The Gee Spot - You Finally Found It

[Gee64]

Then my suspicion is correct. Interesting. It seems like a great deal of general information out there is half right. They understand something is occurring, just not exactly what, and we both know that’s not acceptable to me

This may be due to your word choice but you said hormones are constantly growing in the tips. That doesn’t sound right to me. I thought the plant produces the hormones it needs as it needs them then sends them. For some reason I have this image that the hormones are produced right around the ground line between above and below ground.

Am I misunderstanding the process or is it a lost in translation moment?

Also just to add a little more information on this topic. These cells are what our plants are made of. Just like us being made of trillions of little cells all working together. The nutrients that we provide to our environments/plants are used by the plant to create these cells and work the machinery inside the plant. Like Gee said about calcium basically being the wiring. For instance potassium is used in transpiration. It is used by the plant to open and close the stomata. This is why people who grow in really dry environments see a lot of need for K. The plant is breathing so hard and fast it’s using increased amounts of K. With such an important job it’s not surprising K is a macronutrient

Teaming with nutrients is a wonderful book to check out on this topic. It goes into pretty thorough detail about each of the 17 required nutrients we use as gardeners in a plain speak way with examples and images

I should have said hormones keep directing growth to the tips.

I was always under the impression plants could make hormones anywhere anytime, if they signal a cell to do so, but to be honest I don't know.

Either way if you damage a plant a hormone response occurs causing a reaction. Many reactions actually.

 

[Gee64]

Ok I was right and wrong about the hormones. There’s multiple types that occur in multiple places at once but the ones responsible for root and shoot growth are synthesized in the areas they’re responsible for. So this means topping also deletes hormones. Just like with damaged leaves, I find it difficult to willingly remove stuff the plant has expended energy and resources on. Not sure what that’s about, probably some weird childhood memory I’ve locked up

I don't top because I think its better for the plant. I top because I grow sativas and no matter how I train, an 11 foot sativa won't fit and flower in an 8 foot tent. Not 4 of them. I dont normally top clones.

 

[Carmen Ray]

I don't top because I think its better for the plant. I top because I grow sativas and no matter how I train, an 11 foot sativa won't fit and flower in an 8 foot tent. Not 4 of them. I dont normally top clones.

I'm guessing you would not top autos? I have an auto run coming up soon and I am trying to decide how I will train this time. Last time I grew them in quads but I feel that I wasted potential by growing quads. I grew two autos last year and do you think I can remember how I trained them now (head shaking from side to side)! Either way, there was room for improvement.

 

[Gee64]

I'm guessing you would not top autos? I have an auto run coming up soon and I am trying to decide how I will train this time. Last time I grew them in quads but I feel that I wasted potential by growing quads. I grew two autos last year and do you think I can remember how I trained them now (head shaking from side to side)! Either way, there was room for improvement.

I have never grown an auto Carmen, Sorry. Anyone here grow auto's?

 

[Gee64]

I yanked the last 2 from the 12/12 experiment to disect the rootballs. This was growing in the perlite.

Thats a rooty cup . Sorry seedling. Thank you for transporting my soil nutrients to my worm farm.

Heres the other one. Its roots stayed in the cup and the rootball was different.

And a wanderer almost back to the farm.

They were both 36 days old.

 

[Gee64]

Azi how you coming on the 12/12?

 

[Azimuth]

Azi how you coming on the 12/12?

Today is Day 21, and the 5th node is just beginning to rise up. This should be the start of alternating nodes and sexual maturity, so hopefully I'll know soon, but nothing to report yet.

 

[Gee64]

Today is Day 21, and the 5th node is just beginning to rise up. This should be the start of alternating nodes and sexual maturity, so hopefully I'll know soon, but nothing to report yet.

I hope it works. Seeing it twice would be good. It should.

 

[Azimuth]

Normally i would top it soon to start my quad, but I'll let it go until I see sex, hopefully over the next week or so.

 

[Gee64]

Normally i would top it soon to start my quad, but I'll let it go until I see sex, hopefully over the next week or so.

How tall is it? What size of pot are you in?

 

[Azimuth]

Let's revisit the leaves vs. coco thing as I'm still a bit hung up on that aspect.

Knowing from your research that raw coco is the top choice for raw carbon in the mix, how would you rate "powdered" leaves in comparison, on a scale of 1-10, 1 being a total disaster almost certainly leading to deficiencies and other problems, to 10 being mostly comparable?

One of the important goals of my grow is to source most of what I need locally, preferably from my backyard, and transporting coco half way around the world runs counter to that ethic.

I'll use the coco if it is that materially better, but I'd rather use leaves run through a blender for the carbon input, and get all of the minerals from the leaves as part of the process.

 

[Gee64]

Here is one of the rootballs cut in half and the loose soil shaken out.

 

[Azimuth]

How tall is it? What size of pot are you in?

It's in a 9oz solo SIP. I'll measure tomorrow but I'd say 5-6" tall. I'm keeping it pretty close to the lights to keep the stretch down as much as possible.

 

[Azimuth]

Here is one of the rootballs cut in half and the loose soil shaken out.

Interesting. That's a much longer tap root than I get in my SIPs. With those, the tap root stops and branches out within the first couple of inches and they all morph into the fine feeder roots.

 

[Gee64]

Let's revisit the leaves vs. coco thing as I'm still a bit hung up on that aspect.

Knowing from your research that raw coco is the top choice for raw carbon in the mix, how would you rate "powdered" leaves in comparison, on a scale of 1-10, 1 being a total disaster almost certainly leading to deficiencies and other problems, to 10 being mostly comparable?

One of the important goals of my grow is to source most of what I need locally, preferably from my backyard, and transporting coco half way around the world runs counter to that ethic.

I'll use the coco if it is that materially better, but I'd rather use leaves run through a blender for the carbon input, and get all of the minerals from the leaves as part of the process.

If you were to use ground leaves similar in texture to coco that had NOT started to compost yet, you could use them with pretty good success leading to very good success later in the grow as they are still dense so slow release.

If you mixed fully finished leaf mold with ewc and added that together with the ground leaves and perlite, you would be very successful and rebuildable with that soil.

Also adding your ammendments thru the leaf mold or ewc process to fortify the soil, basically your meals, calciums, and minerals.

I would do it in the ewc process but it may work very well in the leaf mold process.

Finished carbon, fresh carbon, composted organic matter, and minerals

 

[Gee64]

Here is the other one. It was a pad of roots on the bottom, woven walls, a pad of roots on top, and uneaten soil in the center.

Bottom quarter, next quarter, 3rd quarter, and top.

Here is the top pad of roots. The bottom was almost the same in size but more smooth like water roots.

 

[Azimuth]

If you were to use ground leaves similar in texture to coco that had NOT started to compost yet, you could use them with pretty good success leading to very good success later in the grow as they are still dense so slow release.

If you mixed fully finished leaf mold with ewc and added that together with the ground leaves and perlite, you would be very successful and rebuildable with that soil.

Also adding your ammendments thru the leaf mold or ewc process to fortify the soil, basically your meals, calciums, and minerals.

I would do it in the ewc process but it may work very well in the leaf mold process.

Finished carbon, fresh carbon, composted organic matter, and minerals

Ok, great. That's what I'll do. I'd like to add some thermophilic compost as part of the mix but won't have any available for a few months, but I can certainly substitute finished leaf mold for that part now. I don't have all that much finished leaf mold, but I do have some.

And the raw leaves are fresh, dried leaves from last fall that have not been allowed to decompose. Those are what I'm proposing that I grind down for the raw carbon piece.

 

[Gee64]

Sorry Azi, I rate them a 10 but.... If thats your only raw carbon on your 1st grow you may starve in the beginning. Once its recycled it will be primo when mixed with new raw carbon but right now it will take a bit to get rolling. Cut it with 25% coco on the 1st cycle of the soil. If it still lags give it a dose of molasses. Once the microbes get munching on it it will become very good.

 

[Azimuth]

Sorry Azi, I rate them a 10 but.... If thats your only raw carbon on your 1st grow you may starve in the beginning. Once its recycled it will be primo when mixed with new raw carbon but right now it will take a bit to get rolling. Cut it with 25% coco on the 1st cycle of the soil. If it still lags give it a dose of molasses. Once the microbes get munching on it it will become very good.

Ok, that's a compromise I can live with. I'm planning on following through on the strain specific soils, so I'll mix them that way for the next couple of plants.

 

[Gee64]

Ok, that's a compromise I can live with. I'm planning on following through on the strain specific soils, so I'll mix them that way for the next couple of plants.

Leaves generally last more than 3-5 months so on grow #2 and beyond they will bridge the gap until fresh carbon starts to get broken down. Another reason to use one part used soil.