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- #921
Winter Weedy Wonderland - Auto Grow - Royal Queen Seeds
- Thread starter Lady Cannafan
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Gee64
Well-Known Member
Yeah your auto problem is a real head scratcher. I wonder if that strain was available in both auto and photo, and they sent the wrong ones?
Gee64
Well-Known Member
That auto problem does buy you time to get your brix up tho
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- #924
I think I'm going to message RQS today. Maybe they can give some insight.
Yep, it is a head scratcher. I don't see it listed in the feminized choices, only in the Autos for the Mike Tyson line. The packaging definitely says "Auto".
Here's what some of the description says, mentioning a full cycle in as little as ten weeks. I'm not even flowering with these two yet at about 9 weeks in:
Growing Characteristics of GOAT’lato Auto Seeds
Left to her own devices, GOAT’lato Auto becomes a bulky heavyweight. However, growers can easily facilitate a weight cut using different training techniques to keep her small and light. Indoor plants grow to 70–120cm and produce up to 450g/m². In contrast, outdoor plants peak at a height of 160cm and are capable of producing up to 180g/plant. This speedy strain cruises through her entire growing cycle in as little as 10 weeks, making her ideal for those seeking a quick stash.Valid point.That auto problem does buy you time to get your brix up tho
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- #926
Okay, I'm still figuring out how to get the photos right on the brix tests. I didn't get a big sample, so I will try this again later today. Plants were fed/watered about hour+ ago. This is a sample from a middle lower leaf on Royal Gorilla who is being attacked the worst with the bugs.
I will do the VPD tests about 2 oclock today when the room is pretty stable temp from the overnight colder temp.
Is this photo not a good sample, or can you tell anything by it?
I will do the VPD tests about 2 oclock today when the room is pretty stable temp from the overnight colder temp.
Is this photo not a good sample, or can you tell anything by it?
Gee64
Well-Known Member
That looks like a 14, but it's pretty light. It may or may not be valid. If it is a 14 then your new growth shouldn't show any bug damage.Okay, I'm still figuring out how to get the photos right on the brix tests. I didn't get a big sample, so I will try this again later today. Plants were fed/watered about hour+ ago. This is a sample from a middle lower leaf on Royal Gorilla who is being attacked the worst with the bugs.
I will do the VPD tests about 2 oclock today when the room is pretty stable temp from the overnight colder temp.
Is this photo not a good sample, or can you tell anything by it?
It also has a crisp-ish calcium line and could use some, but if they were just fed, try another sample tomorrow. See what you get.
If it is a real 14 then bugs may still be running around on your leaves, but they shouldn't be feasting, so it is entirely possible that your bug issues may be showing up in the rear view mirror. If that's the case, pretty soon they will all be gone completely and new hatches will starve to death. Let's see what tomorrow brings.
If you have some unsulphured blackstrap molasses, then mixing some into some water, at about 2 tsp/gal and giving a full watering to runoff will give a big boost. You can only do it once or twice a grow, certainly no more than once a month, but it's a freebee boost of sugars that won't cause detriment and will boost them. It strengthens microbes and myco, but too often causes addiction and detriment.
If it doesn't say unsulphured, and many don't, just readcthe ingredients. If sulphur isn't listed, it's unsulphured. Needs to be blackstrap tho, it has a healthier nutrient profile.
Gee64
Well-Known Member
Converting to high brix mid grow is a lot of work, but you see it in action so it's worth it. Rebuilding soil with a good recipe and chasing brix right from day 1 is a lot less of a hassle, so don't despair. If you try it again next grow it's way easier.
You don't need to undo and then redo, it just is.
You don't need to undo and then redo, it just is.
Gee64
Well-Known Member
FFOF isn't the greatest supersoil, if you can even call it a supersoil, but it's foundationally pretty solid and will rebuild quite well.
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- #930
I'm glad you said that. I was going to ask if it was worth rebuilding. Expensive azz stuff.
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- #931
I have unsulphured molasses, but it doesn't say black strap. Does that mean it's of no use? You said blackstrap has healthier nutrient profile, so I'm wondering if this might make do with at least some nutrient profile. It's called Grandma's Molasses original. I am out of money to spend on anything else. Gone...done....extinct. LOL
Per serving: Magnesium 10mg, Calcium 30mg, sugar 15g.
I will do another brix tomorrow when the plants have had time to suck in the goodies.
That's a lot to work out! I appreciate you @Azimuth !
Mine takes a week or so. It stinks but only if you smell it closely.
4our8ighty0
Well-Known Member
Dayum that's a ton of good info,I am gonna have to go over it all a few times but I think I'm getting the gist,I don't have,temp gun water stick or brix tester,but I really need to start getting my brix game up tho. I gonna have to just eyeball it but that's probably better than not trying right ?
At the risk of looking dumb I gotta ask about an idea I had. I was trying to think of a way to use someone else's temp gun for one reading,with that 1 reading I can mark down all environmental numbers,rh,temp ECT when I use temp gun 1 time right ? Meaning if I get a leaf temps reading of 85 degree I can take all the other parameters at that moment and adjust them to optimize that one reading ? Right ? Then I could ball park from there and make ball park progress towards brix?
So with that in mind here comes the dumb question....
can that temp gun be used thru a phone ? Are there apps that can turn the phone itself into a temp gun ? Can I get leaf temps w/o a temp gun ? ....
plz bare with me I am a bit of a techno tart
I only ask cuz ik tech is really getting good and maybe there's a secondary method to get any reading that I can use to ball park my brix progress ? LadyCannafan an everyone figured it all out quickly too !!!
At the risk of looking dumb I gotta ask about an idea I had. I was trying to think of a way to use someone else's temp gun for one reading,with that 1 reading I can mark down all environmental numbers,rh,temp ECT when I use temp gun 1 time right ? Meaning if I get a leaf temps reading of 85 degree I can take all the other parameters at that moment and adjust them to optimize that one reading ? Right ? Then I could ball park from there and make ball park progress towards brix?
So with that in mind here comes the dumb question....
can that temp gun be used thru a phone ? Are there apps that can turn the phone itself into a temp gun ? Can I get leaf temps w/o a temp gun ? ....
plz bare with me I am a bit of a techno tart
I only ask cuz ik tech is really getting good and maybe there's a secondary method to get any reading that I can use to ball park my brix progress ? LadyCannafan an everyone figured it all out quickly too !!!
Gee64
Well-Known Member
In theory sort of yes, but in reality no, and that's because leaf temp differential from ambient temps is mainly driven by light intensity.
So if stretch is over and light intensity/hanging height won't change, you can set intensity reliably for long term, because the plant has pretty much stopped growing upwards.
Then if room temp drops or RH changes, VPD may go out of whack, but as ambient temp/RH alters, the 2 degree offset will hold.
Prior to the end of stretch you are both growing closer to the light, which increases intensity and changes the 2 degree offset, and the roots are developing, which gives the plant the ability to handle more light. So in veg you are adjusting and temp taking all the time.
Every day in stretch, so using a buddies gun once won't help you then. It may make today corrected, but tomorrow you will need another temp reading to correct things again.
Good VPD, including proper light intensity will definitely aid in better brix. Brix is 100% about proper balance, however you can grow full synthetics in DWC and VPD/light adjusting will greatly aid your grow, but achieving high brix in a mycoless environment, or any unnatural environment really, is almost impossible.
I say almost, because even tho hydroponics is a hack, you can always hack a hack to make it work, but it's expensive and very labour intensive. Brix rebels against hacks, it needs to operate as the genetics want to, not how we want it to.
But if you really like science and lab work and foliars and reservoir changes, it can be done. You basically need an educational setup such as a university lab or a private lab.
I imagine you could buy a USB attachment, but I don't think phones have IR laser pointers in them.
Bugs are the big indicator. If you don't have any pests and you don't use bug spray, your brix are probably high. If you have thrips your only a few points low, mites your mid level at best, and aphids are you very low brix.plz bare with me I am a bit of a techno tart
If you are growing with LOS, like Lady C is, your usually standing in line to enter the ballpark, and it's only a tweak or 2 away. So getting high brix can happen quickly. Remember, in the presence of adequate light and minrrals, brix comes down to 5 things. Calcium, Oxygen, Carbon, Phosphorus, and microbes/fungii.
Usually low calcium and or overwatering, and quite often both because overwatering flushes calcium, is the cause or at least a major factor.
If it's carbon, then likely the light is too intense and leaves are too hot closing stomata and choking CO2, and if you correct those 3, then the plant responds by propogating healthier microbes, so that only leaves Phosphorus, and it's rarely phosphorus.
If it is P, then it's likely from too much because of a synthetic source adding way to much that bypasses microbes/fungii, or very poor myco that can't mine P from organic sources.
Most soil mixes and ammendments contain adequate P for LOS to at least get to 14-ish.
Folks who use low P veg soil can suffer from low brix in veg.
Good high brix LOS veg soil is just veg soil with added P and proper calcium. And myco/microbes of course.
The one thing that brixers rarely talk about is nitrogen. Our belief in needing tons of it is a synthetic thing.
Plants don't need essential amino's like humans, they can manufacture all their own, and they make it from nitrogen that the atmosphere supplies and microbes fix.
You do need nitrogen sources such as alfalfa or blood meal, or kelp meal, to balance your browns to greens during cooking, and brixers will look for a wider variety of nitrogen inputs here to build a better mineral spectrum, but once things are up and running, added nitrogens crash brix AND create tissues that bugs love.
Very healthy green looking plants can easily be low brix bug attractors because of too much nitrogen. It's like steroids. It builds tons of tissue, but not healthy tissue.
Not quite a direct answer, but once your head wraps around it the answers appear. Then it gets very straight forward.
It takes repeating, no one gets it in one go. Too many adjustments, so you learn them one at a time. Always start with calcium and oxygen.
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- #935
Funny, I have some leaves clawing. Just noticed that with the two plants that aren't flowering. Does locked nitrogen cause yellowing and crispy leaves? I think I've dealt with that before.
The VPD numbers are going to be most useful after the plants have been fed and watered and have time to take things up. Right?
Thinking I should do those numbers tomorrow as well, when I do the brix test.
Right now, I'm getting VPD at .98 -ish on the non flowering, and 1.2-ish on the flowering plants in the back.
My head is spinning.......
That vpd is fine, not perfect but not far. Take brix ten hours after lights on.
Vpd numbers are good anytime. Just to keep an eye on things or adjust something to dial in the vpd better. Just make sure you are keeping the gun in the same ambient environment aka in the room. If the temp or humidity or off because you had the gun sitting in the kitchen table, you won’t have anything close to accurate numbers. So keep it near the plants. I think I remember you said you did. But it’s important.
Vpd numbers are good anytime. Just to keep an eye on things or adjust something to dial in the vpd better. Just make sure you are keeping the gun in the same ambient environment aka in the room. If the temp or humidity or off because you had the gun sitting in the kitchen table, you won’t have anything close to accurate numbers. So keep it near the plants. I think I remember you said you did. But it’s important.
Gee64
Well-Known Member
I'm on my way out, but yes, locked nitrogen causes yellowing and crispy leaves are generally light poisoning, which doesnt mean you were too high in light. I'll explain later.Funny, I have some leaves clawing. Just noticed that with the two plants that aren't flowering. Does locked nitrogen cause yellowing and crispy leaves? I think I've dealt with that before.
The VPD numbers are going to be most useful after the plants have been fed and watered and have time to take things up. Right?
Thinking I should do those numbers tomorrow as well, when I do the brix test.
Right now, I'm getting VPD at .98 -ish on the non flowering, and 1.2-ish on the flowering plants in the back.
My head is spinning.......
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- #938
Yep, It's hanging near the plants in the same environment.
Thanks Wayne Man. (get what I did there? Rain Man....Wayne Man....)
I know....I hear ya....{{{Groan}}}- Thread starter
- #939
Thanks Gee....again. LOL
No rush, take your time and come back when you can. Those plants aren't going anywhere.
We can ask @Bean Genie to weigh in, but my understanding is that auto's are created by mating a photo period with a plant with ruderalis genes, and when doing so, especially until the strain is stabilized, you're going to get a certain percentage of both photo's and auto's.
Like recessive genes show up in some percentage of the offspring but not all.
I know the breeder of the CBG strain I grow says 25% of their photo seeds will actually turn out to be auto's so they ship extra seeds with the order to compensate the grower that was expecting photo's. I've popped 3 seeds so far and one has been an auto.