did a full frame-off restoration on my wife's '40 French car. I built our house and garage and I built a lot of our furniture. Do and learn. It is not necessarily better, or cheaper, but the experience is invaluable, and I love it.

I want to be able to grow, understand what is happening, and why. I think building my own soil and making mistakes is the best path to knowledge (for me). I'll still use the high brix method for growing but after checking into getting our summer garden "brixed", I decided to go another direction. It might be a great decision. It might be a disaster.

Well, i highly doubt a disaster Major....thanks for letting me(us) know you a little better. From what you've said you've accomplished at your place ...the O/D stuff will all be fine. And about the pots...i would leave them above ground as Gray said , as well. That's an awefull lot of soil for one plant. I can't wait to see the results....fingers crossed bud! You'le be using a ladder to tend to them....Yeepa!Have an awesome night Major!

I bet there's a difference in lateral roots and deep roots, and what they uptake. It would make sense that lateral roots would be getting the most nutrition, wouldn't it, since in nature the first few inches of soil are the most fertile ... ?

So, if you keep them raised, you can control the nutrient uptake better, and the bottom roots can invade the native soil for moisture.

Sounds good to me Gray....the roots in those "cage pots" will "air-prune" all thru the grow and get really fiberous, throughout the whole pot. The main center root , as you said will seek out moisture....wherever it is. Gonna be a hoot watchin Major's fun this summer....cheers Gray, Major and Gang...

 

[SmokeyMcFly]

I can't tell you just how jealous I am of those fucking pots

I like GT and Duggans logic, maybe sink them a couple inches so they have good contact with the ground so it gets anchored a bit quicker. No idea if it's necessary or even helpful. I guess it probably depends on the ground level and the bottoms of your pots.

 

[DrZiggy]

major, have you discussed with Doc, testing your soil and getting the soil amended to to be HB instead of building it out of promix?

 

[Cannatard]

I like your thinking Major! Im the same when it comes to "thinking on the fly". I find you learn more valuable lessons that way. Now don't get me wrong, I'll always use Docs kit for cannabis but when it comes to food, ill do what I feel is best for the garden. Anything ive grown in my gardens has been brix tested and although I didnt get the highest numbers, everything still tasted fantastic! Keep up the adventurous spirit bro, It's how we get better!

 

[Major PITA]

I can't tell you just how jealous I am of those fucking pots

I like GT and Duggans logic, maybe sink them a couple inches so they have good contact with the ground so it gets anchored a bit quicker. No idea if it's necessary or even helpful. I guess it probably depends on the ground level and the bottoms of your pots.

I think something like your idea is where I'll end up. I may try half up / half buried. That will probably keep them stable so I won't need to stake them to hold their shape. It would still allow for some root pruning but also help keep the roots cooler when we hit 100 degrees.

major, have you discussed with Doc, testing your soil and getting the soil amended to to be HB instead of building it out of promix?

Not exactly. Doc mentioned it and I know it is an option. Part of the fun I have in growing is trying "stuff". If I send off soil and buy the recommended ingredients, I will learn very little and not get to experiment at all. I don't expect my first attempt to work well, if at all, but I'll keep trying.

I like your thinking Major! Im the same when it comes to "thinking on the fly". I find you learn more valuable lessons that way. Now don't get me wrong, I'll always use Docs kit for cannabis but when it comes to food, ill do what I feel is best for the garden. Anything ive grown in my gardens has been brix tested and although I didnt get the highest numbers, everything still tasted fantastic! Keep up the adventurous spirit bro, It's how we get better!

man.
I've never had a green thumb. Our veggie garden turned out pretty good last summer - better than any year in the past. My wife and I still have lots of room for improvement in all our growing, but that's part of the fun. If I live long enough I might even figure out a few things.

 

[Cannatard]

Dang, are we all a bunch of old farts or what? Sure seems that way lmao!

 

[DrZiggy]

"...Part of the fun I have in growing is trying "stuff". .."

I hear you loud and clear, Major..

 

[ShiggityFlip]

If I grow outdoors again I am making pots just like yours. Pure genius! GTs are just crazy! they will start filling in soon but they are kinda freakish beautiful even now!

 

[PeeJay]

Above or below? Why not a hybrid? Excavate a 4" deep square around 72" wide on all sides. In the middle of that square dig down ~ 16 more inches to fit the cage. Line the perimeter with cinder block. The blocks are 8" high. Set the cage in the hole and it's 24" depth will make it roughly even with the top of the blocks. Fill the whole shebang with amended soil.

Lateral 8" depth of bioactive soil. 24" depth at the core. 4" raised bed. Mrs Horpedahl would be pleased.

 

[Rifleman]

I'm so envious of you doing outdoor grows. The only chance of that around here is in the middle of Shitty Pine Forest with its three inches of Fkn Red Clay topsoil.

 

[B A R]

I'm always introduced to new theories and ideas on your threads Pita. Great convo over the last 3 pages.

 

[Major PITA]

I'm always introduced to new theories and ideas on your threads Pita. Great convo over the last 3 pages.

B A R, have you started your HB grow yet? Cooking some soil?