Doc Bud's High Brix Q&A With Pictures

re: Doc Bud - High Brix Q&A With Pictures

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That is correct. ProMIx HP Mycorhyzza. That's the one.

Thanks guys.
 
re: Doc Bud - High Brix Q&A With Pictures

Great thread you have going Doc. The knowledge contained here is top shelf.

have a few things i was wondering-

i know somewhere in the past you recommended a 6/5/3 mix for mothers. can you run 6/5/3 for just moms or as a base soil, with a few dry meal ferts added in? Like for example how does in your opinion this soil look from Earth Juice -Amazon Bloom as a basesoil?
Earth Juice Amazon Bloom...
it has dry meal ferts and no calcium carb from dolomite .

I was also wondering what you thought of a dry mix from down to earth organics called rock n chicken mixadded to that mentioned soil mix
Rock 'n Chicken (6 Lb Box)
was thinking something like 3 parts traditional SRP + 2 parts rock n chicken mix.

additionally, whats your position on the use of dry molasses amended into soil vs using liquid?
 
re: Doc Bud - High Brix Q&A With Pictures

Great thread you have going Doc. The knowledge contained here is top shelf.

have a few things i was wondering-

i know somewhere in the past you recommended a 6/5/3 mix for mothers. can you run 6/5/3 for just moms or as a base soil, with a few dry meal ferts added in? Like for example how does in your opinion this soil look from Earth Juice -Amazon Bloom as a basesoil?
Earth Juice Amazon Bloom...
it has dry meal ferts and no calcium carb from dolomite .

I was also wondering what you thought of a dry mix from down to earth organics called rock n chicken mixadded to that mentioned soil mix
Rock 'n Chicken (6 Lb Box)
was thinking something like 3 parts traditional SRP + 2 parts rock n chicken mix.

additionally, whats your position on the use of dry molasses amended into soil vs using liquid?

You're on the right track, although the plant doesn't have to be a mother plant.

The 6-5-3 is an attempt to get the right ratio of calcium, magnesium and phosphorus into the soil. It's a "best guess." What I'm doing now is exact, as it's based off soil tests and laboratory recommendations.

I have a great, big bag of Rock n Chicken....used it quite a bit before I started doing high brix. It's a fantastic product.....except for one little problem:

I cannot verify that the chickens are fed non-GMO chicken feed. The lab that I use loved chicken manure until maybe 2 years ago, because the manure is mostly from chickens who are fed GMO feed. So they don't recommend it anymore, and neither do I!

As far as molasses and all that stuff goes, it's better to teach your microscopic helpers to eat healthy fish juice and rocks....not that sugar crap!
 
re: Doc Bud - High Brix Q&A With Pictures

As far as molasses and all that stuff goes, it's better to teach your microscopic helpers to eat healthy fish juice and rocks....not that sugar crap!

I'm a little confused by that one Doc.

All of a sudden molasses is a no no?

A lot of the liquid organic ferts seem to be fish based. So when using them no molasses is needed?

Unrelated; is there a shelf life to the kit? I haven't had the opportunity to use the replacement kit yet and might not until I get my own grow room, which will hopefully be next spring.

@ my whey

I used the 653, Dr Earth organic powdered ferts, and tea and grew one of my best crops to date.
 
re: Doc Bud - High Brix Q&A With Pictures

Hi Doc! I'm inerested in that one too! The molasses question that is...Thanks Hash Hound. I'l take a bit of a guess on this one ,and say that using molassis is awesome ...but you can't achieve even a moderatly high brix level...not enough "rocks" eaten by the "herd".You can still grow great plants using alot of it,i have done it lots,but you just can't get the brix up ,at all. Hope that helped.Anyhow..Doc ,would you mind giving your thoughts on my latest mix "cooking" at the moment? Pots are seven gal. rootbuilder 11"s.(fancy airpots). Promix HP/myc.,E.W.C.perlite,6/5/3 using oyster shell flour instead of ag. lime(nowhere to be found),1/4 cup each of fishbone meal,crab meal,and alfalfa.two cups rock dust. That's it.Ratios are 3 cups mineral mix per pot along with the two cups of rock dust per pot.Trying it now in a grow without the o.s.f. but with limestone screenings,working good ,but not great!Thanks Doc!!
 
re: Doc Bud - High Brix Q&A With Pictures

I'm a little confused by that one Doc.

All of a sudden molasses is a no no?

A lot of the liquid organic ferts seem to be fish based. So when using them no molasses is needed?

Unrelated; is there a shelf life to the kit? I haven't had the opportunity to use the replacement kit yet and might not until I get my own grow room, which will hopefully be next spring.

@ my whey

I used the 653, Dr Earth organic powdered ferts, and tea and grew one of my best crops to date.

I don't think you've seen me use molasses for a long time now. I used it in the past, because I knew that it fed the microbes, which is good compared to having none.....

But we're not just trying to have some microbial life in the soil....we're trying to have massive, hyperactive microbial life, and we want these critters to eat rocks, mostly, with a few bits of organic material as well. If you feed them a diet of sugar....that's what they'll eat. If you feed them a diet of rocks....that's what they'll eat.

Our plants want the rocks and fishy bits....not the sugar. I don't use it anymore.

Hi Doc! I'm inerested in that one too! The molasses question that is...Thanks Hash Hound. I'l take a bit of a guess on this one ,and say that using molassis is awesome ...but you can't achieve even a moderatly high brix level...not enough "rocks" eaten by the "herd".You can still grow great plants using alot of it,i have done it lots,but you just can't get the brix up ,at all. Hope that helped.Anyhow..Doc ,would you mind giving your thoughts on my latest mix "cooking" at the moment? Pots are seven gal. rootbuilder 11"s.(fancy airpots). Promix HP/myc.,E.W.C.perlite,6/5/3 using oyster shell flour instead of ag. lime(nowhere to be found),1/4 cup each of fishbone meal,crab meal,and alfalfa.two cups rock dust. That's it.Ratios are 3 cups mineral mix per pot along with the two cups of rock dust per pot.Trying it now in a grow without the o.s.f. but with limestone screenings,working good ,but not great!Thanks Doc!!

That's the idea bro!
As to your soil mix, seems fine. I'm sure you'll grow some lovely plants in that mix.

The things that hold us back, when it comes to achieving High Brix, are:

1. not enough calcium in the soil
2. Too much potassium, sodium and aluminium in the soil
3. Improper ratio's of Ca/Mg P/K
4. Lack of trace elements
5. Poor CEC of soil

You've probably got the calcium needs with your mix. Hard to say about the Cal/mag ratio without a soil test....no way of knowing. It's also hard to say about the potassium without a soil test except that I'll bet your's is way, way, way high....far too high for High Brix. I know this because ProMix by itself is borderline on Potassium. Start adding stuff and it's almost certain you've got too much K.

Probably the sodium is too high as well. Every "high quality" potting soil I tested was too high in K, sodium and magnesium......ProMix was borderline.

But adding minerals is still an improvement over not......so I highly recommend you continue to experiment! That's what I did.....and it led to where I am now.
 
re: Doc Bud - High Brix Q&A With Pictures

Hey Doc.! I have really been trying to keep the salts and K down with this mix:( Did not add any kelp in the meals...just a 1/4 cup of crab ,alfalfa and fish bone meal. With all the rocks and minerals and keep in mind too, they will be getting a rgular A.C.T and only distilled water. Sorry Doc, should have been more specific with things.Very little of the "meals" are used. Just enough to add diversity to the mix.Very little added potassium.I'm having so much fun!! Thanks Doc!
 
re: Doc Bud - High Brix Q&A With Pictures

Hey Doc.! I have really been trying to keep the salts and K down with this mix:( Did not add any kelp in the meals...just a 1/4 cup of crab ,alfalfa and fish bone meal. With all the rocks and minerals and keep in mind too, they will be getting a rgular A.C.T and only distilled water. Sorry Doc, should have been more specific with things.Very little of the "meals" are used. Just enough to add diversity to the mix.Very little added potassium.I'm having so much fun!! Thanks Doc!

You got it! It is fun...all this growing and such.

The alfalfa and "rock dust" have lots of potassium and sodium between the two, assuming you're talking about Glacial Rock Dust or something like that. The Soft Rock Phosphate has nearly all the trace elements without much sodium, so you don't need another product except maybe some 20 mule team borax...small amount.

Let me know how it goes! Please take some pics!
 
re: Doc Bud - High Brix Q&A With Pictures

Mornin Doc! I didn't know the "glacial rock dust " had so much potasium and sodium.I assumed it was mainly minerals.Should i forget about the two next time? I'l try and take some brix readings when this mix gets into use in a couple of months.I used very little of alfalfa ,so i'm not too worried how it will affect it.The rock dust on the other hand ...i used quite a bit for every 7 gal pot,two full cups to be exact.Will weekly aps of 24hr e.w.c. aerated tea help me get higher brix readings at all Doc?Since getting into using an a.c.t. every week with a full strength foliar spray...the girls ...i think hear me coming with the tea!!They just love the tea and spray once a week.In between the act ,they get a spraying with seaweed (bioweed) and or worm juice.Happy Thanksgiving Doc!!
 
re: Doc Bud - High Brix Q&A With Pictures

Mornin Doc! I didn't know the "glacial rock dust " had so much potasium and sodium.I assumed it was mainly minerals.Should i forget about the two next time? I'l try and take some brix readings when this mix gets into use in a couple of months.I used very little of alfalfa ,so i'm not too worried how it will affect it.The rock dust on the other hand ...i used quite a bit for every 7 gal pot,two full cups to be exact.Will weekly aps of 24hr e.w.c. aerated tea help me get higher brix readings at all Doc?Since getting into using an a.c.t. every week with a full strength foliar spray...the girls ...i think hear me coming with the tea!!They just love the tea and spray once a week.In between the act ,they get a spraying with seaweed (bioweed) and or worm juice.Happy Thanksgiving Doc!!

Well, it sounds like you're giving them lots of everything. I don't really know what to say.

If you're after higher brix readings I do have a very simple path to achieve that.....no guessing.
 
re: Doc Bud - High Brix Q&A With Pictures

Doc...I would love to stop the guess work . The only thing holding me back from a "kit" is ...i'm in Can. and getting anything shipped here seems to scare everyone away!!I have seen lots of great products south of the border that we just can't get, Azomite ...for one.It's not approved yet for ag use up here...we're not nice at customs iether.Doc...i have two months to get a kit up and running.Pro mix HP/myc.and e.w.c. The rest i understand is with your kit right? This is only my 5th post so i'm limited ,ya know.The guess work has been fun over the yrs. but my patience is starting to run out!Can you help?
 
re: Doc Bud - High Brix Q&A With Pictures

Doc...I would love to stop the guess work . The only thing holding me back from a "kit" is ...i'm in Can. and getting anything shipped here seems to scare everyone away!!I have seen lots of great products south of the border that we just can't get, Azomite ...for one.It's not approved yet for ag use up here...we're not nice at customs iether.Doc...i have two months to get a kit up and running.Pro mix HP/myc.and e.w.c. The rest i understand is with your kit right? This is only my 5th post so i'm limited ,ya know.The guess work has been fun over the yrs. but my patience is starting to run out!Can you help?

Shipping to Canada is costly....no doubt about it.

You could try to copy the soil I used to use before the lab. (going from memory, but this will work)

6-5-3-------2 cups per bale of Promix HP
Azomite (could use another source of micro's here) toss in a good handful
Rock n Chicken----4 cups per bale
Ancient Forest humus----1/2 bag per bale
EWC.-------20 pounds per bale

I had some VERY good results with that mix, and enjoyed a good deal of bug suppression as well.

One thing you'll find is that MORE is not better, especially when it comes to micro's. It's rather shocking to realize you can amend 60 gallons of soil with a half of a ziplock sandwich baggie of rocks. (2 cups to be precise) Many people would be tempted to add that entire bag to each 7 gallon pot.

The CEC of your soil will go all screwy if you start adding all kinds of stuff, then you'll start chasing the "deficiency" phantom...and next thing you know you'll be trying Advanced Nutrients.

Easy....simple....that's the way to do it!
 
re: Doc Bud - High Brix Q&A With Pictures

Doc, wow...it's very clear i've been using way too much per 7gal pot! 3 cups of 6/5/3/ for every one...not good!Too many rocks eh?Can you really amend a full bale (60g.)of promix with just 2 cups? Thanks for the great info on the mix. I guess that means , you don't ship here Doc? Anyhow ...if not, i'm going to just keep trying ...Just from going over a few things here with you i have learned a lot!Thanks so much Doc.Can you answer one more question? I am currently growing with that "potent" 6/5/3/mix and they seem to be loving it!With the A.C.T's and all...3 cups of it went into each of four 7 gal. airpots.I have only been growing organic for 3 yrs....so i have alot to learn.Before that it was soiless and diff. nutes all the time.I just want less fuss and more reliability with soil.Thanks Doc:):)
 
re: Doc Bud - High Brix Q&A With Pictures

Hey duggan, I am up in Canada too, Doc has shipped twice to me and both times it has arrived without any problems. It does take about 10-14 days for it to arrive. You would have to get the soil cooking right away if you were to meet your deadline of two months. That's one shortcut you can't take; under-cooking the soil.
 
re: Doc Bud - High Brix Q&A With Pictures

cgrowman...thanks,i'm hoping Doc will give me the scoop on how to get it done...we'll see.I've been trying to match his formula to a degree for a while now and it's time to just get a kit. There are too many variables to deal with eh?It's the nice amounts of resin the Doc can achieve.The more...the better!! I think most of us can grow great looking plants that smoke real nice ,and all but don't have the resin and quality of resin from HB.I just chopped some H.G.K. and it looked good and smokes nice but never really produced much resin...and i know it's me ...not the plant!Or should i say..the soil.Later and happy Thanksgiving cgrowman:)
 
re: Doc Bud - High Brix Q&A With Pictures

Shipping to Canada is costly....no doubt about it.

You could try to copy the soil I used to use before the lab. (going from memory, but this will work)

6-5-3-------2 cups per bale of Promix HP
Azomite (could use another source of micro's here) toss in a good handful
Rock n Chicken----4 cups per bale
Ancient Forest humus----1/2 bag per bale
EWC.-------20 pounds per bale

I had some VERY good results with that mix, and enjoyed a good deal of bug suppression as well.

One thing you'll find is that MORE is not better, especially when it comes to micro's. It's rather shocking to realize you can amend 60 gallons of soil with a half of a ziplock sandwich baggie of rocks. (2 cups to be precise) Many people would be tempted to add that entire bag to each 7 gallon pot.

The CEC of your soil will go all screwy if you start adding all kinds of stuff, then you'll start chasing the "deficiency" phantom...and next thing you know you'll be trying Advanced Nutrients.

Easy....simple....that's the way to do it!

Hey Doc Bud,
First off, let me say thank you on behalf of the knowledge hungry growers like myself. You have provided tons of information on growing, well not just growing, growing like a scientist with a formula.

I have been a synthetic nutrient grower and have always wanted to make the switch to organics, and I am now in the process.

I have been reading tons of online information, and have come to the conclusion that an organic soil mix is the bees knees of growing organically.

While developing an organic soil mix, I used all sorts of sources of information to follow, but I have largely tried following the wealth of information you have provided.

Now I know the only way to achieve a plant with a high brix level is to not use any guess work, like you say, and to inherit the use of foliars. But since I am new to organic gardening, I wish to start with a well rounded soil mix, not a super soil, a single soil I can fill the entire pot with, and add in just a couple compost teas.

Until today, here is the soil mix I have come up with this far:

1 Bail Pro-Mix HP
1 Bag Espoma Organic Perlite
1.5 Bags of Wiggle Worm EWC
1 Bag Ancient Forest Soil
3.5 Cups of 6-5-3 Mix
2 1/3 Cups Azomite
1.5 Cups Kelp Meal
2 1/3 Cups Crab Shell Meal
2 1/3 Cups Neem Seed Meal
3.5 Cups Alfalfa Meal
2 1/3 Cups Fish Bone Meal
2 1/3 Tablespoons BioAg TM-7

Ratios:
Total CU without powders and meals = 6.8 cu
PROMIX = 3.8 cu / 6.8 cu = 55.88%
Perlite = 1.0 cu / 6.8 cu = 14.71%
EWC = 1.5 cu / 6.8 cu = 22.06%
Ancient Forest = .5 cu / 6.8 cu = 7.35%

Soil Amendments Per 1 CU of base mix
½ cup 6-5-3 mineral mix per cu (Calcium Carbonate-Soft Rock Phosphate-Gypsum)
½ cup alfalfa meal per cu
1/3 cup Azomite per cu
¼ cup kelp meal per cu
1/3 cup fish bone meal per cu
1/3 cup neem seed meal per cu
1/3 cup crab shell meal per cu
1 Teaspoon BioAG TM-7(humic and fulvic acids) per cu

My compost tea would have been as follows:
1/2 cup ewc
1/2 cup ancient forest
2 tablespoonsoons of molasses.

And this is until I see your post here, with such a super simple basic recipe that is easier and more cost effective than the one I have created.

I am wondering if you would answer a few questions for me:

First, do you think that my soil mix has too much/too little of anything, or will this work good as a first timer organics soil, that fills 100% of the pot, with just watering and compost teas? Any tips or suggestions are greatly appreciated.

Second, as far as my compost tea goes, I was so sure about molasses as microbe food, until I read you suggesting against it. Would fish hydrolysate ferts be a good replacement for the molasses in my compost tea?

Lastly, a two-fer, the recipe you posted in this quote, would that be, in your eyes, a better mix than the soil mix I have proposed? Is the soil mix you proposed a water only til harvest mix?

I have so many questions and I know the best place to start is to just jump in and try it and gain experience, but I am want the best start possible before I start this transition. Over time I know I will learn much more and will do more, but I want to start simple, yet strong.
 
re: Doc Bud - High Brix Q&A With Pictures

Hey Doc Bud,
First off, let me say thank you on behalf of the knowledge hungry growers like myself. You have provided tons of information on growing, well not just growing, growing like a scientist with a formula.

I have been a synthetic nutrient grower and have always wanted to make the switch to organics, and I am now in the process.

I have been reading tons of online information, and have come to the conclusion that an organic soil mix is the bees knees of growing organically.

While developing an organic soil mix, I used all sorts of sources of information to follow, but I have largely tried following the wealth of information you have provided.

Now I know the only way to achieve a plant with a high brix level is to not use any guess work, like you say, and to inherit the use of foliars. But since I am new to organic gardening, I wish to start with a well rounded soil mix, not a super soil, a single soil I can fill the entire pot with, and add in just a couple compost teas.

Until today, here is the soil mix I have come up with this far:

1 Bail Pro-Mix HP
1 Bag Espoma Organic Perlite
1.5 Bags of Wiggle Worm EWC
1 Bag Ancient Forest Soil
3.5 Cups of 6-5-3 Mix
2 1/3 Cups Azomite
1.5 Cups Kelp Meal
2 1/3 Cups Crab Shell Meal
2 1/3 Cups Neem Seed Meal
3.5 Cups Alfalfa Meal
2 1/3 Cups Fish Bone Meal
2 1/3 Tablespoons BioAg TM-7

Ratios:
Total CU without powders and meals = 6.8 cu
PROMIX = 3.8 cu / 6.8 cu = 55.88%
Perlite = 1.0 cu / 6.8 cu = 14.71%
EWC = 1.5 cu / 6.8 cu = 22.06%
Ancient Forest = .5 cu / 6.8 cu = 7.35%

Soil Amendments Per 1 CU of base mix
½ cup 6-5-3 mineral mix per cu (Calcium Carbonate-Soft Rock Phosphate-Gypsum)
½ cup alfalfa meal per cu
1/3 cup Azomite per cu
¼ cup kelp meal per cu
1/3 cup fish bone meal per cu
1/3 cup neem seed meal per cu
1/3 cup crab shell meal per cu
1 Teaspoon BioAG TM-7(humic and fulvic acids) per cu

My compost tea would have been as follows:
1/2 cup ewc
1/2 cup ancient forest
2 tablespoonsoons of molasses.

And this is until I see your post here, with such a super simple basic recipe that is easier and more cost effective than the one I have created.

I am wondering if you would answer a few questions for me:

First, do you think that my soil mix has too much/too little of anything, or will this work good as a first timer organics soil, that fills 100% of the pot, with just watering and compost teas? Any tips or suggestions are greatly appreciated.

Second, as far as my compost tea goes, I was so sure about molasses as microbe food, until I read you suggesting against it. Would fish hydrolysate ferts be a good replacement for the molasses in my compost tea?

Lastly, a two-fer, the recipe you posted in this quote, would that be, in your eyes, a better mix than the soil mix I have proposed? Is the soil mix you proposed a water only til harvest mix?

I have so many questions and I know the best place to start is to just jump in and try it and gain experience, but I am want the best start possible before I start this transition. Over time I know I will learn much more and will do more, but I want to start simple, yet strong.

Great questions!

I have time for some short, to-the-point answers and then I must go work.

1. That soil mix you posted will work!
2. I'd lose the Neem and Alfalfa in the mix. You might consider adding Alfalfa to one of the teas you'll brew a couple times, maybe once in veg and one more time in like week 4 or 5 of bloom...AFTER all the buds have set and are throwing out pistils.
3. Maybe do with half that amount of Azomite in the mix.

As for feeding, get some cold processed squid, or a high quality fish hydrolysate and feed that every 3rd watering or so......again, mix it into the tea you're brewing.....add half the amount you're supposed to feed per the bottle.

I also recommend not using molasses in the tea. You'll have success with that mix, for sure. Don't foliar feed with that.

Here are some pics.....Champagne, Lemon Paki, Tahoe OG (low brix method :rasta: ) Oh yeah....I got all excited after taking these pics because I thought I saw some PM spots on the top cola of an OG.....but alas, it's just dried up Brix spray....that top is in front of the fan.

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