SubCool Supersoil In SIPs With EWC, CBD Autos For Aspergers

[cbdhemp808]

Another possible solution... rinse the soil with lots of water. Flush it!

 

[CBDMed]

Another possible solution... rinse the soil with lots of water. Flush it!

Ok, well, I decided to Google it. After much reading I think maybe possibly I definitely *might* have learned a few things. And now we will see if any of them are good advice (Because it isn't, always.)

I am paraphrasing, but if I understood correctly, it seems like the drift I was getting is that cooking supersoil is a lot like aging wine. You do not technically absolutely *need* to age wine a long time, but that if you do it right, it can make it a whole lot better, because "aged cooked hot soil" will not burn young seedlings like "young cooked hot soil".
In other words, soil that is cooked a long time "burns less", and tastes better.
Subcool recommends a minimum of 6 weeks, but there was some consensus that longer is better, with 6 months being a suggested ideal amount of time.

Several authors said that if you mix it hot, just cook it longer. For example, soil that is "too hot" and burns at 1-1/2 months may be just fine at 3 months, and even better at 6 months. That is to say that if I understood correctly, they did not seem to think that "too hot" was a problem, so long as you cooked it long enough.
That all sounds good to me, because that way, even if it hypothetically is 150% strength, I just have to cook it 6 months, and then no worries--and I have four more supersoil buckets ahead of this one, so probably we are talking more like a year or two of cooking time.

So I guess I will mix it up like normal, like you suggested at first. Thanks.



EDIT: also, they said that another way to bring down hot soil is to add worms.
Also, they said that cooked rice could help speed up a cooking (???)

One guy adds cheap dog food for corn-based P
Another guy recommended barley malt to help the microbes.
They all seemed to think that Recharge once a week or so was a good idea.

 

[cbdhemp808]

The whole concept of "cooking" is foreign to me. I think all the ingredients I use in my soil mix are ready to go, no need to wait for anything to happen. I use 2 gal fresh worm castings w/ a few worms per about 20 gal of soil (wheelbarrow capacity for mixing). The worm castings are full of microbes, enzymes, fulvic acid, humic acid, etc.

I view the worm castings as the biological supercharger to make the soil nutrients available to the roots.

Worm bins are super easy to set up. I have 3 going right now, and use coir as the medium. I give them kitchen scraps minus the "hard" stuff that doesn't break down easily. The hardest part of worm bins is getting the worms... red wiggler type, not "earthworms".

What people call "burning" means too much nitrogen, but can also mean too much NPK. If you want to get back to a base soil mix, from your recycled soil with unknown NPK, you could put the soil in some kind of large pot, trash can, etc, and flush it with lots of water.

 

[CBDMed]

The whole concept of "cooking" is foreign to me.

Well, I have maybe only a dozen cannabis grow, maybe five or so with super soil. So I don't really know that much. And for full disclosure, I do not think I would use the term "cooking".
I tried to use the term "fermenting" or "aging" about a year ago, and everyone corrected me, because "cooking" is the established term. (Ok.)

I'm not sure what term you use for your normal outdoor garden "tomatoes and turnips" yard waste recycling compost pile (but I think it is the same process of breaking down organic matter through heat and oxygen (basically "rotting" or "rusting".)
I do not know much, but I do know that when I mix the supersoil ingredients, and then add some myco water to start the "cooking", I know that the temperature does raise quite a little bit. (It feels very warm to a bare hand after a couple of weeks. And it continues to feel hot for maybe six weeks, maybe eight weeks.)
And I'm told that when the soil is "cooking" (or fermenting) like that, it is using all the oxyge--so if you try to plant then, it is not nearly as good, because the rotting/cooking/fermenting/whatever you want to call it process is using all of the oxygen, and is generating extra heat for the roots.
At least that is what I think I might know after reading some.

I think all the ingredients I use in my soil mix are ready to go, no need to wait for anything to happen.

Ok.
That might well be the case.
I know that in my case, it asks for bloodmeal, and it's probably dead McDonald's cows or something. But I know that when I "cook" it (i.e., ferment it), it does get pretty hot.

I use 2 gal fresh worm castings w/ a few worms per about 20 gal of soil (wheelbarrow capacity for mixing). The worm castings are full of microbes, enzymes, fulvic acid, humic acid, etc.

Yeah.
At least in his original formula, Subcool does seem to go a little crazy with his EWC. For 10 gallons of base soil he wants you to use anywhere between three and 6 gallons of EWC. (Clackamas Coot is similar.)
SC has a full forum following him and his threads, but with respect, he's not much help regarding recycling the soil, because he buys fresh bags every time, and sends the used stuff to his outdoor gardens.
In his defense, I think he's a full-time medical grower, so maybe he just passes the bag cost along to his consumers? (It seems like an easy fix.)

EDIT 2: but there are lots of people on the forums who do recondition their super soil. And they say that there's a lot of tolerance to it in terms of strength. THey say you have to learn some things, and it is important to get the balances right, and yes, you do need to be ready to supplement. However, they say that as long as the balance is right, if it's a little too strong or a little too weak, it's not really that big of a deal. The plant can adjust, just so long as the balances are right.

About rotting time, I don't really have time to get into it here, but they make a lot of ground plant meals here in country (alfalfa, corn protein meal, fish protein meal, clover meal, etc, anything livestock would eat.), and long-term (if I can never get a proper barn or workshop, maybe in a few years) I want to try to transitioning to mixing all of my own components from 50Lb sacks.
And when I do that, everything everything everything will need to be "cooked", so I'm just working ahead a little, trying to develop a good routine that works no matter what.

EDIT: at least that is what I HOPE I am doing.

I view the worm castings as the biological supercharger to make the soil nutrients available to the roots.

One man expressed the opinion on the other forums that the EWC was "one of the main components fueling the mix."
It sounds like the same concept (just that you expressed it better).

Worm bins are super easy to set up. I have 3 going right now, and use coir as the medium. I give them kitchen scraps minus the "hard" stuff that doesn't break down easily. The hardest part of worm bins is getting the worms... red wiggler type, not "earthworms".

Yes, I did enough research to know that there's a few different kinds of worms (red wiggler and blue African). I'm pretty sure you can get them locally in country no problem. (Anything agricultural you can typically get here. Maybe not the best quality, but you can find it.)
I had two small plastic worm bins I bought off the Internet, our farm manager wanted them, so I gave them to him.
Earthworm castings are dirt cheap on the Internet here. Eventually I want my own, if we ever get physically moved to the property. (Oy....) But for now I'm still in "traveler mode", living out of bags.
(It will be a blessing if I can ever get to my homestead…)

What people call "burning" means too much nitrogen, but can also mean too much NPK. If you want to get back to a base soil mix, from your recycled soil with unknown NPK, you could put the soil in some kind of large pot, trash can, etc, and flush it with lots of water.

Thanks.
This may well prove to be a mistake, but I'm gonna take your first advice, and I'm going to add the normal amount of nutrients to the soil, and then I'm just going to cook it along time.
And then after it has been cooked a long time, I will run a test batch with it, and see if it burns the girls. (I should be on clones at that point, so it will not be $15 USD per test.)
If it burns, I'm sure I can dilute it some, no problem.
But if it is well aged (well fermented) super soil, and it does not burn the girls, then it will probably be a rough adjustment, but I should be able to get back on track after that.

They all mentioned that there was a learning curve, so I am imagining that I will make some mistakes, and learn some things as I go, but several of the experienced super soil users seemed to think that hot soil was no problem, as long as you "cook" (ferment)) it long enough.

I hope that is helpful. I figure if it does not work, and the soil is too hot, then I can always dilute it.

 

[CBDMed]

Oy. Does anyone know a way to test between bonemeal, and rock dust?
I've got six UNLABELED packets of what look like bone meal flour, but I cannot guarantee that they are not rock flour, because the two look very similar.

Does anyone know a chemical test (so I can be sure)?
I put vinegar on samples of bone flour, and rock flour,, and they both fizzed!

If I had a blowtorch I could put it on samples of each, because rock should not burn.) But I do not have a blow torch.)

If no one knows it quick and simple reliable test, then I should just buy new, because it's like $2 a kilo or something (so like $15 or something, so it is not worth spending too much time on).

Thanks! I know it is only $15, but it's bugging me....

 

[InTheShed]

Bone meal should smell and rock dust probably doesn't?

Or compare the smell of the labeled bags to the unlabled ones since you have two bags of known quantities.

 

[CBDMed]

Bone meal should smell and rock dust probably doesn't?

Or compare the smell of the labeled bags to the unlabled ones since you have two bags of known quantities.

Great idea but they look, weigh, and taste about the same.
To me they look closer to bone meal, but I do not want to risk the grow

 

[InTheShed]

Great idea but they look, weigh, and taste about the same.
To me they look closer to bone meal, but I do not want to risk the grow

You didn't mention smell.

If the bags don't smell, mix some of each one in a cup of water.

 

[cbdhemp808]

Oy. Does anyone know a way to test between bonemeal, and rock dust?
I've got six UNLABELED packets of what look like bone meal flour, but I cannot guarantee that they are not rock flour, because the two look very similar.

Does anyone know a chemical test (so I can be sure)?
I put vinegar on samples of bone flour, and rock flour,, and they both fizzed!

If I had a blowtorch I could put it on samples of each, because rock should not burn.) But I do not have a blow torch.)

If no one knows it quick and simple reliable test, then I should just buy new, because it's like $2 a kilo or something (so like $15 or something, so it is not worth spending too much time on).

Thanks! I know it is only $15, but it's bugging me....

According to the two labeled in Spanish, the darker one is bone and the lighter rock. Bone may float while rock would sink.

 

[CBDMed]

You didn't mention smell.

If the bags don't smell, mix some of each one in a cup of water.

Great idea!
I mixed them in water. I think I detect a slight difference in smell.
I am pretty sure they are bone meal.

 

[CBDMed]

According to the two labeled in Spanish, the darker one is bone and the lighter rock. Bone may float while rock would sink.

Good idea. I checked. Both sink, and they behave about the same in water.
However, it does seem to smell more like the bone meal flour, and it looks more like the bone meal flour color. The differences are slight, but I am pretty sure it is bone meal.
Thank you

 

[CBDMed]

OK, I was trying that new technique of putting seeds straight into damp soil without a 12 hour soak. I had a whole bunch of seeds not come up. I'm going back to soaking first.

I had five buckets so I put five seeds in water, and I guess one of them came up! (So here is a baby picture

What to do with the fifth seed? I decided to try one of those woven polyethylene bag thingies, and feeding it water from the bottom. And that way if one of the ones in pots dies I can swap this in. And if all five happen to come up (which can happen sometimes) I will build another bucket! That would be a little cramped in there but here we go.)

Question: do I put two or three grains of myco in the planting hole with the seed? Or not put two or three grains of myco?


EDIT: OK I had to plant them. I put some grains of myco in with the Seeds. I hope that's OK.

 

[InTheShed]

Can't see any reason not to put some myco in there! And I hope all of your clear buckets now have outside sleeves to keep them pitch black.

 

[CBDMed]

Can't see any reason not to put some myco in there! And I hope all of your clear buckets now have outside sleeves to keep them pitch black.

Yes the girls are all wearing black skirts to be modest and to cover their roots...
(Five new seeds plants, CBD Auto Charlotte's Angels )

 

[InTheShed]

Tights or hose? Whatever it is it's gotta be lightproof.

 

[CBDMed]

Tights or hose? Whatever it is it's gotta be lightproof.

Nothing see-through?

I do not think it is completely 100% pitch black, but it seem to work pretty good last time.

I think it is a kind of a weed cloth. (No pun intended )
When I put the camera about 6 inches from the cloth this is what it looks like through the cloth. (It did not focus very well.)

 

[InTheShed]

If you can see light, so can the roots and algae. But you can only do the best you can do. If you have duct tape, that would work as an underlayer.

 

[CBDMed]

If you can see light, so can the roots and algae. But you can only do the best you can do. If you have duct tape, that would work as an underlayer.

I will see what I can do, but I cannot do it today. Right now I'm on deadline, and way behind, and I have to change the channel in about seven or eight minutes. So I've got to run. Maybe next week I can see if I can find either some thicker black shade cloth or weed barrier, or see what else I can do.
Thanks, Shed!

 

[CBDMed]

What I would really like would be to find some colored plastic buckets, so I can get away from this shade cloth business, but I'm not sure they do that here

 

[InTheShed]

I've never seen a clear bucket here!