onthe420train
New Member
Re: 420 Consumer Reports Competition - Haight Solid State vs. Hydro Grow LED
woops I see now.
woops I see now.
Haight Solid State vs. H.G.LED
- Thread starter Keith Lake
- Start date
Re: 420 Consumer Reports Competition - Haight Solid State vs. Hydro Grow LED
day 4 bloom
I apologize for not updating last night as promised. It was a long week and I was pretty beat after my early-morning photo session.
I added labels to many of the pics, but I guess I didn't save the changes properly, so I'll just type it in. The plant tags are all but useless at this stage.
First with no color correction, and then corrected for the HGL tent.
HGL
HSS
HGL
HSS
The HGL plants are so dense and bushy that the branches and shoots down below are not getting much light. The foliage down below the canopy looks starved for light and growth is slow down there. If some of those branches can push through to the light, things will get better, but the canopy just keeps getting prettier and shadier. I will theorize that maybe having the HGL light down at 6" through veg produced very stocky and stacked plants, but that has now become a liability.
The HSS plants, on the other hand, with their light at 12" through veg, are beautifully proportioned, and the lower branches are getting enough light to prosper. A *lot* of that light is reflected light coming off the walls of my tent. This light, and my 32" square tent, are an *excellent* match as far as reflectivity. It's not as intense as the light from the HGL, but it's very effective if you've got the right setup.
HGL
HSS
Again, showing the difference in the density and health of the lower foliage.
I'd love to know how the HGL plants would look had the light been higher in veg, but we won't know on this run.
Do not construe my comments as a slam on HGL, or even as a slam on their 6" recommendation. I've only done this one grow with LED's so far, but I get a sense that in positioning the light over the canopy, there is a fine line between too much stretch and not enough. You don't want to go much over 12" in veg because the lights won't penetrate well with tall plants, but you also don't want plants so stocky and stacked that they choke themselves.
HGL
HSS
They are stretchin' and stinkin'
.
I'm having so much fun doing this grow and journal for all of us
.
At this point, I just wanted to thank all of you following for your support and all of the excellent discussion.
Special thanks to Rob and Soniq for all they have done to help this come together. You guys rock!
day 4 bloom
I apologize for not updating last night as promised. It was a long week and I was pretty beat after my early-morning photo session.
I added labels to many of the pics, but I guess I didn't save the changes properly, so I'll just type it in. The plant tags are all but useless at this stage.
First with no color correction, and then corrected for the HGL tent.
HGL
HSS
HGL
HSS
The HGL plants are so dense and bushy that the branches and shoots down below are not getting much light. The foliage down below the canopy looks starved for light and growth is slow down there. If some of those branches can push through to the light, things will get better, but the canopy just keeps getting prettier and shadier. I will theorize that maybe having the HGL light down at 6" through veg produced very stocky and stacked plants, but that has now become a liability.
The HSS plants, on the other hand, with their light at 12" through veg, are beautifully proportioned, and the lower branches are getting enough light to prosper. A *lot* of that light is reflected light coming off the walls of my tent. This light, and my 32" square tent, are an *excellent* match as far as reflectivity. It's not as intense as the light from the HGL, but it's very effective if you've got the right setup.
HGL
HSS
Again, showing the difference in the density and health of the lower foliage.
I'd love to know how the HGL plants would look had the light been higher in veg, but we won't know on this run.
Do not construe my comments as a slam on HGL, or even as a slam on their 6" recommendation. I've only done this one grow with LED's so far, but I get a sense that in positioning the light over the canopy, there is a fine line between too much stretch and not enough. You don't want to go much over 12" in veg because the lights won't penetrate well with tall plants, but you also don't want plants so stocky and stacked that they choke themselves.
HGL
HSS
They are stretchin' and stinkin'
.I'm having so much fun doing this grow and journal for all of us
. At this point, I just wanted to thank all of you following for your support and all of the excellent discussion.
Special thanks to Rob and Soniq for all they have done to help this come together. You guys rock!
Re: 420 Consumer Reports Competition - Haight Solid State vs. Hydro Grow LED
Thanks for the update SS! Very nice!!!!! It is crazy but the HSS ladies look perfectly symmetrical, just beautiful looking ladies. I can see where you are saying the HGL lights are short and stacked, they look more like a wild bushy crazy lady, vs the HSS straight posture, perfect stature!
If 6" is making them seem a bit too bushy, yet perhaps 12" may make them stretch too much, do you think 8-10" would be more ideal for the HGL lights?
Love this grow...I really like the HSS units, no fans and all that jazz, would be easier to use for side-lighting type applications!
Anyhow. Rockin' on SS!
Thanks so much for sharing!
-Go-
Thanks for the update SS! Very nice!!!!! It is crazy but the HSS ladies look perfectly symmetrical, just beautiful looking ladies. I can see where you are saying the HGL lights are short and stacked, they look more like a wild bushy crazy lady, vs the HSS straight posture, perfect stature!
If 6" is making them seem a bit too bushy, yet perhaps 12" may make them stretch too much, do you think 8-10" would be more ideal for the HGL lights?
Love this grow...I really like the HSS units, no fans and all that jazz, would be easier to use for side-lighting type applications!
Anyhow. Rockin' on SS!
Thanks so much for sharing!
-Go-
420warriors
New Member
Re: 420 Consumer Reports Competition - Haight Solid State vs. Hydro Grow LED
All the girls look great SS. I know it couldn't be done for this comparison but do you think the HGL might work better with some LST?
All the girls look great SS. I know it couldn't be done for this comparison but do you think the HGL might work better with some LST?
420
Founder
Re: 420 Consumer Reports Competition - Haight Solid State vs. Hydro Grow LED
great photos my brother, please keep up the amazing work!...
great photos my brother, please keep up the amazing work!...
Re: 420 Consumer Reports Competition - Haight Solid State vs. Hydro Grow LED
Could it be that HGL got it wrong on the 1w vs higher wattage LEDs? This was a major differentiator in the HGL marketing blitz on the forums. It may be true that the higher wattage LEDs are not as efficient but they also may have greater penetration.
Could it be that HGL got it wrong on the 1w vs higher wattage LEDs? This was a major differentiator in the HGL marketing blitz on the forums. It may be true that the higher wattage LEDs are not as efficient but they also may have greater penetration.
Re: 420 Consumer Reports Competition - Haight Solid State vs. Hydro Grow LED
Hard to say exactly, but I'm thinking that 10-12" would have produced enough stretch to prevent the issue.
Every strain's different too, so you do have to be on top of it while they're vegging. These lights do seem to give a grower more control over stretch than HID's, but that same advantage can blow up in your face if you aren't observant and careful about adjusting the distance to canopy.
thank you go green!
No, I don't.
I think the HGL may have trouble covering these four plants as it is when they get larger, so going horizontally with the grow would not be a good thing with this light.
You can see in the pics that I'm shifting the HGL pots around as creatively as I can to avoid overlap but still keep them in the sweet spot. That's going to get harder and harder to do, and the plants are going to start leaning in towards the light. I've almost had to mark the pot locations with tape in that tent so that I can easily put them back in the sweet spot after I take them out for pics.
The HGL's forte is intensity, not coverage. I think this light would work significantly better with 2 plants rather than 4.
Going horizontal with LST would just aggravate the issue.
------------------------------------------------------------------
The HSS light's forte is coverage at the expense of intensity.
This light's design begs for a horizontal style grow!
If it has enough intensity to flower well, a SOG, SCROG or LST grow would be covered very nicely.
-------------------------------------------------------------------
I'm pretty much sold on LST for indoor grows with any kind of lighting unless a grower has big watts and tall ceilings.
thanks brother, excellent question!
Hard to say exactly, but I'm thinking that 10-12" would have produced enough stretch to prevent the issue.
Every strain's different too, so you do have to be on top of it while they're vegging. These lights do seem to give a grower more control over stretch than HID's, but that same advantage can blow up in your face if you aren't observant and careful about adjusting the distance to canopy.
thank you go green!
No, I don't.
I think the HGL may have trouble covering these four plants as it is when they get larger, so going horizontally with the grow would not be a good thing with this light.
You can see in the pics that I'm shifting the HGL pots around as creatively as I can to avoid overlap but still keep them in the sweet spot. That's going to get harder and harder to do, and the plants are going to start leaning in towards the light. I've almost had to mark the pot locations with tape in that tent so that I can easily put them back in the sweet spot after I take them out for pics.
The HGL's forte is intensity, not coverage. I think this light would work significantly better with 2 plants rather than 4.
Going horizontal with LST would just aggravate the issue.
------------------------------------------------------------------
The HSS light's forte is coverage at the expense of intensity.
This light's design begs for a horizontal style grow!
If it has enough intensity to flower well, a SOG, SCROG or LST grow would be covered very nicely.
-------------------------------------------------------------------
I'm pretty much sold on LST for indoor grows with any kind of lighting unless a grower has big watts and tall ceilings.
thanks brother, excellent question!
Re: 420 Consumer Reports Competition - Haight Solid State vs. Hydro Grow LED
It's too early to draw any conclusions, but I enjoy speculating as well!
One thing for sure, these LED's veg some healthy plants....both of them.
If you want ornamental Cannabis, the LED's are the way to go.
But, if you want flowers, it remains to be seen which one produces and how much.
Fast forward, SS.
It's too early to draw any conclusions, but I enjoy speculating as well!
One thing for sure, these LED's veg some healthy plants....both of them.
If you want ornamental Cannabis, the LED's are the way to go.
But, if you want flowers, it remains to be seen which one produces and how much.
Fast forward, SS.
Re: 420 Consumer Reports Competition - Haight Solid State vs. Hydro Grow LED
I agree here. From What I have seen and done. Whatever is directly under the light is where your intensity basically is. We should have known this from when Cammie was trying to explain to us that just because she had 10 lights or whatever in her setup, she took pictures to show that even with other lights off, the lapping of coverage does not take place, but only slightly on the very outside edges of the units. This means on a 19x13 unit, you can basically place that exact size, give or take an inch or few, and get just that for a footprint.
I was very discouraged with this fact, however, I think it is simply the defect of the too narrow beam for intensity reasoning. 90Degrees on the HGL panels, to me, seem like they would be much for efficient. At the same time, bumping the 120 watts up to 150-200W on that same size panel would make for even better results.
Good note getting the coverages out in the open and in a realistic situation. As the plants grow larger, the coverage area will seemingly shrink! Leaving only the buds and plant directly under the unit to be lit with light. All else will be reflected light, or greatly less intensified light from the outer edges.
I Hope you can make it all work in your favor...
-Go
I agree here. From What I have seen and done. Whatever is directly under the light is where your intensity basically is. We should have known this from when Cammie was trying to explain to us that just because she had 10 lights or whatever in her setup, she took pictures to show that even with other lights off, the lapping of coverage does not take place, but only slightly on the very outside edges of the units. This means on a 19x13 unit, you can basically place that exact size, give or take an inch or few, and get just that for a footprint.
I was very discouraged with this fact, however, I think it is simply the defect of the too narrow beam for intensity reasoning. 90Degrees on the HGL panels, to me, seem like they would be much for efficient. At the same time, bumping the 120 watts up to 150-200W on that same size panel would make for even better results.
Good note getting the coverages out in the open and in a realistic situation. As the plants grow larger, the coverage area will seemingly shrink! Leaving only the buds and plant directly under the unit to be lit with light. All else will be reflected light, or greatly less intensified light from the outer edges.
I Hope you can make it all work in your favor...
-Go
Re: 420 Consumer Reports Competition - Haight Solid State vs. Hydro Grow LED
I took some pics as I was adding the hydroton layer, and I did the HSS plants first, took a break and a few pics of the HGL plants, and then added it to their pots.
They were all hydrotonized a few minutes apart.
We are comparing 126w to 180w because HGL was confident that their light was not at a disadvantage with the lower wattage and wanted to go heads-up against HSS.
This point was discussed in the planning stages of this comparison and HGL consented to the agreement because they are very confident in their design.
Despite the HGL's slow growth below the canopy, I'm hoping some of those branches can manage to poke their way through and get some light.
Both lights do veg extremely well, but that's not why most of us are here.
thanks man, good questions
I took some pics as I was adding the hydroton layer, and I did the HSS plants first, took a break and a few pics of the HGL plants, and then added it to their pots.
They were all hydrotonized a few minutes apart.
We are comparing 126w to 180w because HGL was confident that their light was not at a disadvantage with the lower wattage and wanted to go heads-up against HSS.
This point was discussed in the planning stages of this comparison and HGL consented to the agreement because they are very confident in their design.
Despite the HGL's slow growth below the canopy, I'm hoping some of those branches can manage to poke their way through and get some light.
Both lights do veg extremely well, but that's not why most of us are here.
thanks man, good questions
usul
New Member
Re: 420 Consumer Reports Competition - Haight Solid State vs. Hydro Grow LED
Well said Doc, and you've said as much as well SS. While speculating about the performance of each light at this stage may be interesting the only thing that really counts is bud production. Things can change dramatically as time goes on. Even with my little grow I've found the plant I would have thrown out at week 4 is by far the best performer at week 8.
Thanks so much for your great work SS - very much appreciated.
It's too early to draw any conclusions, but I enjoy speculating as well!
One thing for sure, these LED's veg some healthy plants....both of them.
If you want ornamental Cannabis, the LED's are the way to go.
But, if you want flowers, it remains to be seen which one produces and how much.
Fast forward, SS.
Well said Doc, and you've said as much as well SS. While speculating about the performance of each light at this stage may be interesting the only thing that really counts is bud production. Things can change dramatically as time goes on. Even with my little grow I've found the plant I would have thrown out at week 4 is by far the best performer at week 8.
Thanks so much for your great work SS - very much appreciated.
Re: 420 Consumer Reports Competition - Haight Solid State vs. Hydro Grow LED
Absolutely!
The last thing I want to do is poison the waters before the lights have a chance to show what they can do in bloom.
I'm just describing what I'm seeing and what the implications might be down the line, but my comments are just speculative at this point.
Things could change a lot.
thanks for the voice of reason usul
Absolutely!
The last thing I want to do is poison the waters before the lights have a chance to show what they can do in bloom.
I'm just describing what I'm seeing and what the implications might be down the line, but my comments are just speculative at this point.
Things could change a lot.
thanks for the voice of reason usul
wifecaretaker
New Member
Re: 420 Consumer Reports Competition - Haight Solid State vs. Hydro Grow LED
My harvest really depended on which cola was right under the 90w. i was able to place 3 tops under my little 90w, and each accounted for 50 percent of each plant. The other buds could go into the bubble bags. they are that weak. given my light is probably really lame, but i was still sold the world. no doubt a 400w hps would have given fat nugs all over, at the same price. live and learn i guess.
wct
My harvest really depended on which cola was right under the 90w. i was able to place 3 tops under my little 90w, and each accounted for 50 percent of each plant. The other buds could go into the bubble bags. they are that weak. given my light is probably really lame, but i was still sold the world. no doubt a 400w hps would have given fat nugs all over, at the same price. live and learn i guess.
wct
Re: 420 Consumer Reports Competition - Haight Solid State vs. Hydro Grow LED
Well, I'm optimizing their environment as much as I possibly can. I already tend to pamper my plants too much, so you can imagine. They are getting lots of love, so if I can keep this thing on track, it should give us a good idea of how they perform.
If there's a hero in any of this, it's Mrs. Sun.
Well, I'm optimizing their environment as much as I possibly can. I already tend to pamper my plants too much, so you can imagine. They are getting lots of love, so if I can keep this thing on track, it should give us a good idea of how they perform.
If there's a hero in any of this, it's Mrs. Sun.
Re: 420 Consumer Reports Competition - Haight Solid State vs. Hydro Grow LED
Ah, the thing I am learning most while doing all of this is to listen to the Mrs. Go. So I know what you mean on that part Sun! Sometimes, an outside perspective is seemingly the worst thing, but essentially the best thing.
-Go-
Ah, the thing I am learning most while doing all of this is to listen to the Mrs. Go. So I know what you mean on that part Sun! Sometimes, an outside perspective is seemingly the worst thing, but essentially the best thing.
-Go-
MountainHigh
New Member
Re: 420 Consumer Reports Competition - Haight Solid State vs. Hydro Grow LED
You are doing great with all those plants, I just got caught up again.
You can definitely see differences in the lights so far.
(I forget they moved all the LED grow's to their own forum and forget to check)
SS, I just love your grow! (Science ftw)
You are doing great with all those plants, I just got caught up again.
You can definitely see differences in the lights so far.
(I forget they moved all the LED grow's to their own forum and forget to check)
SS, I just love your grow! (Science ftw)
hydronewbie
New Member
Re: 420 Consumer Reports Competition - Haight Solid State vs. Hydro Grow LED
Dear Setting Sun:
In the spirit of the climax of the football season, how about a half-time report complete with facts and statistics of the grow based on the first frame of this thread. I know that would take some time, but I think it would be useful to juxtapose the growth of the plants during veg versus flowering. Just an idea. again for all your hard work, I don't mean to add another chore. Maybe there is someone who is good at generating statistical data who is interested in this grow and would volunteer to put together a comparison table.
Best,
Dear Setting Sun:
In the spirit of the climax of the football season, how about a half-time report complete with facts and statistics of the grow based on the first frame of this thread. I know that would take some time, but I think it would be useful to juxtapose the growth of the plants during veg versus flowering. Just an idea.
again for all your hard work, I don't mean to add another chore. Maybe there is someone who is good at generating statistical data who is interested in this grow and would volunteer to put together a comparison table.Best,
Re: 420 Consumer Reports Competition - Haight Solid State vs. Hydro Grow LED
I have seen multiple posts sayin "led's sure do veg well" or some derivative of that,
I say, man SS, you sure do veg well. lol.
light is just one component of a healthy system, and SS has it down pat. keep up the good work bro, both of these manu's are lucky to have you put their best foot forward. You are making them both look good. . . now lets see if you can work your magic in flower. . . but i already know you will.
peace and love.
WOF
I have seen multiple posts sayin "led's sure do veg well" or some derivative of that,
I say, man SS, you sure do veg well. lol.
light is just one component of a healthy system, and SS has it down pat. keep up the good work bro, both of these manu's are lucky to have you put their best foot forward. You are making them both look good. . . now lets see if you can work your magic in flower. . . but i already know you will.
peace and love.
WOF