Grant1153
New Member
My apologies I misread and thought you said 1/2 oz was used, as you can see the oils have already gotten to me
Cannabis Oil Users Cafe & Lounge
My apologies I misread and thought you said 1/2 oz was used, as you can see the oils have already gotten to me
Good to hear. Now we have some working idea of what to expect from sugar leaves. It'll be nice to be able to have some tested some day to compare the quality of the oils.
Shawnee, just because I'm interested, what would the cost difference be between 8 oz of sugar leaves and an ounce of bud?
Great idea Sue!
....If i had access to a Lab that would test the difference between Shake oil and Bud oil i would be there tomorrow..I think this is a very necessary process to get resolved. Any Volunteers? Is there anything you can get online or anywhere else for that matter that will test accurately.?
....If i had access to a Lab that would test the difference between Shake oil and Bud oil i would be there tomorrow..I think this is a very necessary process to get resolved. Any Volunteers? Is there anything you can get online or anywhere else for that matter that will test accurately.?This is where it gets dicey, Sue.....a gram of CCO from the dispensary goes for $80. 3 grams goes for $180, which brings it down to $60 a gram....I need to find out how many grams a cancer patient would tack in a month....anyone....?
Since this was my neighbor, I practically gave away the 8 oz. of sugar leaves....but I am also such a softy; I can't afford to bankrupt myself in the process....my desire to want to help others cannot pay my mortgage at the end of the day....
A cancer patient is coming over tomorrow and I'm going to help her fill out the paperwork to get her legal card....I cannot be her caregiver because my dance card is already full....the seriousness of her brain tumors threatens to stress me out to the max, so I may direct her to the dispensary and just advise her from the sidelines....I won't have an opening for another patient until September....
This doesn't answer your question, Sue; you can PM me if you want me to be more specific.....
To note, also, the CCO in the dispensary is tested and they will only accept oil made from the Everclear alcohol, which is only available in Indiana....I live in Michigan.....my neighbor used a product called Swan Isoprophyl for $25 a bottle....Rick Simpson uses this OR some other product, which can be purchased at Menard's on the cheap, but sounds fishy to me....as you can tell, I am in over my head here and just don't have enough information....I think I need to talk to Cannafan......
I am facing a moral dilemma here, as to what my responsibility as a caregiver/grower means to my patients....I consider myself a grower, and am in competition with me, myself, and I to turn out the highest quality organic cannabis on the planet....but where does my responsibility end....I have some patients who fiercely advocate for themselves and make gel caps, pain crème, tinctures, lip balm, etc....others are too busy socially to take the time......so where does that leave me, if they won't advocate for their own health.....I struggle with this all the time.....thoughts anyone.....?
Shawnee, this is a serious concern of mine. Not for me personally, because I dealt with this head-on myself in the beginning, when I was only confronted with less life-threatening conditions. The reality of how easily this could turn from joy to stress was glaringly obvious.
Some suggestions:
You're a caregiver, by calling and by nature. Your first patient, and the one that matters most, is you. Cajun just learned that the most dangerous way he could have chosen. You don't need oil to fend off your own cancer, but I'd bet my life you have a compromised ECS like the patients you serve, just not so compromised that you've developed something as serious as out-of-whack tumor cells that you now have to battle back to oblivion.
Thank God we work with cannabis.
Yes, it frustrates me on occassion, but I'm dealing with it wonderfully. Much better than I thought. Lol!
Recommendation number one: Before you let yourself climb out of bed every morning I want you to give a war whoop and yell out your joyful intention to play with the universe this glorious day. You work with cosmic alchemy. Is there any greater calling? Revel in it girl. Every day, every moment. Ramp that power you carry up like the mighty shield it is. The clarity you need for the job ahead on your path will follow.
Recommendation number 2: Start tacking, if you aren't already. Your system could use the additional cannabinoids, at least for now, or you wouldn't be questioning yourself. This is my theory, but someday they'll prove it. So, consider a small tack a couple times a day to bolster your ECS. The new thread has some other ideas.
As to the sugar leaf indulgence, your instincts will guide you. My first thought was that you managed to find out how much oil one could extract from your sugar leaves without having to go through all that effort yourself, and got paid for it. Lol! Allow yourself an occasional research grant, so to speak.
You do have that mortgage, but you can think of yourself as a money magnet and you'll find yourself avoiding shortages ever, as in they never occur. 
That's worked for me for a couple decades now. Not rolling in cash, but haven't come up short in decades. Somethings working there.
I'm taking part of my vacation in paradise to have this conversation with another cultivator in your same mindset. He started as a hobby, and then took on a friend with cancer. The stress of keeping up with his friend's needs has created stress where once there was only joy. Part of my mission is to help him work through this dilemma. Having his friend beat one of the two cancers has bolstered him, but now production has to ramp up to go after the more aggressive lung cancer.
We're not trained for any part of this job, really, and this is the trickiest part. panacea has shared with us the poignant frustration of helping those who won't help themselves beyond taking the capsules. It becomes a personal ethical choice. If you feel it's enabling then you need to find a way not to feel like that. That may mean direct them to someone who's not so ethically thin-skinned.
You have the right to evolve your business to take on only those patients willing to be an active member of the team. Even the sickest patients have dedicated personal aides. It obviously means something to you that your efforts to grow are met with more involvement on the patient end. There're good reasons for that. These plants take a certain dedication and expense to grow. We understand the potential of what we work with. It feels wasteful to do less than you can, to take a pedestrian view of your healthcare.
Truth be told, it's the patients who accept that lifestyle changes are demanded to overcome a cancer overload and get the body to swing back to homeostasis that succeed in the end. Those are the team members you were hoping to find. You've come face-to-face with the human frailty of the ego. Not everyone will care the way you do.
Do you have an initial trial period? This is the natural point to realign either your patient to another caregiver or your attitude to one that isn't swayed by what others are doing or thinking. The deliberate waking will eliminate any judgemental tendencies, which may solve this dilemma for you altogether. Just because the universe brought them to you doesn't mean you have to keep them all.
A couple booklets to hand out to inquiring patients might be a nice touch. Something they can take with them while you each think about how that interview went and whether you'll be moving forward together? Possibly something that gives them some info on supporting the ECS without cannabis. I'm visual, for all the words. Lol! I could help with that part.
You know I adore you? I'm so fascinated by your career choice. I give this much thought, because of you, and because I've felt your influence guiding me in this direction from the beginning. It intrigues me to find us having this conversation at this time. I found my perch. Made that decision just this morning, and part of it includes the possibility of starting small as a caregiver myself, in a legal state.
Hmmmm...... That path appears to be lighting up.
Some suggestions:
You're a caregiver, by calling and by nature. Your first patient, and the one that matters most, is you. Cajun just learned that the most dangerous way he could have chosen. You don't need oil to fend off your own cancer, but I'd bet my life you have a compromised ECS like the patients you serve, just not so compromised that you've developed something as serious as out-of-whack tumor cells that you now have to battle back to oblivion.
Thank God we work with cannabis.
Yes, it frustrates me on occassion, but I'm dealing with it wonderfully. Much better than I thought. Lol! Recommendation number one: Before you let yourself climb out of bed every morning I want you to give a war whoop and yell out your joyful intention to play with the universe this glorious day. You work with cosmic alchemy. Is there any greater calling? Revel in it girl. Every day, every moment. Ramp that power you carry up like the mighty shield it is. The clarity you need for the job ahead on your path will follow.
Recommendation number 2: Start tacking, if you aren't already. Your system could use the additional cannabinoids, at least for now, or you wouldn't be questioning yourself. This is my theory, but someday they'll prove it. So, consider a small tack a couple times a day to bolster your ECS. The new thread has some other ideas.
As to the sugar leaf indulgence, your instincts will guide you. My first thought was that you managed to find out how much oil one could extract from your sugar leaves without having to go through all that effort yourself, and got paid for it. Lol! Allow yourself an occasional research grant, so to speak.
You do have that mortgage, but you can think of yourself as a money magnet and you'll find yourself avoiding shortages ever, as in they never occur. That's worked for me for a couple decades now. Not rolling in cash, but haven't come up short in decades. Somethings working there.
I'm taking part of my vacation in paradise to have this conversation with another cultivator in your same mindset. He started as a hobby, and then took on a friend with cancer. The stress of keeping up with his friend's needs has created stress where once there was only joy. Part of my mission is to help him work through this dilemma. Having his friend beat one of the two cancers has bolstered him, but now production has to ramp up to go after the more aggressive lung cancer.
We're not trained for any part of this job, really, and this is the trickiest part. panacea has shared with us the poignant frustration of helping those who won't help themselves beyond taking the capsules. It becomes a personal ethical choice. If you feel it's enabling then you need to find a way not to feel like that. That may mean direct them to someone who's not so ethically thin-skinned.
You have the right to evolve your business to take on only those patients willing to be an active member of the team. Even the sickest patients have dedicated personal aides. It obviously means something to you that your efforts to grow are met with more involvement on the patient end. There're good reasons for that. These plants take a certain dedication and expense to grow. We understand the potential of what we work with. It feels wasteful to do less than you can, to take a pedestrian view of your healthcare.
Truth be told, it's the patients who accept that lifestyle changes are demanded to overcome a cancer overload and get the body to swing back to homeostasis that succeed in the end. Those are the team members you were hoping to find. You've come face-to-face with the human frailty of the ego. Not everyone will care the way you do.
Do you have an initial trial period? This is the natural point to realign either your patient to another caregiver or your attitude to one that isn't swayed by what others are doing or thinking. The deliberate waking will eliminate any judgemental tendencies, which may solve this dilemma for you altogether. Just because the universe brought them to you doesn't mean you have to keep them all.
A couple booklets to hand out to inquiring patients might be a nice touch. Something they can take with them while you each think about how that interview went and whether you'll be moving forward together? Possibly something that gives them some info on supporting the ECS without cannabis. I'm visual, for all the words. Lol! I could help with that part.
You know I adore you? I'm so fascinated by your career choice. I give this much thought, because of you, and because I've felt your influence guiding me in this direction from the beginning. It intrigues me to find us having this conversation at this time. I found my perch. Made that decision just this morning, and part of it includes the possibility of starting small as a caregiver myself, in a legal state.
Hmmmm...... That path appears to be lighting up.
Thanks for your thoughtful observations and insights into my moral struggle....I am over the moon joyful to be able to do what I do and my passion is deep and wide....what I definitely never dreamed or thought about was "what if I develop a reputation" and people start beating down my door....now, Sue, I don't have an ego, believe me quite the opposite, but I have to work at not letting this overwhelm me....I am very low key, even tempered, and no drama....but, people talk and if something is good, word gets around....I consider myself a grower, as I said, who toils alone downstairs....a very solitary existence, so I wasn't realizing how I stack up to others....how could I....I only have the 420 journals to look at....heck, I don't even journal myself....I don't really have much to say....
I'm taking your words to heart....I need to tack and smoke more....hell, I'm swimming in cannabis but rarely indulge since I'm so busy with all my plants and taking care of my farm...Great advice. I love your idea of those sugar leaves being part of my research grant....Too funny.
Also, I think I should vet potential patients more closely and question how big an advocate they plan on being for themselves....by the time these people get to me they are pretty desperate and it makes my heart hurt....also, it takes 4-6 weeks to get the medical card from the state and it involves $$, so people don't change caregivers at the drop of a hat. I don't know any growers either, or at least, any growers who aren't dirty as in filthy bug infested grow rooms....I realize every grower gets infested at some point, but I happen to be pretty darn sanitary.
Yes, I need to take a deep breath and get over myself....I can really take this seriously can't I.....
I'm taking your words to heart....I need to tack and smoke more....hell, I'm swimming in cannabis but rarely indulge since I'm so busy with all my plants and taking care of my farm...Great advice. I love your idea of those sugar leaves being part of my research grant....Too funny.
Also, I think I should vet potential patients more closely and question how big an advocate they plan on being for themselves....by the time these people get to me they are pretty desperate and it makes my heart hurt....also, it takes 4-6 weeks to get the medical card from the state and it involves $$, so people don't change caregivers at the drop of a hat. I don't know any growers either, or at least, any growers who aren't dirty as in filthy bug infested grow rooms....I realize every grower gets infested at some point, but I happen to be pretty darn sanitary.
Yes, I need to take a deep breath and get over myself....I can really take this seriously can't I.....
Great idea Sue!
Panacea,
In my legal state, if you want to take your overages to a dispensary to receive "contributions" (stupid legal language), it is mandatory that it is tested before it can appear on the shelves....another crappy law is that I can only leave 2.5 ounces per trip and am not paid anything until it sells, usually one gram at a time...forget that! I have a wholesaler that takes my entire grow after harvest and 1 week cure and it's all cash....I like to move it out of the house as fast as possible.
Back to the testing and labs....they are everywhere....many dispensaries and compassion clubs (a safe place for patients and caregivers to exchange meds) are purchasing their own testing equipment and getting their own people certified....a large investment, yet another source of income for them.....most are aligning themselves to be compliant and ready when my state goes legal for all. In the last 3 years I've experienced pricing come down from $70-80 to $40 for testing for pests, mold, mildew, THC and CBD %. Not that the dispensary will reveal that necessarily and you still don't know if they wash their buds or use synthetic nutrients.
My sugar leaves are coated and loaded with trichomes....in fact, that is what I give my patients a portion of, gratis, per month....the buds go to the wholesaler/retail buyers for eye appeal....I don't even smoke any buds (profits) and get to bypass all the testing.....IMO, there is absolutely no difference between sugar leaves and buds....I can't wait for my neighbor to give me feedback on the oil he made last night....
I am an organic high brix grower, so I feel that I am doing all that I can to grow healthy turgid plants to bring out the best of each strain.
Have a great day!
Shawnee, it sounds like some early vetting practices are a direction to start. Your reputation wil keep you stable in a volitile market. That peace of mind is priceless. I felt Doc smile at the sugar leaf revelation. I consider the sugar leaves the cream of the crop. For some reason marketers see them as less appealing. I find them beautiful, and as a home grower I leave them all on.
Sue, I had to get some hay for the horses today....all that physical work allowed my mind to concentrate on your advice to me this morning...and Shawnee had an 'aha' moment...the cancer patient is coming over tomorrow with her husband and her brother....I have assembled a show-and-tell table to explain what cannabis is all about...a trichome slideshow from the eye candy thread to show her where the goodness lies, seed examples, a seed under the towel with a developed tap root example, a mason jar of sugar leaves, some pain cream, dry gel caps, tincture, and tea bags made by my patient #1....
Next, I'll bring out my extra magic butter machine that is for sale and discuss the recipes for making tincture and CCO with it and show her my hotplate for boiling the CCO down since I have a propane stove.
Next I will discuss her options:
Buy CCO from the dispensary at $80 a gram, or $60 for 3 grams....Cajun says 1 gram per day is the dose she should take/build up to....that would come to $1800 per month. Yikes!
OR
Purchase some sugar leaves from me and start making tincture....2 cups can be made from 1 oz....not bad
THEN become my patient in Sept when I will have an opening and she will be gifted 1/2 oz gratis per month (that will help a little)
OR
Become a grower herself!
Lastly, I wrote down your Study Hall site and Canna's Oiler Café site to reference.
Short and sweet.
Either way, she will be making her own product. Did I miss anything?
Thank you for being an inspiration and helping me problem solve. My passion is intact! Best of all, the stress is gone, thank God!
I am honored to provide all the help and guidance she and her family need for her to make an informed decision that will best meet her circumstance.
Next, I'll bring out my extra magic butter machine that is for sale and discuss the recipes for making tincture and CCO with it and show her my hotplate for boiling the CCO down since I have a propane stove.
Next I will discuss her options:
Buy CCO from the dispensary at $80 a gram, or $60 for 3 grams....Cajun says 1 gram per day is the dose she should take/build up to....that would come to $1800 per month. Yikes!
OR
Purchase some sugar leaves from me and start making tincture....2 cups can be made from 1 oz....not bad
THEN become my patient in Sept when I will have an opening and she will be gifted 1/2 oz gratis per month (that will help a little)
OR
Become a grower herself!
Lastly, I wrote down your Study Hall site and Canna's Oiler Café site to reference.
Short and sweet.
Either way, she will be making her own product. Did I miss anything?
Thank you for being an inspiration and helping me problem solve. My passion is intact! Best of all, the stress is gone, thank God!
I am honored to provide all the help and guidance she and her family need for her to make an informed decision that will best meet her circumstance.
KingstonRabbi
Well-Known Member
Nice marketing along with informed consent. Whichever option she chooses she's involved in decisions. Too bad you can't get pure grain alcohol. This is much better than using solvent you're not comfortable using.
KingstonRabbi
Well-Known Member
Yes, it's illegal to transport across state lines. A) it's still contraband in your state, and b) your state wants its taxes on the liquor (the real issue!). And c) technically it gets the Feds involved in your business. But who's gonna know? If it's for the greater good...
BTW, do you know what solvents commercial producers use? If you want to be completely legal you might be able to get a permit for the stuff.
BTW, do you know what solvents commercial producers use? If you want to be completely legal you might be able to get a permit for the stuff.
Excellent plan Shawnee. I knew I had a good chance to wake up the marketing genius.
I'd like to suggest a link to the thread on supporting the ECS without cannabis. These are things they need to incorporate anyway, so a little heads up and some encouragement to support the ECS with happier, less tension-ridden thoughts can go a long way, especially when offered with your special brand of compassion. The loving guidance of a compassionate caregiver turns out to be more important in many cases than the medication being administered. Provocative thoughts.
Shawnee your story is so similar to my own , thou your are treating more patients( i live in a province where it is illegal). I also have been giving many people my oil from sugar trim and also the bud oil, many have assured me the sugar trim oil is just as strong if not stronger at times. But for my own peace of mind i only give any cancer patients my Bud oil until i can get definite proof they are the same medicinally. As far as treating patients and how far you can go without putting yourself in debt (financially & emotionally), Do not let the moral dilemma get you down. I have treated a lady now who had lung cancer and COPD( both cured) since October of 2015 , she still to this day wants my oil and claims she will never stop taking it, problem being is that i was giving her the oil for nothing while she was treating her cancer and copd. I mentioned to her about maintenance doses, but her so called maintenance doses are still 5-10 grams a month.I have given this lady well over 150 grams of oil for practically 0$, WHERE DOES IT STOP!?....I will tell you where it stops...This lady still smokes 2 packs of cigarettes a day( if she don't care i won't either), her son told me he was going to grow plants last year and get me to make the oil(he brought me a sandwich bag of the shittiest looking weed i have seen) not even a ounce! I finally told him i will need some money if she plans on taking the oil for life, Someone who really needs this should be getting this for nothing......And guess what? i never lost a minutes sleep after i mention it to him, but before that, I also was struggling with the moral dilemma and could not sleep. Bottom line , people got to help themselves also, never have a guilty conscious for whatever decision you make, you obviously are a tremendous compassionate person...So it is time to realize that. You can only do so much. STAY GOLD
Now my moral dilemma is living in a illegal province and watching many people around my County being diagnosed with cancer and unfortunately passing away from it. I feel so compelled to help many of these strangers knowing the CCO protocol that all of you have put together could potentially save a life. Very frustrating when you are to paranoid to draw unwanted attention to your purpose in fear of prosecution. But it also sucks when you feel a little guilty that you did not bring the "CCO protocol" to someones attention after they have passed on, always thinking what if i knocked on the door and brought it to they're attention? would they of been sitting around the Christmas tree with the family this past holiday enjoying some drinks & laughs?...It can be very unsettling at times... Did not think being so compassionate can have it's consequences. /l\
- Thread starter
- #2,999
CCOiler
Well-Known Member
Hi Shawnee, here's a link to a sponsor Welcome to Extractohol - Extracts it All! Not sure if they will send to your State or not.
Oh, Kingston, thank you for doing the research for me....I didn't know....I'm so busy researching my patients and keeping up with my state medical laws that it drives me crazy...there are no commercial growers in my state since we are like the wild west and only medical....which suits me just fine....so all of us are on are own and left to our own devices....therefore my struggles as to where my job begins and ends as a medical caregiver is very grey and fuzzy....thank you all of you for helping me keep my priorities straight and my eye on the ball....
