- Thread starter
- #10,541
I won't be comparing them to eachother per se but it will indeed be interesting!
Doc Bud's High Brix Q&A With Pictures
- Thread starter Doc Bud
- Start date
I won't be comparing them to eachother per se but it will indeed be interesting!
Me too Gov.
Are they the finest simply because they put out more light? They consume more electricity, so it's good to hear they will put out more photons. But are they more efficient? If we spend more to power them and spend more to move the heat they produce, the ~60% savings in acquisition cost will be "consumed" over time due to operating costs, plus I assume the bulb is still consumable, too. Not that LEDs are not consumable parts, I get that but their longevity is usually enough that a good panel manufacturer will cover them under warranty.
I was originally looking at the Gavitas but cooling capacity became an issue for me, as well as power consumption so I went the LED route.
Not challenging you, I'm trying to understand what I'm missing out on if I'm stuck with LED. Higher quality product? Greater yield? Etc. If it's just greater photon density out of a single apparatus that consumes more power and produces more heat, then I don't feel like I'm missing anything. If they produce some portion of the light spectrum that's missing from the LED panels AND that equates to greater plant health, then we're talking about something worth investing in better air handling to deal with the extra heat.
The Gavita DE lamps are incredibly efficient for an HID. A typical 1000W hps will output roughly 1200 umols while the DEs will output 2000 umols with the same power draw. 
That's some of the most efficient tech on the market, better than white COBs.
Higher efficiency = lower heat.
In this case, a 600/750 Gavita DE replaces a typical 1000 hps. Same umols, 40% less heat, plus longer usable life.
That's some of the most efficient tech on the market, better than white COBs. Higher efficiency = lower heat.
In this case, a 600/750 Gavita DE replaces a typical 1000 hps. Same umols, 40% less heat, plus longer usable life.
- Thread starter
- #10,545
They don't produce much more heat than the 4 LED's they replaced. At least it seems that way during trials.
I lost over an ounce of prime bud due to the tops bleaching out under the LED's....no matter which brand. Gavita's won't due that.
LED is awesome and I will always use them. I'll probably use these Gavita's for special grows.
oooh...WN!
I better get one of those Gravitas if we're going to have a Doc Bud vs. Ziggy 'Grow Down'
Doc, you too...thought I was the only one getting bleached tops. A few of mine with my present grow have begun to bleach a lil....but not all and not always the closest tops to the light. What gives. This time around I even left the lights right at the very top of the GR and they (the tops) are still showing a lil bleaching here and there and are no way too close to the LEDS. What could be causing this. Too intense at certain points in the footprint...not sure. A lot of my grows seem to be getting this , but not too much to really worry but , but , but, somethings not perfect and it bothers me.
- Thread starter
- #10,548
I think putting the LED's on a mover might help with the bleaching. That will be something I try in the future for sure.
Hey Doc,
Noobie here but have been lurking for a while. Wanted to start an account a while back but registration was down. Anywho, I cannot PM you and wanted to get started w/ the kit. You have another firm believer! My motivation, grow great plants and stop spending out of the nose for "top shelf"
Thanks for your help sir!
Noobie here but have been lurking for a while. Wanted to start an account a while back but registration was down. Anywho, I cannot PM you and wanted to get started w/ the kit. You have another firm believer! My motivation, grow great plants and stop spending out of the nose for "top shelf"
Thanks for your help sir!
In my setup I've seen consistent yellowing of the tops getting the most light and I've pretty much decided that they're too close. I'm running 1000 watts of LED in a 4x4 and letting the canopy get under 20 inches. That's too close for this intensity.
But that's with my present skills, I'm convinced. It's not really "too much" light - my plants just aren't healthy and vigorous enough to use it. The leaves can't metabolize fast enough to keep up with the transpiration rate. Healthier plants don't show the fade.
The best use of plenty of lights is to mount them high. Once you get past a foot or two, the penetration goes way up.
If the intensity is 1000 PAR at 2 feet, it's still about 500 (minimum) at about 39 inches. You get 15 inches depth of canopy.
If it's 1000 at 12 inches, it's down to that same 500 PAR at 2 feet. You only get 7-8 inches of canopy depth.
3000 PAR at 3 feet would get you a 4 foot deep canopy.
... I have calculator brain today, it seems ...
But that's with my present skills, I'm convinced. It's not really "too much" light - my plants just aren't healthy and vigorous enough to use it. The leaves can't metabolize fast enough to keep up with the transpiration rate. Healthier plants don't show the fade.
The best use of plenty of lights is to mount them high. Once you get past a foot or two, the penetration goes way up.
If the intensity is 1000 PAR at 2 feet, it's still about 500 (minimum) at about 39 inches. You get 15 inches depth of canopy.
If it's 1000 at 12 inches, it's down to that same 500 PAR at 2 feet. You only get 7-8 inches of canopy depth.
3000 PAR at 3 feet would get you a 4 foot deep canopy.
... I have calculator brain today, it seems ...
I have been running my 600W hps at about 12" and my 3Wx150 eshines (Platinum p450) at about 8". Last grow I had just one bud that went white. This grow so far I have no had any bleaching (day 27 flower).
Doc why not do an HPS/LED combo grow? They complement each others spectrum nicely. You even have those cool royal blue LEDs that would fill out the blue spectrum that HPS lacks so nicely.
Doc why not do an HPS/LED combo grow? They complement each others spectrum nicely. You even have those cool royal blue LEDs that would fill out the blue spectrum that HPS lacks so nicely.
- Thread starter
- #10,552
PM'd ya there aruu.....
Here's the current problems and difficulties with this crazy kit and the insane low potassium soil:
The high calcium dogma I always push has some side-effects. 5'+ tall plants with 5+oz of produce on them that need zero to minimal staking. The other side effect is resin. Of course a "good" grower would instantly recognize these problems and add potassium in order to weaken the stems and decrease resin. Someday I'll learn. Until then I continue to do stupid stuff like let them dry out in veg, spray the buds with fish juice and a bunch of other stuff, and worst of all....wash them in water upon harvest.
I'm doing a bunch of stuff wrong, it seems. At least that's what I've been told. If I got really smart, I could injure and weaken the biota by adding organic matter. But I'm just not smart enough to do that.
These are the largest plants I've grown of this strain to date.
I'm confused. They cost less, weigh less, produce more usable light, use less electricity and give off the same amount of heat as comparable LED panels? Yet the LED are so "intense" that they bleach the plants whereas the Gavita will not. Is the LED too "concentrated" due to the highly directional light?
- Thread starter
- #10,554
They cost less and weigh less....very true. However they use MORE electricity and produce slightly more heat.
I do not know why/how LED's bleach and HPS don't....but it's a well known phenomenon. Now, please don't think I'm anti-LED! My veg room is now LED as is 2/3 of the bloom chambers.
SmokeyMcFly
Well-Known Member
It's strange I have had plants in veg grow into and around the LEDs without bleaching and I have have buds grow really close without bleaching while others did bleach and even lower colas bleached. I'm starting to think we might be creating hotspots where light from multiple panels are combining or something weird like that.
- Thread starter
- #10,556
I totally agree RE hotspots. I think a mover would be very helpful in solving that problem. The panels I use are far too heavy for a mover, however.
TrichGobbla
New Member
They make 3 wheeled rollers that fit perfect under a 5 gallon bucket, I use them as well for my coco grows and they really help when rotating plants.. Just food for thought
TrichGobbla
New Member
TrichGobbla
New Member
Here we go, this plant is in a 3.5 gallon hydro bucket with plant rollers from the dollar store lol, pfff, 3 bucks and they work great.
Much respect doc
Much respect doc
Alright gentlemen, I got my first Cat Drench done on the 7th. I'm having to water every three to four days. Two questions, is it too soon to do the second Cat? Also, looking at the pic below, is it too late to do a second or am I still in the window of opportunity?
