Sauga's First WW Indoor Grow, LED Style

I think my girl has taken a turn for the worse. She has a lot more leaves that look sick, the stems are turning red and I'm afraid I'm going to lose her. Not only that but my other girls are starting to show signs now of calcium def. I want to keep an open mind here about the cal def, and the high pH, but my gut says it's not a pH problem. I tend to think it's something else contributing to the cal def. From what @Smeegol is suggesting I shouldn't be going over board with the LJ. The soil is still moist from yesterdays drink.
Even with the 10 drops of LJ the pH hasn't changed, hanging around 7.

EDIT: I'm still treating it as pH problem for now
 
Smeegol said:
In your last post you say ph 7-8 which if I remember correctly you also posted awhile back ( apologies if I'm wrong ) bout your concerns of " leaf septoria " which I also had on a plant and my ph was 7.9 for a cpl months.....
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You are absolutely correct. And since I posted that info about pH I have been trying to get it down, organically. Using the LJ at 1-2 drops per liter didn't seem to move the needle but I kept adding it each watering

Smeegol said:
That played havoc till I got a ph pen that has the solution and distilled water mix, that is your best ally in getting your ph under control as you want 6.2-6.8 anywhere there and it will stay happy.
I don't know enough about letting ph swing to make certain elements more available to the plants but 6.5 is what you want...
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I do have a pen, with calibration solution if that's what you mean. I could never get it to work correctly. How does one test the soil with a pen? Do I need to dilute the soil in distilled water and check that way?

Smeegol said:
Also 10 drops of lemon juice per lt of water is throwing caution to the wind cause you are dropping your ph way to low with your other additives if that makes sense...

So if you make 1lt feed mix add the lemon juice lastly drop at a time until you have your ph where you want it.....
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Yes I did read about shocking the plant. But I'm afraid too slow of a pH drop and it will be too late anyhow.

Thanks Mr Smeegs. I'll keep working on getting the pH down.
 
After calming down a bit, I took the plant out of the tent for some pics. I mentioned earlier the stems were turning red, well they look like that in a tent with a purple light. They look normal when outside. :oops:
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Smeegol said:
Out of the tent they look fine to me, and I reckon the other guys n gals might agree... Let's chalk this up to " I'm a worried father syndrome "
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I know right? l I still agree with @Pennywise there is a pH issue that is locking out the Ca. At what pH would you mix your solution to add to the water? In otherwords, is a batch of rain water pH'd to say 5 too acidic or show I go down to say 4 before adding to the girls?
 
MrSauga said:
I know right? l I still agree with @Pennywise there is a pH issue that is locking out the Ca. At what pH would you mix your solution to add to the water? In otherwords, is a batch of rain water pH'd to say 5 too acidic or show I go down to say 4 before adding to the girls?
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Afternoon mr.S I won't lie to you, that's above my understanding as I haven't had these types of probs yet, in my journal every attempt I've made to grow in the last 2 years I only get as far as veg then I have another back op so all my plants move to the farm where my brother carrys on with them till harvest so I'm learning alongside you at the same time...

So if your rainwater when you measure it before amending stands at 5 you want to raise it to 6.5 cause that's the range where all nutrients are most available. I don't know how the lockouts occur and I know you are in soil but I'm confused as to why you are ph ing before amending . I know you are searching for a reason to what's caused the lockout and Penny and Derby will guide you better than I as they understand the different nutes and such...

But why don't you try 1 plant with a ph of 6.5 with all amendments in and the other as normal while you problem solve......

And my promise to you for this coming week is to purchase a ph pen and tds meter so I can learn and have a grasp on what we are talking about...
 
Smeegol said:
So if your rainwater when you measure it before amending stands at 5 you want to raise it to 6.5 cause that's the range where all nutrients are most available. I don't know how the lockouts occur and I know you are in soil but I'm confused as to why you are ph ing before amending . I know you are searching for a reason to what's caused the lockout and Penny and Derby will guide you better than I as they understand the different nutes and such...
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OK so I may have made this sound more confusing then I should have. Let me start from the beginning.
If my soil is over 7 right now, and I want it to be around 6.8, should I be pH'ing my water to 6.8? It makes sense to pH to 6.8 if that's what I want the soil to be at, but in order to get it down quicker, should I pH my water to 5? Hopefully that made more sense.
 
MrSauga said:
OK so I may have made this sound more confusing then I should have. Let me start from the beginning.
If my soil is over 7 right now, and I want it to be around 6.8, should I be pH'ing my water to 6.8? It makes sense to pH to 6.8 if that's what I want the soil to be at, but in order to get it down quicker, should I pH my water to 5? Hopefully that made more sense.
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Haha ok I understand where you are now with the above explanation, ok if your ph is 7 you are aiming for 6.8 and take your ph to 5 in order to have your soil come in at 6.8....??

Then take it to 5.5 to get within a better range of 6.8 you don't want a massive ph swing from 5 all the way to 6.8....

But what I don't understand is if the perfect ph is 6.5 for soil, then why do you want 6.8...???
I understand you are trying to control the lockout by keeping it steady at 6.8 but by keeping it in that higher range you are heading for lockout territory slowly but surely. By taking it all the way to 5 you are throwing your plants gears into reverse at a 100miles an hour type of thing...

Think of a seesaw you want it to be level ( 6.5 ) not ( 5 ) and not 6.8-7 . You are not in coco or hydro where you have to account for ph swings like this.... Soil has a specific ph range which is 6.5 you say you want 6.8 hypothetically speaking but if you feed it that 6.8 you are prolonging the lockout cause it's drawing on those nutes causing the lockout.... Feed the plant the 6.5 ph range that growing in a soil needs and your problems will go away you should notice a difference with the next 2 feeding cause she's had time to unblock at the correct ph range.....

I'm also learning like I say my friend and that was the biggest lesson I have learnt personally, your end result of mix with all your amendments aim for as close to 6.5 as you can.....

Please ask mr.Stank and mr.Blew Hiller as they are both soil and more learned than I in this regard....

But above all mr.Sauga I bet you we are going to be learn together......:goodjob::high-five::thanks:
 
Smeegol said:
But what I don't understand is if the perfect ph is 6.5 for soil, then why do you want 6.8...???
I understand you are trying to control the lockout by keeping it steady at 6.8 but by keeping it in that higher range you are heading for lockout territory slowly but surely. By taking it all the way to 5 you are throwing your plants gears into reverse at a 100miles an hour type of thing...
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My bad when saying 6.8. I was not paying attention to the numbers as much as I was using it as an example. So yes if I was shooting to have my soil pH at 6.5 then I should pH my water the same.

Smeegol said:
Think of a seesaw you want it to be level ( 6.5 ) not ( 5 ) and not 6.8-7 . You are not in coco or hydro where you have to account for ph swings like this.... Soil has a specific ph range which is 6.5 you say you want 6.8 hypothetically speaking but if you feed it that 6.8 you are prolonging the lockout cause it's drawing on those nutes causing the lockout.... Feed the plant the 6.5 ph range that growing in a soil needs and your problems will go away you should notice a difference with the next 2 feeding cause she's had time to unblock at the correct ph range.....
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I was referring to the pH of watering at 5 since the pH drops slow, from my understanding. So, I was thinking to make the water pH'd at 5 to reduce the time it took to lower the pH. But like you said it's probably too much and stick with what I want the soil to be, 6.5.
I think I got it now.

Thanks mr Smeegs.
 
In soil Van, Bob and some of the others can help you with this. In coco don't chase the ph of your coco, make sure your water/ nutrients are ph'd correctly by adding your nutes to the water then correcting ph right before you water. If you water to a small amount of runoff then the ph readings of the coco itself is irrelevant.
 
Pennywise said:
In soil Van, Bob and some of the others can help you with this. In coco don't chase the ph of your coco, make sure your water/ nutrients are ph'd correctly by adding your nutes to the water then correcting ph right before you water. If you water to a small amount of runoff then the ph readings of the coco itself is irrelevant.
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I'll reach out to @Van Stank and see if he can shed some light on what I need to do. If I measure the pH in my rain water now it stands at 6.8. All my watering has been done with the same rain water. I haven't added any nutes except for the compost tea. I have never measured the pH of that but I would assume(i know) that is is slightly on the acidic side as well.
Most recently I added about two inches of worm castings in the top two inches. So to me the water pH seems fine. I have a new soil tester coming in today to get a better reading of the pH in the soil. I'm also going to take soil samples today and check the NPK levels. I'll post back later with results.
 
Smeegol said:
Howdy mr.S so it stands at 6.8 now so after you've made the tea and it still reads 6.8 round there now you add your lj to get close to 6.5.... You are hovering right on target my friend just drop the ph perfect water balloon....haha
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Oh it's been a great day so far. Lots of sun and beautiful daytime temps w/no humidity.
My plan was exactly that. Bring her down to 6.5 and go from there. I think I'm going to take her outside today to get a better look and some better pics.
Keep it green Mr Smeegs and thanks for the help once again.
 
Pennywise said:
What I'm seeing looks like ph flucuations, possibly being too high then too low.
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Awesome Penny, I haven't been monitoring the pH for consistency. What you say makes sense now. I'm sure my compost tea is more acidic causing it to drop, then regular watering causes it to go back up. I'll be testing every batch of water from now on and try and get some stability. I'll have to adjust my tea accordingly in the future.
 
I check my nute water every feeding to be certain. With the coco I run 6.0-6.5 seems to do the trick. In soil you can go a little higher but not not by much.
 
afternoon mr.Sauga I hope you don't mind if I share a pic of the #quadsquad.. Decided after a feeding the girls to go all #newtify on the plant in question... I don't think you have done this step or if you don't have due to size of pot but this was my next logical step. So I removed the 1st set of horizontal branches on each arm and the over unders branches on each arm now it's focus time on the growth tip I believe..
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So I think once the arms reach the edge of the container I'll up-pot her to her next container...

Thanks for allowing me to share....:Namaste:
 
So I took 4 soil samples from around the pot, around 2" down. I didn't want to go lower and risk damaging roots. P and K look fine, but the N isn't really registering on the chart. None or depleted. I will take another test later to verify the results. Since N is best absorbed I think around 7-8pH I would be right to assume that it isn't being locked out correct? Assuming this test is close enough to being correct, I don't really see any signs of N def.
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