Cottage 420's Organic Perpetual Indoor Garden

Yes Jellium and we made a few crosses with that keeper pheno they are the same.

Last summer was Wifi-Jellium that I sent a cut to @beez0404 he reversed and made me some seeds. I ran one of them in a container outside last summer. Was the best of everything I've ran and it was chopped in September which is awesome along with uber yields to go with.

Got like 18 zips in the can from that one plant.

Was just puffing some last night and hadda thank Beez for the seeds again! lol
Tried this one ... then another one... then the Wifi-Jellium and bam yup thats the one.
 
Bobrown, I'm new to this organic gardening thing and have a question on the amended super soils like Coots Mix, Subcool's, the TLO mix etc.

If I understand it correctly, the theory is to add in all of the organic materials and minerals needed by the plant for the entire grow up front, so that all that is needed the rest of the time is a good quality water and therefore it is more convenient for the duration of the grow, although mixing the soil initially takes a fair amount of work.

I've recently been reading a couple of books on organic growing, the first is the TLO book from The Rev, and the second is The Regenerative Growers Guide to Garden Amendments (essentially a KNF, Korean Natural Farming, book).

In the world of organics, dandelion is acknowledged as one of the great accumulator plants and its leaves, roots and flowers have many/most of the minerals plants need in higher quantities than most others, save comfrey and stinging nettle. In KNF these plants' leaves, roots and flowers are fermented using brown sugar which is said to extract the various minerals in a plant usable liquid format, much like the microbes provide after breaking down the various amendments added to the Super Soils.

So, my question is, could a similar outcome be realized using the base soil mix of 1:blushsmile:1 CSPM, aeration, worm castings/compost but rather than adding all of the other amendments up front, simply add a recomended amount of plant, or even better fish, extract to a weekly watering schedule and call it a day?

I'm guessing probably not for some reason as it would almost certainly be much more cost effective and simpler to go that route and you guys wouldn't be going through all the time and effort to add all the things to your soils the way you do if what I'm suggesting would be as effective.

So, assuming my supposition is correct, what is it about the various amendments in their original forms that make them preferable to the liquid version I can give my plants with a bit of fish juice. Perhaps soil texture or some other benefit?
 
Azimuth said:
Bobrown, I'm new to this organic gardening thing and have a question on the amended super soils like Coots Mix, Subcool's, the TLO mix etc.

If I understand it correctly, the theory is to add in all of the organic materials and minerals needed by the plant for the entire grow up front, so that all that is needed the rest of the time is a good quality water and therefore it is more convenient for the duration of the grow, although mixing the soil initially takes a fair amount of work.

I've recently been reading a couple of books on organic growing, the first is the TLO book from The Rev, and the second is The Regenerative Growers Guide to Garden Amendments (essentially a KNF, Korean Natural Farming, book).

In the world of organics, dandelion is acknowledged as one of the great accumulator plants and its leaves, roots and flowers have many/most of the minerals plants need in higher quantities than most others, save comfrey and stinging nettle. In KNF these plants' leaves, roots and flowers are fermented using brown sugar which is said to extract the various minerals in a plant usable liquid format, much like the microbes provide after breaking down the various amendments added to the Super Soils.

So, my question is, could a similar outcome be realized using the base soil mix of 1:blushsmile:1 CSPM, aeration, worm castings/compost but rather than adding all of the other amendments up front, simply add a recomended amount of plant, or even better fish, extract to a weekly watering schedule and call it a day?

I'm guessing probably not for some reason as it would almost certainly be much more cost effective and simpler to go that route and you guys wouldn't be going through all the time and effort to add all the things to your soils the way you do if what I'm suggesting would be as effective.

So, assuming my supposition is correct, what is it about the various amendments in their original forms that make them preferable to the liquid version I can give my plants with a bit of fish juice. Perhaps soil texture or some other benefit?
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Just to give you some idea about why/how we use the Coots mix.

This recipe is mix once and use for many years with minimal amending like adding leaf mold or compost and small amounts of Kelp Meal and EWC.

So that work you mentioned I did it last time with the soil I'm using for growing weed, I mixed that soil back in 2016 or maybe 2015. I also mix it for outdoor gardens as a top dress in the early spring.

Coots came up with this soil mix when he was growing trees in his nursery professionally and he needed a mix that lasted 6 years or longer as those specialty trees he was growing had to sit wrapped in burlap for that long time. They hadda be a specific size so that size it took 6 or 7 years. He didn't want have to move them around and mess with them for size reasons and the extra work. This soil mix just happens to work very well with cannabis.

I actually will add some fish emulsion 1 or 2x a grow but I have to be extremely light handed it will burn my plants. I did that last summer burnt several plants.

The mix with the amendments is meant to be long lasting meaning it can be used several years if not for-ever.

So not adding the amendments I wood be mixing soil every other run using your suggestions.

I can go down the short list of amendments and give you the reasons they are there if you wood like.

The KEY to any soil recipe really comes down to the humus portion. What we make that part of the mix with is the key. Vermi-composting is an art. You can get amazing results with composting your kitchen scraps and adding in amendments to the bin instead of or in addition to your soil mix.

I'm lazy af - I'm constantly looking for ways to improve my efficiency. Organic soil in containers is about as easy as it gets.

"Get your compost right and you really wont have much to worry about." CC
 
bobrown14 said:
Coots came up with this soil mix when he was growing trees in his nursery professionally and he needed a mix that lasted 6 years or longer as those specialty trees he was growing had to sit wrapped in burlap for that long time. They hadda be a specific size so that size it took 6 or 7 years. He didn't want have to move them around and mess with them for size reasons and the extra work. This soil mix just happens to work very well with cannabis.
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What a wonderful back story and explanation for why little re-amending is needed with Coots Mix. That's cool to know that, thanks! :bongrip:
 
bobrown14 said:
I can go down the short list of amendments and give you the reasons they are there if you wood like.
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Yes, please.

And the back story was interesting. I've seen some of his interviews on the UTube. Interesting guy. Good researcher, too!
 
Azimuth said:
Yes, please.

And the back story was interesting. I've seen some of his interviews on the UTube. Interesting guy. Good researcher, too!
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He mentored me and many many others brought us along on a very nice ride.

He pays it back side to side.

Weed pass it on.
 
Hey Azimuth - not to speak for Mr. Bobrown since he is fully qualified and so much deeper than I can comprehend but another thought is give ample time for all the amendments to be mixed together, watered in and sweated or cooked together in a tub or barrel with a lid on it for anywhere from 30 to 90 days. Dont know how they do it at fox farms but I would imagine large batches of soil ingredients are mixed up then cooked in giant piles but the big idea is for the soil to heat up internally to kickstart the breakdown of organic material and fire up the microbial activity.

However that’s kinda what geoflora is doing with their new top dress organic dry amendment fert, dont know if they use dandelion or dehydrated FPJ in their mix but spoon it on, water it in and no need to reapply for 2 weeks is their feeding schedule for the new product so you might be on to something. Personally I like to cook soil but I came here to learn...
 
013,

I grow in small containers, flowering in 1 gal pots, and several of the super soil type growers seem to be universal in their thought that the microbeasties will be hard to keep going and the additional minerals will tend to run out in that small of a quantity of base mix over the course of a grow.

So, I'm trying to find an organic solution to feeding the plants what they need in a form they can use if I won't be able to count on the micro's and if the minerals are going to run out. And honestly, I don't mind adding a bit to to each feeding if that means I can stay organic. I grow it for the medicinal qualities so a clean end product is very important to me. Quantity is secondary (probably a good thing with my limitations ).

The KNF approach seems to provide the nutrients in a plant available format, so this seems like it might be a good compromise to achieve what I want. So, maybe the super soils approach is not quite for me, but I like the makeup of the base mix with the compost and fresh worm inputs and, like you, I'm here to learn from the experts.

I grow in a cabinet and stealth is important so scaling up is really not an option for me at least at this point. So, 1 gal max it is, and finding a reasonable organic way around that limitation is what I'm after. I know larger pots would be better but unfortunately that’s not going to happen for me at least for now. Although, I might be able to do 2 gal cloth pots which would certainly help.
 
Azimuth said:
013,

I grow in small containers, flowering in 1 gal pots, and several of the super soil type growers seem to be universal in their thought that the microbeasties will be hard to keep going and the additional minerals will tend to run out in that small of a quantity of base mix over the course of a grow.

So, I'm trying to find an organic solution to feeding the plants what they need in a form they can use if I won't be able to count on the micro's and if the minerals are going to run out. And honestly, I don't mind adding a bit to to each feeding if that means I can stay organic. I grow it for the medicinal qualities so a clean end product is very important to me. Quantity is secondary (probably a good thing with my limitations ).

The KNF approach seems to provide the nutrients in a plant available format, so this seems like it might be a good compromise to achieve what I want. So, maybe the super soils approach is not quite for me, but I like the makeup of the base mix with the compost and fresh worm inputs and, like you, I'm here to learn from the experts.

I grow in a cabinet and stealth is important so scaling up is really not an option for me at least at this point. So, 1 gal max it is, and finding a reasonable organic way around that limitation is what I'm after. I know larger pots would be better but unfortunately that’s not going to happen for me at least for now. Although, I might be able to do 2 gal cloth pots which would certainly help.
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You can grow in organics in 2 gallon pots, I do it fairly regularly. I don't really feed anything throughout my grow per say, but I do top dress twice maybe three times total in small pots. I generally start in solo cups or half gallon pots and then up pot to the 2 gallon right before flip. This is a Super Lemon Haze that I just chopped the other day, grown in a 2 gallon pot.

I have a grow buddy that I was helping recently with a harvest and we were talking about this very subject....growing in small pots organically, and how there is a perceived notion that you can't get to the finish line in small pots with organic growing. He's told those that don't believe it can be done repeatedly that its possible but some people don't believe ya even after seeing things for themselves. I just smile and chuckle about people saying it can't be done.

During the warmer months, I can pull 2 zips off a 2 gallon plant, but those numbers drop in the winter as my growing temps plummet in the basement (50s in the basement, low 60s in the tent). I might get 40 grams in the winter months while growing in small pots.

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I have never tried it in 1 gallon pots....I think the only way I would ever try it would be from clone. Go from solo cup and up pot to a 1 gallon, give it 2-3 days and flip. 1 gallon is just such a small amount of material to get something through 60-70 days. With the addition of top dressings, I think it would be very doable, but don't expect much in the way of yield.
 
Stank,

Seeing those results with a 2 gal are a good motivation for me to see if I can make that work with my space. I like to go two plants deep and so am limited to 9-10" diameter pots, but I see that 2 gal cloth pots are about that size. And the cloth pots are supposed to promote much better root structure.

Maybe there's hope for me yet.
 
Azimuth said:
Stank,

Seeing those results with a 2 gal are a good motivation for me to see if I can make that work with my space. I like to go two plants deep and so am limited to 9-10" diameter pots, but I see that 2 gal cloth pots are about that size. And the cloth pots are supposed to promote much better root structure.

Maybe there's hope for me yet.
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It can be done with the right soil, I can attest to it. Don't believe the doubters.
 
No, I make my own organic super soil and tinker with various different ratios for different strains. Landrace strains are generally light feeders so they get a lightly amended, or even un-amended used soil.

As I find keeper strains I start tinkering with the soil mixtures for those after I've run them two or three times. Once you get a feel for it you can start making your adjustment pretty easily.
 
I may give it a whirl in a 1 gallon, just to see if I can do it in my base soil. I can keep clones in solo cups for up to 45 days with no additions. I'm sitting here looking at a clone that might be perfect to Try with.
 
The problem I have with small containers and coots mix is the roots fill the container completely pretty quickly and watering becomes the issue.

In 3 gal pots at the end of a 5 week veg I'm watering 2x a day and the water just runs right thru to the catch tray then the plant drinks that back up in short order.

With root bound plants they start suffering unless I top dress with compost etc.

I have ample room so the issue for me is working at up canning. I should be just putting seedlings into final containers. I have a limited supply of final container that's my story and I'm sticking to it.

Here's a few pics of some landrace Transkei from Pondoland. Finally started flowering. Took about 4 weeks.

These are some very pretty plants.

Gotta male that is totally killer a beast takes up a whole 4x4 tent and I cut him down to 1/2 his size so I could move him out of the flower room. Sorry girls. Hes about to pop his sacks. He's got a very very strong smell. Looks like he could withstand some big ass wind too. I'll get pics of him up here shortly.

Transkei

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Transkei is over head high and just started flowering. I'll be a supercrop master after this grow. I'm collecting pollen for Future and do some seed making. Should be fun.
 
I found a Gelato I had just up potted from a solo cup to a 1 gallon pot back on the 26th of Jan.....I just flipped her today to give it a shot. That was my sentiment on the container size Bob, constant watering. I know I won't be a fan of that at all.....thankfully its the winter time and my temps are in the mid 50s in my basement so they won't be drinking at full speed thankfully. I probably wouldn't try it in the summer time with my basement temps 25 degrees warmer.

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Nice setup stank. Yeah I cant be watering like that, I'll forget an be like hermie city. Been there.

Edit: segue alert.

Here's some male balls. This plant I topped cut back half the plant easy supercropped and burned several tops in the lamps. Complete torture. He still chugging along and looking healthy af too. Ball sac opening in..... in gonna say 2 more days.
Anyone have advice on collecting and storing pollen??
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bobrown14 said:
The problem I have with small containers and coots mix is the roots fill the container completely pretty quickly and watering becomes the issue.
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Yeah, that hasn't been my experience :confused:.

Haven't got the watering thing down yet to get the root filled containers. Probably overwatering. I get roots, and they get to the bottom and circle around, but nothing remotely close to root bound.
 
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