Haight Solid State vs. H.G.LED

Re: 420 Consumer Reports Competition - Haight Solid State vs. Hydro Grow LED

Have HSS and HGL had any input on this? I usually sit by and watch the debates on here. But I feel strongly that cutting at the same time, while scientific and equal just doesn't allow completion of the comparison. what if one finishes earlier with higher yield and wins,but the other would take two more weeks and achieve better results? People would go buy the winning light based on incomplete data, only to have the second best. I guess the question is; Who is the contest for, The manufacturer or the potential customer? :peace:
 
Re: 420 Consumer Reports Competition - Haight Solid State vs. Hydro Grow LED

DocBud said:
Been out of town....just caught up. In such a hurry, no time to type grammatically correct sentences.

Harvesting time is an "art." Who says the triches are 50/50? You do!

Pre-planned date of harvest is a science. Who says it's day 63? The calender!

The seeds were germed the same day, have been given the same nutes and water, in the same soil. We're testing lights here.

IMO, you must harvest them the same day, within hours of each other. Otherwise, you're letting one plant grow longer than the other....which makes any comparison regarding yield impossible.

Analogy:
Let's say were testing MPG in cars. The correct way to do it is drive each car, the same speed and distance on the same road, the same day, within minutes of eachother, measuring wind speed and temperature, etc.

Do this enough times to get a true comparison and you have an accurate measurement of each car's mpg.

Now, imagine the same test, but with one car that gets to drive longer than the other....not a true test.

Chop 'em the same day to be scientific.
Chop 'em when they're ready for the best product....but the science goes out the carbon filter.
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Only way this means anything is if you are measuring outcome in grams/watt-hr, never seen pot measured that way myself, just in grams/watt or grams/sq ft. Sure would make people reconsider the whole measurement system if you add time as a factor instead of when the product is finished. Long flowering strains could never compete....autoflowering strains would be the king!!!! :smokin:
 
Re: 420 Consumer Reports Competition - Haight Solid State vs. Hydro Grow LED

Superweed said:
Wonderful job, nice setings. Love.
:peace:
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thank you Superweed!

bienvenuti brother!

CocoJoe said:
Starting to snow :peace:
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yes it is!

take care bro ;)

420hydro said:
My head hurts! I came upon this thread this morning and it's taken me all day to read (at the moment) 68 pages. It has got to be one of the best threads that has ever been published. The technical information offered is astounding. At times, this was reading like a good adventure story.I applaud the vendors for letting this happen.
And you SS have shown a perfect textbook grow.
I'm more excited to see how this ends than the adventure novel I'm currently reading.

Hanging on every word and picture... :woohoo:

OverGrow
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wow, thanks for reading through the whole journal.

I'm glad you found good info and enjoyed your read ;)

I'm pretty excited myself to see how this turns out!

your kind words and encouragement made my day ;)

nice to meet you OG!
 
Re: 420 Consumer Reports Competition - Haight Solid State vs. Hydro Grow LED

hey bmarduk, my only concern is that you only used 60 days for your usage time! I guess that is o.k. if you veg using a different unit but that needs to be factored in as well because the stat should be a count from seed or beginning of vegetative stage for a clone to bear standard.
 
Re: 420 Consumer Reports Competition - Haight Solid State vs. Hydro Grow LED

I'm reading all the flowering time input from everyone, :thankyou:


I would also like to add that when I agreed to take on this comparison grow, I decided that my desires as regards final yield amount, trich color decisions, etc., would take a back seat to providing information that would help other growers, so please do not factor that in to your thinking on this issue.

While, of course, I would love to have a nice yield at 50/50 trichs, and I do appreciate people thinking about how this will work for me on a personal level, I would love even more to finish this grow in a way that is the *most* helpful to those considering LED's, or even just curious about LED's.

I have some stash, and I'm going to be starting another grow fairly soon after this one, so I'm more than willing to take a hit for the team if need be.
 
Re: 420 Consumer Reports Competition - Haight Solid State vs. Hydro Grow LED

bmarduk said:
Hey SS, we just fired up our PPF 800 yesterday and today it is sagging in the middle a little bit. I know that you're very busy and no hurries, but if you could eyeball or even better, put a straight-edge on it and check for gaps, I would appriciate it.

thanx 4 everything, you are doing a masterful job with this.
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So does mine.:goodluck:
 
Re: 420 Consumer Reports Competition - Haight Solid State vs. Hydro Grow LED

MountainHigh said:
Only way this means anything is if you are measuring outcome in grams/watt-hr, never seen pot measured that way myself, just in grams/watt or grams/sq ft. Sure would make people reconsider the whole measurement system if you add time as a factor instead of when the product is finished. Long flowering strains could never compete....autoflowering strains would be the king!!!! :smokin:
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If the test is like this one, there'd never be different strains competing against each other. Strain type would be irrelevant since all plants in the test would be the same strain (clones, preferably).
 
Re: 420 Consumer Reports Competition - Haight Solid State vs. Hydro Grow LED

Im really liking the discussion going on in here. Some real bright people cultivate MJ, I like that. Marijuana is so commonly associated with the burned out wrong crowd in general but when you read all the brain storming, plans, ideas, inventions associated with the process of making it, you gain a whole new respect for it all. Keep it up 420! This forum, website, (thread) is awesome~!:bravo:
 
Re: 420 Consumer Reports Competition - Haight Solid State vs. Hydro Grow LED

420warrior said:
Have HSS and HGL had any input on this? I usually sit by and watch the debates on here. But I feel strongly that cutting at the same time, while scientific and equal just doesn't allow completion of the comparison. what if one finishes earlier with higher yield and wins,but the other would take two more weeks and achieve better results? People would go buy the winning light based on incomplete data, only to have the second best.
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I have received some communication on the issue from one of the manufacturers, but since the rules for the grow don't address the issue, I'm still not sure how I'm going to handle it.


I guess the question is; Who is the contest for, The manufacturer or the potential customer? :peace:
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That's an excellent question and cuts to the chase very well, but even when you get to the chase on this, there's issues that complicate things. Both for the customers and the manufacturers, the comparison being "for" them could mean different things.

thanks bro, I appreciate your insights
 
Re: 420 Consumer Reports Competition - Haight Solid State vs. Hydro Grow LED

Bolivar said:
If the test is like this one, there'd never be different strains competing against each other. Strain type would be irrelevant since all plants in the test would be the same strain (clones, preferably).
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Sorry Setting Sun, but this is my last comment on this subject, in the end it is between you and the sponsers, but here are a few thoughts.

I guess my comment was if you are gonna crunch numbers, then do it like anyone else would...with finished product, but figure time in if they don't harvest at the same time. If you wanna judge this simply based on plant weight set a date and harvest, you can't be subjective and scientific...because then the smoke report means nothing, what if one light ends up making really flavorful smoke or higher thc content, you will never know that if you terminate any of the plants early, you will throw all that data out the window...

But lets get serious, you currently have a 25% (4 plants per condition) statistical anomaly ratio (at best)...so unless one group's weight is greater than 25% more, you will in no way be able to claim any kind of scientific variance based on the lights....get a grow of 100 or a 1000 then grow for science. And simply to rule out variable genetics (pheno's), this test should of been done with clones. 25% variance is generous (scientifically anyway).

This is a product comparison, I say compare finished product just like the 420 contests do, subjectively as that is all you got man legit wise anyway.

I may be wrong too on the math as I don't feel like researching it, but I know science deals with large repeatable numbers to be able to report lower statistic variance, especially dealing with genetics...that stuff is amazingly variable...I have two twin nephews (not identical), they are 4 inches different in height, one is a mesomorph and the other a metamorph in body structure, you could not of known that when they were babies, they were very similar then. (I use them as a reference as they are the same "seed" but different pheno :grinjoint:)

:peace: SS, forgive my ramblings.
 
Re: 420 Consumer Reports Competition - Haight Solid State vs. Hydro Grow LED

I like your rambling.

It's true that this comparison is lacking in sample size, repeatability, etc., to be a truly valid scientific comparison, so if there is "science" being thrown out the window by allowing each plant to mature individually, it's not science we could take to the bank.

thanks MH, appreciate your comments ;)
 
Re: 420 Consumer Reports Competition - Haight Solid State vs. Hydro Grow LED

Setting Sun said:
I like your rambling.

It's true that this comparison is lacking in sample size, repeatability, etc., to be a truly valid scientific comparison, so if there is "science" being thrown out the window by allowing each plant to mature individually, it's not science we could take to the bank.

thanks MH, appreciate your comments ;)
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In all honesty, I trust your subjective opinion after you put together all the factors from the weight of the finished product to how it smokes and it's flavor and get a few friends opinions too, blind test though, smoke them out on separate days with the different types and see if they immediately notice any difference...count how often they ask for more etc. Sounds like more fun anyway...more chances to get high with friends :grinjoint:.

I know you are grow support for a reason. I trust you and this site. After all, anytime a test is subjective and anything involving taste is subjective, you need to trust your judges. ;)

:peace: my friend.
 
Re: 420 Consumer Reports Competition - Haight Solid State vs. Hydro Grow LED

Hi SS, we all have our own preferences on trich maturity for the kind of smoke we like. I personally prefer more of a heady buzz, so harvest when trichs ar milky. But I digress.....

As long as both sets of plants are given enough time to mature to the same level, then I think time is secondary.

The goal is to see what each light can do. If one light grows plants to maturity faster than the other, then great, but surely the yield and quality of the final product are more important than saving a couple of days here or there. After all, by the time harvest day comes around, we have generally been waiting for over 3 months, so a few more days is no big deal.

In summary, I would harvest the plants as and when they are ready, ensuring they all have the same level of maturity when actually harvested.
 
Re: 420 Consumer Reports Competition - Haight Solid State vs. Hydro Grow LED

bmarduk said:
Hey SS, we just fired up our PPF 800 yesterday and today it is sagging in the middle a little bit. I know that you're very busy and no hurries, but if you could eyeball or even better, put a straight-edge on it and check for gaps, I would appriciate it.
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The gap is about 3/16" or so at the center of the panel.


HPIM1910_Medium.JPG
 
Re: 420 Consumer Reports Competition - Haight Solid State vs. Hydro Grow LED

I still say, let them finish individually. I as a grower I would be concerned about final quality and quantity, more than any thing else. If you chop them at the same time, what have we learned? That the lights can veg and bloom plants nothing more.:popcorn:
 
Re: 420 Consumer Reports Competition - Haight Solid State vs. Hydro Grow LED

OldMedMan said:
I still say, let them finish individually. I as a grower I would be concerned about final quality and quantity, more than any thing else. If you chop them at the same time, what have we learned? That the lights can veg and bloom plants nothing more.:popcorn:
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agreed. let them finish individually to whatever trich development you are shooting for, and if it takes longer for one light to get there then that's the kind of info we're looking for.
 
Re: 420 Consumer Reports Competition - Haight Solid State vs. Hydro Grow LED

Well that took about 3 hours to read and catch up! Great information and much learned and still being taken in ! Whew!
Awesome comp grow SS. I just recently got my PFF-800 and really like it so far, only 2 days in to flower right now. :goodluck: on the harvest!
 
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