The Everything SWICK Club: 2023 And Beyond

Carmen Ray said:
Hello SWICKers, please can I ask you for your thoughts. My two autos are presenting with different looking leaf issues. The plants haven't looked droopy at all so I haven't considered them over watered. However if I look at these leaves I wonder what can be the cause and how I can change things for the better.

I have used my LOS previously. It is a premixed craft soil which is hot. I mixed a 50 % seedling mix to get the plants started but now their roots will have reached beyond that safety and they are now in the main soil. I have previously had issues not dissimilar to this and couldn't work out the problem. In previous grows I have given calmag which seemed to help. It's a water only soil and I have been using rain water.

I have stuck a wooden skewer into the soil and it comes out damp with soil stuck to it on the bottom 2/3rds of the stick and the top third is dryer with no soil stuck to the stick.

Gelato auto

Gelato auto


Leaf Tips Clawing

Leaf Tips Clawing

3rd and 4th nodes.

Necrotic Looking Leaf

Necrotic Looking Leaf

2nd node.

Necrotic Looking Leaf

Necrotic Looking Leaf

1st node

Parmesan auto

Parmesan auto

Leaf issues.
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Any good news Carmen? Got a gut instinct? I hope the magnesium helped. I feel like I've seen this before and should remember something specific but I just can't seem to retrieve the memory - so I'm following along, hoping it'll stay with me this time. Does the worst one have a blue sheen around the 'necrotic' portions? best to you -RD
 
ReservoirDog said:
Any good news Carmen? Got a gut instinct? I hope the magnesium helped. I feel like I've seen this before and should remember something specific but I just can't seem to retrieve the memory - so I'm following along, hoping it'll stay with me this time. Does the worst one have a blue sheen around the 'necrotic' portions? best to you -RD
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Hi RD, thank you for checking in. There was definitely a blue sheen around the necrotic portions. I described it as sections of the leaf taking on a shadowy appearance. Do you recognize that symptom?

I think that the Calmag helped that plant because the next set of leaves appear to be alright and so do the new ones coming in. It was night time and I didn't have any Epsom salts on me so I decided to take a chance and see if Calmag would help. I can't say for sure that it was the right thing to do but the plant is better so far.

Parmesan Auto On Swick

Parmesan Auto On Swick

2 Days after Calmag.
1 Day after worm castings.

Parmesan Auto On Swick

Parmesan Auto On Swick

2 Days after Calmag.
1 Day after worm castings.

The other plant was displaying a different symptom, clawing leaves, but I treated it with Calmag too, then panicked and flushed it when the clawing worsened. The plant has been drying out for two days with a fan on it. Others have explained to me that the clawing I am seeing is consistent with curling from over-watering rather than nitrogen toxicity.
 
I seem to recall that the blue tinge in the leaf around that sort of damage specifically may point to phosphorus, but am still trying to follow up and confirm this. That colouring does have a specific relationship to a primary or secondary nute for sure.

What is your nutrient like, are you a soil grower, using nutes for emergencies or do you fertilize with regularity? (I'll go back and look)

The plant in question looks to have the tobacco virus, or a genetic abnormality perhaps?

I'll follow up on the 'blue' even if you grow out of it, and let you know.
Best Regards - RD
 
ReservoirDog said:
I seem to recall that the blue tinge in the leaf around that sort of damage specifically may point to phosphorus, but am still trying to follow up and confirm this. That colouring does have a specific relationship to a primary or secondary nute for sure.

What is your nutrient like, are you a soil grower, using nutes for emergencies or do you fertilize with regularity? (I'll go back and look)

The plant in question looks to have the tobacco virus, or a genetic abnormality perhaps?

I'll follow up on the 'blue' even if you grow out of it, and let you know.
Best Regards - RD
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Thank you! I am using a super-type, water only soil, fed with rain water.

This plant does have something going on with an abnormality of sorts I think, but it's getting there.

Parmesan auto

Parmesan auto

Vegging nicely at 25 days. Swicking.

And best wishes to you to RD.
 
I stuck a bbq skewer into the soil of my SWICK this morning after filling the res, and after forgetting about it for 6 hours :rolleyes: it came out dry! That makes me think that I'm really kinda growing in hempy with the soil just there to help keep the enormous plant upright!

So here's my question for all you SWICKers: Do you think there is any advantage to top watering and getting the roots to use the soil as well?

Background info:

My SWICK is soil over perlite in stacked 5 gallon buckets, the top one with no bottom, the bottom one filled with perlite with a 1" air gap before the soil starts.

Here it was on was on Wednesday, 3 days into flip and drinking a gallon/day into the res.
20230705_082716 5KC day 65, flip 5.jpg

20230705_082716 5KC day 65, flip 5.jpg

  • Media owner InTheShed
  • Date added
5 Killer Cookies

Top water or nah?

:thanks:
 
InTheShed said:
I stuck a bbq skewer into the soil of my SWICK this morning after filling the res, and after forgetting about it for 6 hours :rolleyes: it came out dry! That makes me think that I'm really kinda growing in hempy with the soil just there to help keep the enormous plant upright!

So here's my question for all you SWICKers: Do you think there is any advantage to top watering and getting the roots to use the soil as well?

Background info:

My SWICK is soil over perlite in stacked 5 gallon buckets, the top one with no bottom, the bottom one filled with perlite with a 1" air gap before the soil starts.

Here it was on was on Wednesday, 3 days into flip and drinking a gallon/day into the res.
20230705_082716 5KC day 65, flip 5.jpg

20230705_082716 5KC day 65, flip 5.jpg

  • Media owner InTheShed
  • Date added
5 Killer Cookies

Top water or nah?

:thanks:
Click to expand...
Once or twice I sparingly top watered my swicks in my previous grow, and I have just done the same for my Gelato auto 1 half an hour ago as the top couple of inches are dry after the flush & dry episode. I trickled a liter in over the top of the layer of worm castings.

I used to do that with the wet /dry cycle too. I would sparingly dampen the top layers of the soil to help those top roots out. It appeared to be helpful in my experience. However, the top layer never is as damp as the bottom of the bag on the swick, so that appears to be normal.

It's also necessary if supplementary feeds are given from the top.

In your situation I'd be loathed to over do it because the plant appears so well, but you could water to trickle off in the swick. Can you see what is happening in the reservoir in plastic buckets?

That's my experience but the others have been doing this for years and will have more insight. I saw Emilya talking about periodically top watering her SIPs to supply nutrients if I'm not mistaken.
 
With GeoFlora you would have to top water sometimes. With this I only top watered on the two transplants, and I am hesitant to make any changes. :rolleyes:

That's why I figured I'd put it out to the hive mind!
 
I think it may be a question of type of feed. In an organic grow the top feeder roots are important and keeping them engaged is part of that process. I try to keep them moist with an organic mulch with periodic additions of compost and worm castings and regular misting.

For salt based nutes I'm not sure that's all that important and, given how healthy that plant is, I'm not sure I'd mess with whatever you're currently doing.
 
Thanks Azi!
Azimuth said:
I think it may be a question of type of feed. In an organic grow the top feeder roots are important and keeping them engaged is part of that process. I try to keep them moist with an organic mulch with periodic additions of compost and worm castings and regular misting.
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Maybe I'll try cardboard on top and see if that helps, but 12" of dry soil might not be changed by covering the top.

Am I the only one doing this outside? Cound that be a factor?
Azimuth said:
For salt based nutes I'm not sure that's all that important and, given how healthy that plant is, I'm not sure I'd mess with whatever you're currently doing.
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I did have roots in the soil on both transplants though the bulk were at the bottom in the perlite. But the soil doesn't know what the nutes are so I would think the water would climb through capillary action regardless. Could the water roots be drinking it all up before it has a chance to rise?

I'm going to dig around at the surface and see if there are roots at the top. But messing with the plant does seem foolish at this point!
 
Well, your wick is perlite, not fabric nor rope, and likely has lessor wicking capabilities (though seems like the perfect amount for the plant).

@Carmen Ray has a bit of a hybrid with a perlite base but a fabric pot on top which likely sets the wicking level higher up, at least near the pot sides as I'd guess that the fabric is more efficient than some soil mixes in moving moisture.

Might as well bring it home the way you're currently doing so you have a baseline for future grows if you then want to mess with success.
 
Azimuth said:
Well, your wick is perlite, not fabric nor rope, and likely has lessor wicking capabilities (though seems like the perfect amount for the plant).

@Carmen Ray has a bit of a hybrid with a perlite base but a fabric pot on top which likely sets the wicking level higher up, at least near the pot sides as I'd guess that the fabric is more efficient than some soil mixes in moving moisture.

Might as well bring it home the way you're currently doing so you have a baseline for future grows if you then want to mess with success.
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Quite true! When I decided on the design I was thinking of how hempy roots filled the pot even though the res was just a couple of inches at the bottom, but maybe it doesn't actually wick well into soil.

I did have one other thought: what if I've been giving it a gallon every morning when it would really like another gallon at night? That's an easy thing to try.
 
InTheShed said:
I did have one other thought: what if I've been giving it a gallon every morning when it would really like another gallon at night? That's an easy thing to try.
Click to expand...
Why, because it's not big enough already?

:laughtwo:
 
Azimuth said:
Why, because it's not big enough already?

:laughtwo:
Click to expand...
Might have to build a bigger shed!

As a test, I've actually been adding water to the res every two hours today since the initial fill at 9am, and nine hours later it's taken almost a gallon more. I've stuck a skewer in the soil to see where that water is going and I'm sure by the time I put it in the shed for the night it will have taken the entire second gallon.
 
To get the moisture level up higher you might have to "prime the pump" by watering from the top initially. Depends on how well your mix wicks when dry I suppose.
 
Azimuth said:
To get the moisture level up higher you might have to "prime the pump" by watering from the top initially. Depends on how well your mix wicks when dry I suppose.
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After 2 gallons in 10 hours, the bbq skewer sunk 10" into the soil still comes out dry. Tomorrow I top water until the res overflows. What's the next test?
 
Azimuth said:
@Carmen Ray has a bit of a hybrid with a perlite base but a fabric pot on top which likely sets the wicking level higher up, at least near the pot sides as I'd guess that the fabric is more efficient than some soil mixes in moving moisture.
Click to expand...
I changed my set up last grow Azi. I have the babies on perlite swicks in plastic pots, with large drain holes and a fabric wick into the seedling mix but when they are up-potted they go onto home made swicking plates, made from a fabric swicky pad placed on top of a cake cooler, on top of an upended Bato pot, in an inch of water.

Swick Set-up

Swick Set-up

I cut up a cloth pot for the swicky pad and strips of absorbent dishcloth for the wicks.

Swick Set-up

Swick Set-up

I have an upturned Bato pot with a cake cooler balanced on the base and covered by a network of...

The initial roots grow into the perlite bed but on transplant they become air pruned going forward.
InTheShed said:
Tomorrow I top water until the res overflows.
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I'm very interested to see what transpires and whether the plant starts using the soil.
 
Good morning. I am trying not to panic. The browning of the leaves is spreading upwards.

Shed, you did say it is possible that it is the variegation causing it but am I overwatering this plant?

Leaf Spotting 3rd Leaves

Leaf Spotting 3rd Leaves

The leaf issue is spreading upwards slowly. Calmag given 1 July.

Leaf Spotting 3rd Leaves

Leaf Spotting 3rd Leaves

The leaf issue is spreading upwards slowly. Calmag given 1 July.

Is this plant overwatered?

Is this plant overwatered?

Is this plant looking overwatered?
 
Hi Carmen, I had that happen in my SIP. I gave it calmag in my rez to get some calcium in her. That's what I see in the brown spots, a cal def.
Overwatered, I don't think so.
 
StoneOtter said:
Hi Carmen, I had that happen in my SIP. I gave it calmag in my rez to get some calcium in her. That's what I see in the brown spots, a cal def.
Overwatered, I don't think so.
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Thank you Otter. I just gave a dose of calmag with some microbes, fish hydrolysate and BSM. I mixed 2 L and poured that into the pot over the EWC. I have taken the pot off the swick and put it onto a towel to help it dry out somewhat before I put it back on the swick. Hold thumbs for me. Oh, I also moved the lights back down to 50 %. They were on 75 % at 11 inches / 28 cm.
 
Carmen Ray said:
Thank you Otter. I just gave a dose of calmag with some microbes, fish hydrolysate and BSM. I mixed 2 L and poured that into the pot over the EWC. I have taken the pot off the swick and put it onto a towel to help it dry out somewhat before I put it back on the swick. Hold thumbs for me. Oh, I also moved the lights back down to 50 %. They were on 75 % at 11 inches / 28 cm.
Click to expand...
Holding thumbs, crossing fingers and toes, and knocking on wood! Good call to bring the lights up a tad Carm! @11inches may have caused them to try to grow faster than their roots could have provided for them. That in itself may have brought the cal def. It's a fine balance when they're young.
 
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