Haight Solid State vs. H.G.LED

Re: 420 Consumer Reports Competition - Haight Solid State vs. Hydro Grow LED

Slowpuffer said:
I guess that's a good reason to have the walls really close to the plants. So the hgl would work better in a 3x3 space, instead of 4x4. And a short roof may help also. My tent is 4x4x7.5 so not compact enough . Hope you're right about the hss making a come back, but I don't expect it !! Another question for my inquisitive mind, do you think that bacause the beam is more compact, could you raise the hgl, and cover more space and still have enough ump ??:welldone::surf::peacetwo:
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That's what happened when I raised it from 6" to 8-10". The coverage increased significantly and it still maintained enough intensity to get to where we're at today.

At 6", it wasn't doing so good over 4 plants. Coverage was poor, and there was very little reflected light off the tent walls because there wasn't enough space between the light and canopy for the beam to radiate outwards much.

For this style grow and this many plants, 8-10" has been the ticket for the HGL.
 
Re: 420 Consumer Reports Competition - Haight Solid State vs. Hydro Grow LED

Very well executed comp grow SS. Great pics and descriptions of what you're doing with the plants and your rationale is always clearly indicated. Well done.
 
Re: 420 Consumer Reports Competition - Haight Solid State vs. Hydro Grow LED

Setting Sun said:
That's what happened when I raised it from 6" to 8-10". The coverage increased significantly and it still maintained enough intensity to get to where we're at today.

At 6", it wasn't doing so good over 4 plants. Coverage was poor, and there was very little reflected light off the tent walls because there wasn't enough space between the light and canopy for the beam to radiate outwards much.

For this style grow and this many plants, 8-10" has been the ticket for the HGL.
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At six and below your barely covering the size of the panels. It's tough to gage your first try, especially with a new strain. Your certainly keeping them all satisfied regardless.:goodjob:
 
Re: 420 Consumer Reports Competition - Haight Solid State vs. Hydro Grow LED

Setting Sun said:
DAY 46 BLOOM

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The HSS light has been down 3-4" above the canopy for three weeks. Right after taking this set of pics, I staked the 38" tall HSS 2 plant, as she was starting to lean and I didn't want to take any chances on her falling over or snapping her main stem.

Whatever variable this might introduce has far less impact than having either of those things happen.


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Progress is slow but steady.

The HGL pots are drying out every 2-3 days, and the HSS pots every 4-5 days.

All the plants are healthy and doing well.

thanks for following!
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Steady as she goes Sun! It was at about this time that I noticed some prematue browinig of the pistil on some of the plants. 2 or 3 of them turned all copper brown. And I mean all of it and the plants didn't do much after that. It wasn't like they shriveled up or anything. Just all perky and everything just a dark copper color. I had never seen that before .
 
Re: 420 Consumer Reports Competition - Haight Solid State vs. Hydro Grow LED

Slowpuffer said:
Right, but you say it's only covering 70 per cent of the canopy. If you raised it till it almost completely covers, would it be too weak at that height. I'm just thinking of possibilities ??
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Hmmmm, can't really answer that without doing a bloom cycle with it at whatever height would cover the canopy 100%, but I estimate that it would be at least 16-18" off the canopy.

HGL requested that I go no higher than 12", so maybe that's where intensity would start becoming too weak for effective flowering.

Brings up an interesting question that I've been pondering ever since I raised the HGL light.

Do bud sites *require* intense direct light in order to do well, or is the total amount of foliage illuminated more important for bud growth?
 
Re: 420 Consumer Reports Competition - Haight Solid State vs. Hydro Grow LED

Mmmmick said:
Very well executed comp grow SS. Great pics and descriptions of what you're doing with the plants and your rationale is always clearly indicated. Well done.
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thank you Mmmmick ;)

thistle3583 said:
Nicely designed and run study. Thanks for all the work.
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thanks thistle, glad you're watching ;)

ledtester said:
At six and below your barely covering the size of the panels. It's tough to gage your first try, especially with a new strain. Your certainly keeping them all satisfied regardless.:goodjob:
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When you put things in perspective, as in there are lots of people using 100-200w of energy to light their bathrooms, it's really pretty amazing what these lights are doing.

thanks ledtester ;)
 
Re: 420 Consumer Reports Competition - Haight Solid State vs. Hydro Grow LED

Setting Sun said:
Do bud sites *require* intense direct light in order to do well, or is the total amount of foliage illuminated more important for bud growth?
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Assuming the plants we grow aren't totally screwed up in a genetic sense....IE they could grow in the wild if some seeds were thrown out there....I conclude that it's illuminated foliage that produces bud, not illuminated budsites.

But, keep in mind that's mere speculation and deductive reasoning based on how fruits and flowers grow. They're almost always in the shade.

The phenotype of my current strain that had such gigantic and dense foliage also has the largest, most dense buds.....and much of them are shaded due to the huge fanleaves.

Sativa's on the other hand, tend to have fewer leaves and more light getting through, but they also have smaller buds.

So, my semi-educated position----which is open to correction---is that leaves produce bud. Well lighted, healthy leaves produce better bud.
 
Re: 420 Consumer Reports Competition - Haight Solid State vs. Hydro Grow LED

Setting Sun said:
Thanks bros.

Growing, and discussing growing, is a lot of fun, especially with all the great people I've met on this website :thankyou::thumb:


Today is six weeks into bloom and I'll take some pics tonight and update.

I did squeeze a couple buds and they seem fairly solid. Kinda hard to tell yet though. They're not airy and I can't see any light through them, but they need to grow out more before I get a better sense of how dense they are.

They're stinking up a storm when I take them out of the tents. Not even a hint of skunk, just this deep earthy musky BO on a hot summer day funk.

Never smelled anything like it, but I can't wait to fire some up.:ganjamon:



You know, I make a lot of "stoner" sounding comments like that, but I need to express that this herb is literally saving my life.

I'm diabetic and I've had surgery on my lower back for ruptured disks. That's a bad combo because I need to exercise in order to control my blood sugar and I have to avoid opiate pain meds. If my back is hurting, which it often is, I can't exercise and my blood sugars are whacked.

Since I started using medical marijuana for my back pain, I've been able to get off opiate pain meds, and drop my weight from 240 to 195 lbs. I was able to lose the weight because I'm now able to exercise without pain, and my diabetes is under better control than it's ever been.

So yeah, I wanted to say that, because my experience has made me a strong believer in the medicinal value of marijuana, and I may make "stoner" comments and joke around, but if it wasn't for this herb, I would not be doing well at all, assuming I was still here to begin with.

OT? maybe for some, not for me ;)
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Grats on that Sun. I'm also a diabetic and I have broken my neck and back in a fall. I feel your pain. Thanks for all the hard work! :peace:
 
Re: 420 Consumer Reports Competition - Haight Solid State vs. Hydro Grow LED

Setting Sun said:
Hmmmm, can't really answer that without doing a bloom cycle with it at whatever height would cover the canopy 100%, but I estimate that it would be at least 16-18" off the canopy.

HGL requested that I go no higher than 12", so maybe that's where intensity would start becoming too weak for effective flowering.

Brings up an interesting question that I've been pondering ever since I raised the HGL light.

Do bud sites *require* intense direct light in order to do well, or is the total amount of foliage illuminated more important for bud growth?
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That's one of the things I love about this journal, constant questions being raised. It seems standard belief is that direct light is needed, but many growers say not to trim fan leaves because that's where the magic happens. I'm interested to see the opinions on this. I think it's the foliage lighting that matters, but would guess that the foliage nearest each bud would be responsible for that buds growth. :peace:
 
Re: 420 Consumer Reports Competition - Haight Solid State vs. Hydro Grow LED

420warrior said:
That's one of the things I love about this journal, constant questions being raised. It seems standard belief is that direct light is needed, but many growers say not to trim fan leaves because that's where the magic happens. I'm interested to see the opinions on this. I think it's the foliage lighting that matters, but would guess that the foliage nearest each bud would be responsible for that buds growth. :peace:
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Basic botany teaches that there is a "circulatory" system in plants....the Xylem and the Phloem. One moves things from the roots to the apical meristem, with all the leaves, shoots and branches in between......the other moves in the opposite direction.

Some nutrients are mobile: Nitrogen, Potassium, magnesium, phosphorus to name a few of the big ones. These can be moved to where they're needed by the plant.

Others can only move from the roots up...they can't translocate. Among those are zinc, boron, sulfur and others.

Leaves make carbohydrates from all those elements, Co2 water. Roots also make stuff and supply raw materials to the leaves. Buds can only happen if the plant has a healthy carbohydrate factory (leaves) and good roots.

So, the fan leaves that are just below each bud certainly do produce nutrition for that bud, but they can also produce for the rest of the plant, because the plant has the ability to move nutrients to where they are needed most.

I don't want to make a direct comment about SS's LED grow.....but if you look at the leaves and the buds, you'll notice something. (hint hint)

In other words, if the leaves don't get enough light....the buds will be smaller.

I hope that wasn't totally useless commentary.
 
Re: 420 Consumer Reports Competition - Haight Solid State vs. Hydro Grow LED

DocBud said:
Assuming the plants we grow aren't totally screwed up in a genetic sense....IE they could grow in the wild if some seeds were thrown out there....I conclude that it's illuminated foliage that produces bud, not illuminated budsites.

But, keep in mind that's mere speculation and deductive reasoning based on how fruits and flowers grow. They're almost always in the shade.

The phenotype of my current strain that had such gigantic and dense foliage also has the largest, most dense buds.....and much of them are shaded due to the huge fanleaves.

Sativa's on the other hand, tend to have fewer leaves and more light getting through, but they also have smaller buds.

So, my semi-educated position----which is open to correction---is that leaves produce bud. Well lighted, healthy leaves produce better bud.
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I mostly agree with Doc on this. That is one of the reasons I avoid trimming fan leaves if at all possible. Some provide energy stores for roots while others provide energy stores for buds. There is another factor to consider as well. When you trim a plant it responds by distributing jasmonic acid. JA inhibits growth and stimulates the plant's immune response. The plant assumes it is under herbivorous attack and cranks up its defenses. I would say a few leaves cut here or there is not an issue but if you remove a lot of foliage you may be inviting too much of this response.

That said, many parts of the flowers are green which indicates to me that they also contribute to harvesting energy from the sun. My modification to Doc's theory is that ideally both buds and fans need to be illuminated, but if you have to choose, the upper fan leaves should take priority. I would tuck them. The lower fan leaves provide more of their energy to the roots so leave them as well since root may need them. Buds rely less on these leaves.

ledtester said:
Steady as she goes Sun! It was at about this time that I noticed some prematue browinig of the pistil on some of the plants. 2 or 3 of them turned all copper brown. And I mean all of it and the plants didn't do much after that. It wasn't like they shriveled up or anything. Just all perky and everything just a dark copper color. I had never seen that before .
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I had the same problem on my HGL LED grow. I never conclusively determined the cause. I had thought it may have been a ph issue causing some burning.
 
Re: 420 Consumer Reports Competition - Haight Solid State vs. Hydro Grow LED

Setting Sun said:
Hmmmm, can't really answer that without doing a bloom cycle with it at whatever height would cover the canopy 100%, but I estimate that it would be at least 16-18" off the canopy.

HGL requested that I go no higher than 12", so maybe that's where intensity would start becoming too weak for effective flowering.

Brings up an interesting question that I've been pondering ever since I raised the HGL light.

Do bud sites *require* intense direct light in order to do well, or is the total amount of foliage illuminated more important for bud growth?
Click to expand...

The human eye is easily fooled by light. I believe that the area that appears to be underlit is merely not in the sweetspot but still gets enough light to support good growth. Of course at some distance from the sweet spot the drop is sufficient to impede growth. A meter designed to read numerous specific wavelengths would be necessary to determine where the critical drop off occurs. the human eye won't get you there.
 
Re: 420 Consumer Reports Competition - Haight Solid State vs. Hydro Grow LED

I believe that new theroies will be discovered, pertaining to the way plants grow and mature, while doing these kind of tests !! What were they trying to grow on the space station with the original leds ?? I bet it was'nt lettuce ?? Ha !! Can ya imagine being on the space station and doing a big bowl and just tripping on space !! Better yet, can you imagine the blast off !!?? We've already learned that plants take up water at a slower rate with leds, and other discoveries will come, what, well, we don't know yet !! It's easy to see that a plant vegged under led, looks different, now why is that ?? We just don't know yet !! Even if we find that we can't grow with leds, they are the future of lighting !! Can you imagine a baseball stadium lit up with leds ?? Well another month and we'll know for sure if these lights make the grade. like you originally saaid, if either light don't produce what your 250 did, then it's not exceptable !! Ha !! Grow on SS !!
 
Re: 420 Consumer Reports Competition - Haight Solid State vs. Hydro Grow LED

Hey SS:

The HSS looks too spindly for my preference...I grew some super lemon haze like that last year and had to throw 'em out. I found out my light technique was all wrong using a 250 watt hps. they just stretched and barely flowered. Newbie learning curve.

But, no offense, both sets have fairly dainty buds at this point. I hope they bulk up soon. CFL's seem to do better from what I've observed elsewhere. Then again, I'm very impatient.

Thanks again for the primo job, dude!
 
Re: 420 Consumer Reports Competition - Haight Solid State vs. Hydro Grow LED

slimm said:
I had the same problem on my HGL LED grow. I never conclusively determined the cause. I had thought it may have been a ph issue causing some burning.
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Did they all do it because we had 3 out of the 11 so wasn't quite sure why.
 
Re: 420 Consumer Reports Competition - Haight Solid State vs. Hydro Grow LED

All my plants did it - some less than others. Two different strains reacted the same.
 
Re: 420 Consumer Reports Competition - Haight Solid State vs. Hydro Grow LED

ledtester said:
Steady as she goes Sun! It was at about this time that I noticed some prematue browinig of the pistil on some of the plants. 2 or 3 of them turned all copper brown. And I mean all of it and the plants didn't do much after that. It wasn't like they shriveled up or anything. Just all perky and everything just a dark copper color. I had never seen that before .
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Thanks for the heads-up.

I'll be alert for the color change and stalled growth.
 
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