Renegade's Hydro Flux - Featuring TwiLight Group's 432 Watt Spider COB LED

[skunnymonster]

I've gotta say with the colour, it looks like they've got a great spectrum. I think this could be impressive

 

[skunnymonster]

Just thinking out loud here but if Twilight has the answer, that'd be great. Why not put the clusters out into the corners or fit them in a bigger case so you can get a bigger footprint out of it? It's not just this light but any that are fitted with clusters, why do they put them so close together?

 

[Renegade69]

Just thinking out loud here but if Twilight has the answer, that'd be great. Why not put the clusters out into the corners or fit them in a bigger case so you can get a bigger footprint out of it? It's not just this light but any that are fitted with clusters, why do they put them so close together?

Great question Skunny....

I would imagine it's because of the lens. Rounded so it's spread is wider. And remember this lamp unlike CO's is 120 degree...his is 140 degree. If you look at their specs the higher you go the bigger the footprint. Makes sense that you would loose some effectiveness but not much.

Check out their diagram showing the footprint.

 

[Renegade69]

Good morning all....

So the first thing I noticed this morning was my temps. I purposely closed the doors to see how much heat there would be in the unit over night.

For about an hour last night I turned the intake fans off and just left the inside fan running. Temp reached 88. I reset my gauges and turned the intake fans back on and when I checked this morning the temp seemed to hold at 84. The cabinet is in a small closet so I would have to keep the closet doors open because even with my other light it can get pretty hot in there if they were closed.

Oh, and the exhaust fan is always running when lights are out. It's plugged into the same timer that controls the lights.

This should answer the question regarding the past problems with COB's and heat.

Also keep in mind my cabinet is only 35" X 19" X 54"....

 

[Renegade69]

A quick update to what we are doing. Sorta an introduction.

Hydro Grow

Strain is Nirvana's Blue Mystic: Indica, Short Plant, 7-9 weeks flowering, stoned effect (body buzz and relaxing ...couch lock....LOL
Week 5 of veg/training stage
Indoor
Hydro
Reservoir: ------------ BP6, 6 gallon
Light: TwiLight Group's 432watt "Spider04 COD LED"
Nutrients: General Hydroponics FloraSeries Performance Pack
Suppliments: GH's CALiMAGic

Growing style....Fluxing!!!

 

[skunnymonster]

Good info Renegade
I've just looked on the answers page at the par graphs, it has a very intense 2ft radius in the centre which tails off dramatically at each incremental outer reading. At a height of 24" the centre reads 1236 Umol 12" from centre 1072 Umol, 24" from centre 870 Umol, 36" from centre 460 Umol. So surely by looking at this it's obvious by spreading out the clusters you'd get a better & more even spread of light. My logic says if the clusters were 2 or 3 feet apart you'd have a better footprint with 4 less intense hotspots instead of one. You'd also get less tail off as the weaker light radius from each cluster will overlap.

Does that make sense, or am I talking shite?

 

[Renegade69]

Good info Renegade
I've just looked on the answers page at the par graphs, it has a very intense 2ft radius in the centre which tails off dramatically at each incremental outer reading. At a height of 24" the centre reads 1236 Umol 12" from centre 1072 Umol, 24" from centre 870 Umol, 36" from centre 460 Umol. So surely by looking at this it's obvious by spreading out the clusters you'd get a better & more even spread of light. My logic says if the clusters were 2 or 3 feet apart you'd have a better footprint with 4 less intense hotspots instead of one. You'd also get less tail off as the weaker light radius from each cluster will overlap.

Does that make sense, or am I talking shite?

Absolutely makes sense. Maybe it could be a consideration with future units. But IMO moving the clusters further apart would require them to redevelop the overall size of the unit. Wondering if this was a consideration and therefor they came up with what we are looking at now. This would also help in keeping the cost down.

So let's consider this....for the cost you could purchase multiple units and hang them a certain distance from each other. I know the plan is to make it possible to daisy chain multiple lights. Not sure how many but even two in line with each other would be nice.

More food for thought...

 

[Renegade69]

Hey Renegade! I've caught up subbed up..

Might i make a suggestion for your DWC?

Aquashield!!!! This stuff kicks high water temps ass!!! as well it colonizes your root zone and protects it from the harmful bacteria while allowing the beneficial bacteria to thrive. Its a liquid compost solution derived from composted poultry litter, and will obliterate anything not useful in your res, and turn it into a useful food source for your roots.

!!

Green,

Where do you get your AquaShield?

 

[skunnymonster]

I like your thinking, just imagine if you put 4 in a 4x4 tent the Umol would be insane compared to a 1000w HPS & drawing just a touch less power. Now that would be a great side by side comparison grow

I also think it would be good if there was any way of daisy chaining individual clusters on a rail

 

[Light Addict]

Looking great in here!
A couple of points, Renegade your spot on! The spreading of clusters is as it is, due to costings of the actual unit I'm sure. Skunny your correct of course but light companies are trying to find that happy medium. Between effectiveness and cost in relation. Also I imagine it has something to do with the cooling of the light!

As for the flux don't be afraid to give the flux ends more foliage than other points! This will aid in the speed of the flux growing out. For instance I leave the fan leaf that spans out from the underside node at flux ends every other node. I leave it on untill the flux arm end starts to overtake said leaf . Then I remove and wait for the next same positioned leaf to happen along and repeat.

 

[skunnymonster]

Hey LA, you could experiment with your clusters when you switch to over to Osram. You'll be able to see the effective footprint of a single cluster & figure it out. You're probably right though it's probably not cost efficient to produce light rails with clusters.

 

[Renegade69]

As for the flux don't be afraid to give the flux ends more foliage than other points! This will aid in the speed of the flux growing out. For instance I leave the fan leaf that spans out from the underside node at flux ends every other node. I leave it on untill the flux arm end starts to overtake said leaf . Then I remove and wait for the next same positioned leaf to happen along and repeat.

Thank you so very much for stopping in LA....

Your spot on regarding the fans (hell it's your technic...LOL). That's exactly what I was trying to do. I am hoping to leave the under of the over/under fans in as long as I can. And going a step further and taking your direction to wait till the next node and top takes over the under fan before cutting out.

What I'm finding....and I'm sure you can relate...LOL. Is that I just can't leave her alone long enough. And I do believe you said train and step away for a couple of days to let her turn up again.

So my patience or the lack there of....is getting the worst of me. I'll try and do better. So what do you suggest??? 2-3 days before pulling her down again??

I think I lost a side shoot the other day when I was pulling one of the side by side fans out of the way. The shoot hadn't really developed and when I tucked the fan under it snapped and took the arm with it. Not gonna stress over it I'll just fold an arm in it's place later on. Or just leave it be....

Good news it looks like that arm is still there and growing just fine....yea me...LOL.

 

[trichomes]

I like your thinking, just imagine if you put 4 in a 4x4 tent the Umol would be insane compared to a 1000w HPS & drawing just a touch less power. Now that would be a great side by side comparison grow

I also think it would be good if there was any way of daisy chaining individual clusters on a rail

looking great Renegade, we need Jason/ "J-sun" @ Twilight in here to help out skunny & myself.

with all these engineering theories & equations

just kidding, great questions skunny I;m just starting to learn more about LED, keep those questions coming for J-sun, he is very good with the answers he shares.

J-sun

 

[Renegade69]

On another note....

Been gone all day and when I returned this evening the temp in the cabinet had top'd out at 88. Still within range although on the high side. When I'm home the cabinet doors remains open most of the time with the curtain pulled down.

The plants are really responding to the Spider. this morning they were all mostly horizontal and tonight all points are completely turned up. Now if I can only leave them the hell alone and let them get a little more vertical before pulling back down. The brightness of this light is really nice.

Won't mess with them tonight but no promises for tomorrow. I will be away from the house for 2 days so she'll have plenty of time to get vertical.

Also, being this is a short stature plant which lends itself to close nodes I'm having a problem keeping the fans out of new growth.

I would still recommend using a short plant for Fluxing....again for the same reason...tight nodes.

 

[Renegade69]

looking great Renegade, we need Jason/ "J-sun" @ Twilight in here to help out skunny & myself.

with all these engineering theories & equations

just kidding, great questions skunny I;m just starting to learn more about LED, keep those questions coming for J-sun, he is very good with the answers he shares.

J-sun

LOL... you must have just caught me trolling your yard....LOL. I do need to return because you asked a question that I had the answer to but when I saw the lights come on I scrambled like roaches...LOL.

Welcome my friend....

 

[trichomes]

Ren, lol, sweet light

 

[Renegade69]

Green,

Where do you get your AquaShield?

And is it comparible to GH's FloraShield???

 

[Greenthumb J]

And is it comparible to GH's FloraShield???

NO! I was going to use Florashield cause my local hydro store ran out of Aquashield and apparently according to Agriculture Canada, it isn't allowed across the border anymore, but i returned my bottle of Florashield. The difference between the two is Florashield is used to clean and flush your root system as well as growing system and is NOT TO BE used with Gen Hydro's Subculture-M and Subculture-B or any beneficials i guess as it will destroy the beneficial bacteria.

Here is the write up about Hydroguard (which is aquashield but botanicare changed the name again) directly from my Botanicare Urban Growers Sourcebook:

"Hydroguards unique formula, available exclusively from Botanicare, contains an isolated form of Bacillus bacteria known as Bacillus Amyloliquefaciens. This scientifically isolated bacterium was selected for its superior ability to amplify root mass and health, especially in Hydroponic gardening, when compared to the more well known Bacillus subtilis species. Upon application, the highly concentrated and pure culture of Bacillus bacteria in Hydroguard rapidly colonize the root zone and for a network of highly efficient microbes that work together to deliver exactly what each plants needs when its most crucial. These specialized rhizobacteria activate the plants natural defense system, assist in the break down of organic materials, and increase nutrient availability.

- Contains a scientifically isolated strain of beneficial bacteria, Bacillus Amyloliquefaciens.
- Helps maintain a healthy root zone 100% naturally
- Breaks down nutrients and makes them more readily available for the plant.
- More effective than the traditional Bacillus Subtilis species."


Those be the words from Botanicare. I stand by the product.

I will hook ya up actually. I will PM you for the link to where to order this stuff if you are in the US. My buddy Cannabis 1 just ordered a 1 gallon and they gave him a free upgrade to 2.5 gallon!! i'm jealous! i was only able to order 3 one litre bottles as the canadian hydro store online only had 3 left i guess!!

ah well.. maybe i will have to get him to ship me a jug!!

 

[Renegade69]

NO! I was going to use Florashield cause my local hydro store ran out of Aquashield and apparently according to Agriculture Canada, it isn't allowed across the border anymore, but i returned my bottle of Florashield. The difference between the two is Florashield is used to clean and flush your root system as well as growing system and is NOT TO BE used with Gen Hydro's Subculture-M and Subculture-B or any beneficials i guess as it will destroy the beneficial bacteria.

I will hook ya up actually. I will PM you for the link to where to order this stuff if you are in the US. QUOTE]

And hook me up you did...thanks for the share.

Big difference in cost too.

Thank you my friend.

 

[Renegade69]

Good morning one and all....

This mornings update is no different from any other. Plant is doing great and even in my limited experience can tell that she loves the new light.

The temps overnight with fans off and mister on only reached 90 and was at 88 when I opened the cabinet this morning.

All points were turned up to the lights and I made some gentle adjustments. I will wait for responses from others regarding final cutting before stepping away for a couple of days.

Here are her readings this morning...

17 Aug 14, Sunday, Day 30, Week 5, Day 2

Morning....
Air=86
RH=41
PH=5.8
PPM=959
Res Temp=80.9

I'm going to post my first post over at Flux Central with some proper introductions but this is what she looks like this morning....

All the arms are where I want them I just need to decide it any which fans to cut out.



Pay no attention to the under's on the Flux arms, they will remain till I get some substantial growth above them. And I don't really want to cut the over's on the Flux arms even thought they look like they are covering lower growth. The light seems to be reaching them just fine. I will take some input on that.

But the other fans are in question. And they can go if all agree.