Jon's First Outdoor Grow: Sugar Breath Photoperiod & Strawberry Banana Autoflower

[Jon]

Haha I'm glad we're ok. Also glad you've been busy but for the best reason ever hehe. Trim jail is a painful one but has the best release date ever haha.

Should have known I was being a paranoid fool as usual .

I know what you mean lol. I spent today watching the new Witcher season and came on to over 150 notifications. I can't imagine how many you must have lol!

Cant wait to see the weight in! The quality is guaranteed with your grows so just interested to see how much you have to smoke over Christmas heheh.

Sending positive thoughts for your final result and positive vibes to get you through trim days hehe

Thanks Moon! Yeah, there were around 380 notifications. Lol. And I didn't respond to your message cuz I can only respond with emojis still for now. Yeah man I wouldn't blow you off. You appear to be doing quite well and must be psyched. Heck of a recovery from the beginning, really good job. They're humming now it looks like.

So I'm now out of trim jail. Round one is completed. The following are all trimmed and jarred from both the indoor and outdoor grows as several came up together:
- Slurricane
- Ghost Train Haze
- Hulkberry (she took the longest)
- 4 Strawberry Bananas
- Gelato
- Raspberry Parfait


9 down, 9 to go. The Pineapple Upside Down Cake gets chopped in a day or two. The four outdoor autos come up pretty soon after that. That's five plants and will be round 2.

Then will be the three coco girls in the tent, they'll be round 3.

Finally, we wrap up the outdoor grow with the final plant, the outdoor Apple Blossom photo. She's round four to herself.

That's how the timing works out. Each round is a few days of hell then I get a significant break. Not bad at all really. Imagine if all 18 plants harvested together. And that first round was the worst. I went animal on it. I'll post a first round yield for those buds in a couple days once I'm sure my Infinity Natural Moisture Exchange Packs (arrived today finally and just in time to hit all the jars) have my stuff stabilized. I use them instead of the Bovedas cuz they go with the Infinity jars I use. I have Bovedas for the other rounds as all that is going to have to go in mason jars. I'm out of Infinity's. I have one large one and one small one left, which will not be enough to hold the PUC. So common gutter mason jars it is. Lol.

So it'll be nice to catch up on everyone I've been missing now and get the hell out of my own space and head for several days. Yay. I can even play my bass again. Wow, the rest of my life is back! Least I haven't been blowing off my editing, that I'm caught up on (dumb real job). Isn't some holiday coming up?

 

[Moony]

God damn that's some serious plants still to come and some already done. Your going to have such lovely variety. No chance of you getting bored of a strain any time soon haha. I thought I had my hands full with 9 plants but it makes my setup look like a holiday haha.

Yeah I'm doing great now! So happy hehe. I'll let you have a catch up on my journal. I'll give ya a hint. Roll a smoke cos I've done 2 videos too now! Hehe. Nothing too long one 5 one 3 mins I think so won't take hours haha. Just when you get time obviously

Can't wait to see some bud shots once everything is dried cured and manicured! As well as the final weigh in lol

 

[Jon]

God damn that's some serious plants still to come and some already done. Your going to have such lovely variety. No chance of you getting bored of a strain any time soon haha. I thought I had my hands full with 9 plants but it makes my setup look like a holiday haha.

Yeah I'm doing great now! So happy hehe. I'll let you have a catch up on my journal. I'll give ya a hint. Roll a smoke cos I've done 2 videos too now! Hehe. Nothing too long one 5 one 3 mins I think so won't take hours haha. Just when you get time obviously

Can't wait to see some bud shots once everything is dried cured and manicured! As well as the final weigh in lol

Oh cool videos too. I'll check it out! BTW - I already posted several bud pics from all the strains I believe. I also posted a 4 picture finished buds picture comparison of the four Strawberry Bananas. Pics are in whatever journal those plants were a part of. If you feel like looking around. I'll post more with the yield report.

 

[Jon]

Hey @Bill284, here's our next upcoming thing. I'm heading off the pass now for tomorrow morning's question cuz I plan to sleep in for the first time in forever now that trim jail round one is over.

Tomorrow we begin week 7 of the FF feed chart on the cocos. At the end of that week, we flush with Sledgehammer.

So...
- if it's water to runoff it's flush too, so okay there
- but....can I flush with tap or hose water? or do I have to flush gallon by 5.8 gallon?
- should I put calmag in the flush water? and should I follow the flush after letting them ween any moisture off with a feeding as the "final gallon" of the flush?

That's it. Not too hard, right? Lol.

Thanks Bill.

 

[Moony]

Oh cool videos too. I'll check it out! BTW - I already posted several bud pics from all the strains I believe. I also posted a 4 picture finished buds picture comparison of the four Strawberry Bananas. Pics are in whatever journal those plants were a part of. If you feel like looking around. I'll post more with the yield report.

I seen the other pics . I mean I want the whole lot every strain put together so can compare them all hahah.

 

[cjsbabygirl313]

Thanks Moon! Yeah, there were around 380 notifications. Lol. And I didn't respond to your message cuz I can only respond with emojis still for now. Yeah man I wouldn't blow you off. You appear to be doing quite well and must be psyched. Heck of a recovery from the beginning, really good job. They're humming now it looks like.

So I'm now out of trim jail. Round one is completed. The following are all trimmed and jarred from both the indoor and outdoor grows as several came up together:
- Slurricane
- Ghost Train Haze
- Hulkberry (she took the longest)
- 4 Strawberry Bananas
- Gelato
- Raspberry Parfait


9 down, 9 to go. The Pineapple Upside Down Cake gets chopped in a day or two. The four outdoor autos come up pretty soon after that. That's five plants and will be round 2.

Then will be the three coco girls in the tent, they'll be round 3.

Finally, we wrap up the outdoor grow with the final plant, the outdoor Apple Blossom photo. She's round four to herself.

That's how the timing works out. Each round is a few days of hell then I get a significant break. Not bad at all really. Imagine if all 18 plants harvested together. And that first round was the worst. I went animal on it. I'll post a first round yield for those buds in a couple days once I'm sure my Infinity Natural Moisture Exchange Packs (arrived today finally and just in time to hit all the jars) have my stuff stabilized. I use them instead of the Bovedas cuz they go with the Infinity jars I use. I have Bovedas for the other rounds as all that is going to have to go in mason jars. I'm out of Infinity's. I have one large one and one small one left, which will not be enough to hold the PUC. So common gutter mason jars it is. Lol.

So it'll be nice to catch up on everyone I've been missing now and get the hell out of my own space and head for several days. Yay. I can even play my bass again. Wow, the rest of my life is back! Least I haven't been blowing off my editing, that I'm caught up on (dumb real job). Isn't some holiday coming up?

Hey there @Jon! Glad to see you made it out of jail and are on parole for a while! I spent all day in cookie jail (results from todays work are on my thread) … and am gonna be there for the next few days. It sounds like it wont be long before your parole gets revoked and tou have to go back.

But it sounds like you just got a killer haul and have another coming!!!

 

[Bill284]

Hey @Bill284, here's our next upcoming thing. I'm heading off the pass now for tomorrow morning's question cuz I plan to sleep in for the first time in forever now that trim jail round one is over.

Tomorrow we begin week 7 of the FF feed chart on the cocos. At the end of that week, we flush with Sledgehammer.

So...
- if it's water to runoff it's flush too, so okay there
- but....can I flush with tap or hose water? or do I have to flush gallon by 5.8 gallon?
- should I put calmag in the flush water? and should I follow the flush after letting them ween any moisture off with a feeding as the "final gallon" of the flush?

That's it. Not too hard, right? Lol.

Thanks Bill.

Good morning Jon.
Hope you have recovered from your week of trimming.
First I always water to runoff so I never have to flush my ladies.
Between Bk & Frass feeding my roots and always watering until it's pouring out I don't get a deficiency.
But that doesn’t answer your question.
If it calls for it then I would definitely do it.
Seeing as it's a flush not a feed mix your Sledgehammer as recommended and
don't fret about ph,ing or mag.
Flush as per the schedule.
Then give a full strength feed immediately after.
That should keep them happy.
Let me know how they react to that.

Stay safe
Bill

 

[Jon]

I seen the other pics . I mean I want the whole lot every strain put together so can compare them all hahah.

Lol. I tried to take a pic of the seven strains I just harvested, one bud of each. Each bud was too small in the pic to get them all in to a decent picture. I gotta figure out the best way to present them all. But I will, you know I will. Who could resist that?

 

[Jon]

Good morning Jon.
Hope you have recovered from your week of trimming.
First I always water to runoff so I never have to flush my ladies.
Between Bk & Frass feeding my roots and always watering until it's pouring out I don't get a deficiency.
But that doesn’t answer your question.
If it calls for it then I would definitely do it.
Seeing as it's a flush not a feed mix your Sledgehammer as recommended and
don't fret about ph,ing or mag.
Flush as per the schedule.
Then give a full strength feed immediately after.
That should keep them happy.
Let me know how they react to that.

Stay safe
Bill

Well, I have been watering to runoff since we discussed it and the plants are not sitting in it to suck it back in now. But not the whole time, and it does call for it. Great, what you outline was my first choice of action too. I like when I find myself thinking like Bill!! Thanks. How's your coffee? I got a great organic coffee person who makes her own beans if you need a good source of awesome organic coffee.

 

[Bill284]

Well, I have been watering to runoff since we discussed it and the plants are not sitting in it to suck it back in now. But not the whole time, and it does call for it. Great, what you outline was my first choice of action too. I like when I find myself thinking like Bill!! Thanks. How's your coffee? I got a great organic coffee person who makes her own beans if you need a good source of awesome organic coffee.

I love good coffee.
I'm up at 4 am drinking coffee by 4:05,hehe.
Nothing beats an espresso though.
Haven't seen my espresso maker since the fire .
Let me know how they react to the Sledgehammer Mr Valdez.

Stay safe
Bill

 

[Jon]

Good Morning, @Emilya, hope this day finds you well.

I have an interesting situation, and wanted to share my solution for you for your feedback if you have a few minutes. I have found with molasses and seemingly especially autos, some like it more than others. My photos always tend to have no issues, but sometimes the autos do. And the issue almost always has looked the same and caused the same issue. The molasses stays in the soil more than other stuff you put in. You can see it in your runoff or if you flush, it's brown. For a while. And sometimes that can cause problems. I've determined it causes cal/mag lockout. Every time it happens what I begin to see is the classic reddish brown spotting that signifies that deficiency. Like chicken pox kind of, red spots.

The only answer in my experience is to flush then follow the flush with a water/cal mag feeding and feed water and cal mag again if that doesn't do it. This has worked in 7 of 8 cases this has happened over my grows.

Here's the interesting part: This is happening (just starting, not an issue yet, but must be stopped right now in it's tracks or my buds will be compromised) on the Gorilla Zkittlez. I noticed it yesterday for the first time. Only she's in Sohum.

So if I flush (and it has to be a real flush, not a five gallon quickie), the odds at this late stage are that I will eliminate much of what the soil has left to feed these girls. So the question becomes, what will they eat for the rest of their lives?

I decided to do this:
- flush
- top dress/amend with Geoflora, bokashi and frass
- finish the flush with a plain water/cal mag gallon after medium gets not so soaked
- next watering, feed a very mild cocktail of FF bloom nutes, to sustain her while the microbes get up to speed
- watch

She's got at least three weeks left, maybe four. More than enough time for the microbes to get up to speed and benefit the plant. The mild cocktail should keep her going.

So you see my logic, as well as knowing I'm flying relatively blind, but not so much cuz this has happened enough times that I believe the solution will work. If it was soil I know it would. So what do you think?

 

[Jon]

I love good coffee.
I'm up at 4 am drinking coffee by 4:05,hehe.
Nothing beats an espresso though.
Haven't seen my espresso maker since the fire .
Let me know how they react to the Sledgehammer Mr Valdez.

Stay safe
Bill

Will do. Some folks put aloe in for that flush too. I never have. Ever done that? Any reason to? I've been wanting to try it.

 

[Bill284]

Will do. Some folks put aloe in for that flush too. I never have. Ever done that? Any reason to? I've been wanting to try it.

Aloe has hormones that stimulate root growth.
I unfortunately have never used it so can't advise from experience.
Also I don't flush so no need.
I don't see any harm in trying something that's beneficial though.
I have used kelp before though, terrific stuff.
And tea with Bk, Fr and molasses.
Just never aloe.

Stay safe
Bill

 

[Jon]

I love good coffee.
I'm up at 4 am drinking coffee by 4:05,hehe.
Nothing beats an espresso though.
Haven't seen my espresso maker since the fire .
Let me know how they react to the Sledgehammer Mr Valdez.

Stay safe
Bill

Me too. Check out Grateful Beans.

 

[Jon]

Aloe has hormones that stimulate root growth.
I unfortunately have never used it so can't advise from experience.
Also I don't flush so no need.
I don't see any harm in trying something that's beneficial though.
I have used kelp before though, terrific stuff.
And tea with Bk, Fr and molasses.
Just never aloe.

Stay safe
Bill

Ok I'll consider it since we have some time yet. So on the praying and the light, guess what? They're all three already back to the same crazy prayer angle. Even though I lifted them to all the same height as the Blueberry. All three can't get any closer (6 inches is as low as we can go). I can't even believe at 6 inches from the light and getting blasted with 1300 par they continue to pray like this. But maybe it's not so surprising in this case. Maybe it's due to growing up for so long in the sun. I think the reason I'm seeing this is cuz no matter what they're getting from my light, two things seem to be in play:
- it's still not as strong (par/ppfd) as the sun, obviously. Not even close no matter what I throw at them light wise.
- they are not getting the full sun spectrum like the real sun provides no matter how good the LED

So what we're seeing I think it them thirsting for the sun I took away. And I think it might just be possible that the plants have become "conditioned" to the sun and therefore are responding positively to the gigantic ppfd numbers I have them at. Normally in early budding I would have them more at like 1050-1100. But these girls seems to just be the ultimate light whores, all three of them.

Wondering if growing up in the sun and beginning flower in the sun has allowed them to flourish at higher light intensity in the tent versus if the same plants fed the same way in the same soil and pots, but growing from scratch under LED in the tent would? That's kinda the theory I'm working on here, based on observation and a little experience.

Thoughts?

 

[Bill284]

Ok I'll consider it since we have some time yet. So on the praying and the light, guess what? They're all three already back to the same crazy prayer angle. Even though I lifted them to all the same height as the Blueberry. All three can't get any closer (6 inches is as low as we can go). I can't even believe at 6 inches from the light and getting blasted with 1300 par they continue to pray like this. But maybe it's not so surprising in this case. Maybe it's due to growing up for so long in the sun. I think the reason I'm seeing this is cuz no matter what they're getting from my light, two things seem to be in play:
- it's still not as strong (par/ppfd) as the sun, obviously. Not even close no matter what I throw at them light wise.
- they are not getting the full sun spectrum like the real sun provides no matter how good the LED

So what we're seeing I think it them thirsting for the sun I took away. And I think it might just be possible that the plants have become "conditioned" to the sun and therefore are responding positively to the gigantic ppfd numbers I have them at. Normally in early budding I would have them more at like 1050-1100. But these girls seems to just be the ultimate light whores, all three of them.

Wondering if growing up in the sun and beginning flower in the sun has allowed them to flourish at higher light intensity in the tent versus if the same plants fed the same way in the same soil and pots, but growing from scratch under LED in the tent would? That's kinda the theory I'm working on here, based on observation and a little experience.

Thoughts?

I agree.
Best beginning they could have.
I'd like to be in it too.
-10 c here today.
Not terrible but not warm.
Mother Nature always seems to do the best work.

Stay safe
Bill

 

[Emilya Green]

Good Morning, @Emilya, hope this day finds you well.

I have an interesting situation, and wanted to share my solution for you for your feedback if you have a few minutes. I have found with molasses and seemingly especially autos, some like it more than others. My photos always tend to have no issues, but sometimes the autos do. And the issue almost always has looked the same and caused the same issue. The molasses stays in the soil more than other stuff you put in. You can see it in your runoff or if you flush, it's brown. For a while. And sometimes that can cause problems. I've determined it causes cal/mag lockout. Every time it happens what I begin to see is the classic reddish brown spotting that signifies that deficiency. Like chicken pox kind of, red spots.

The only answer in my experience is to flush then follow the flush with a water/cal mag feeding and feed water and cal mag again if that doesn't do it. This has worked in 7 of 8 cases this has happened over my grows.

Here's the interesting part: This is happening (just starting, not an issue yet, but must be stopped right now in it's tracks or my buds will be compromised) on the Gorilla Zkittlez. I noticed it yesterday for the first time. Only she's in Sohum.

So if I flush (and it has to be a real flush, not a five gallon quickie), the odds at this late stage are that I will eliminate much of what the soil has left to feed these girls. So the question becomes, what will they eat for the rest of their lives?

I decided to do this:
- flush
- top dress/amend with Geoflora, bokashi and frass
- finish the flush with a plain water/cal mag gallon after medium gets not so soaked
- next watering, feed a very mild cocktail of FF bloom nutes, to sustain her while the microbes get up to speed
- watch

She's got at least three weeks left, maybe four. More than enough time for the microbes to get up to speed and benefit the plant. The mild cocktail should keep her going.

So you see my logic, as well as knowing I'm flying relatively blind, but not so much cuz this has happened enough times that I believe the solution will work. If it was soil I know it would. So what do you think?

First of all, let me get on you a bit for your usage of the phrase cal/mag deficiency. These are two different issues and you will usually have either a calcium deficiency or a magnesium deficiency.

Molasses has very little nutrient in it that might cause a lockout. Not only that, but one of the nutrients that it does have is magnesium. It does not make sense to me that adding magnesium could cause a magnesium lockout, or calcium either for that matter. And you talk about getting your microbes up to speed, even though you are aggressively feeding them the perfect sugar to keep them going, even if the plant had somehow given up on them or the sohum ran out of minerals.

So here we are again, somewhere between assumptions and bro science. I don't believe a flush is your answer. I would like to see some pictures specifically of the symptoms you are seeing, but I think you have enough clues here to get to a better answer than flushing. Flushing is to clear a problem, salt or lockout, but you haven't convinced me that molasses could cause a lockout. As you said, it will also wash away vital nutrients... is it worth that risk on a theory?

You mentioned that the sohum is keeping up with the photos, but it is your autos having the problem. Fast growing autos. hmmm. Could it be that since they are growing so aggressively that they actually are using/needing more calcium or magnesium than their slower growing photo cousins? I think this is much more likely than the lockout you have convinced yourself that you are having. You are growing quite aggressively too, hitting them with massive light and additional inputs, you speak of phenomenal lift and transpiration... is it not possible that you are simply looking at a simple deficiency and that more Ca or Mg could solve it? I would up my calmag to maximum dosage and I would consider a foliar of epsom for even more Mg to look for a resolution to this, before I would flush.

 

[Moony]

Well, I have been watering to runoff since we discussed it and the plants are not sitting in it to suck it back in now. But not the whole time, and it does call for it. Great, what you outline was my first choice of action too. I like when I find myself thinking like Bill!! Thanks. How's your coffee? I got a great organic coffee person who makes her own beans if you need a good source of awesome organic coffee.

Hey Jon. Bit of advice I stole from another grow video I watched lol. If you need to water till run off but don't want the girls to sip it back. raise your ladies up to allow drainage using golf balls or small bouncy balls rubber balls etc. Stick them in your tray and put the pot ontop allows draining and airflow without them being able to suck it back up .

Just a tip from the world of growing hehe, which I stole lol...

 

[StoneOtter]

In addition to Emilya's note I want to mention a question. Will geoflora be able to catch up to the demand of a complete flush? There's going to be stripped rootzone needing nutrients and I'm not sure geoflora is fast acting enough to really help rebound it back to good health. What do you think?

 

[cjsbabygirl313]

First of all, let me get on you a bit for your usage of the phrase cal/mag deficiency. These are two different issues and you will usually have either a calcium deficiency or a magnesium deficiency.

Molasses has very little nutrient in it that might cause a lockout. Not only that, but one of the nutrients that it does have is magnesium. It does not make sense to me that adding magnesium could cause a magnesium lockout, or calcium either for that matter. And you talk about getting your microbes up to speed, even though you are aggressively feeding them the perfect sugar to keep them going, even if the plant had somehow given up on them or the sohum ran out of minerals.

So here we are again, somewhere between assumptions and bro science. I don't believe a flush is your answer. I would like to see some pictures specifically of the symptoms you are seeing, but I think you have enough clues here to get to a better answer than flushing. Flushing is to clear a problem, salt or lockout, but you haven't convinced me that molasses could cause a lockout. As you said, it will also wash away vital nutrients... is it worth that risk on a theory?

You mentioned that the sohum is keeping up with the photos, but it is your autos having the problem. Fast growing autos. hmmm. Could it be that since they are growing so aggressively that they actually are using/needing more calcium or magnesium than their slower growing photo cousins? I think this is much more likely than the lockout you have convinced yourself that you are having. You are growing quite aggressively too, hitting them with massive light and additional inputs, you speak of phenomenal lift and transpiration... is it not possible that you are simply looking at a simple deficiency and that more Ca or Mg could solve it? I would up my calmag to maximum dosage and I would consider a foliar of epsom for even more Mg to look for a resolution to this, before I would flush.

Even though I’m no expert like Emilya, I agree with the approach of not using a sledge hammer to drive a needle through fabric