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The vapor pressure of EtOH at 121C is 49.5psi. The offset pressure would be 34.5psi. I see no reason why a Ball canning jar wouldn't remain intact at that internal pressure. Time to break out the pump and rig up a test.
edit: I'm going to install a Schrader valve in the lid, enclose the 1 gallon jar in a bag to capture the shrapnel, and test to failure. Any guesses how much pressure it'll take and whether the lid or glass fails first?
Jar by far. 30 PSI.The vapor pressure of EtOH at 121C is 49.5psi. The offset pressure would be 34.5psi. I see no reason why a Ball canning jar wouldn't remain intact at that internal pressure. Time to break out the pump and rig up a test.
edit: I'm going to install a Schrader valve in the lid, enclose the 1 gallon jar in a bag to capture the shrapnel, and test to failure. Any guesses how much pressure it'll take and whether the lid or glass fails first?
I took the vapor pressure number derived from the Clausius-Clapeyron equation for EtOH at 121C and subtracted the known steam vapor pressure of 15psi at 121C. That yields the effective pressure inside the vessel.How are you getting your offset pressure numbers?
I'm thinking you're likely very close. I'm going to try to blow up a Ball jar in the morning. I'll have to use a quart jar though because the gallon jars have plastic lids and are full of flowers. And yes, if it ever progresses to full-on autoclave testing it'll be outside in a very explosion-proof location.Canyon said:Jar by far. 30 PSI.
After that try a half pint. I suspect that the half pints with the decorative diamond design would hold up best and also act a lot like a fragmentation grenade.
Are you conducting these medical experiments outside?
I never know, you know
I'm using 200 proof which simplifies the math. No partial pressures to figure out, right?If you are not in a rush, I could could get you some rough temp and pressures for Everclear in a few days.
I'll def post up photos if anything newsworthy happens! LOL. But a heated chamber full of pressurized ethanol vapor is exactly how a chemi-clave works. A steam-clave doesn't have the condensing coils for spent solvent recovery but since it'll be outside during testing even a catastrophic failure venting to atmosphere won't pose a health hazard.Of course, I'm not sure if an autoclave full of vaporized ethanol is going to be a safer alternative to an exploding jar?!?
Anxious to hear the results. Good luck and don't forget to duck!
Another factor to consider. Damn. I had wondered if the reaction might be reversed under pressure, recarboxylation in a sense, but after some quick and dirty research that doesn't appear likely. My gut feeling is that the bonds will be broken and the CO2 will stay in solution until the pressure is released. Carbonated tincture maybe? LOL, I have no idea. I do know that after the reaction I'll supercool the reaction vessel before opening it to hopefully avoid the warm champagne response, then allow the CO2 to offgas naturally.Scientific did some heavy duty calculations on this somewhere back in this thread. Hurt my head to try to follow that. There was some question if the added pressure impeded the the ability of the co2 molecule to be off gassed. I don't think the question was resolved.
You've got some pretty cool toys. Looking forward to your finding.
Canna-seltzer Rider...gap in the market!Carbonated tincture maybe
Problem solved. No exploding glass jars, though. Sorry.
Testing with just EtOH won't produce the same reaction as a cannabis tincture. When the THC-a is heated the carboxyl bond is broken and H2O and CO2 are produced. Someone with a better recollection of inorganic chemistry than I possess could calculate/estimate the volume of CO2 produced and the resultant pressures. I'm taking the safe route because I don't want my first batch to be spattered all over the inside of the autoclave with sticky glass shards.
edit: I kinda fudged with the photo.
So I just have to do a chemical assay to determine how many total moles of the analyte are bonded to the THC-a molecules in a given sample. So easy a cave dude could do it.The decarboxilated CO2 will be 12% of the weight of the acids in your concentration. CO2 weighs 44.01g/mol.
Just solve for P Here
So I just have to do a chemical assay to determine how many total moles of the analyte are bonded to the THC-a molecules in a given sample. So easy a cave dude could do it.