First CFL Grow Using 30 Watt CFLs

[donpaul.p]

@teSmp, i think your right about the bulb, even though its a dual spec i still dont think its good enough for veg, i put one of my seedlings under it to do a 12-12 from seed and as soon as it went under the hps it started stretching, but it is further away from the light as im not to bothered about it, just trying a 12-12 from seed thats not a hempie,

the bulb im using is this
sunmaster 400watt dual spectrum grow lamp, thats what it says on the box, it also says this
watt 400
bulb shape t15 or ti5, ( not sure but it looks like t15)
lumens 55,000
life hours 24,000
burning position universal
lamp :sl400w.u46.dsp part#: 10035

on the back of the box it says the following,
promotes larger leaf area/mass
encourages increased numbers of plant internodes
encourages early flowering
produces higher chlorophyll levels for greener healthier plants
produces thicker primary stems ( the stems on the hempies are thicker than my thumb)
produces higher yield
for use in commercial greenhouse and hydroponic use

so thats the bulb im using, as my ballast is digital this means i can use a mh bulb, so as long as its a 400watt bulb i should be ok to use it, ill try and pick one up and see if it makes a difference with the next lot of plants i put under it, the problem is though that my plants in normal pots are growing as normal and not getting the same growth as the hempie, plus they have been vegged under the hps as well. im just not sure what to make of it, am i going to get a lower yield due to the nodes been far apart or is it going to increase yield, its something i can only find out after its finished, but for now im hoping it gives me more than my 20g i got off my last hempie

 

[miwa]

dam...maybe i should increase my nutes..

 

[donpaul.p]

i wouldnt get going mad mate, it might not be the nutes, till i know for sure its to hard to say, it could be down to more than 1 thing so till these clones get growing i wont really be able to tell you anymore, it could be the hydro and soil mix making them grow like this, soil in the top part then hydro in the bottom, their so much it can be, nutes,light,hydro, my magical touch, etc etc.

all i can do is see how the clones turn out, none of my plants have shown nute problems, so i could probably up the dose on all of them, but my hempies are only getting the same nutes as the other plants i have in flower, so if it was just down to the nutes then the other plants would be growing the same, but their not, the hempies are way taller, twice the size of the plants that have been in veg for 4 weeks or so, i need to figure it out, it could also be the 2 strains, i could do with finding someone that has grown afgan skunk fem and also reserva privada sour kush, maybe then i can sort out why im getting this crazy growth,

 

[teSmp]

I always increase nutes until the plant says its to much or it messes with the pH/ppm in my res.. If there is slight burn on the tips then decrease it a little bit and if it doesn't progress that's where I want to run my nutes.. A few weeks later increase them again because they can handle more nutes as the grow progresses..

I swear I thought you said you vegged these 2Ls a bit before you flowered them? And the last one you did you flowered when it was small or no veg time? Another thing with hydr is its getting as much nutes/water as it wants 100% of the time, you can obviously see that soil does not have that advantage. And before you go say hydro doesn't taste as good, did you think your last 2L tasted like shit, I highly doubt it!

I would get those new bulbs.. Your veg would go faster and your nodes would be a lot closer.. You want the roots to branch off like that, I wish I could get a pic in my res... I would like to see a pic of these plants though.

 

[donpaul.p]

my last hempie as 12-12 from seed, i planted the seed in the hempie then it went strait under 12-12, your right in saying this had some veg time, after it broke through the ground it was under 24-0 for about a week, it was only 2inches tall when i transplanted it, as soon as i transplanted it it went under the hps as the hempie was to big to keep in the veg cupboard, so id say it had about a week of veg at the most, so it did have a tiny amount of veg, but nothing like weeks of veg so it was only 2 inches or slightly bigger when it went under the hps.

none of my plants have ever showed signs of nute problems, the bottles say to mix a gallon of water with the amount of nutes, but i do half i have a 2ltr pop bottle that i fill with water then i add the nutes to that, so my bloom says to give 20ml per gallon, so i half this and add 10ml per 2 litre, now i know a gallon in the usa is slightly different in the uk, or at least litres are, but i dont think its by much, in theory i could up the dose on all my plants then as none have ever showed signs of over nute or nute lock out.

as for the taste i dont even think its worth worrying about, i was only stating what i had read elsewhere, it said hydro grows quicker but you do lose some of the quality in taste where as soil retains this quality to a higher level, to me it makes no difference, it tasted ok to me so im not to bothered either way about the taste as to be fair it hardly makes any difference, as long as its flushed before harvest i cant even see their been much of a difference, if anything i would of though hydro would of tasted slightly better due to it not having all the other stuff in the soil that the plant dont need, so the difference between hydro and soil is only the rate of growth in my eyes anyway, i was perfectly happy with the bud off my last hempie and it tasted like bud and smoked like bud so it must of been bud,
who ever noticed the difference must be some genius because i cant see how you can really tell the difference, each strain will be different, even down to the temps etc etc, all this would impact the final taste so id be happy with both hydro and soil, i cant see it making enough difference to be noticed.

but yep your right mate, they did have a small amount of veg, they have also been getting the highest bpn feed for well over a week and this was when they had only just started throwing out pistils at the nodes, so surely i should of got some nute burn at this stage, the only reason i can think why im not getting nute burn is due to the fact that they are drinking it and using it to fast for it to cause a problem, if it was in soil then it would be soaked into the soil and this then might cause me problems, but the hempies are not causing me any growth problems apart from the height, would i increase yield if i upped the nutes slightly, so say it says give 20ml per gallon what about if i went up a couple of ml say 24ml per gallon, i use a syringe to measure so i know im giving it exactly what it says im giving it.

i was just a bit warry about giving higher nutes without ppm tester as i dont know enough to even know when enough is enough, apart from the plants getting stressed, but then if the plants got stressed i could lower the dose back down, i just didnt want to mess with something thats working and all my plants seem ok with the dose im giving them, i wont mess about now im this late in flower on my other plants, but when i put the others under the hps to veg ill see how far i can take the nutes, ill try it with clones so i can compare one with the other, if i give the 1 clone the nutes it should be getting and then give the other a higher dose then that will give me some sort of base to compare the growth to, thats my plan anyways

 

[donpaul.p]

ill take some pics tomorrow mate and show you the 2 plants, ill measure them to show you exactly how big they are getting, its 00:30 now and the lights are off, so when they come on tomorrow ill do an update and take some pics, my plants in flower look really good now so ill put pics of them all up, but its just these hempies have got me a bit stumped with why their getting so tall, if it is the light then why did the other hempie not get this big and why has the other plants in flower not got this big, the only thing actually different is the hydro part, the other plants are in soil and this is in soil and hydro, so chances are its something to do with that, but still these plants are taller than other hydro plants i have seen, its not like they have been vegged for ages, so surely if it was down to the hydro then plants would be huge after a few weeks of veg, the rate their growing now id run out of head room pretty quick if they was still under veg, the only other option im thinking about is the 12-12 stretch, these would of started stretching at 12-12 but because they was still tiny when they was put under 12-12 then maybe they had more time to stretch, but then my other hempie would of done the same, maybe i just chose 2 strains that grow like this under the conditions im giving them, who knows, till the clones start growing i wont know much more

 

[teSmp]

Yeah that's what I thought... Think about this. If you throw a plant under 12/12 at 2" tall and it barely has any root mass then it doesn't have enough roots to get to it's full potential. Now if you veg a plant for 2-4+ weeks and you have a good root mass and put it into flower it's going to be able to reach it's full potential. If I remember right you said that the roots took off on the one with the air stone in veg still?? Like I said yesterday I believe, experience + hydro + veg time = a big plant..

Check this out, I'll remove the pics if you want:

that's 2.5 weeks difference.. The first 5 days of flower it continued on with normal veg growth and when it started stretching it went 2-4" every day for 1.5 weeks.. For me, giant root mass + hydro + experience... If you think otherwise look at my first SCROG! What variable changed; soil, experience, environment... If I let it grow straight up, it would have doubled/tripled in height.. Have you seen the greenhouse seed grow videos??? If not please do now (particularly the soil vs hydro grows):

https://www.growhd.tv/channel/Green-House-Seed-Co-Grow-Videos/3

and yeah I agree with you on the taste and I've heard several people say soil is better. I'm MORE then happy with the taste I get from hydro, I think the difference is negligible.

 

[miwa]

good videos..with that jack it was a lot of diff between hydro and soil...i didn't know the gap was that big...i better tune in my hydro...

 

[teSmp]

good videos..with that jack it was a lot of diff between hydro and soil...i didn't know the gap was that big...i better tune in my hydro...

There's a huge gap! Flip through several of those videos it's almost ridiculous.. Those videos are nearly half the reason I switched lol.

 

[Jimmycricket]

Loved the first plant Don P. It had some serious roots. bright white too!!!

 

[Smokemupm8]

Yeah that's what I thought... Think about this. If you throw a plant under 12/12 at 2" tall and it barely has any root mass then it doesn't have enough roots to get to it's full potential. Now if you veg a plant for 2-4+ weeks and you have a good root mass and put it into flower it's going to be able to reach it's full potential. If I remember right you said that the roots took off on the one with the air stone in veg still?? Like I said yesterday I believe, experience + hydro + veg time = a big plant..

Check this out, I'll remove the pics if you want:

that's 2.5 weeks difference.. The first 5 days of flower it continued on with normal veg growth and when it started stretching it went 2-4" every day for 1.5 weeks.. For me, giant root mass + hydro + experience... If you think otherwise look at my first SCROG! What variable changed; soil, experience, environment... If I let it grow straight up, it would have doubled/tripled in height.. Have you seen the greenhouse seed grow videos??? If not please do now (particularly the soil vs hydro grows):

growHD.tv

and yeah I agree with you on the taste and I've heard several people say soil is better. I'm MORE then happy with the taste I get from hydro, I think the difference is negligible.

Hi how are ya?? Hope all things are well
Sorry, just saw teSmps post, and replied!
So teSmp, 2.5 weeks later from what you had in that Veg pic to that flower?? Shit, she blew up under that screen, it gives me ideas for next time now, as said if i WERE to flower her now, id get a bit of stretch for sure, but yeah not as what i need.
Good effort on that, a single plant only yeah??
Ill be screen shopping from now
SORRY FOR POSTING HERE BRO!!
Smokemup...

 

[JamesTheGreen]

miwa, Absolutely, INCREASE, but like Don says, do it slowly, do not want an un-fixable or severe BURN to Happen, Outside Plants take to Nute Increase better, IMHO, or You can just give them more, because they have the room, and sun and such. I always water a little bit more, when I give Mega Strength Nutes, not Flush, Just a little more Water, to even things out a little Better. just take your time and be careful!!! SINCERELY, JAMESTHEGREEN.

 

[teSmp]

Hi how are ya?? Hope all things are well
Sorry, just saw teSmps post, and replied!
So teSmp, 2.5 weeks later from what you had in that Veg pic to that flower?? Shit, she blew up under that screen, it gives me ideas for next time now, as said if i WERE to flower her now, id get a bit of stretch for sure, but yeah not as what i need.
Good effort on that, a single plant only yeah??
Ill be screen shopping from now
SORRY FOR POSTING HERE BRO!!
Smokemup...

Yep only one plant under the screen. However, I've been saying all that growth is attributed to the hydro not the screen. It would have blown up vertically if the screen wasn't there. I've used a screen with soil and the growth was alright at best. I've used the same nutes the whole time (BPN)... And with this grow I've only been using the nutes at 75% and with the soil SCROG 100-110% of the feeding chart because I didn't have a PPM meter.. So I'm not contributing any of this to the nutes because they're the same and I'm using 25-30% less.

 

[donpaul.p]

@teSmp, thanks for the link to the vids mate, ill check them out, the hempies where under 24-0 for a week from seed, i could not check the roots as i had started them in small pots with soil in, i then just tipped them out the pots and put them in the hempies, both hempies started off about the same root wise, after 4 or 5 days the roots where poking out the bottom so thats when i filled the res and added the air stone, then over time the one with the air stone got more roots and is slightly taller than the other plant,
all i can do is see what happens, both are still growing, how ever the one without the air stone is now further in flower than the 1 with the air stone so that 1 has slowed down now its further in flower, i think this is where the different strains will show, the other with the air pump is still growing as fast as it was and its not as far in flower as the one without the air pump,

so ill go check them vids out, but to be honest hydro would be more risky for me to do, soil is easier to play dumb, but hydro clearly grows the plants quicker, the plant can take in the nutes and water as it needs it without having to go and find it in the soil, plus you know when the plant needs more, where as soil you never know how wet it is further down so its hard to get the balance right.

but im happy with the results im getting on my plants in normal pots, i didnt have any concerns till these hempies reached for the sky, im glad the 1 has slowed down now, just got to wait for the other to stop the stretch and go into full flower, my last hempie finished at just over half the height of these, so their is some reason why these are growing faster than my last hempie, im using the same bottle and the same res i just recycled it from the last hempie, the nutes are the same but i did start the highest feed a whole lot sooner, all i can do now is see how it goes, if this is going to happen every time i do a hempie then its going to make it hard on the plants in normal pots so ill need to see the results from there hempies and then decide where i go from their, my last 2ltr dwc hempie was the perfect size and was able to grow along side my other plants with no problems, but these hempies have got huge leaves and they block the light to the other plants so i have had to tie the leaves out the way and remove any that was resting on the buds of the other plants,

thanks for the input and thanks for the links to the vids, ill check them out, if i had somewhere else to grow id go down the hydro root for sure, but for now i got to stick with the soil grows and the odd 2ltr dwc hempie, a full hydro set up would make me look like a pro, and i cant have that if the worse happens, where as soil i can just say i got some seeds in some bud i bought and stuck them in pots and added water, so i can play the soil grow down, but hydro id have a tough time explaining it, plus i get enough of my plants to last me between grows and the autos work well for this with their short veg and flower time,

 

[teSmp]

Alright let me know how you like those videos, they're pretty impressive.. And I kind of get your logic but to be honest I don't think it would work out that way. In my mind 1-3 hydro (OR soil) plants would like better in front of any judge then 10-15 hydro OR soil plants. I'm not going to try and convince you or anything because I want you to do what makes you feel comfortable.. I'm certainly not a lawyer, but I'm pretty sure I'm right. And I don't think playing stupid would work in your favor, saying it's for personal use and sticking to that would be much better... Just think for a second, would 10-15 plants look better or 1-3 (regardless of growing medium)? And which one of those options would you have a better time explaing was for personal use?

 

[miwa]

i like things nice and easy..hydro i had to keep close watch on the ph..had to learn when i had too much nutes ..too much nutes and your plant will just drink water then there goes your ph...ran me back to soil...but i'm not finished...probably do a drain to waste or something...already know how to do a DWC and drip method...i'm just amazed at the difference in those videos...between water and soil...

 

[teSmp]

i like things nice and easy..hydro i had to keep close watch on the ph..had to learn when i had too much nutes ..too much nutes and your plant will just drink water then there goes your ph...ran me back to soil...but i'm not finished...probably do a drain to waste or something...already know how to do a DWC and drip method...i'm just amazed at the difference in those videos...between water and soil...

That's odd... Was your environment dialed when you tried it? Your going to have continuous problems if your temps are above 82F with a DWC... To me hydro is 10x easier. Sure I check the pH/PPM once a day and adjust, but that takes me 2 minutes. Everything else does itself.

 

[donpaul.p]

i get what you saying mate, my aim is to only have 6 plants at a time, but i planted all my regular seeds to get them out the way so my plant numbers are higher than i want them to be, but ill be weeding out the weaker clones and any males from seeds, id prefer to have say 4 -6 plants in flower that i can take clones from and also plant new seeds, so id like a 6 plant rotation, but this means i need at least 12 plants in total, id like to get enough bud so i can just have the 6 plants from start to finish then once i harvest them ill plant some more or use clones, im hoping this fridge clone idea works cuz this would mean i could take clones and store them in the fridge till the plants have finished flowering then i could plant the clones and seeds and still stick to a max of 6 plants, but for now ive got the ones in flower and some in veg, but this time round im going to get more bud so im hoping i can sort it out better,
this is where the scrog idea sounds good, i mean 1 plant filling a 3ft by 3ft room would give me the amounts of bud i need to keep me growing between grows, i am thinking whats best to do, once these have flowered off ill be able to start planning where i want to go next, im not comfortable with what i got now and its always in the back of my mind, but if i planted only fem seeds then id have less plants, but i planted all my reg seeds to get them out the way.

i cant do a sog due to the numbers needed, but a scrog would solve that problem, so i am leaning towards doing a big scrog with a monster cropped clone, so once i have got these 6 plants in flower out the way, ill move my plants i have got in veg under the hps and weed out the weak clones and males, this will then leave me with just them plants to deal with, thats when i can start thinking about setting up a scrog, after watching teSmp's scrog it really does look like the best option for me, but i got a few weeks to go before i can start thinking about that.

but i will be doing a 3ft by 3ft scrog so watch this space,

 

[teSmp]

i get what you saying mate, my aim is to only have 6 plants at a time, but i planted all my regular seeds to get them out the way so my plant numbers are higher than i want them to be, but ill be weeding out the weaker clones and any males from seeds, id prefer to have say 4 -6 plants in flower that i can take clones from and also plant new seeds, so id like a 6 plant rotation, but this means i need at least 12 plants in total, id like to get enough bud so i can just have the 6 plants from start to finish then once i harvest them ill plant some more or use clones, im hoping this fridge clone idea works cuz this would mean i could take clones and store them in the fridge till the plants have finished flowering then i could plant the clones and seeds and still stick to a max of 6 plants, but for now ive got the ones in flower and some in veg, but this time round im going to get more bud so im hoping i can sort it out better,
this is where the scrog idea sounds good, i mean 1 plant filling a 3ft by 3ft room would give me the amounts of bud i need to keep me growing between grows, i am thinking whats best to do, once these have flowered off ill be able to start planning where i want to go next, im not comfortable with what i got now and its always in the back of my mind, but if i planted only fem seeds then id have less plants, but i planted all my reg seeds to get them out the way.

i cant do a sog due to the numbers needed, but a scrog would solve that problem, so i am leaning towards doing a big scrog with a monster cropped clone, so once i have got these 6 plants in flower out the way, ill move my plants i have got in veg under the hps and weed out the weak clones and males, this will then leave me with just them plants to deal with, thats when i can start thinking about setting up a scrog, after watching teSmp's scrog it really does look like the best option for me, but i got a few weeks to go before i can start thinking about that.

but i will be doing a 3ft by 3ft scrog so watch this space,

Yeah that's a good idea because that's all that is going through my head when you say you have to many plants it gets me nervous (not the way your growing them).. A seedling still counts as a plant.

I've seen so many soil SCROGs (including mine) that have nearly failed and it sucks.. The growth to fill the screen is slow and when you flower and expect it to stretch and fill up the screen + grow upwards to give you your 6-12" buds it never happens.. Regardless I think your right and a SCROG would best suit your needs and will keep you interested in your grow. I don't think there is much cooler indoors then seeing one plant fill an entire screen. I think since you plan on doing a 3x3 screen you could get a plant healthy enough that it still would stretch like it's supposed to but I'm not sure. You able to watch a video yet? Or do you have to watch it at your moms because the internet?

 

[donpaul.p]

i dont need to be getting paranoid by having to many plants, so i need to get the numbers down, once these regular seeds are out the way i can then rest a bit easier at night without wondering if the front door is going to get put through, i know my dog will keep em back as long as poss so id have the chance to pull a few plants out the pots but only with the small plants, couldnt do it with the bigger plants but the small ones i could get rid of before they get in, but its not going to happen is it, touch wood, but yep i need my numbers down, a handful of plants would make me feel much better.

ill check the vids when i go over my moms tomorrow mate, she having the kids for a bit cuz their off school n i got stuff i need to get done so ill check the vids tomorrow mate, how many plants would i need for a 3 by 3 scrog, would 2 do it or would you go with more,