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Many thanks Krissi!
Stunger's Organic Soil Stealth Balcony: Landrace Mulanje & Other Sativas
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Update - further on the Mulanje...
Greetings 420 enthusiasts! Well today I am smiling and I shouldn't be, I don't have a right to be. But let me step back a moment. When my star girl the Mulanje met her demise, I wasn't quite ready to bid her farewell, so I chucked her at the back of a covered but open area where I store some garden tools. Last night, I couldn't help going and having a looksee and another 'squeeze' of her buds after earlier finding a large swollen bract with a seed in it. Altho it is all immature and all larf quality it did coat my fingers so I thought I'd bring it into the studio for a closer look today. I've left her hanging on a door.
In my initial quick look, I found close to 2 dozen seeds of a good size. Of course I'll keep them because they look like they might be viable. That would be a bonus!
As my fingers got stickier and stickier I thought I should try this in the dynavap. Still very wet, but scissor chopped, I waited as much as half an hour, then valiantly did 2 vapcaps. I was surprised at getting a very nice cerebral buzz for 1.5 hours as a result. I was quite chuffed about that, it is actually usable, something to smile about as a consolation prize!
Tomorrow, at least the scissor chopped stuff will be almost dry, which will be good as vaping it green was a bit of a throat burner. Of course, I must add I haven't had any new stuff to smoke since last year, so I am not too surprised that I have found it rewarding. I will leave her hanging till she is dry, and then see what I can glean off her and harvest any other seeds she has too.
The wind is belting the balcony plants today as it has for the last 2 days. But the 3 remaining girls are all looking good in their own individual ways.
The Mango Sherbert I have started a droughting regime with her by not watering her. Of course it is hard with the unpredictability of the weather. In the event of rain, I will try to put something to cover the pot top to reduce likelihood of the soil getting wet. She is in a biggish pot at 50L (13 gallon) so it will retain more moisture than a smaller pot. However it does have at least 60 holes, some quite large, drilled into the pot's sides and base, so they do lose soil moisture quickly than a regular pot. I have not watered her since the 20th March. The strong winds we've been having must be helping to dry her soil further. Yesterday, I noticed a small bit of bud rot on 1 cola, I guess from a caterpillar, which I gouged out with my thumb.
Anyway, that's all I have today, be well and I hope you're enjoying some nice smoke! 
Greetings 420 enthusiasts! Well today I am smiling and I shouldn't be, I don't have a right to be. But let me step back a moment. When my star girl the Mulanje met her demise, I wasn't quite ready to bid her farewell, so I chucked her at the back of a covered but open area where I store some garden tools. Last night, I couldn't help going and having a looksee and another 'squeeze' of her buds after earlier finding a large swollen bract with a seed in it. Altho it is all immature and all larf quality it did coat my fingers so I thought I'd bring it into the studio for a closer look today. I've left her hanging on a door.
In my initial quick look, I found close to 2 dozen seeds of a good size. Of course I'll keep them because they look like they might be viable. That would be a bonus!
As my fingers got stickier and stickier I thought I should try this in the dynavap. Still very wet, but scissor chopped, I waited as much as half an hour, then valiantly did 2 vapcaps. I was surprised at getting a very nice cerebral buzz for 1.5 hours as a result. I was quite chuffed about that, it is actually usable, something to smile about as a consolation prize!
Tomorrow, at least the scissor chopped stuff will be almost dry, which will be good as vaping it green was a bit of a throat burner. Of course, I must add I haven't had any new stuff to smoke since last year, so I am not too surprised that I have found it rewarding. I will leave her hanging till she is dry, and then see what I can glean off her and harvest any other seeds she has too.
The wind is belting the balcony plants today as it has for the last 2 days. But the 3 remaining girls are all looking good in their own individual ways.
The Mango Sherbert I have started a droughting regime with her by not watering her. Of course it is hard with the unpredictability of the weather. In the event of rain, I will try to put something to cover the pot top to reduce likelihood of the soil getting wet. She is in a biggish pot at 50L (13 gallon) so it will retain more moisture than a smaller pot. However it does have at least 60 holes, some quite large, drilled into the pot's sides and base, so they do lose soil moisture quickly than a regular pot. I have not watered her since the 20th March. The strong winds we've been having must be helping to dry her soil further. Yesterday, I noticed a small bit of bud rot on 1 cola, I guess from a caterpillar, which I gouged out with my thumb.
DV8
Well-Known Member
You deserve any consolation prize after all that mate.
Hey tell me, if you can guess, you reckon those seeds are your selected breeding, or her response to impending death?
Like F1 regs or S1 fems?
Hey tell me, if you can guess, you reckon those seeds are your selected breeding, or her response to impending death?
Like F1 regs or S1 fems?
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- #624
Cheers DV8. I presume that they are not S1's but F1's from the male's pollen. I need to look more closely to check whereabouts they are, whether on the stems that I deliberately pollinated, or other areas where they shouldn't be, but in saying that, while I did my best to keep the pollen to those stems, it is the outdoors, they were windy days and I delayed for several days for a less windy day to do it. And plus it is possible that pollen could also have been blown from the male earlier in late February.
That's a positive update Stunger! I'm happy for you. 
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- #626
Thanks GDB! It was a surprise to find I have got some seeds, and that the bud actually has some functional potency.That's a positive update Stunger! I'm happy for you.
Great consolation prize in my book! Glad you got something from her. Something to toke and something to grow.
Also...I hate caterpillars!
Also...I hate caterpillars!
Gouging is an appropriate response. Add a little bit of bitterness and anger for good measure!
An excellent result, all things considered!
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- #629
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- #630
Update - "droughting" the Mango Sherbert
Greetings 420 enthusiasts! This update is about carrying out a 'droughting' approach to my right most balcony girl, the Mango Sherbert. I grew this strain last year and harvested it on the 16th of April, so I am expecting to harvest around a similar time this year, in around 3 weeks, give or take.
Droughting?
For those of you who are not familiar with droughting and would like to know more, and share with some great gardeners, our wonderful fellow member @Krissi1982, has a thread devoted to it here --> Droughting and its medicinal effects in cannabis.
Basically it is when the plant suffers the stress of dehydration over a period of time sufficient to provoke a response that can result in increased oil/resin in it's buds to help it cope with the stress of not getting enough water.
A personal experience of droughting
To save doubling up my writing, I have copied this paragraph from a post I made to Krissi's thread mentioned above. Mine is a simplistic view from a personal drought experience I had over a dozen years ago. In hindsight, it was a fantastic droughting grow which produced the best hitting buds that I have ever grown (from bag seed where the bagged bud was average), and it was 100% accidental. The plant was late germinated, early December (Southern Hemisphere) and grown outdoors on a balcony whose stone tiles I have measured on hot days, as reaching up to 50C/122F, so that's a lot of radiant heat causing the plant further stress. It was grown in a small dark blue ceramic pot, with a basic organic potting mix (about 15L, nearly 4 gallons I guess), and only twice in it's life it got some tomato fertiliser in it's water. The dark pot would heat up badly in the sun, and every hot day the plant would be badly wilting by the afternoon. The resulting buds were quite 'airy', but appearance wise they looked like the trichomes had repeatably melted and covered the buds/sugar leaves with a 'varnish like' appearance that seemed to make them very stiff and hard. They were by far the most sticky buds I have grown. This was a plant that you could imagine in the wild, growing out of dry rock crack, beaten by wind and sun. That was because it had made itself very oily, and therefore it could deal with the adverse elements quite fine. I must add, the drought process in this case wasn't just for 10 days but for the whole summer heat flowering period. It was a newbie grow!
My droughting experience reawakened
But stepping back a bit, after I had that 'accidental' droughting experience, I surmised that the dehydration and daily wilting in the hot sun was further assisted by the stone tiles that heat up and radiate more heat back to the plants. It was @Maritimer whose wonderful investigations into droughting and stimulating insect attacks to increase the potency of his buds, who reawakened in me the experience I mentioned above, all those years ago, and he referred to the published work and thesis of Dr Caplan, on using controlled drought stress to increase the concentration of the major cannabinoids. For those interested, here is a link to one of Maritimer's posts showing the conclusions of that study --> Dr Caplan's study conclusions.
More recently
2 years ago, I 'semi droughted' 2 plants. It was 'semi' because I was battling some pests on them and I didn't follow it through so much.
Last year, I gave my plants whatever water they wanted, they grew pretty nice and looked much better than the previous year's plants, but I couldn't help feeling that the previous plants that I semi droughted were a little bit more potent than last year's.
This grow
So today, it is day 7 of no watering for the Mango Sherbert, we did get a little rain the 2nd day but there is a roof over the balcony and I don't think much rain if any, actually fell on her. There has been very strong winds to the balcony these past days, up to 80kph, so that must be drying her out too. Plus her 50L container has been heavily drilled out on the sides and bases, I think at least 60 holes, and I find that they do noticebly dry out a lot more quickly than undrilled pots.
So I am doing this post today because she has started quite dramatically showing her response to 7 days of droughting and I wanted to show the pics as a reference point. A lot of her leaves are now hanging vertical. After these photos were taken I gave her about 2 cups of water. The afternoon sun has stuffed her compared to her morning pics. But tomorrow morning, I will evaluate how she is, and if her wilting is no better then I'll probably give her a minimal watering with the view of sending her back into wilting mode again once she's had a little drink and a 'perk up', as I still have about 3 weeks to play with.
The old miners used canaries to check for the air quality underground. In my pots it is the worms, and the past couple couple of days I have seen quite a few dead worms on the tiles, they're feeling the drought stress too.
This morning some of her leaves were flipped and showed some sagging, by the afternoon, there was wilting, and by 5pm many of the leaves were completely lank, and flapping spent in the wind, hanging vertically. So because I still have 3 more weeks to go to harvest, I want to condition her to respond to these conditions of dehydration for repeated periods but ideally not kill her before then.
I looked at her 3 hours after I gave her the 2 cups of water, and she looks to have barely changed, a tiny little bit, but imagine she'll get some strength back over night with the sun gone, and I am interested in seeing how she looks in the morning before I water her again.
Mango Sherbert day 7 of no water - 11am
Mango Sherbert day 7 of no water - 3pm
Mango Sherbert day 7 of no water - 5pm
Anyway, something for the droughters! Be well and I hope your gardens are going great.
Greetings 420 enthusiasts! This update is about carrying out a 'droughting' approach to my right most balcony girl, the Mango Sherbert. I grew this strain last year and harvested it on the 16th of April, so I am expecting to harvest around a similar time this year, in around 3 weeks, give or take.
Droughting?
For those of you who are not familiar with droughting and would like to know more, and share with some great gardeners, our wonderful fellow member @Krissi1982, has a thread devoted to it here --> Droughting and its medicinal effects in cannabis.
Basically it is when the plant suffers the stress of dehydration over a period of time sufficient to provoke a response that can result in increased oil/resin in it's buds to help it cope with the stress of not getting enough water.
A personal experience of droughting
To save doubling up my writing, I have copied this paragraph from a post I made to Krissi's thread mentioned above. Mine is a simplistic view from a personal drought experience I had over a dozen years ago. In hindsight, it was a fantastic droughting grow which produced the best hitting buds that I have ever grown (from bag seed where the bagged bud was average), and it was 100% accidental. The plant was late germinated, early December (Southern Hemisphere) and grown outdoors on a balcony whose stone tiles I have measured on hot days, as reaching up to 50C/122F, so that's a lot of radiant heat causing the plant further stress. It was grown in a small dark blue ceramic pot, with a basic organic potting mix (about 15L, nearly 4 gallons I guess), and only twice in it's life it got some tomato fertiliser in it's water. The dark pot would heat up badly in the sun, and every hot day the plant would be badly wilting by the afternoon. The resulting buds were quite 'airy', but appearance wise they looked like the trichomes had repeatably melted and covered the buds/sugar leaves with a 'varnish like' appearance that seemed to make them very stiff and hard. They were by far the most sticky buds I have grown. This was a plant that you could imagine in the wild, growing out of dry rock crack, beaten by wind and sun. That was because it had made itself very oily, and therefore it could deal with the adverse elements quite fine. I must add, the drought process in this case wasn't just for 10 days but for the whole summer heat flowering period. It was a newbie grow!
My droughting experience reawakened
But stepping back a bit, after I had that 'accidental' droughting experience, I surmised that the dehydration and daily wilting in the hot sun was further assisted by the stone tiles that heat up and radiate more heat back to the plants. It was @Maritimer whose wonderful investigations into droughting and stimulating insect attacks to increase the potency of his buds, who reawakened in me the experience I mentioned above, all those years ago, and he referred to the published work and thesis of Dr Caplan, on using controlled drought stress to increase the concentration of the major cannabinoids. For those interested, here is a link to one of Maritimer's posts showing the conclusions of that study --> Dr Caplan's study conclusions.
More recently
2 years ago, I 'semi droughted' 2 plants. It was 'semi' because I was battling some pests on them and I didn't follow it through so much.
Last year, I gave my plants whatever water they wanted, they grew pretty nice and looked much better than the previous year's plants, but I couldn't help feeling that the previous plants that I semi droughted were a little bit more potent than last year's.
This grow
So today, it is day 7 of no watering for the Mango Sherbert, we did get a little rain the 2nd day but there is a roof over the balcony and I don't think much rain if any, actually fell on her. There has been very strong winds to the balcony these past days, up to 80kph, so that must be drying her out too. Plus her 50L container has been heavily drilled out on the sides and bases, I think at least 60 holes, and I find that they do noticebly dry out a lot more quickly than undrilled pots.
So I am doing this post today because she has started quite dramatically showing her response to 7 days of droughting and I wanted to show the pics as a reference point. A lot of her leaves are now hanging vertical. After these photos were taken I gave her about 2 cups of water. The afternoon sun has stuffed her compared to her morning pics. But tomorrow morning, I will evaluate how she is, and if her wilting is no better then I'll probably give her a minimal watering with the view of sending her back into wilting mode again once she's had a little drink and a 'perk up', as I still have about 3 weeks to play with.
The old miners used canaries to check for the air quality underground. In my pots it is the worms, and the past couple couple of days I have seen quite a few dead worms on the tiles, they're feeling the drought stress too.
This morning some of her leaves were flipped and showed some sagging, by the afternoon, there was wilting, and by 5pm many of the leaves were completely lank, and flapping spent in the wind, hanging vertically. So because I still have 3 more weeks to go to harvest, I want to condition her to respond to these conditions of dehydration for repeated periods but ideally not kill her before then.
I looked at her 3 hours after I gave her the 2 cups of water, and she looks to have barely changed, a tiny little bit, but imagine she'll get some strength back over night with the sun gone, and I am interested in seeing how she looks in the morning before I water her again.
Mango Sherbert day 7 of no water - 11am
Mango Sherbert day 7 of no water - 3pm
Mango Sherbert day 7 of no water - 5pm
That's a great consolation prize! Stunger, I hope the lesson that gets learned (or remembered) by most from your Mulanje experience is how to accept a negative with class and grace. Your positivity is infectious. Always seeing the upside and making sure the people you visit feel it too. It's really impressive, bravo. I don't know that I could be as gracious as you have been.Update - further on the Mulanje...
Greetings 420 enthusiasts! Well today I am smiling and I shouldn't be, I don't have a right to be. But let me step back a moment. When my star girl the Mulanje met her demise, I wasn't quite ready to bid her farewell, so I chucked her at the back of a covered but open area where I store some garden tools. Last night, I couldn't help going and having a looksee and another 'squeeze' of her buds after earlier finding a large swollen bract with a seed in it. Altho it is all immature and all larf quality it did coat my fingers so I thought I'd bring it into the studio for a closer look today. I've left her hanging on a door.
In my initial quick look, I found close to 2 dozen seeds of a good size. Of course I'll keep them because they look like they might be viable. That would be a bonus!
As my fingers got stickier and stickier I thought I should try this in the dynavap. Still very wet, but scissor chopped, I waited as much as half an hour, then valiantly did 2 vapcaps. I was surprised at getting a very nice cerebral buzz for 1.5 hours as a result. I was quite chuffed about that, it is actually usable, something to smile about as a consolation prize!
Tomorrow, at least the scissor chopped stuff will be almost dry, which will be good as vaping it green was a bit of a throat burner. Of course, I must add I haven't had any new stuff to smoke since last year, so I am not too surprised that I have found it rewarding. I will leave her hanging till she is dry, and then see what I can glean off her and harvest any other seeds she has too.
The wind is belting the balcony plants today as it has for the last 2 days. But the 3 remaining girls are all looking good in their own individual ways.
The Mango Sherbert I have started a droughting regime with her by not watering her. Of course it is hard with the unpredictability of the weather. In the event of rain, I will try to put something to cover the pot top to reduce likelihood of the soil getting wet. She is in a biggish pot at 50L (13 gallon) so it will retain more moisture than a smaller pot. However it does have at least 60 holes, some quite large, drilled into the pot's sides and base, so they do lose soil moisture quickly than a regular pot. I have not watered her since the 20th March. The strong winds we've been having must be helping to dry her soil further. Yesterday, I noticed a small bit of bud rot on 1 cola, I guess from a caterpillar, which I gouged out with my thumb.
Anyway, that's all I have today, be well and I hope you're enjoying some nice smoke!
Here's another upside - look how happy the balcony girls are now that they can breathe a little easier!!!
DV8
Well-Known Member
Hey fella I was thinking about your grow just now, was kicking around and stumbled onto Joes page (I mean if you are Trala are there its worth a look).
While I was reading through I did wonder about to things in relation to your Malanje girl that went to an early death. Look its probably raw, and I might be wrong but here goes.
When you did your spraying for catapillers (BT was it) do you think theres a chance it might have messed her up? I cant help but think if it was wet as get out, windy etc, is there a chance she could have ended up with a concentrated amount at her feet? Or possible ingestion from the open wound caused by the tie trauma?
I have a mate, good mate, an arbourist, and have given him some help from time to time. After way more than a decade his understanding of trees is quite phenomenal, and I was reminded of a conversation we had regarding pruning.
I was pruning some fruit trees and bushes using improper technique. The result were sites, wounds, that held open for an extended time, instead of quite quickly repairing and closing.
His words kind of rung in my ears, that very normal things, like moisture, insects, sprays, disease etc can have a huge effect on a plant in a very short time. His description was based upon us, if you close up after surgery properly, you minimise the internal exposure to outside threats. So that water you wash yourself every day is fine on your skin, but can be a problem if theres enough trauma at the wound site.
Even good old rain water in very small amounts can ruin a bloody big tree.
I didnt notice anything in your pics but maybe the open site wasnt quite as innocuous as might be presumed.
And I was thinking that pest spray might be a culprit, it died in something like root failure, or accelerated lockout, maybe she got shutdown by taking in some chems in her innards?
While I was reading through I did wonder about to things in relation to your Malanje girl that went to an early death. Look its probably raw, and I might be wrong but here goes.
When you did your spraying for catapillers (BT was it) do you think theres a chance it might have messed her up? I cant help but think if it was wet as get out, windy etc, is there a chance she could have ended up with a concentrated amount at her feet? Or possible ingestion from the open wound caused by the tie trauma?
I have a mate, good mate, an arbourist, and have given him some help from time to time. After way more than a decade his understanding of trees is quite phenomenal, and I was reminded of a conversation we had regarding pruning.
I was pruning some fruit trees and bushes using improper technique. The result were sites, wounds, that held open for an extended time, instead of quite quickly repairing and closing.
His words kind of rung in my ears, that very normal things, like moisture, insects, sprays, disease etc can have a huge effect on a plant in a very short time. His description was based upon us, if you close up after surgery properly, you minimise the internal exposure to outside threats. So that water you wash yourself every day is fine on your skin, but can be a problem if theres enough trauma at the wound site.
Even good old rain water in very small amounts can ruin a bloody big tree.
I didnt notice anything in your pics but maybe the open site wasnt quite as innocuous as might be presumed.
And I was thinking that pest spray might be a culprit, it died in something like root failure, or accelerated lockout, maybe she got shutdown by taking in some chems in her innards?
Well, except for the Mango Sherbert. She doesn't look like she's feeling the love!That's a great consolation prize! Stunger, I hope the lesson that gets learned (or remembered) by most from your Mulanje experience is how to accept a negative with class and grace. Your positivity is infectious. Always seeing the upside and making sure the people you visit feel it too. It's really impressive, bravo. I don't know that I could be as gracious as you have been.
Here's another upside - look how happy the balcony girls are now that they can breathe a little easier!!!
Hey @Stunger , are you going to drought the others too? Seems like your great experience before, and then the fully watered but not as potent round the next year, probably makes you want to, or no?
Emeraldo
Well-Known Member
Condolences for poor Mulanje (of course not to be confused with, ahem, "poor Melania").
No pun-ishment intended! No need to beat a dead horse here...According to @Stunger's posts, the root cause of poor Mulanje's demise has not been determined. From her outward appearance in the photos, however, it was definitely some kind of systemic imbalance, a lockout affecting the whole plant. Not something local caused by an external application of something that spread over the exterior of the plant like an infestation.
@DV8 if BT in excess amounts could be a systemic toxin, and could enter through the roots or through a wound, that could be worth looking into. I've never worked with BT, but I bought a quart of it just recently after reading how my friend Stunger has been using it and thought I might give it try this year. Now maybe I won't do that.
Info on that would be appreciated, and all BT-users would probably be grateful. I was thinking BT was harmless...@Stunger please correct me if I'm wrong but I understood your 4 plants were all in the same conditions, soil, care, environment -- including BT applications -- with the sole exception of the recent top dressings the Mulanje received prior to dying. I'm not sure anymore if the other 3 plants were top-dressed in the same way, and if they were it only proves the point.
But in any event the other 3 plants were not affected, which might point to the Mulanje herself as reacting in a way that other plants in the same conditions did not. I'm still going on the theory that Dubi (ACE Seeds breeder) has indicated, that certain tropical sativas do not do well with high or even medium levels of nitrogen. Genetics need to be taken into account in a case like this.
This year I hope to grow some haze plants that are tropical sativas (Purple Haze x Malawi, Super Malawi Haze, Super Lemon Haze, Arjan's Haze #1, Michka). Am heeding Dubi's advice and learning from my own and others' mistakes. Mixed up a batch of soil last fall that leaves out all but a very low level of N. Will start a new thread on that grow when it gets going.
This ^^ is my guess. I think he loved her to death.
Hey Koro. Sad to see the Mulanje go early. Nice consolation to get seeds off her though.
Emeraldo
Well-Known Member
Yeah, those seeds are a gift!
The silver lining....^^
Sorry to hear about the Mulanje...that had to be a gut punch, but nice to find out she's not a total loss!
Have you considered letting her ride just a tad bit longer? Longer than you would normally let it go? Maybe another 2-3 weeks? Maybe just save a branch to harvest later. Worth a try.
It is not the BT. The Bacillus thuringiensis bacteria is an isolated species that targets a specific order of insects, in our case many caterpillar species.
It's safe to use. I know a lot of cannabis growers that use it. It has never caused anything like this.Now maybe I won't do that.
DV8
Well-Known Member
I personally think its great advice, depending on conditions etc. A side by side would be a great comparison test. I have one foot in the camp of giving them (outdoors) harsh treatment and leaving them run a bit longer, a cpl days is neither here nor there, but this suggestion I love.
Of course though Stunger totally your call.
Well this is good info, cheers mate, ruling out causes is just as helpful in narrowing an answer.
Edit. I skimmed through a fair bit of related material after following your link mate, and even without thorough reading its obvious to me this is certainly not the cause. Occurs naturally in soils etc.