Making Your Own Nutrient Concentrates

I'm kind of new to the whole macro/micro nutrient ect but very interested, I started with nutrifield a+b but they had like 7 other bottles on their nutrient line so i ended up with them all i think that's where my stuff is so out of whack, i've loaded my full nutrient line into hydrobuddy (10 bottles including calmag) any tips on how to get a better ratio sorted like the one you posted above?
 
Punch in those targets I shared in my previous post and click calculate. It will try to get as close as it can to those targets with the nutrients your have listed. For all intents and purposes, N-P-K-Ca-Mg-S and Si are macros and the rest are micros, but when used in hydro buddy, that app doesn't know or care what we consider to be macro or micro, so the classifications aren't all that important.

It might be pointless to target your micros if they're already blended together in one bottle. In that case, you're pretty much locked in to what's in the bottle. If you have access to nutrient salts and chelated elements down under, I highly suggest ditching liquid nutes and making your own from concentrates. If all there is available is wet nutes, than it is what it is.
 
I think there may be some confusion as to what type of N is in amino acids. I recently read that the organic N is NH2, not NH4+ which would be helpful to know when making decisions. With no rhyme or reason, I am forming the opinion that aminos aren't performing well in my res. FWIW, I only use less than half the smallest recommended dose and ever since I started adding it, growth has slowed some. Perhaps they'll be better used in a spray? How long have you had total N @70? I had deficiency symptoms at 90ppm and toxicity at a little over 100, but that's when CalNite was my only source of ammonium and it's N ratio is 14.4 : 1.1. It could have been the relationship to my other levels that made 90N too low, but yourself being 20ppm even lower, keep aware and have an N rich spray on standby. Neptune's Harvest Fish Hydrolysate has a good balance of N in it with 3parts nitrate to 1 part ammonical. I'm using it once a week @ 4ml/Gal plus other organics, epsom and gypsum.

I upped my Fe to 2.5 and if all goes well, when I mix another micro nutrient concentrate, I will target for 3ppm. All of my resources aside from you is telling me ideal is in the 2-3 ppm range, so I will inch my way north.

I have read that Mg can be as high as Ca, just not more. I'm currently at 2:1, but I did briefly experiment with 1.5:1 and didn't see any adverse reactions, but it being so involved in the creation of carbs and energy, I do also intend to soon revert to working my Mg levels higher than 50% of Ca.
My NH4 comes from CaN03 and then I top it up to my target range with MAP. General rule of thumb with NH4 is 10% of total nitrogen. I was running mine around 7.5-8% TN to keep my rootzone ph around 6.4 but 10% works better. I’ve been running this formula for a few days now with a little bit of a fade out on a few leaves but upping the Mg fixed that. I used to always hang around the 3:1 Ca/Mg ratio but since following Skybounds work I think 2:1 works better. Amino acids help chelate Ca and help enable better absorption amongst a myriad of other beneficial things. The plants can use it immediately so in essence I’m lessening the nitrates so the plant doesn’t have to work as hard to convert said nitrates but instead can feed from the amino and NH4. It’ll help get the sucrose flowing. I run a quality trichodermia product called Plantmate Drench (agri product not hydro shop garbage) so the aminos and fulvic feed the bennies etc. I’ll never use myco’s in hydro unless you run P at about 20ppm. Any higher and the myco changes from being simbiotic with the plant to parasitic. I had it happen once while using them. Great during veg but a no go during flower. Trichodermia and coco work the best imho
 
I had great vigorous growth and a lower EC to boot with these targets some months back. I've since been exploring new ranges and am trying new things so I didn't want to share my most current levels until I'm more certain they're productive. But this mid bloom blend will get your macros in order, but your micros look like they're out of whack with Fe being a lot lower than Zn. That might become problematic, but it also might not, I'm just not used to seeing anything in the micros being used more than Fe.

safe start.JPG
That’s a good mix that one
 
Hey guys, trying hydrobuddy out for the first time today as i've had issues with the nutrient line i use. Played around with the bottles i have on hand and this is what i've come up with, First pic is what they were getting, 2nd pic is what i've come up with through the program, Could someone tell me if this is a suitable ratio for flowering im week 3-4 and any possible tweaks i can do? (can't get the P any lower)
 

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My NH4 comes from CaN03 and then I top it up to my target range with MAP. General rule of thumb with NH4 is 10% of total nitrogen. I was running mine around 7.5-8% TN to keep my rootzone ph around 6.4 but 10% works better. I’ve been running this formula for a few days now with a little bit of a fade out on a few leaves but upping the Mg fixed that. I used to always hang around the 3:1 Ca/Mg ratio but since following Skybounds work I think 2:1 works better. Amino acids help chelate Ca and help enable better absorption amongst a myriad of other beneficial things. The plants can use it immediately so in essence I’m lessening the nitrates so the plant doesn’t have to work as hard to convert said nitrates but instead can feed from the amino and NH4. It’ll help get the sucrose flowing. I run a quality trichodermia product called Plantmate Drench (agri product not hydro shop garbage) so the aminos and fulvic feed the bennies etc. I’ll never use myco’s in hydro unless you run P at about 20ppm. Any higher and the myco changes from being simbiotic with the plant to parasitic. I had it happen once while using them. Great during veg but a no go during flower. Trichodermia and coco work the best imho

Can you link me to info discussing not using microbes in solutions with more than 20ppm of P because I've been using microbe teas for years in hydro and never had my P that low. so if I'm doing something wrong, I'd like to know the "why" so I can make any needed changes.

Also, I just started ramping down my use of amino acids. I use the granular AAs from Kelp4Less but have noticed a slow down in growth overall throughout my crop over the course of months. Through various adjustments of various components, I am near certain the culprit is my AAs. After looking up Amino Acids (in wiki), you'll see that the form of N is -NH2. I'm still trying to find out if the plant can use that molecule. Daniel Fernandez made a nice BLOG ENTRY about the questionable reputation of Aminos and I am forming the conclusion that AAs are more useful to treat plants out of stressful events, but not so much for a constant use. So previously, I used to add 6 quarter TSP scoops in 10 gallons of res, then 4, now I'm taking it down to 1 scoop for the res. I mix all of my powdered/dry organic products in the beginning, so the gypsum, yucca, fulvic/humic/kelp blend and the AA, and with a little water in a screw lid jar, I shake the bullshit out of it all when making a new res. This way the Ca will have some residence time with the AA and it can chelate.

My train of thought to increase Ca uptake is to lower the K and find the ideal ratio of NH4/NO3. Pursuant to you jumping on this thread and sharing your findings, I also bought MAP to supplement my NH4. Already I notice a bit more green in my new growth, the exact green I've been trying to produce for the past months, but have failed at. So I'm already loving the NH4, and I have it at 10% or less. I expect your 8% to be closer to ideal, but I'll flesh that out for myself. I just want to lower the K some more.

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Hey guys, trying hydrobuddy out for the first time today as i've had issues with the nutrient line i use. Played around with the bottles i have on hand and this is what i've come up with, First pic is what they were getting, 2nd pic is what i've come up with through the program, Could someone tell me if this is a suitable ratio for flowering im week 3-4 and any possible tweaks i can do? (can't get the P any lower)

since both P and N are toxic in your mix, try lowering both targets, lower K as well. What I found I needed to do to resolve better ranges when I used blends of salts was to trick Hydro Buddy by intentionally punching in skewed targets and clicking on Calculate. Just keep tweaking your targets over and over and over as needed till it outputs levels closer to ideal. At some point you're going to need to supplement your macros so try to locate the following products;

Calcium Nitrate
Potassium Sulfate

Those should be all that you need to be able to lower your P to 65, then bring your N and K back up to ideal targets.
 
Appreciate the info man i'll definitely look into getting some. So just try get the lower P and N and sacrafice some K?

Yes, lower K, N, whatever else you need to lower till you get your P around 60 and N around 100. K can go really high, but I'd like to see what it looks like if you get your P and N down.

Also hydrobuddy was no hope in trying to get a target for me i pretty much came up with those numbers by manually changing the weights

Setting weights is for when you tell hydro buddy how much of each solution to use, but if you "Reset Weights", this will zero out all the weights applied to your solutions, then on the main page choose the default position, set your elemental targets in the center column, and Hydro Buddy will try to get you to the targets using your solutions.

concen.JPG
 
Yea i've tried that but it still just goes all over the whack no matter what numbers i try put in. I'll try manually get some better numbers but it's gotta be better than what i was running previously haha

Zero all your targets, then target just the P and N and see what it returns?

Is switching your nutrient brand an option for future growing or is this brand all you can get your hands on? I know what it's like to waste money, but the my primary end goal is a lot of great bud, and that helped me get past my frustration.
 
Yeah man it's totally an option for me to switch definitely going too. That's what i got using just the n and p lol

Show the elemental returns, not the solutions. We're communicating about elements.

Edit - What I'm wanting to see is what happens to the other elements when you dial in your N and P.
 
Sorry mate this is all new to me. Are there any other raw nutrient i should purchase on top of the potassium sulfate and calcium nitrate? Also i have calmag here . I can't get it to do it automatically no matter where i start or what i try i think it's just what's available in my bottles
 

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Here in the states, I can get everything I need to make about 5-10 years of nutes for about $200 before shipping. IDK what's available down there or what's not, but my approach is to mix my own chelated micro nutrient concentrate and that is what I use universally in my various reservoirs. This way I don't need to be concerned with the frequent changes I make to my macros and secondaries. This regimen is my first solid chart. I'm up to my 5th revision now and am contemplating my 6th, but the beauty of using salts with HB is I hit my targets with total accuracy so am free to try any blend out there.

AA.JPG

(edit - I just noticed my NH4+ is so high. This is because when I made the first chart, I didn't have MAP, so I didn't target NH4. FYI, NH4 should be 10% of total N needs or less.

What I am currently using is as follows;

Potassium Silicate (Silica)
Monopotassium Phosphate (MKP)
Potassium sulfate (K-sulf)
Magnesium Sulfate (Epsom)
Magnesium Nitrate (MagNite)
Calcium Nitrate (CalNite)
Monoammonium Phosphate (MAP)
Calcium Sulfate (gypsum) (powder form)

To make a micro concentrate, you must use chelated metals or the concentrate will oxidize within hours and your iron will fall right out of solution as iron oxide (rust). These are;

Iron DTPA
Manganese EDTA
Copper EDTA
Zinc EDTA
Boric Acid (any source of Boron)
Sodium Molybdate (any source of Molybdenum)
 
Can you link me to info discussing not using microbes in solutions with more than 20ppm of P because I've been using microbe teas for years in hydro and never had my P that low. so if I'm doing something wrong, I'd like to know the "why" so I can make any needed changes.

Also, I just started ramping down my use of amino acids. I use the granular AAs from Kelp4Less but have noticed a slow down in growth overall throughout my crop over the course of months. Through various adjustments of various components, I am near certain the culprit is my AAs. After looking up Amino Acids (in wiki), you'll see that the form of N is -NH2. I'm still trying to find out if the plant can use that molecule. Daniel Fernandez made a nice BLOG ENTRY about the questionable reputation of Aminos and I am forming the conclusion that AAs are more useful to treat plants out of stressful events, but not so much for a constant use. So previously, I used to add 6 quarter TSP scoops in 10 gallons of res, then 4, now I'm taking it down to 1 scoop for the res. I mix all of my powdered/dry organic products in the beginning, so the gypsum, yucca, fulvic/humic/kelp blend and the AA, and with a little water in a screw lid jar, I shake the bullshit out of it all when making a new res. This way the Ca will have some residence time with the AA and it can chelate.

My train of thought to increase Ca uptake is to lower the K and find the ideal ratio of NH4/NO3. Pursuant to you jumping on this thread and sharing your findings, I also bought MAP to supplement my NH4. Already I notice a bit more green in my new growth, the exact green I've been trying to produce for the past months, but have failed at. So I'm already loving the NH4, and I have it at 10% or less. I expect your 8% to be closer to ideal, but I'll flesh that out for myself. I just want to lower the K some more.

Figre 6.jpg
Loving your work skybound and here’s the link.
Used to be manic botanix. It was that site where all of my early reading and learning came from. great reading and lots of info on that site. The amino product I use is this
It’s a quality product as is all of the products from nutri tech. Other than my raw salts everything else comes from there. Lots more info there too. They even have a chart for cannabis here
Check out the blogs and stuff it’s good reading.
I’m picking up this shortly and it’s been just what I’ve been looking for. It’s got all the trimmings
Lots and lots of information for high brix particularly soil growing.
You’ve got the NH4 going on now which is awesome. I reckon it helps a lot with frostiness too but you’ll see what I mean. Regarding the myco here’s the link
I’m not sure what myco strains are created from tea but in hydro anything above 20ppm of P makes the mycos a hindrance. We supply plenty of P in our solution so no need. High brix in soil different story with mycos but better off without in hydro. Trichodermia is really good though. Can’t wait to see your findings man, I’ll just keep throwing my things I find at you while I watch you work. Great job
 
Yea i've tried that but it still just goes all over the whack no matter what numbers i try put in.

I also find that HB does a crappy job of mixing when there are more than about four bottles involved. I thought maybe it’s giving priority to certain nutrients over others which skews things so much- but if so I can’t see what.
What’s worked for me is to reduce to only a few bottles- get an idea what’s going on- then work up from there and start setting the weights myself.
 
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