SweetSue's Cannabis Oil Study Hall

[SweetSue]

Sue, both of those stories are horrible to hear about and my thoughts are with both.

Does Neikodog know what "mistakes" he made that resulted in the combustion? It appears working inside was mistake #1. was he using an electric stove? What about ventilation?

I think any info that can help others from making the same mistakes would be a GOOD thing!

He was working indoors, with the gas burner on. So two strikes there. He'd done the same process before without issue, but this was a double batch (7 oz). When the fumes ignited they attempted to smother it with a towel. Neikodog doesn't remember what happened next, but suddenly his clothes were on fire. He burned his left hand, left leg and belly, and feels blessed to have gotten off so easy. He's also appreciative of the healing properties of a good cannabis pain cream. After hours of agony the pain cream cut the pain in about five minutes.

Let's learn from this. Safety first. Well-ventilated means just that. Best choice, outdoors.

 

[AKgramma]

Let's learn the lesson of solventless oil production. My first successful concentrated oil was done with a month-old tincture created with a Bicardi solvent. (The strongest stuff I can get here). Cooked down in a jar sitting in a water-filled mini-crockpot. I was too afraid to cook it over the gas stove.

Those stories were so sad to read! So sorry for them! sending

 

[Mr. Krip]

He was working indoors, with the gas burner on. So two strikes there. He'd done the same process before without issue, but this was a double batch (7 oz). When the fumes ignited they attempted to smother it with a towel. Neikodog doesn't remember what happened next, but suddenly his clothes were on fire. He burned his left hand, left leg and belly, and feels blessed to have gotten off so easy. He's also appreciative of the healing properties of a good cannabis pain cream. After hours of agony the pain cream cut the pain in about five minutes.

Let's learn from this. Safety first. Well-ventilated means just that. Best choice, outdoors.

I'm not sure which is worse, the lack of ventilation or the gas burner, but that combo can be deadly, so glad he's (relatively) OK and still has a house!

For anyone that only has access to an indoor gas burner, you can still make RSO safely!

Use the double boiler setup working OUTSIDE. Leave the unevaporated solvent outside and well away from the stove. Boil the water inside, then bring boiling water outside to the RSO, put the pot of RSO on top (in a double boiler) and it will start evaporating. The alcohol evaporates at a much lower temperature than the water, so as the boiling water cools, the alcohol will continue to evaporate. When the water temp gets down below about 170*, it will need to be re-boiled. So it's a little slower and, depending on quantities, you'll likely need to re-boil the water several times to evaporate all the alcohol. Each time you re-boil, the alcohol stays outside and away from the stove and the boiled water is brought out to the solvent mixture.

The alcohol itself is definitely flammable, but not what I would call "volatile". The alcohol fumes, on the other hand, are most definitely volatile and any contact with a flame or spark will ignite the fumes. I even worry about static electricity and, even working outside, I recommend using a fan to blow the fumes AWAY from you and help them dissipate quicker.

As good as the pain cream is, please everyone, save it for the aches and pains of getting old or for after going on a hike or long workout, or something. No need to see how good it is after burning yourself up for not taking safety first!

 

[SweetSue]

When I use this method I wait for a day when I have strong cross-ventilation in my living room, and set my pans up at the furthest window from the kitchen and with the breeze blowing out the window. I bring the boiling water to those pans. My other option is always on the balcony itself. That puts me as far from any flames as I can get until I'm down to a minuscule amount. I'd been finishing over a flame, a process I'm rethinking in favor of an induction cooktop.

This process requires you to be careful about hauling boiling water, another safety concern. A better option, IMO, is to use a press and get away from solvents. Ethanol may have the edge for total pull, but the volitility of the solvent makes it so risky that pressing becomes more attractive. The challenge is to max out the pressing. That's what Shiggity and his cohorts are working out for us.

 

[KingstonRabbi]

I'll be keeping all this in mind as I'm making my 2nd batch of CCO tonight. I use a still for safety and alcohol recovery, but do the final boil off on stove with hood on full and both kitchen doors open. Last time I couldn't smell the alcohol vapor from the double boiler, so I think I'm safe with that method. Even so, right now I am decarbing the herb first so I can try boiling water method instead of having to monitor oil temp between 212 and 250.

Happier news, the cream I made for my wife is helping her chronic joint pain. I need to make it a little stronger (used 3 grams herb instead of 4) but she can already feel it easing her back pain also. 1 more drop of CCO ought to do it.

 

[nivek]

Sue. Hello. Nice to be here again. On my phone. Must be brief. Pls. I am preparing to make my second batch of oil this aft. Promise to fill you in fully. One q pls. This time i am following your added steps as well. Not so rushed this time. So. My golden brew awaits me in the freezer as i type. It is so pretty. A d golden,as yuo said it would be after winterizing. Now, there is some sediment at the bottom of the jar. Must be waxes and undesireables i am thinking.

Is that correct? I want to remove sediment? I am thinking all wanted oils are dissolved in the alcohol. Correct? Cheers and thanks sue. Chat soon

 

[SweetSue]

Sue. Hello. Nice to be here again. On my phone. Must be brief. Pls. I am preparing to make my second batch of oil this aft. Promise to fill you in fully. One q pls. This time i am following your added steps as well. Not so rushed this time. So. My golden brew awaits me in the freezer as i type. It is so pretty. A d golden,as yuo said it would be after winterizing. Now, there is some sediment at the bottom of the jar. Must be waxes and undesireables i am thinking.

Is that correct? I want to remove sediment? I am thinking all wanted oils are dissolved in the alcohol. Correct? Cheers and thanks sue. Chat soon

You'd be correct nivek. Strain it one more time to remove the undesirables and then you're good to go. Great work. I look forward to some pictures my friend.

 

[KingstonRabbi]

Results of 2nd batch:

First off, I was able to use still to extract nearly pure alcohol from cheap vodka. Cost about as much a bottle of everclear, but it saved me day trip to Oregon to buy it. I was able to confirm it was close to 190 proof by weighing syringe full vs syringe of tap water. 9g vs 11g, even allowing for rounding errors is still is a least 150 proof. Need to get bigger syringe for more precise measurement.

That gave me about 2 liters of alcohol for 4 oz of buds and leaves. Decarbing made the plant material extremely brittle and I ended up with a lot of chlorophyll etc in the wash. that's okay, I'm used to it. I was able to use boiling water bath to boil off last of alcohol. Only problem was that there water from recycled alcohol that ended up in oil, and I couldn't boil that off. I chilled oil overnight and just poured off water.

End result, 16g of CCO. Also the cream I made for my wife earlier. Blows my mind that I made $800 worth of medicine in one evening from my worst plants! I have 24 bigger, stronger and probably more potent plants to harvest over next month. Feel foolish for ever doubting I could grow and make my own.

 

[Mr. Krip]

Results of 2nd batch:

First off, I was able to use still to extract nearly pure alcohol from cheap vodka. Cost about as much a bottle of everclear, but it saved me day trip to Oregon to buy it. I was able to confirm it was close to 190 proof by weighing syringe full vs syringe of tap water. 9g vs 11g, even allowing for rounding errors is still is a least 150 proof. Need to get bigger syringe for more precise measurement.

That gave me about 2 liters of alcohol for 4 oz of buds and leaves. Decarbing made the plant material extremely brittle and I ended up with a lot of chlorophyll etc in the wash. that's okay, I'm used to it. I was able to use boiling water bath to boil off last of alcohol. Only problem was that there water from recycled alcohol that ended up in oil, and I couldn't boil that off. I chilled oil overnight and just poured off water.

End result, 16g of CCO. Also the cream I made for my wife earlier. Blows my mind that I made $800 worth of medicine in one evening from my worst plants! I have 24 bigger, stronger and probably more potent plants to harvest over next month. Feel foolish for ever doubting I could grow and make my own.

Great job, Brother! +REPS!!!

 

[SweetSue]

Results of 2nd batch:

First off, I was able to use still to extract nearly pure alcohol from cheap vodka. Cost about as much a bottle of everclear, but it saved me day trip to Oregon to buy it. I was able to confirm it was close to 190 proof by weighing syringe full vs syringe of tap water. 9g vs 11g, even allowing for rounding errors is still is a least 150 proof. Need to get bigger syringe for more precise measurement.

That gave me about 2 liters of alcohol for 4 oz of buds and leaves. Decarbing made the plant material extremely brittle and I ended up with a lot of chlorophyll etc in the wash. that's okay, I'm used to it. I was able to use boiling water bath to boil off last of alcohol. Only problem was that there water from recycled alcohol that ended up in oil, and I couldn't boil that off. I chilled oil overnight and just poured off water.

End result, 16g of CCO. Also the cream I made for my wife earlier. Blows my mind that I made $800 worth of medicine in one evening from my worst plants! I have 24 bigger, stronger and probably more potent plants to harvest over next month. Feel foolish for ever doubting I could grow and make my own.

Yeah...... Let me add my own reps on top of those. Well done KR, well done!

See how easy this is? How maddening it is that they want us to believe it needs to be something controlled by large corporations?

Kuddos on the alcohol reclaimation. When I did my first run to increase the proof of my ethanol I laughed at how easy that was to make happen, because traveling to another state isn't an option for me at this time. In my opinion, it was worth the cost of the distiller just to be able to use a higher-proof solvent. I'd not thought of weighing the syringes to determine the proof of the ethanol. That alone was worth the reps+.

I've got a big smile right now KR.

 

[CajunCelt]

Awesome job KR!
+reps

 

[lazyfish]

G'day, Sue,

Sorry to jump in, but I was thinkin... If terpenes are such a big part of the high then what will essential oils do if I put some in my bong water...

I got some thinkin' to do...

 

[Greensmurf420]

I'm not sure which is worse, the lack of ventilation or the gas burner, but that combo can be deadly, so glad he's (relatively) OK and still has a house!

For anyone that only has access to an indoor gas burner, you can still make RSO safely!

Use the double boiler setup working OUTSIDE. Leave the unevaporated solvent outside and well away from the stove. Boil the water inside, then bring boiling water outside to the RSO, put the pot of RSO on top (in a double boiler) and it will start evaporating. The alcohol evaporates at a much lower temperature than the water, so as the boiling water cools, the alcohol will continue to evaporate. When the water temp gets down below about 170*, it will need to be re-boiled. So it's a little slower and, depending on quantities, you'll likely need to re-boil the water several times to evaporate all the alcohol. Each time you re-boil, the alcohol stays outside and away from the stove and the boiled water is brought out to the solvent mixture.

The alcohol itself is definitely flammable, but not what I would call "volatile". The alcohol fumes, on the other hand, are most definitely volatile and any contact with a flame or spark will ignite the fumes. I even worry about static electricity and, even working outside, I recommend using a fan to blow the fumes AWAY from you and help them dissipate quicker.

As good as the pain cream is, please everyone, save it for the aches and pains of getting old or for after going on a hike or long workout, or something. No need to see how good it is after burning yourself up for not taking safety first!

After reading what happened to neikodog and understanding how volatile the fumes can be. I'm wondering if a safer option would be to use an electronic skillet.

1st question... Would a double boiler method work using an electric skillet filled with water and a Pyrex bowl or metal pan for rso

2nd question... Would it work better with no water in the skillet and using it as a hotplate and 2 pans for the double boiler.

If so, It would eliminate the flame for those who have gas stoves. Electronic skillet is portable and can be moved outside.

 

[SweetSue]

G'day, Sue,

Sorry to jump in, but I was thinkin... If terpenes are such a big part of the high then what will essential oils do if I put some in my bong water...


I got some thinkin' to do...

It would just muck up your bong. The reason they work with the cannabis is that they're delivered together in whatever method you administer. Oil in bong water will only stick to the glass and be more mess to clean up. Eat some mango about 30-45 minutes ahead and let that expand the high.

 

[SweetSue]

After reading what happened to neikodog and understanding how volatile the fumes can be. I'm wondering if a safer option would be to use an electronic skillet.

1st question... Would a double boiler method work using an electric skillet filled with water and a Pyrex bowl or metal pan for rso

2nd question... Would it work better with no water in the skillet and using it as a hotplate and 2 pans for the double boiler.

If so, It would eliminate the flame for those who have gas stoves. Electronic skillet is portable and can be moved outside.

It's definitely a better option. In this case, you set up a double boiler, bring the water to a boil and turn the heat off if you desire until it's needed again.

The skillet would work with water for the evaporation, but you'd need an oil bath instead of water to do the decarbing at the end. Water won't get hot enough to get to decarbing temps.

 

[KingstonRabbi]

It's definitely a better option. In this case, you set up a double boiler, bring the water to a boil and turn the heat off if you desire until it's needed again.

The skillet would work with water for the evaporation, but you'd need an oil bath instead of water to do the decarbing at the end. Water won't get hot enough to get to decarbing temps.

I used boiling water bath to boil off the remaining alcohol. It took a while (refilled boiling water 3x) but alcohol did boil away. From that point on there was no danger of using oil bath to heat to decarb temps even on stove top. I decarbed herb before hand on this batch, but for next batch I'll go back to decarbing on stove after alcohol is boiled completely away. Key to safety is to keep alcohol vapor away from burner or other ignition source. Boiling water bath is simple solution.

 

[SL2222]

Susan - I'm here. Thank you for inviting me. I have a lot of looking around to do

 

[SweetSue]

Susan - I'm here. Thank you for inviting me. I have a lot of looking around to do

Welcome Sara. I've been watching for you. Take your time and don't hesitate to ask anything.

And Sara, welcome to the family you didn't know you had.

Just in case you're interested, here's the link to my Callanetics thread.

Callanetics - Meditation In Movement

 

[AKgramma]

I used boiling water bath to boil off the remaining alcohol. It took a while (refilled boiling water 3x) but alcohol did boil away. From that point on there was no danger of using oil bath to heat to decarb temps even on stove top. I decarbed herb before hand on this batch, but for next batch I'll go back to decarbing on stove after alcohol is boiled completely away. Key to safety is to keep alcohol vapor away from burner or other ignition source. Boiling water bath is simple solution.

My first successful CCO was reduced with a water bath in a small slowcooker. I, too, am afraid to use flame or oil bath with my tinctures.

 

[Arctic Bowl]