Panama x Malawi - Probiotic & Organic Indoor Soil Grow

Well, I don't think that the CS treatment is working at all this time around. The last time that I did it with some success, I was spraying and reversing little clone plants. These big full-sized ones just seem to absorb all that I can spray on them and flower without a problem. I am really wishing I had put these girls in the 3 gallon pots in under the CMH light instead, given how beautiful they are turning out. I'm real tempted to just swap the lights into each tent right now given that the CS seems to have no effect, but these girls are real lanky and the ones in the 5 gallon pots are much larger so I think even with all that yellow ugliness I will yield more off of those large plants with a large light. They'd probably wither up and die if I tried to put them under this little T5.





Speaking of the girls under the CMH, they're at least starting to flower nice and decent now. Their leaves are very perky, and they're training under the net just fine. Honestly they seem very healthy if not for the yellowing. Some of the tops seem to be getting better color to them, maybe they just wanted to flower.





Meanwhile the auto-watering has been going okay, but I don't know how accurate this timer I've got is actually keeping time. I've ran these pumps with a stop-watch many times to calibrate things, and I know they do about 400 mL/Minute yet when I set the timer for 1 minute, there's a little less than 400 mL in the jar I've setup under my recirculation tap. Then the other day it should have ran 2 minutes, but there was much less than 800 mL in the jar. I'm thinking it may have siphoned it back out of the jar though.

bob that bottom feeding method sounds pretty interesting, how does the water not just start spilling out of the top, or is it like a recirculation setup? I just have mine setup drain-to-waste, though I don't have the pots in one tent elevated so they've been sitting in the run off for a while now :/ It doesn't seem to evaporate fast enough when the pot its stitting in isn't wicking it into the air so fast.

I'd really like to get a setup tapped into the main water line so the plants just drinkup all they want without me worrying about it. I'm pretty sure with those blumat water spikes it could be done relatively cheaply with what I have, what I really need to build is a resevoir with a float-switch that I can pump out of.
 
Hey Fert....those first few plants you showed look awesome! I would consider swapping the lights as well if those are your best girls. Very happy and healthy looking brother!
 
Hey Fert....those first few plants you showed look awesome! I would consider swapping the lights as well if those are your best girls. Very happy and healthy looking brother!
Yeah I'm not sure though because they're still pretty all and lanky, I don't think they'd really support much bud in the end because of that. Still very nice and perky looking though. My gut tells me I'll still get more off the sick looking plants with as large as they are and their structure.

I'm still going back on feeling like they need to be fed with something or not. One thing I've noticed is that the Jack Herer Auto seems to be pretty happy, and I know that its roots have reached the big pot's soil because I can see its leaves raise or lower depending on watering. Meanwhile it's nice and happy and green looking, so if the soil was too rich you'd figure that it would show it. On the other hand, if the soil was not rich enough for the big plants, then such a little plant may still be nice and healthy in it.

So I'm brewing up some ACT, thinking about putting in some EarthJuice in it as well. If the soil is too rich it will make it worse, but on the other hand it could be a very well timed fix since I'm just starting to put on some flowers.











 
Well today is about two weeks after I flipped them, and I decided to feed with some ACT and EarthJuice tea.

Into 2.5 gal, bubbled 48 hrs, filtered through cheesecloth:
2/3 cups ( Yeah whoops ) EWC
2/3 cups Kelp Meal
2 Tbsp Black Strap Molasses
3 Tbsp EJ Bloom
2 Tbsp EJ Catalyst
1 Tbsp EJ Meta-K
1 Tsp EJ Micro-Blast
1/2 Tsp Ej OilyCann
1/2 Tsp EJ Bloommaster(0-30-50)
4 tsp of Neem Oil

Hopefully we'll see some improvement in a week or so. Though I have to say for all these problems, at 2 weeks since flip, these little blossoms look pretty good.








The ones in the T5 tent got about a 1/5 dilution of the same tea, but honesty I don't know how much longer they're going to be up, things kind of went sideways in there--literally. I sprayed them down with spinosad and they started leaning over. Just not enough light I don't think. It's kind of interesting how much their pistils are browning up. Meanwhile the CS treatment has done absolutely squat, so I don't think I'll even be bothering to spray them much more. I'd need a few weeks more for sacs to to pop out, then a couple weeks before pollen starts dropping, and by that point the recipient plants in the other tent will be at about 6 weeks along and might not be able to make fully developed seeds by the time I want to chop them down. Probably make bubblehash with them in the end.



 
Well, trying to do some 3-day comparison shots...

Here's the Panama x Malawi #5 before and after ACT



Here's #3, and part of #5 before and after ACT



Maddog and #2 before and after ACT



A couple maddog tops before and after...


#2 Tops before and after...



Kind of hard to tell any difference in the 3 days, but I think I'm seeing less loss of color in new growth so hopefully back on track. The flowers and tops seem to be developing pretty well...














Meanwhile the plants that were supposed to be reversal plants are getting quite resinous, and making some nice buds up top, while everything else below is very spindly and dying off. I don't know that it would be wise to keep these plants going for too much longer as there's lots of dead material and they're all spindly and falling over on themselves. I don't want them to be bait for pests, and I haven't really given them as strong a dose of neem as the other plants. Anyway I'm just liking how much trichomes they're packing on, so I want to see how much longer they'll go and what kind of harvest I can get off these, but as far as spraying them with CS I think it's probably a waste of time to continue doing that at this point.



 
Get some yo-yos and give them support when they need it. Don't chop them if the flowers are still growing.
Oh yeah, I'll probably go with string though instead. Those yo-yos are kinda spendy. $3 on some string and slip-knots is what I'm gonna do!

But I'm just worried that their lower branches are looking kind of dead-like. Just wondering if they'll go the whole way or start to croak.
 
Well, today is the 4th week since I flipped to 11/13 for the Panama x Malawi. I'm gonna do those big and bold like Stank does so it's easy to track progres...

I picked most of the dead/dying leaves off. I'm hoping that the EarthJuice feed will prevent any more from dying, but still not really sure I fed them enough of it, or that there's not other uptake issues at play. For all I know these could just be rootbound, it seems up in the air.

Week 4









Meanwhile, that makes it about 6 weeks for the ones that I had tried to reverse. They're starting to show some calcium deficiency, it looks like. Though the splotches look a little whitish, could be something else.




Meanwhile, I'm trying to do some LST on the little Jack Herer auto I've got going



Anyway, many balls in the air, we'll see how they drop. I'm really curious to see how much I yield off those plants off the little 200w T5. I'm going to use those plants for bubblehash, so I don't really WANT to trim them, but I figure I might as well and that way I can weigh how much smokeable bud I got off those plants.

I'm not really sure what I'm going to be doing after this run. I had planned to shut down over the summer, and I probably need to cook up a new batch of soil or re amend this or something, so that would be opportune timing. But since my CS reversal was unsuccessful, it makes me sad because I'd like to keep some clones of these Panama x Malawi to try again with better soil. They're really good plants and I found a couple phenos I liked. I guess I'm just going to have to buy some more of them and hope I get the same ones down the line. I need to try some of my other strains anyway.
 
Hey your Jack is coming along nicely. Looks like she is going to turn out pretty decent. Can't say I have been overly impressed with Greenhouse's Auto version based off how its grown for others. Luckily mine is doing pretty well so I can't really complain.
 
Hey your Jack is coming along nicely. Looks like she is going to turn out pretty decent. Can't say I have been overly impressed with Greenhouse's Auto version based off how its grown for others. Luckily mine is doing pretty well so I can't really complain.

Yeah, they looked a little raggedy as little seedlings, I think the variegation was interesting and I do think there might be a lot of Ruderalis in these. What's been interesting to me is that a photoperiod under 12/12 from bloom usually shows pistils at day 21 or so for me, but this Jack is heading toward day 34 under 11/13 lighting and it's not showing any pistils yet. Kind of makes me wonder when/how the auto decides to flower.
 
Lots of opinions on the cause of that for sure. Despite all those opinions, I see little scientific backing on any of them. They are a complete mystery to me brother.
 
Well, I don't think that the CS treatment is working at all this time around. The last time that I did it with some success, I was spraying and reversing little clone plants. These big full-sized ones just seem to absorb all that I can spray on them and flower without a problem. I am really wishing I had put these girls in the 3 gallon pots in under the CMH light instead, given how beautiful they are turning out. I'm real tempted to just swap the lights into each tent right now given that the CS seems to have no effect, but these girls are real lanky and the ones in the 5 gallon pots are much larger so I think even with all that yellow ugliness I will yield more off of those large plants with a large light. They'd probably wither up and die if I tried to put them under this little T5.





Speaking of the girls under the CMH, they're at least starting to flower nice and decent now. Their leaves are very perky, and they're training under the net just fine. Honestly they seem very healthy if not for the yellowing. Some of the tops seem to be getting better color to them, maybe they just wanted to flower.





Meanwhile the auto-watering has been going okay, but I don't know how accurate this timer I've got is actually keeping time. I've ran these pumps with a stop-watch many times to calibrate things, and I know they do about 400 mL/Minute yet when I set the timer for 1 minute, there's a little less than 400 mL in the jar I've setup under my recirculation tap. Then the other day it should have ran 2 minutes, but there was much less than 800 mL in the jar. I'm thinking it may have siphoned it back out of the jar though.

bob that bottom feeding method sounds pretty interesting, how does the water not just start spilling out of the top, or is it like a recirculation setup? I just have mine setup drain-to-waste, though I don't have the pots in one tent elevated so they've been sitting in the run off for a while now :/ It doesn't seem to evaporate fast enough when the pot its stitting in isn't wicking it into the air so fast.

I'd really like to get a setup tapped into the main water line so the plants just drinkup all they want without me worrying about it. I'm pretty sure with those blumat water spikes it could be done relatively cheaply with what I have, what I really need to build is a resevoir with a float-switch that I can pump out of.

Look up AutoPot XL - that's what I use. I tried Bluemats... I have a shit ton of em in a box. That system you can set up to a timer and a hose I think... have the timer but maybe someday outdoors I'll use em.

The AutoPot system has a reservoir and it runs on gravity. So the only thing I have to do is fill the res with water .... I built a 10" high stand out of 2x6 and plywood the res sits on. That's all... I could use a timer to fill the res if I wanted but haven't gotten around to hooking it up.

To keep water levels there's a float system for each pot... water goes below a certain level the valve opens and water goes in.... plants drink and over and over it goes. Pretty slick setup. Been running it for a few years now.

Every once in a while I get a clog of gunk that gets in the base where the valve is and it gets clogged and water stops. Can tell when the plant looks thirsty. In a few years only happened a few times. 1 time I was away for a few weeks .... almost lost a plant! Was ok in the end.

Your setup is pretty cool... a bigger res you could automate for a long while...

I've been thinking of changing my current reservoir to larger hard plastic rain barrel. My current 1 is soft sided material..heavy duty tho so easy to tear down and clean which I do usually 1x a year. The rain barrels have bases that are perfect height for a gravity fed system.
 
Fert said:
What's been interesting to me is that a photoperiod under 12/12 from bloom usually shows pistils at day 21 or so for me, but this Jack is heading toward day 34 under 11/13 lighting and it's not showing any pistils yet. Kind of makes me wonder when/how the auto decides to flower.

34 days 11/13 flower and no flowers?? Something aint right!! If its an auto give it more light it doesn't matter about hours a day for them. Usually the AUTOs will flower in 2 weeks or so... doesn't take long.. but I run mine @ 20/4 lighting.
 
34 days 11/13 flower and no flowers?? Something aint right!! If its an auto give it more light it doesn't matter about hours a day for them. Usually the AUTOs will flower in 2 weeks or so... doesn't take long.. but I run mine @ 20/4 lighting.

Problem is there is no "giving it more light" since it's in the tent with my other photoperiod girls. But honestly the more veg time it gets before it flowers will probably help me out since I was worried it would start when it was all dwarfed. About the only thing I could do is raise it up on something to get it closer to the light, but I don't really want to create a leaning-tower-of-potza type situation. I'm still figuring out what I can do as far as that goes.

Yeah, the AutoPot systems looked nice, but too far outside of my budget. I know they're not that expensive relatively speaking, but heck $100 is an investment for me, $200 is a take-a-loan investment. Sad but true, the tales of a disabled grower.

Anyway after you've explained, I think I like the AutoPot system more than the Blumats. Do you have the water-sensor ones or just the regular hydrating spikes? I guess the sensing ones work by keeping pressure inside of the little carrot with water, and if the water level in the soil goes down so does the pressure in the carrot, opening up the valve. Problem is if you let the soil get too dry, then the have to be opened up and refilled. So if you let your res go empty by accident, they can dry out, and then next time you fill the res they'll be wide open and you can flood your system out. I decided I'd need to invest in a run-off tray (big $60 one down at the hydro shop is perfect.... but $60 :( ) if I'm going to mess around with the Blumats. But I've seen other growers swear by them.

I'm also thinking about throwing together a new batch of soil, but that will run about $50-$60 for more peat moss, perlite and EWC. I'd like to go scout some out like you do, but I don't trust myself enough to grab the right stuff. Plus the EWC I get has kelp meal and rock dusts in it already. Anyway if I whip that up now, it should be cooked and ready to go for something else by the time I harvest. I'm not even sure I'll want to grow anything over the summer, but I guess it will be better to have it and not need it, and then if I don't use it, then it will just have all that time over the summer to stabilize for winter. But I can always recyle the stuff I have now so I'm not sure I wanna spend the money.

edit:

Oh @bobrown14 I forgot to mention something I was reading lately. I was looking up if it's okay to use ACT through my submersible pump, or if it would clog the pump up, and I found an article that was talking about whether centrifugal ( my style ) or diaphragm pumps were better for the microbiology in an ACT. One article claimed the impellers in a centrifugal pump kind of "slice and dice" the micro-life, whereas another study claimed the high pressures (70 psi and greater) of a diaphragm pump were worse. I'm not really sure who to believe on the topic. One guy claimed to have confirmed the impeller's were worse with microscopic assay, but he didn't really detail his method so who knows if he just brewed a bunk batch of tea for that test. I would have honestly thought that the microlife was too small to be affected by those large edges on an impeller, and on my pump they're not particularly sharp or anything either.
 
Well, today is the 4th week since I flipped to 11/13 for the Panama x Malawi. I'm gonna do those big and bold like Stank does so it's easy to track progres...

I picked most of the dead/dying leaves off. I'm hoping that the EarthJuice feed will prevent any more from dying, but still not really sure I fed them enough of it, or that there's not other uptake issues at play. For all I know these could just be rootbound, it seems up in the air.

Week 4









Meanwhile, that makes it about 6 weeks for the ones that I had tried to reverse. They're starting to show some calcium deficiency, it looks like. Though the splotches look a little whitish, could be something else.




Meanwhile, I'm trying to do some LST on the little Jack Herer auto I've got going



Anyway, many balls in the air, we'll see how they drop. I'm really curious to see how much I yield off those plants off the little 200w T5. I'm going to use those plants for bubblehash, so I don't really WANT to trim them, but I figure I might as well and that way I can weigh how much smokeable bud I got off those plants.

I'm not really sure what I'm going to be doing after this run. I had planned to shut down over the summer, and I probably need to cook up a new batch of soil or re amend this or something, so that would be opportune timing. But since my CS reversal was unsuccessful, it makes me sad because I'd like to keep some clones of these Panama x Malawi to try again with better soil. They're really good plants and I found a couple phenos I liked. I guess I'm just going to have to buy some more of them and hope I get the same ones down the line. I need to try some of my other strains anyway.
Take a couple of flowering clones off the bottom and keep it going ?
 
With your Malawi cross, Arctic and I grew out Malawi and both of us had our plants go yellow and drop all the fan leaves by harvest time. It makes for super easy trimming lol
 
Take a couple of flowering clones off the bottom and keep it going ?

Oh I see so you just splay them out though to get more light in rather than turning the pots so each side gets more light?

Yeah I'm tempted to take some and start again, but the thing is then if I get locked into a cycle and the heat starts to be unbearable it will be a lousy time and I won't want to not finish them out. Plus I have a whole bunch of other strains I've been wanting to try. Just not sure what to do.

With your Malawi cross, Arctic and I grew out Malawi and both of us had our plants go yellow and drop all the fan leaves by harvest time. It makes for super easy trimming lol

Ha yeah mine too last run with it, though this time around the yellowing was going down in veg too so I feel like these are going to be practically leafless by the end of flower.

This strain is really great, and I'm just conflicted on what to do with it because I know I can buy a couple more beans of it from ACE, but I don't know if I'll get the same phenotypes I like out of it. #3 and #5 are the ones I want to keep the most, #5 beacuse it's a yielder and a stout beast of a plant, but #3 is potent as heck and smells like pistachios so I mean how could I not keep that. But keeping clones going means making my house a hothouse which I hate, or trying to grow them outdoors, and I'm not sure they'd have the time to finish outdoors.

This is why I can't cycle or get dialed in, always doing something different.
 
Do you have a pic of the #3 pheno?

Yeah, in this post I put up closeups of #1, #2 and #3. Sadly #1 runted out when I reveg'd them and potted it, so I replaced it with an Auto Jack Herer. #5 is doing the best now ironically. Anyway, #2 and #3 looked very similar in the leaves and structure, but the buds looked different.

Panama x Malawi - Probiotic & Organic Indoor Soil Grow

Let me see if I can find some more of them in veg and see which pot is #3 so you can look at the past pics, page 5 and backward is the 1st cycle I did with them.

Okay yeah, last cycle the number #3 was in the pot in the upper-right hand corner. Of course thanks to the scrog, you'll probably not have an easy time seeing it, I couldn't really find any good pictures of it but when my lights come on I'll take some pics of the one I've got going under the T5 right now.

Matter of fact, I just realized I had some. It's the bottom-left corner in this tent. But I'll still get you some better pics of its leaves later.



 
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