Max's First Grow - Soil - LED - Painkiller XL

MaxHeadroom said:
Thanks Lady V. I'll give it a go at the weekend and report back. Would the filter be outside the tent, or would the fan be inside?

Wonderingly
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When I was living in a duplex in the middle of town I had my fan on top of my carbon filter and my hose up high. I was trying to find a photo to show you. When I had my inspection the land lady did not smell a thing. I will go back through my stuff and see if I can find a good shot.
 
Lady Vadalon said:
When I was living in a duplex in the middle of town I had my fan on top of my carbon filter and my hose up high. I was trying to find a photo to show you. When I had my inspection the land lady did not smell a thing. I will go back through my stuff and see if I can find a good shot.
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That would be great to enable me to visualise it, thank you.
 
This is what I did for the smell. Your filter can be placed outside of your tent as well. I had mine inside. I sucked the air from the top and filtered back through the can.:Namaste:
filterSetup.jpg
 
TarheelGrower said:
Very nice!
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Thanks, and welcome to my first grow TG. I didn't heed the warnings about how addictive growing is. I scoffed when I read that in many journals.. oh boy, how wrong I was! I'm hooked and busy thinking of how to clone the Painkiller XL for the next grow. I'm also thinking of a custom enclosure in my locked home office to get the tent out of the guest bedroom.

Do you have a grow journal yet? I can't get enough of reading journals.
 
Day 39 Last Day of Veg - EDIT - Flowering delayed

A milestone has been achieved! Today I set the light timer to 12/12, hurrah!

Edit: I set it back to 18/6 before getting to the first 12 hour dark period. I've ordered Bud Ignitor and a switchable 600/400/250w HPS for extra light during flower. More on this in a new post later.

I don't think I have the room to veg these beauties any longer. I'm hoping they completely fill my 2'6" square SCRoG frame and give me a decent harvest. Painkiller XL takes 10 weeks from start of flower, then of course there's the drying and curing time. Drying makes me nervous, but I've got plenty of time to learn about that.

I'm thinking Boveda packs will be used in the curing jars and no doubt I'll be asking for advice on perhaps the most important phase.

I've set the light timer to be on between 09:00 - 21:00. This means no more morning peeks at the girls, but it does give me time to play with them after work every day. I believe they need 2 more weeks of Old Timer Grow, before switching to Bloom nutes.

I can't even begin to tell you how excited I am to flip these girls. Hopefully you will all find the next phase as exciting as I do. From here on, unless something thrilling happens, I'll be doing weekly updates. I suppose I should do a picture of them on the last day in veg and the second day under the SCRoG frame.

You can see they are already poking through the screen
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Up skirt shot
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A view from the top
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This is where I start to ponder if I should get a second Mars II 400. Based on 200 true watts and a 6.25 square foot area, I've got 32 watts per foot.. is this a bit on the low side?

Edit: after checking the Mars Hydro site, it appears that the true figure is closer to 173 watts. This gives me 28 watts per foot. Another light won't hurt :-)
 
Lady Vadalon said:
This is what I did for the smell. Your filter can be placed outside of your tent as well. I had mine inside. I sucked the air from the top and filtered back through the can.:Namaste:
filterSetup.jpg
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I see how that could work very well - it eliminates the possibility of ducting pin pricks letting odour through because pressure in the ducting going out is positive rather than negative. I'm not sure I could get my fan in the tent though. You have much more space in there that I have in my little tent. +reps for an ingenious solution and pictures.
 
Max can you hang your filter?
 
Holes in the ducting on your set up shouldn't cause problems if the ducting is post filter. The things I would do would be to mount the fan right next to the filter can and push air out of the tent. I would also tape all the seams on your fan As that would be the only place unfiltered air could enter post filter. I also run insulated ducting. It helps with duct integrity, noise,and heat.
 
Hi Shig,

Great advice. My filter is in the tent and my fan outside. They are joined together by 10m of ducting. The only way air leaves the tent is through the filter - I know this because the tent walls bow inwards with the fan on.

The tent is 3'4" square and the room it is in is 16' x 14'. The room smells strongly of weed and it escapes into other rooms. It's ok with the window open but the best I can do is leave it on vent - I've already been burgled so I can't leave a window unlocked.

The filter is rated at 380m3 per hour and the fan 187m3 so there's no way the fan is too strong for the filter.

My thoughts are

1. The filter is duff
2. Pin pricks in the ducting inside the tent.
3. Bad seal between filter and ducting

With the fan being after the ducting any pin pricks would draw in the odour from inside the tent and push it into the room. Same if the seal is bad. I can't prove the ducting or seal are at fault but I'll reseal it just in case.

Alas I'm not prepared to duct out through a wall or into the loft space so that leaves fixing the cause rather than the symptoms. My money is on a duff filter so I may invest in a Rhino filter as others have had great success with that one. Step one though is to check the seal.

Thanks for taking the time to comment, it is much appreciated.
 
firstly blowing through the filter imo is not necessary at all and will create positive pressure. i would:

1. try having filter directly attached to fan to avoid gaps or holes induct between the 2.

2. just have the duct out of tent blowing into room as heat cant be a big issue on that panel.

3. you want neg pressure in tent for 2 reasons.. 1. so fresh air is being pulled through tent. 2. odours are def pulled through filter so even if there is a leak there is some protection and its easy to isolate leak.

3. Change filter to a rhino or can filter and always use a bigger filter than you think you need.

4. If you have a smell leak and its only in veg something is really wrong. remember you will always smell the plants in the room when the tent is open.


Your light per square foot is low. Dont expect monster buds with those panels. i dont care what anyone else says those panels dont out perform hps, not even close. yes some individuals make them work but i dont believe everything i see. i think some resukts are inflated and the ones that arent the growers have experience. Just trust me, if you are going to buy another panel, switch to hps and you will max that tent. I have used good led panels and they arent cost effective when you run like for like. my business partner has a big led business and i was in the factory in china last year helping with deveolpment. His panels are great and i still wouldnt use them because of price and the savings are exaggerated, just my 2 cents.

your scrog will fill up nicely. but if you want clones take them now mate and just keep them under a low watt cfl in the corner of the room. if you need help with cloning i will take you through it step by step.

If you can get it hit the plants with advanced nutes bud ignitor now and for the next 10-14 days, it really works and get the plant flowering. switch to bloom nutes after a week or even straight away if plants are healthy. little details that add up and make big differences.
 
Cultivator said:
firstly blowing through the filter imo is not necessary at all and will create positive pressure. i would:

1. try having filter directly attached to fan to avoid gaps or holes induct between the 2.

2. just have the duct out of tent blowing into room as heat cant be a big issue on that panel.

3. you want neg pressure in tent for 2 reasons.. 1. so fresh air is being pulled through tent. 2. odours are def pulled through filter so even if there is a leak there is some protection and its easy to isolate leak.

3. Change filter to a rhino or can filter and always use a bigger filter than you think you need.

4. If you have a smell leak and its only in veg something is really wrong. remember you will always smell the plants in the room when the tent is open.


Your light per square foot is low. Dont expect monster buds with those panels. i dont care what anyone else says those panels dont out perform hps, not even close. yes some individuals make them work but i dont believe everything i see. i think some resukts are inflated and the ones that arent the growers have experience. Just trust me, if you are going to buy another panel, switch to hps and you will max that tent. I have used good led panels and they arent cost effective when you run like for like. my business partner has a big led business and i was in the factory in china last year helping with deveolpment. His panels are great and i still wouldnt use them because of price and the savings are exaggerated, just my 2 cents.

your scrog will fill up nicely. but if you want clones take them now mate and just keep them under a low watt cfl in the corner of the room. if you need help with cloning i will take you through it step by step.

If you can get it hit the plants with advanced nutes bud ignitor now and for the next 10-14 days, it really works and get the plant flowering. switch to bloom nutes after a week or even straight away if plants are healthy. little details that add up and make big differences.
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Hi Cultivator, this came at just the right time as I'm toying with HPS as the second light. For around a third of the price of LED I could get HPS and end up with the best of both worlds - a mix of LED and HPS. I'm thinking of 250w, which would give me a total of 67w per foot. Does this sound good? The makes I can find around the £60 mark are Omega or Sensua. Do you have any comments on which to chose out of the two?

As for the fan - I definitely have negative pressure and the fan is sucking through the filter, not blowing. Zero air escapes the tent - it all goes in the filter, down the ducting and out through the fan (which is definitely set to suck rather that blow).

I'll have to order the bud igniter and will look at that thanks.

Cloning scares me - I have nowhere to put clones at the moment, although someone on here suggested a cardboard box will do at a pinch. I may watch more of your great videos on cloning and if I get lost I'll ask thanks. One thing that confuses me about cloning holders is how the new roots don't get damaged when you take them out. It looks like the stalk is poked through a slit in rubber - how are they taken out of that?

Thanks for the assistance, much appreciated.
 
Firstly i wouldnt waste time on 250w hps. what is stopping you from using a 600w? im sorry if this is already answered in here, i havent read every page. Id want double that wattage per sq foot, i cant think of any situation that requires running such low wattage as its not crazy expensive to run 1 600w hps. maybe you could clear that up for me?



Trust me there is no reason to fear cloning. its so so simple. look at the clones i took in my journal, it goes against everything 'pros' say you should do. just water and rockwool and no propogator and 1200w of hos and 100% success in 10 days with beautiful roots.

To begin id say get a propogation tray with rockwool cubes. dont use tiny cubes, maybe 3inch cubes. build a small box and place a 50w t5 in there and they will root and grow real slow so be nice to go in tent after harvest. You can use clonex if you want but just wasting your money really. most important thing is to keep the rickwool warm and not dry out completely.
 
Cultivator said:
Firstly i wouldnt waste time on 250w hps. what is stopping you from using a 600w? im sorry if this is already answered in here, i havent read every page. Id want double that wattage per sq foot, i cant think of any situation that requires running such low wattage as its not crazy expensive to run 1 600w hps. maybe you could clear that up for me?



Trust me there is no reason to fear cloning. its so so simple. look at the clones i took in my journal, it goes against everything 'pros' say you should do. just water and rockwool and no propogator and 1200w of hos and 100% success in 10 days with beautiful roots.

To begin id say get a propogation tray with rockwool cubes. dont use tiny cubes, maybe 3inch cubes. build a small box and place a 50w t5 in there and they will root and grow real slow so be nice to go in tent after harvest. You can use clonex if you want but just wasting your money really. most important thing is to keep the rickwool warm and not dry out completely.
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The only reason is I thought 600w would be overkill in my little tent. To buy the actual light is only pennies difference between 250w and 600w. I have solar panels so running the lights costs me nothing during daylight hours. Would you really put 600w in a 3 foot tent? I'll certainly listen to advice on this.

I'm on the famous rain forest site at the moment looking at bits so I'll look up the tray and rockwool cubes now.

Cheers
 
yes id use 600w in 3 ft tent but if you are worried about extracting heat atleast use a 400 duel spec. You could use a red spectrum which would maybe boost yield a little but i find quality is better with duels. just get quality bulbs.
 
Odour Woes - Step One

I've just taped the ducting to the filter then put the jubilee clip on top and tightened it up securely. It looked like the clip originally went over a wire and wasn't clamped down enough to give an air tight seal, thus dragging odours straight into the duct. The window is currently open to get the air in that room fresh before sealing it up tight to test again. I was wondering what kind of test equipment would be useful until I remembered we are born with functioning noses. Doh!

If this doesn't work I'll see if I can couple the fan directly to the filter as suggested by both Lady V and Cultivator. Fingers crossed this does the job. I figured I'd tackle each potential area one by one in ascending order of cost and complexity. Reading about it and sitting on my arse (ass or fanny for my American chums), doing on line shopping for a new filter wasn't going to solve it.

I'll report back on the effectiveness or otherwise of improving the filter-to-duct seal.

Thinking of odours; the girls got rather fragrant at 2 weeks old. Does this mean I'll need odour control for a separate clone box? I strongly suspect I will, because they will be slowly growing under a couple of small cfl's for 9 - 10 weeks when the tent is in bloom/flower mode.

I know I say thank you a lot, but damn it, you guys and gals give great advice that is very much appreciated. You've saved my grow in the early stages and kept me on track for the past 5 weeks or so. I'm down to one codeine a day and living in pain all the time - this grow is important to me for medical reasons; I really hope the Painkiller XL lives up to its name. In the hope that it does I'll get set up to clone ASAP.

Thank you for all the help, support and advice.
 
Cultivator said:
yes id use 600w in 3 ft tent but if you are worried about extracting heat atleast use a 400 duel spec. You could use a red spectrum which would maybe boost yield a little but i find quality is better with duels. just get quality bulbs.
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I've found a bit of a deal on a light set with a switchable digital ballast - only £20 more than a fixed 600w with a magnetic ballast. Apparently it can be set to 250, 400 and 600 and initially comes with a 600w bulb. At £75 it's just over half the price of a second Mars II 400. You've convinced me to go HPS on the second light :-)

I'm not sure what make the bulb is - sorry for all the questions but what brand would you consider to be good?
 
Almost Flowered...

This morning I set my lights to 12/12, however I backed out before the first 12 hour dark period. I've been following the journals and videos of a fellow Brit's commercial grows (take a bow Mr Cultivator). Following some advice I've ordered a 600/400/250w HPS with digital ballast and some Bud Ignitor. Cultivator doesn't waste time or money on things that don't work, hence the Bud Ignitor order. He also helped me make up my mind on the second light. I toyed with the idea of a second Mars II 400 but I've heard great things about mixing HPS and LED. It also comes in at half the price of a second Mars II.

Another deciding factor for me was the fact I have to run an 800w oil filled radiator in my tent to keep the temps up and I need to make a clone box. All of this has prompted me to hold off flipping the girls. It would make me very happy if I could flip on 1st February as this will make it much easier for me to keep track of time in flower... yes, I'm a simple chap :-)

The HPS comes with a 600w bulb which I'll run at 400w to give me 91w per foot. I'm assuming bulbs are happy being driven at lower power, right? If 91w/ft is excessive I can always run it at 250w (67w/ft). If it's not enough I can run it at 600w (124w/ft). There must come a point where all those extra watts are wasted so that's why I opted for a switchable ballast.

The goodies should arrive by Monday and will be pressed into service on arrival.
 
didnt realise you were in uk, makes my advice much easier as i can point out places for you to order bits and pieces.

always have bulb turn on at 600w then once its reached full power, id give 15min, then turn down. You will fry your bulb if you turn it on on any other setting. Lumi ballasts and bulbs are good value for money.
 
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