Decoding The Holy Grail: Terpene & Cannabinoid Retention: Decarb to Extraction

I would freeze it(mash) quickly soon after if not used. if wet, mold can grow on the mash even in fridge :)

Good advice. A while back, Sue asked about how long it keeps without problems. Ive left a small sample in the fridge for now 8 weeks. No sign of troubles. I thinks its because Im storing in the little jar it was baked in. Everything is heat sterilized which must be helping.

Adding to a jar in the freezer makes it real easy to store up a good supply for a second run. :thumb:
 
SweetSue, thankfully, it was purely recreational. The OOO's are big but tolerable for occasional use. And, the BIG bag I ordered is saying don't leave oils in them. But they are not vegan I don't think. Anyway, fridge or freezer, it should not matter.
 
Ziggy, I love you. I didn't shower you with nearly enough hugs when we were in Jamaica. :hugs: :hugs: :hugs:

Ok, 00s hold .90 ml of oil.

Reading quickly sometimes changes the message - kinda like word substitution.

I read this as "Ziggy I love you. I didn't shower with you nearly enough when we were in Jamaica."

Whoa ... back up the truck and read that again.
 
Nova
I looked the one Kickn was using over rather well. While I agree that there is not much to it, it looks well designed and it decarbs rather well. My bet is that the price will come down.

Oldbear,
Thanks, I have some numbers that I worked up in mg/g that are a little lower than your percent infused for the 2hr infusion. The 2 hr oil run came in around 78% and the 4hr run was around 85%. Longer times may pull a little more out.

My main problem with infused oil is that it is not that strong if you are using it to extract plant oils from buds. Multiple extractions with the same oil would bring up the concentration while adding to the loss. I suspect that Kickn is working on something along these lines now.

Kickn ask me in a PM, that I did not get back to him about, how much I was extracting with a rosen press? "It depends" did not sound like a good answer. "When it is working, most of it." is more correct. Qwet probably has a better recovery rate with the extra cost of the alcohol or the extra equipment and hassle of recovering it.

If you figured an infusion rate around 85% and control the decarb to retain some of the acids, you could add in any amount or combination of concentrated extracts to the mix. This could open some interesting possibilities.

I have all but two small dabs of the forth of a gram of strain specific terpene profile in CBD concentrate. The dabs made me slightly light headed for a few minutes, then a calming fealing. After about 20 minutes I added a few hits of high THC bud. That put me in a nice place. I want to add what is left into something.

I still have around 20 grams of the Nightmare Cookies. We have tests of the dried buds. That will save the starting tests on anything we can come up with to try. We also have an extended terpene test comming.

The uncertainty of how long I will be out of town is adding to the things I need to do before I leave. I don't know how much more I will get posted before I leave.
 
Scientific, I was under the impression that the 00 caps held .95 ml. Are you saying it's really .75, or was that a typo?

For the Now Healthy Foods 00s, I said about .75 gram. At a density of .92 for coconut oil, that would be .8 ml (and there's room for a little more in there). (Serious pharmacist talk here. ;))
 
This sounds very useful, IMO. I always look for ways to salvage a plant that's challenged. I'd use a deep stock pot to suspend it in. The tall cylinder would control the column of hot steam. I'd think silk or a stainless coffee filter would suffice as a container. You'd want lots of exposed surface. Kicked my brain right into high gear InTheShed. Lol! Decarb is a function of time and temperature. Somewhere there must be a chart that can tell you how long to heat at that temperature.

Since it's still a bit off topic I won't post the whole update here, but I just wanted to let you know that I have completed my attempt to use the buds with botrytis, and the detailed posts are here and here. After I dried the results I put one bud in a ziplock to see if it ever molds. In the meantime, the rest is going to be a massage cream.

If it works out well it could be the answer to those who wish they didn't need to waste those "challenged" plants!
 
Hi Everyone.

I harvedted earlier than expected, so I'm sharing my stealth cannabutter recipe. In the coming weeks I'll be extracting with ethanol and dry ice to share my recipe with the rest of the community.

Bebecillo's Guide to Stealth Cannabutter (Recipe & Advice)

Greetings!

What a delightful gift to the community. Thank you Bebecillo. :hugs:

I look forward to the documentation of the dry ice extraction. I find myself thinking about this at the oddest times. :laughtwo: I found myself pricing vacuum ovens the other day. Lol!
 
It's a shame we have no access to tech like that here.

I was thinking the other day about an air frier, that should decarb weed stupidly fast right? Samsung even has a microwave/air frier combo

I was looking at one just the other day, thinking the same thing. I don't know of anyone who's tried, but if temperature can be controlled and you can get it to run long enough, I couldn't see why it wouldn't.
 
That very similar to the on I have Sweetsue, great post btw
I'm in the middle of one right now. It both infuses and decarbs the cannabis in a tightly sealed jar at 170 degrees, which is the smallest temperature my gas oven hits.

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I'm making a batch of brownie oil, which I typically begin by decarbing in the oven, but this harvest was dried low and slo to retain as many terpenes and flavinoids as possible, so I decided to try to keep them more intact with this method.

Bust the flowers small but not powdery, and combine with carrier oil and liquid sunflower lecithin in a jar that can be tightly closed. You're going to be shaking it up every time you think of it over the 36 hours.

Heat the oven to the lowest setting. Remove all but one rack from the oven and place that one in the center of the space. Place the sealed and vigoriously-shaken jar on a baking sheet on the rack and leave it there for at least 24 hours, shaking vigoriously every time you remember it's in there. I always do 36 hours.

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The lid is hot. Remember the pot holder. :laughtwo:

With brownies I don't bother straining, but at the end of the process you strain, refrigerate at least overnight, but preferable for 24 hours to give the lecithin time to encapsulate the oil-bonded cannabinoids for swifter absorbtion.



:laughtwo: That's what it is. Lol! I have a similar one.

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It didn't perform as well as I'd hoped, but it never occured to me to make the bundles the size of lemons, so I'll try again next batch.

I much prefer the old dependable potato ricer. Sloppy, but effective. Only problem is all the surfaces to hang onto the oil.

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Oldbear taught me to eat the mash, a practice I've grown quite fond of in a short time, but this idea excites me. I love having multiple options, don't you? :battingeyelashes:



Neiko proved to me over a year ago that you can get almost 100% decarb in your oven - I believe he achieved 97% on the test he shared with us in the study hall. So yes, you're paying for convienience and appearances. For me, the tCheck would be the device that'd get my attention, if it weren't for the fact that many of the chemovars I grow are in excess of 15% THC values, or at least that's the expectation. My medicinal oils are mostly in the 15% or less for THC, but that's one strain.

If I'm going to invest in testing its going to be with a lab. For the kitchen cannabis alchemist producing oils for the family and friends all this close monitoring of the cannabinoids is a luxury we can live without. We work with what may be the safest medicinal herb on the planet. My interest here is in creating the most medicinally diverse oils in that home kitchen I can, and all this brainstorming is helping me do that.

Thank you all for being so engaged with this process. :hugs: :hugs: :hugs: :hugs: :hugs:
 
Something to think about on our journey... We are always concerned about loss no matter what kind. We lose THC when we extract no matter how we do it. We now know terpenes are tough to retain. We strive to find ways to help our body process the cannabinoids better; less we ultimately lose what we worked so hard to preserve. Which brings me to an important quandary- efficiency of ingestion methods. This has been talked about directly and indirectly via recipes all over the place. I do not have the answers, but lately i certainly have raised some questions. The problem with answering the questions is the same as with the extractions- you must test. Well, testing at the consumption point is tougher yet. Of course, we must first test what we consume. After that, we just have to do multiple trys at a certain method to reach a consensus about this or that. In that vein, here's what I did.

I decarbed a g of bud. Ended up at .9g. Took the .9g and ground it up. Shoved it into capsules. Then heated coconut oil and dissolved LSL into it. Then poured the oil mixture into each capsule making a wet mixture in each. Let set 15 min.

SO: The premise is-
1. Decarbed bud is ready to get you medicated.
2. The coconut oil in the solution should help in bio availability.
3. The LSL should help in bio availability. (not encapsulated)

At 12% THC (a guess), there should have been 120mg in there. After decarb = 105mg. So we should have apx 105mg. Test time. My favorite part. Come to think of it, the test dummy expression is getting more common. The unscientific result, after 2 tests on 2 different uhhh test dummies, The consensus is that it felt like 50-60mg. More loss????

Here's the thing. No, we cannot let up on extraction efficiency. But next is bio availability. Now, it would seem that I set up a pretty decent environment in those caps. But the reality is that it didn't perform up to it's potential. Furthermore, I have found that just shooting encapsulated oil down the hatch is about the same; or in the cap for that matter. Without fail, I get a bigger bang out of incorporating the oil into food. I feel strongly that for some reason it is more available to the body if incorporated into a more complex food. That is a mystery. Thoughts?
 
I need to test that

Try it in more food, see if the results are good or not noticable

Maybe a rice dish.rice absorbs very well...

I'll do some testing with my oils..capsul and rice dish
 
Re: Decoding The Holy Grail: Terpene & Cannabinoid Retention - Decarb to Extraction

Added notes

With foods it makes sense. The nutes and vitamin in foods gets obsorbed and distributed faster and consistent

Thus it seems plausable that with food it could be a better option for consuming
 
I need to test that

Try it in more food, see if the results are good or not noticable

Maybe a rice dish.rice absorbs very well...

I'll do some testing with my oils..capsul and rice dish

Yeah guys, do some unscientific testing... Cap up the same amount you eat in a dish and try both ways. I try to keep it out of the oven but it just seems to work better within a baked item.
 
Added to extraction efficiency and bio-availability you can also add the inconsistency of assimilation from one individual to another to further complicate a good synopsis. A common factor to deal with is the fact stomach acid is detrimental to cannabinods. But armed with this info, I'm still not sure if it's better to accompany oral medication with other food to dilute the damage or take it by itself to get through the stomach as quickly as possible. Metabolization actually begins in the duodenum in the presence of bile. Yet another inconsistency as determined by liver health or if your still in possession of your gall bladder. I, with my cholecystectomy, find slightly better results taking my night time tincture with a small amount of a good fat. Peanut butter being my fave. I'm like the rest, many questions with not many answers. Enjoying kicking things around, though.
 
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