Colorful Sunset Sherbet Clones DWC

[HunterHunt]

Yea man for sure. Just checking in here and there. Im on auto pilot over here. Soil and mega crop. Easiest growing I have ever done with crazy results. No checking anything lol. No pH or PPM pens. Simple. I love it. Keep up the good work!

 

[Michael Hunt]

Well folks, i think i messed up our scrog already.

We went out of town for 4 days. In preparation i refilled the res, turned the chiller down to try and slow growth a bit, and set the fan pretty high to keep air temps down as well. I forgot to turn the thermostat off though, so the fan cut off completely for what i would assume to be most of the time we were gone. Temps got to the low 70’s and humidity spiked to about 75%.

Normally this would be great but we were trying to slow the growth down while away. Not what happened at all. They exploded! And drank a ton of water. They had to have doubled in size in 4 days, and drank nearly 10 gallons of water in the same time.

going to have to do another major haircut tonight to see what we are working with. But its ridiculous. Check em out!

And here’s a cool leaf

Thats it for now.

If there is anyone with scrog experience willing to lend some knowledge I'm all ears. Should we add a second screen? Just flower them out as is and hope for the best? Make an attempt at pinching branches and getting them back under the net? The branches have gotten FAT and they are definitely not soft down by the netting anymore.

Any input is greatly appreciated and i hope everyone out there has a wonderful day!

 

[Jon]

Well folks, i think i messed up our scrog already.

We went out of town for 4 days. In preparation i refilled the res, turned the chiller down to try and slow growth a bit, and set the fan pretty high to keep air temps down as well. I forgot to turn the thermostat off though, so the fan cut off completely for what i would assume to be most of the time we were gone. Temps got to the low 70’s and humidity spiked to about 75%.

Normally this would be great but we were trying to slow the growth down while away. Not what happened at all. They exploded! And drank a ton of water. They had to have doubled in size in 4 days, and drank nearly 10 gallons of water in the same time.

going to have to do another major haircut tonight to see what we are working with. But its ridiculous. Check em out!

And here’s a cool leaf

Thats it for now.

If there is anyone with scrog experience willing to lend some knowledge I'm all ears. Should we add a second screen? Just flower them out as is and hope for the best? Make an attempt at pinching branches and getting them back under the net? The branches have gotten FAT and they are definitely not soft down by the netting anymore.

Any input is greatly appreciated and i hope everyone out there has a wonderful day!

Damn man those things went apeshit on you. That's crazy. Look at it as a testament to the health of your plants to this point!

I am scared of this exact same thing happening. And I don't have scrog experience. But I do have SOME knowledge and a lot of logic. As you describe the strength of the stems, it doesn't sound like tucking all that under the first screen is an option, so it sounds like you've ruled that out. If I were in your position I'd do one of three things, and I'm not sure which would be best:

- Install a second screen about six inches or eight inches above the other and bend all those puppies under the second screen, then grow the second screen out keeping everything there. Then flip em.
- Supercrop all those branches, flatten out the existing screen that way, tuck what I could under the screen, and wait a few days and flip em.
- Install the second screen, but supercrop just the tallest of those crazy girls and get the tallest ones on the first screen. Let them repair, get stronger, and maybe even send you some extra shoots right up top, as I understand supercropping can do. Get the second screen the way you want it and flip em.

They look really healthy man. I wouldn't sweat what you have going on. It's an opportunity, not a problem. Heh. But I would flip them soon cuz I can see the potential there for those puppies to get out of control big. Do you know what to expect in terms of stretch regarding the strains you're growing? They are going to be BIG it looks like.

You could have worse problems. I'd be scared shitless to go away and leave my babies for four days. And there's not a babysitter on earth that I trust to do what I would do. Lol.

Anyway, for what it's worth from a reasonably educated novice grower. Good luck!

 

[Jon]

Damn man those things went apeshit on you. That's crazy. Look at it as a testament to the health of your plants to this point!

I am scared of this exact same thing happening. And I don't have scrog experience. But I do have SOME knowledge and a lot of logic. As you describe the strength of the stems, it doesn't sound like tucking all that under the first screen is an option, so it sounds like you've ruled that out. If I were in your position I'd do one of three things, and I'm not sure which would be best:

- Install a second screen about six inches or eight inches above the other and bend all those puppies under the second screen, then grow the second screen out keeping everything there. Then flip em.
- Supercrop all those branches, flatten out the existing screen that way, tuck what I could under the screen, and wait a few days and flip em.
- Install the second screen, but supercrop just the tallest of those crazy girls and get the tallest ones on the first screen. Let them repair, get stronger, and maybe even send you some extra shoots right up top, as I understand supercropping can do. Get the second screen the way you want it and flip em.

They look really healthy man. I wouldn't sweat what you have going on. It's an opportunity, not a problem. Heh. But I would flip them soon cuz I can see the potential there for those puppies to get out of control big. Do you know what to expect in terms of stretch regarding the strains you're growing? They are going to be BIG it looks like.

You could have worse problems. I'd be scared shitless to go away and leave my babies for four days. And there's not a babysitter on earth that I trust to do what I would do. Lol.

Anyway, for what it's worth from a reasonably educated novice grower. Good luck!

BTW, I have the same intake from above thing going on as you do. I see in your picture that you have the hose exiting down by the plants on the one side. That's ok, but what I did was have it so the hose basically exits on top of the lights. This cools the lights, but it also diffuses the air coming in so that it rains down into the tent evenly, versus all at the one spot where it potentially affects one or two plants with temperature changes more so than any of the others. If you have CO2 it also help drag the CO2 down onto the plants cuz cold air = heavier air. It's kind of a win win win, and with the hood of your light shaped how it is it would diffuse perfectly into your tent if you did it that way. Again, I'm a rookie and it's just what's working for me, but I bet it would improve your situation, and also get that hose out of your way.

 

[HunterHunt]

Looking good man! Your space is to small and to many plants for a true SCROG. You could SCROG one plant in that space max two. Just use it for a support net and install a second one above. You should be getting set up to flower soon or you will run into the same problem with the 2nd net. I want my tops flowering as they grow through the 2nd net so its a firm support for the colas. Your net is so low to your plants its almost not needed since you are not doing any type of training with it really. My first net goes like 3 feet away from the bottom but I like bigger plants.

You could always move the net up more and train a little more. You have holes to fill before the 2nd net. Everyone of those holes should have a cola in it in a perfect world =). Mine never do. Also its really hard to slow plants. Best way to "slow" them is top them.

 

[Michael Hunt]

Damn man those things went apeshit on you. That's crazy. Look at it as a testament to the health of your plants to this point!

I am scared of this exact same thing happening. And I don't have scrog experience. But I do have SOME knowledge and a lot of logic. As you describe the strength of the stems, it doesn't sound like tucking all that under the first screen is an option, so it sounds like you've ruled that out. If I were in your position I'd do one of three things, and I'm not sure which would be best:

- Install a second screen about six inches or eight inches above the other and bend all those puppies under the second screen, then grow the second screen out keeping everything there. Then flip em.
- Supercrop all those branches, flatten out the existing screen that way, tuck what I could under the screen, and wait a few days and flip em.
- Install the second screen, but supercrop just the tallest of those crazy girls and get the tallest ones on the first screen. Let them repair, get stronger, and maybe even send you some extra shoots right up top, as I understand supercropping can do. Get the second screen the way you want it and flip em.

They look really healthy man. I wouldn't sweat what you have going on. It's an opportunity, not a problem. Heh. But I would flip them soon cuz I can see the potential there for those puppies to get out of control big. Do you know what to expect in terms of stretch regarding the strains you're growing? They are going to be BIG it looks like.

You could have worse problems. I'd be scared shitless to go away and leave my babies for four days. And there's not a babysitter on earth that I trust to do what I would do. Lol.

Anyway, for what it's worth from a reasonably educated novice grower. Good luck!

Thanks man. They definitely went apeshit. We were a little overwhelmed upon opening the tent for the first time back. It was pretty nerve wreaking to leave em for that long but that was my whole point behind building a recirculating system. Having a larger volume of water so that we had a little more flexibility with our time. Probably going to build a second screen and just even out the canopy that way. This strain stretches and gets out of control in no time. Obviously lol. Our last run grew right up into the light and yielded us around 15oz of smokable buds. The second screen is going in ASAP cuz i expect to see at least an 18" stretch before they finally stop. At least that's what their mother did on the last run. But that was also without a net

BTW, I have the same intake from above thing going on as you do. I see in your picture that you have the hose exiting down by the plants on the one side. That's ok, but what I did was have it so the hose basically exits on top of the lights. This cools the lights, but it also diffuses the air coming in so that it rains down into the tent evenly, versus all at the one spot where it potentially affects one or two plants with temperature changes more so than any of the others. If you have CO2 it also help drag the CO2 down onto the plants cuz cold air = heavier air. It's kind of a win win win, and with the hood of your light shaped how it is it would diffuse perfectly into your tent if you did it that way. Again, I'm a rookie and it's just what's working for me, but I bet it would improve your situation, and also get that hose out of your way.

I've considered moving that vent up but there is actually another vent open down low on the other side to bring cool air up through the canopy. I'm not planning on moving the tube vent above the light expecting to need all the space i have up there for the stretch. I swore to myself and the misses i wouldn't let them outgrow the tent again. So much for that

 

[Michael Hunt]

Looking good man! Your space is to small and to many plants for a true SCROG. You could SCROG one plant in that space max two. Just use it for a support net and install a second one above. You should be getting set up to flower soon or you will run into the same problem with the 2nd net. I want my tops flowering as they grow through the 2nd net so its a firm support for the colas. Your net is so low to your plants its almost not needed since you are not doing any type of training with it really. My first net goes like 3 feet away from the bottom but I like bigger plants.

You could always move the net up more and train a little more. You have holes to fill before the 2nd net. Everyone of those holes should have a cola in it in a perfect world =). Mine never do. Also its really hard to slow plants. Best way to "slow" them is top them.

Thanks for the input @HunterNitro

I figured this isn't really a true scrog but being the first time using any kind of netting so we're having fun using the term anyways

I'm gonna "retry" with the second net to even everything out a little better since the two on the right are so much further along that the ones on the left. We still have a pile of yoyo's from the last harvest so if we need more support down the road, we've got it covered. I considered topping them again before we left. Last time we topped the new growth exploded. I cant imagine what they would look like had we topped them again before we left. Thought some abnormally low root temps would do the trick but they just thrived. Didn't even bother turning the chiller back up. Clearly they like cold toes

 

[Jon]

Thanks man. They definitely went apeshit. We were a little overwhelmed upon opening the tent for the first time back. It was pretty nerve wreaking to leave em for that long but that was my whole point behind building a recirculating system. Having a larger volume of water so that we had a little more flexibility with our time. Probably going to build a second screen and just even out the canopy that way. This strain stretches and gets out of control in no time. Obviously lol. Our last run grew right up into the light and yielded us around 15oz of smokable buds. The second screen is going in ASAP cuz i expect to see at least an 18" stretch before they finally stop. At least that's what their mother did on the last run. But that was also without a net


I've considered moving that vent up but there is actually another vent open down low on the other side to bring cool air up through the canopy. I'm not planning on moving the tube vent above the light expecting to need all the space i have up there for the stretch. I swore to myself and the misses i wouldn't let them outgrow the tent again. So much for that

Yeah I swore to myself I wouldn't let them outgrow the tent this time no matter what. Lol. Good that you know what to expect cuz of a previous run. Sweet. So what, does it only qualify as a "true" scrog if EVERY hole is filled with a bud? What's a "true" scrog?

 

[Michael Hunt]

Yeah I swore to myself I wouldn't let them outgrow the tent this time no matter what. Lol. Good that you know what to expect cuz of a previous run. Sweet. So what, does it only qualify as a "true" scrog if EVERY hole is filled with a bud? What's a "true" scrog?

Honestly, I'm not entirely sure. To me, its a grow with a net that has as many squares filled as possible. Probably over 75%. I'm sure there is a far more accurate answer to that question though.

 

[HunterHunt]

@Jon , SCROG is simple. Build a net just like Michael Hunt has and as the plant grows you tuck everything under the net and spread it out. Every new growth that pokes up you keep tucking and spreading. After a few weeks your net will be around 75% full. Flip to flower, continue to tuck for a week or two through the stretch, let them grow up through your holes for about a week through the end of stretch so you have nice colas sticking up in each hole. Cut every thing under the net thats not on the canopy top, and you have a perfect flat top of nothing but colas. All even and they will all be the same size. It just maximizes light to the coals and keeps everything even. Its works good as long as you can keep humidity low if you pack them tight. This is a good method to pull 1lb+ from a single plant if you have the wattage.

Here is a two plant scrog I did in the past:

 

[Jon]

@Jon , SCROG is simple. Build a net just like Michael Hunt has and as the plant grows you tuck everything under the net and spread it out. Every new growth that pokes up you keep tucking and spreading. After a few weeks your net will be around 75% full. Flip to flower, continue to tuck for a week or two through the stretch, let them grow up through your holes for about a week through the end of stretch so you have nice colas sticking up in each hole. Cut every thing under the net thats not on the canopy top, and you have a perfect flat top of nothing but colas. All even and they will all be the same size. It just maximizes light to the coals and keeps everything even. Its works good as long as you can keep humidity low if you pack them tight. This is a good method to pull 1lb+ from a single plant if you have the wattage.

Here is a two plant scrog I did in the past:

Hey Hunter, thank you. Yes, that's precisely my understanding and what I intend to do. In fact I have the exact same 2 x 4 screen with 4 x 4 legs. I use eyelet hooks screwed into the wood all around to weave the string, which gives me an extra 3/4" if I string using the loop instead of around the base. I use the 2 x 4s so that I have a frame all the way around to lean on from the wheelchair while I work the plants, otherwise I'd make the same thing out of PVC. I put furniture pads on the bottom of mine so they don't tear my silver floor. And since you can put it so the screen is on the top or bottom of the screen frame, it buys you another four inches if you want it. I'm adding a four inch block to mine before I put it in this time so that when it's all said and done the screen itself will be 34" off the floor of the tent. That makes the full screen start there at flowering, and even if they double in size or more I have the space since the light is way low profile by design. And at that height the screen will be 24" from dirt surface level when I flip them to flower. If I get anything near the scrog consistency and yield you got from the one in the picture I'm going to be the happiest second time grower who ever lived. Honestly, that's one of the best scrogs I've ever even seen a picture of, especially for two damn plants. WAY pro. Yield must have been fantastic. It's beautiful. Great work. So basically in my mind I had something that looks very much like your picture. That's exactly and precisely my goal. Thanks so much for posting.

Here's a question. In terms of keeping the screen as consistent as possible with five plants in the 5x5, I have chosen a five pattern like the five on dice. Isn't that the most logical way to fill the screen evenly?

Thanks!

Jon

 

[Jon]

@Jon , SCROG is simple. Build a net just like Michael Hunt has and as the plant grows you tuck everything under the net and spread it out. Every new growth that pokes up you keep tucking and spreading. After a few weeks your net will be around 75% full. Flip to flower, continue to tuck for a week or two through the stretch, let them grow up through your holes for about a week through the end of stretch so you have nice colas sticking up in each hole. Cut every thing under the net thats not on the canopy top, and you have a perfect flat top of nothing but colas. All even and they will all be the same size. It just maximizes light to the coals and keeps everything even. Its works good as long as you can keep humidity low if you pack them tight. This is a good method to pull 1lb+ from a single plant if you have the wattage.

Here is a two plant scrog I did in the past:

Dude I just read your papaya grow journal. What a great grow. We are kindred spirits. I LOVE OCD, and rarely do I see OCD on my insane level, or at least that's my self perception, lol. Check out my current journal - my second grow. Two 5 x 5s. I like everything just so, like you. You are an inspiration. I'd love for you to stop by and lemme know how I'm doing so far!

 

[Michael Hunt]

After a few hours of trimming, bending, and pulling, we managed to get all 4 ladies back under their net. I’d say its a whole lot closer to 75% now

Picked up a new timer as well to start the 12/12 cycle tomorrow. Cleaned and refilled the res with the first week of the transition period doses. Still keeping the ph around 5.8 and the temps at 69* in the canopy with the light on. Rh says 63% but the probe is literally sitting on the canopy of leaves.

and the carnage. Probably the biggest pile of leaves i have ever taken from plants that were still this young. Probably gonna trim one more time early in the stretch and then leave them be.

 

[Jon]

After a few hours of trimming, bending, and pulling, we managed to get all 4 ladies back under their net. I’d say its a whole lot closer to 75% now

Picked up a new timer as well to start the 12/12 cycle tomorrow. Cleaned and refilled the res with the first week of the transition period doses. Still keeping the ph around 5.8 and the temps at 69* in the canopy with the light on. Rh says 63% but the probe is literally sitting on the canopy of leaves.

and the carnage. Probably the biggest pile of leaves i have ever taken from plants that were still this young. Probably gonna trim one more time early in the stretch and then leave them be.

Beautiful job man. I knew you'd get that under control. That screen looks to be as close to perfectly ready to flip as my inexperienced eyes can imagine. I have several questions if you don't mind a little peppering, lol.

So is your experience that filling the screen 75% of the way is the way to go? Does it get too overgrown if you fill beyond that? And now once you flip, can you talk a little bit about what you do through the stretch? How exactly do you "set" the bud sites to come up and fill holes? What kind of pattern do you use with the branches? Is the end of each branch (presumably the cola, right?) at a hole?

The part of the scrog method between flipping to 12/12 and when the stretch ends and they are pretty much done growing vertically is the part I am confused about. What do you do?

 

[Michael Hunt]

Beautiful job man. I knew you'd get that under control. That screen looks to be as close to perfectly ready to flip as my inexperienced eyes can imagine. I have several questions if you don't mind a little peppering, lol.

So is your experience that filling the screen 75% of the way is the way to go? Does it get too overgrown if you fill beyond that? And now once you flip, can you talk a little bit about what you do through the stretch? How exactly do you "set" the bud sites to come up and fill holes? What kind of pattern do you use with the branches? Is the end of each branch (presumably the cola, right?) at a hole?

The part of the scrog method between flipping to 12/12 and when the stretch ends and they are pretty much done growing vertically is the part I am confused about. What do you do?

Thanks man!
I’ll do my best hehe. The 75% thing is just what i’ve read a few places. I dont see any reason you couldnt go beyond that especially if your a fan of removing big leaves. But it would definitely get crowded if you left every big fan on at 100%.

At this point, we’re flying by the seat of our pants. The plan is to just do what feels right throughout the stretch. It will drag on for a few weeks at least so we have some time to figure it out.

As for what we’ve been doing on deciding where to put branches. It all depends on the branch really. Which way is it growing and what is the furthest hole the top of the branch will reach out to. Then we let all the side bud sites fill in the holes that were left open from stretching her out.

We give the lower sites a few days to try and peek up through the canopy and find a home. If they don't make it, they get chopped. Setting a higher bar for these girls than the last one we grew.

attempting this “scrog” and running a RDWC system for the first time has us learning constantly. So this is by no means experienced advice

 

[Jon]

Thanks man!
I’ll do my best hehe. The 75% thing is just what i’ve read a few places. I dont see any reason you couldnt go beyond that especially if your a fan of removing big leaves. But it would definitely get crowded if you left every big fan on at 100%.

At this point, we’re flying by the seat of our pants. The plan is to just do what feels right throughout the stretch. It will drag on for a few weeks at least so we have some time to figure it out.

As for what we’ve been doing on deciding where to put branches. It all depends on the branch really. Which way is it growing and what is the furthest hole the top of the branch will reach out to. Then we let all the side bud sites fill in the holes that were left open from stretching her out.

We give the lower sites a few days to try and peek up through the canopy and find a home. If they don't make it, they get chopped. Setting a higher bar for these girls than the last one we grew.

attempting this “scrog” and running a RDWC system for the first time has us learning constantly. So this is by no means experienced advice

Thanks for the input! And understood. Yes, I plan to *strategically* remove big fan leaves, mostly if they are blocking lower potential bud sites. But I'll leave as many as I possibly can until I do the "big" chop of all the stuff underneath the established canopy once it's filled out. I love that chop. As you say, I'll let the plants dictate that stuff. I'm excited to see what happens in the next two weeks for your stretch, and see if/when the second screen goes in, if you need it, etc... Gonna be excellent learning for me, lol. Thanks for the coattails.

 

[Michael Hunt]

Thanks for the input! And understood. Yes, I plan to *strategically* remove big fan leaves, mostly if they are blocking lower potential bud sites. But I'll leave as many as I possibly can until I do the "big" chop of all the stuff underneath the established canopy once it's filled out. I love that chop. As you say, I'll let the plants dictate that stuff. I'm excited to see what happens in the next two weeks for your stretch, and see if/when the second screen goes in, if you need it, etc... Gonna be excellent learning for me, lol. Thanks for the coattails.

Always happy to help man That's what this place is for.

Oh a second screen will definitely be necessary. These branches aren't as strong as they look and really struggled to hold the buds up last run. We ended up using a few dozen yoyo's to support everything. It was a crazy mess. And we are NOT doing that again damnit lol.

 

[Michael Hunt]

The canopy has already already filled in and looks like i was never in there hacking and cutting no more than 24 hrs ago.

Night one of 12/12 complete. Only about 74 more to go!

 

[Michael Hunt]

Another little peek in the tent this morning before the lights shut off. Also a shot of the underbelly and some pistils they’re been throwing for a week or 2 now.

some stats for those who like numbers

Air temp lights on: 70*
Air temp lights off: 60*

Rh lights on: 55% above canopy, 67% below
Rh lights off: 68% above canopy, 75% below (this needs to be fixed)

Water temps are being held between 65-67* thanks to the chiller. Which barey runs now that the canopy has finally filled in and covered the buckets from the light.

ph is being kept between 5.7 and 6.0 and the girls seem happy about it.

Ppm and EC are still being eyeballed. Since my meter broke and im too stubborn to buy a new one. The last one barely ran a year and it was a decent meter. So until i can find a new probe, the ol eyeballs will just have to do!

Happy friday everyone! We finally made it to the weekend

 

[Jon]

Another little peek in the tent this morning before the lights shut off. Also a shot of the underbelly and some pistils they’re been throwing for a week or 2 now.

some stats for those who like numbers

Air temp lights on: 70*
Air temp lights off: 60*

Rh lights on: 55% above canopy, 67% below
Rh lights off: 68% above canopy, 75% below (this needs to be fixed)

Water temps are being held between 65-67* thanks to the chiller. Which barey runs now that the canopy has finally filled in and covered the buckets from the light.

ph is being kept between 5.7 and 6.0 and the girls seem happy about it.

Ppm and EC are still being eyeballed. Since my meter broke and im too stubborn to buy a new one. The last one barely ran a year and it was a decent meter. So until i can find a new probe, the ol eyeballs will just have to do!

Happy friday everyone! We finally made it to the weekend

That's a nice looking screen man. Yeah, you probably don't want different Rh numbers above and below the canopy. I assume the answer is a bit of targeted defoliation to open up spots for air flow and maybe a couple fans blowing upwards into the underside of the canopy? Seems all you need to do is make it so the air moves around the tent more effectively, right? Isn't that a problem that can be solved with fans inside the tent, and adjusting the intake and/or exhaust systems? I have two fans for under the canopy and two fans for above the canopy when the time comes. Sweet looking budsites man. Can't wait to see how you yield. What day of flower is this? Are they stretching yet? I didn't notice any tucking in the picture?