Brightlight's Strain Fest: Organics & LED

[Duggan]

re: Brightlight's Strain Fest - Organics & LED

Pro Mix is almost 100% Organic! There is a very minute amount of a wetting agent in the mix...that's it,..it's all organic after that. So , i suppose you are correct , if you need 100% .

 

[GodOfPot]

re: Brightlight's Strain Fest - Organics & LED

Thank you for the replies

Currently I'm not organic and am using ProMix HP as is, but that was just a decision based on timing, I'm not set in my ways about anything, still so much to learn!
I don't have problems with using synthetics(for now anyways) if they're beneficial to me, but I have a far ways to come yet still lol

Also, not looking for the easy way out love to read about stuff and be completely hands on with my plants

 

[GodOfPot]

re: Brightlight's Strain Fest - Organics & LED

Hey all, looking for some advice on my medium(50% promix HP, 25% perlite, 25% vermiculite)

Generally when I water, the water completely mixes in with the medium and you see a good mix of both water and the "soil" floating around. The past 2-3 feedings I've noticed that it seems to be the water is pooling more on top and the medium really isn't mixing in as the water runs through, the medium has become more "clumpy" or "solid like" opposed to seeing lots of individual particles floating and mixing around(just see perlite floating around now)... anyone know why that is?
I know my medium, has become more acidic lately(not completely sure why, could be the peat breaking down or over use of PH down in my water?)I picked up some dolomitic lime today to start raising the PH up, I'll start with trying to raise .5, in 5 gal smart pots how much should I try to put into each one to achieve a .5 increase? Pots are pretty filled, maybe like 90-95% topped

As always thank you for your advice & wisdom!

 

[brightlight]

re: Brightlight's Strain Fest - Organics & LED

Use a Yucca product. Yucca is a saponin = wetting agent. Also helps w/ nutrient chelation. Works real well...watch liquid go straight down.

 

[Skunkworkz]

re: Brightlight's Strain Fest - Organics & LED

ProMix, is utter bollocks to grow cannabis in. Just shite. I'll just pop in & chime in "Switch to coco!" And go grab a ️

 

[GodOfPot]

re: Brightlight's Strain Fest - Organics & LED

Use a Yucca product. Yucca is a saponin = wetting agent. Also helps w/ nutrient chelation. Works real well...watch liquid go straight down.

It's not so much that the water isn't draining down cause it is, it's like I need to take a hand held garden hose or something to the surface just to break it up some, and I'm wondering if there's a reason behind that or if it's just something that occurs over time.

ProMix, is utter bollocks to grow cannabis in. Just shite. I'll just pop in & chime in "Switch to coco!" And go grab a ️

I have a huge bag of the shite too, if I do make a switch though, I'm leaning towards LOS.

Thanks again

 

[Skunkworkz]

re: Brightlight's Strain Fest - Organics & LED

Fun Fact: "ProMix", translated from very polite but sneaky Canuckistan . to God-fearing . USA . Freedom English means "mud."

 

[Van Stank]

re: Brightlight's Strain Fest - Organics & LED

Hey bright, looking for a good read on LOS, something that talks about the principals to it, how it works etc... figure since you're the one who opened my eyes to it, here's a good first place to ask .

This is an excellent thread here on 420 for growing in Organic Soil. Great info and still very active if you have specific questions.

Building a Better Soil - Demonstrations & Discussions of Organic Soil Recipes

 

[NorCaliwood]

re: Brightlight's Strain Fest - Organics & LED

I seen a pretty wildberry a page or two back........... Mine are slow growing bushes. But then I topped them afew times,, and have they vegging in 1 gallon pots till I get space... Both are realllllly bushy plants... Hope they crank out some buddage like yours are doing.... Sweet looking shit my friend.. Keepem Green

 

[GodOfPot]

re: Brightlight's Strain Fest - Organics & LED

This is an excellent thread here on 420 for growing in Organic Soil. Great info and still very active if you have specific questions.

Building a Better Soil - Demonstrations & Discussions of Organic Soil Recipes

Thank you...I think most of my confusion has come with all the different terms used like Super Soil vs LOS vs ROLS vs HiBrix etc.....

When I first started I got turned off of "super soil" with the whole idea of "just add water", so I didn't read into it a lot because just doesn't seem like fun only adding water

When BL came along and talked about all these "enhancers" he uses it seems a lot more interesting and a lot more involved, which spiked my interest a lot... Still have a lot to read about because I still don't fully understand the difference between building a super soil in which you just water, or the idea like BL does where you're adding enhancers etc...

Definitely scroll through that thread this weekend sometime and read into it more .

 

[Duggan]

re: Brightlight's Strain Fest - Organics & LED

Top of the day to ya BL, GOP , and friends! A thought GOP,...you could try Doc Bud's 'kit' in ProMix,..as someone else has said it pretty much guarantees you success , but with lots of room for tweaking things yourself , while not compromising yield , quality or consistency! It's ALMOST 100% organic using PM with Doc's gear too. Take a stroll thru some of the High Brix journals and see all of our success. I was where you are about 30 yrs. ago and tried just about every medium and method. Doc's gear takes most of the guess work out of it while still affording the chance to learn about things ..A LOT! I am more than happy using DBHBB....now i have time to enjoy my grows!
Just my 2 on the subject....anyone knowing me ,...seen this coming . Cheers BL, GOP and friends. Have a terrific Thanksgiving Day weekend!

 

[Skunkworkz]

re: Brightlight's Strain Fest - Organics & LED

re. Nutrients; I'm going to go with "The most efficient (& therefore best) way from Point A to Point B is a straight line."
The more new growers "tweak" things, the more they fuck things up. The counter-argument being "If they don't fuck up, they won't learn" is really imo just a cop-out. They'll get wrecked, and learn, from plenty of other hobgoblin variables, outside of plant nutrition. So, keep plant nutrition alchemy WAY out of the early "tweak & learn" lexicon, unless the new grower wants to smoke a LOT of shitty pot. For years.
I was talking to some grower friends recently, probably sixty years experience between us, and only one of us (and him only once) could recall ever smoking exceptional, "organic" marijuana. (Cue: Gnashing of teeth, cries for my head etc.) And yes, I know how BL grows, and I think it's great-and very interesting. As to consistent results, I believe he'd tell you that it's an art form, and a grossly complex science when you combine cannabis with indoor growing/lights/microbes, so results will be varied. He's been doing it long enough to have amassed a record of Catastrophic Fails, (As have I. Failure builds character. Which doesn't make it suck any less. But I digress.) and via those, has gained enough experience & wisdom, to pull off organic grows that make him happy. (And look amazing.) YRMV.
That said, in my playbook, every noob should go buy a simple gallon of Floralicous Bloom, google "Lucas Formula" & grab their ph pen. Too. Fucking. Easy. So then they can focus their attention on more important things, like the cat invading their grow tent or the neighbors complaining that the $89 iPower carbon scrubber they bought from Amazon isn't doing shit to cover the smell of the $40 single feminized seed he's flowering in the spare bedroom. Stuff like that.


Ok, ️


SFV

 

[Duggan]

re: Brightlight's Strain Fest - Organics & LED

Ah , yes Skunk , i couldn't agree with you more about failure , success "tweaking" things ,..all that. Beleive me, i have suffered thru many a grow , and as has been mentioned, the variables are far too numerous . IMHO finding fault in this system is futile. The growers and new ones too using Doc's gear are learning all the right things to do it properly , via minerals and microbes. As far as PH,...indoors in a soil mix of any kind , i'm surprised you still try to balance (manually) it. Anyhow , all that stuff being said , all i was trying to say , was you can still learn lots about growing without making all the mistakes we have made over the yrs. One of my reasons for being here , is to help new growers succeed , with their very first crop. Myself,...i don't have the time to watch growers make foolish errors , just to learn...fug that!
These days it costs an awful lot to outfit a good , functioning GR that can produce repeatedly. Why not start off 'good to go' Cheers Skunk , BL , Gray and friends.

 

[GodOfPot]

re: Brightlight's Strain Fest - Organics & LED

Appreciate the advice from both of you, thank you .
As to synthetic vs organic, the methodology used isn't the most important factor to me, the most important result is the end product with potency being the single most important factor.....of course there's going to be learning curves, there will be with whatever approach one decides to do, however, even when an experienced grower switches he's still going to experience pains with his new method as he learns, so to me choosing the better method, even though the growing pains are going to be harder at the beginning, is still worth it in the end, because whether one has to learn now or later how to do it the "best" way they can, they still have to learn.
I'm all for challenges and learning, I like to tackle things head on, I been buying bud for 25 years now without ever really knowing what it is or how it was grown, so if it takes a year of slugging it through the hardships to learn properly then that's what it takes, but at least you gain the knowledge of knowing that beyond the initial hardships, you and your bud will be that much better for it.
I began synthetic because of the ease of it and how quickly I started, I had seeds germinating before I had even decided on a medium lol, the goal was simple, I don't care about what the end product was, I care to learn the limits as much as I could, cop out or not, it was my philosophy heading in to my first grow, I got "lucky" in that I ended up with 2 males so that allowed me to "baby" my females more and "push" the limits of my males hard, which is exactly what I've done, and the biggest thing I learned was that cannabis isn't as fragile as so many people make it out to be, it is in fact a pretty resilient plant that can be pushed and bounce back. But during the whole first grow I knew that the method I chose would not give the "best" results, and so I've tried to poke and prod to see which method I find the most appealing, and BLs is def what stuck out the most..... Yes he's a well experienced vet, and I'll experience lots of growing pains trying to learn from his style, but I think it'll be worth it in the end, I've already started gearing up to move my grows to this style(hopefully implemented in time for next grow) because I do believe it is among the very best, and I personally don't like settling for anything less then I know I'm capable of doing, so this is the direction I'm headed, and of course there'll be catastrophes along the path, but that's what's great about community is they're here to help each other evolve and learn, and to prevent catastrophes before they occur .

 

[bobrown14]

re: Brightlight's Strain Fest - Organics & LED

re. Nutrients; I’m going to go with “The most efficient (& therefore best) way from Point A to Point B is a straight line.”
The more new growers “tweak” things, the more they fuck things up. The counter-argument being “If they don’t fuck up, they won’t learn” is really imo just a cop-out. They’ll get wrecked, and learn, from plenty of other hobgoblin variables, outside of plant nutrition. So, keep plant nutrition alchemy WAY out of the early “tweak & learn” lexicon, unless the new grower wants to smoke a LOT of shitty pot. For years.
I was talking to some grower friends recently, probably sixty years experience between us, and only one of us (and him only once) could recall ever smoking exceptional, “organic” marijuana. (Cue: Gnashing of teeth, cries for my head etc.) And yes, I know how BL grows, and I think it’s great-and very interesting. As to consistent results, I believe he’d tell you that it’s an art form, and a grossly complex science when you combine cannabis with indoor growing/lights/microbes, so results will be varied. He’s been doing it long enough to have amassed a record of Catastrophic Fails, (As have I. Failure builds character. Which doesn’t make it suck any less. But I digress.) and via those, has gained enough experience & wisdom, to pull off organic grows that make him happy. (And look amazing.) YRMV.
That said, in my playbook, every noob should go buy a simple gallon of Floralicous Bloom, google “Lucas Formula” & grab their ph pen. Too. Fucking. Easy. So then they can focus their attention on more important things, like the cat invading their grow tent or the neighbors complaining that the $89 iPower carbon scrubber they bought from Amazon isn’t doing shit to cover the smell of the $40 single feminized seed he’s flowering in the spare bedroom. Stuff like that.


Ok, ️

OK... I like your thought process!

For new guys that wanna wade into LOS or Doc Buds kit... ask yourself one question.

Do I like to fuck with my plants all the time... if answer = yes ... Doc Bud's kit will work for you.

Me... I don't mess with my plants. Proven fact, the less I'm around the better the plants do without me as long as they are getting enough water.


That said, for LOS like we run and its the same indoors and out, get a soil recipe that works and follow it like you are baking a cake. Don't substitute don't add this or that, don't think more is better.... in fact don't think about it. The more thought the more chances for fuck ups..... and start reading about soil and microbes and how they work with plants. A little science goes a long way, and will keep your wallet in your back pocket .. errr well seeds are a thing, so warning seed purchases get addictive.

LOS is all about the compost.... we work 10x more on building compost than actually working in the gardens including weeding outside.

Pick your poison:

Pretty bottles of nutrients
Pretty seed packets

Oh yeah about peat moss... in Canada peat moss is strictly monitored and harvest quotas are controlled by the government.

ProMix is from a company called "Premier Horticulture". They sell a lot of different Peat products. ProMix is basically sold to the professional landscapers, the guys and gals that go around and cut your grass and plant your gardens etc. ProMix has a wetting agent (chemically made) and Mycos added into the bale.

They also sell the same product that is organically certified called "Premier Sphagnum Peat Moss" and it readily available at Lowes (where I get it) and HD and likely also at you local nursery as is the ProMix.

Both are Canadian so both products are "Canadian Sphagnum Peat Moss" - if you peat moss doesn't say its from Canada and sphagnum peat moss .. keep looking

The difference is Mycos and the wetting agent added into the ProMix. The price is $40 for the ProMix and $10 for the Premier ... same peat moss.

Sooo do we need the mykos and the wetting agent for our soil mix. Well I buy Mycos by the pound for $10 or so lasts me a year or longer.. indoors and out, so nope don't need that. Do we need the wetting agent. Well likely we will be adding Kelp Meal and Alfalfa Meal to our soil mix as well as the peat moss. Those 2 meals have saponins in spades (well the Alfalfa meal does). Saponins is what is used as a wetting agent. Saponins can be found in organic form, soap nuts is where we get ours... not that we need to add any into the soil mix but if we wanted to that would be an excellent source. Soap nuts we can get a year supply off ebay for $10 and that's using it for daily washing clothes, dishes, the house ... and it's an excellent soil drench.

So that extra $30 for that bale of ProMix... man I almost puked when I bought my first and only bale of it..... ahemmm how much??? It's Peat Moss WTF? Fancy lookin bag tho... and it has all the right words on it.

Gettin off my "SOAP" box... <---- haha see what I did there?

Gettin windy... my point... time to puff.

Love that pic of SFV there Skunk and love your attitude.

Pretty hard to mess up a whole grow in organic soil... sometimes I mess up outdoors in the garden but Canna in containers I've had pretty good luck. Any plants that are not stellar don't make it to flower room... very simple really. I've chopped as many plants down in VEG as I have in flower. Probably missed a few golden eggs but meh... girls better be working hard or they get the toss! Worms like em as much or more than me.

Happy worms happy farmers.

 

[brightlight]

re: Brightlight's Strain Fest - Organics & LED

It's not so much that the water isn't draining down cause it is, it's like I need to take a hand held garden hose or something to the surface just to break it up some, and I'm wondering if there's a reason behind that or if it's just something that occurs over time.

Thanks again

Ok so "crusty" at top of soil? Know what you mean....I get a gradual build-up up top myself from all the Ca & bone meal I use. Before I water I use my trusty back scratcher as a small rake/hoe to break/chop it up a little. I'll increase the SLF when this happens too.....breaks it down very well.

Here's pic of $3 back scratcher that's a handy small pot garden tool.

Thanks ALL for soil & nutrient thoughts. I was out shopping for seeds. JK.....well not completely.

 

[Pennywise]

re: Brightlight's Strain Fest - Organics & LED

Alwas gotta be on the lookout for new genetics.

 

[GodOfPot]

re: Brightlight's Strain Fest - Organics & LED

It's funny too cause my wife's family owns a peat moss field out east, and for years in the back of my head I always just wondered what peat moss was really used in lol
Glad to know it gets some great use .

SLF is on the list to come, for now I'll just break it up every time before I water it until I can grab some

Is it normal to see roots coming out the top of your soil? I'd take a pic but it's lights out right now

 

[Graytail]

re: Brightlight's Strain Fest - Organics & LED

Re: ProMix peat moss ...

Back a few years ago I called Premier for info about the various versions they offer, and managed to talk with a soil engineer. I learned that all the retail products they offer, including ProMix, start out the same. They simply balance pH with calcium - mixed carbonate and dolomite. Then the other additives go in. I've seen the bales of peat from Premier but I don't see any mention of pH, and we didn't discuss that product.

Is it pH balanced too, or do you add that yourself?

 

[Van Stank]

re: Brightlight's Strain Fest - Organics & LED

Thank you...I think most of my confusion has come with all the different terms used like Super Soil vs LOS vs ROLS vs HiBrix etc.....

When I first started I got turned off of "super soil" with the whole idea of "just add water", so I didn't read into it a lot because just doesn't seem like fun only adding water

When BL came along and talked about all these "enhancers" he uses it seems a lot more interesting and a lot more involved, which spiked my interest a lot... Still have a lot to read about because I still don't fully understand the difference between building a super soil in which you just water, or the idea like BL does where you're adding enhancers etc...

Definitely scroll through that thread this weekend sometime and read into it more .

I don't know. I scroll through a ton of journals from all different mediums and as I watch people try to figure out what they need to add in to fix this deficiency, or that deficiency and in some cases watched them try to figure it out for a few weeks and I thought "what a pain in the ass". Not to mention I watch the Coco growers that can't leave their girls alone for more than a day and in some cases have to feed their girls 2 or 3 times a day and I thought, screw that.

I grow in essentially a water only for the most part and I love it. I get what you are saying and I am expanding things I try just to see what they do in controlled situations. I love the fact that I can water my girls and leave them be for 4 days or so until they need another drink.

The reality is there is a lot you can do in a soil medium. You can do teas and foliars and what not, use some 'organic' nutes and other things if you want to and sure they can help. But if your soil is right you really don't have to do much if you don't want to.....and that is the appeal to me. I can play with it if I want, but I don't waste hours measuring PPMs, and Runoff PH and I am not handcuffed to my plant and unable to leave for a weekend if I want to. Not to mention the money I don't spend on all these nutrients and supplements.....more money for me to spend on seeds!!

In the end it really comes down to what kind of relationship you want to have with your plants. Do you want to spend a few minutes a day (if that) and get great buds or do you want to play around and try adding a little of this and a little of that and spend more time with them. There is no right or wrong answer, just your answer and you may find your choice changes as your grows progress. Either way, its a great joy for most of us regardless of what medium we grow in. Happy growings brother!!