WheelOFortune's - first turn

WheeloFortune said:
inferno,

it depends on how you get your females, and how stable the strain is in the first place.

feminized seeds are all the rage these days, and a lot of european breeders offer nothing but feminized seeds anymore. for instance the strawberry cough that i grow is from dutch passion, and were feminized when i bought them (3 years ago now.) i think dutch passion might only sell feminized seeds now too.


they definately produce ass well as no fem seeds and will not hermie, if you either (a) get them from a reliable seed bank or (b) feminize them yourself THE RIGHT WAY.

(1) light poisoning
i have made feminized seeds before using the light poisoning method. this is the most popular method, the easiest, the cheapest, and the worst. . . just turn on the lights for a while in the middle of the night cycle.

when i did it i would go to 12/12 for one week.
the second week of flower i would turn on my lights for an hour dirctly in the middle of the dark cycle. so 12 on, 5 1/2 off, 1 on, 5 1/2 off, and repeat.
then go back to 12/12.

this would reliably produce male sacs from female plants. the problem is that the sacs would grow right inside of the flowers or just above them, and then just make seeds in that flower. . . not spread the pollen all over (maybe a bit on the branches directly under a sac too). this means that all of my plants were only being inbred with them selves (if all of your plants are clones from the same mom, you have this inbreeding problem too)

after light poisoning, and inbreeding, these seed tend to produce more hermies and semi-hermies. all of my light poisond seeds are semi-hermies where the top colas are seedless and all the bottom branches are full of seeds. but those seeds are all semi-hermies or hermies too.

not good if you want reliable sensi.

(2) Gibrillic acid
dangerous to your health. very toxic. i stay away.

(3) STS (silver thiosulfate solution.)
there are two easy to get cheap chemicals available at any photography store called silver nitrate and sodium thiosulfate. you mix a small amount in a specific order to make STS solution. if there is interest i could post instructions to make it. but for now lets just say 20 bucks worth will make 200 1 liter bottles, and each 1 liter bottle will treat 15-20 plants. (and you only treat one or two per cycle)

all you do is take your target female, and spray it down with STS with a spray bottle, until it is drenched and running off the leaves. (if you have autoflowers you do this at the end of the third week) if you have clones, then you just put them in 12/12 the next day.

for about 4 weeks you will get yellowing of leaves and little to no growth. after that you will get PROFUSE male sac. not just a few little balls, but full male tops.

this is usually done 3-4 weeks before your other females are ready to be pollinated. this way you have time to harvest the pollen before you need it for the other ladies.

obviously keep the she-male in a seperate area if you dont wont millions of seeds. then use a paint brush to polinate a few buds for a few seeds.

im gonna want alot of seeds, so il prob grow the male in my clone box, then when the pollen starts to be released, ill just take 4-5 of each plant that i want pollinated (cross bred) and move it into the clone box with the she-male for a few days. . . prob shake she-male over top of them too.

then they'll go back into wheel with the rest of the non-pollinated girls.
there is no inbreeding (unless all clones have same mom, and even then its not as bad as light poison)
all of the seeds are pure female with no more chance of hermie than the original seed. maybe less if its a good cross breed.

also a second application can be made 2 weeks after the first for more profuse male flowers, a temp around 80, and a bloom nute high in phosphorous when male flowers are forming give best results.

wow, long post, did i forget anything?
Click to expand...

Thanks Wheel some good info there.;)

+rep

Pan4
 
correction btw, i fixed it in my post.

after spraying STS, yellowing and no growth for 2 weeks not 4.

thanks for the +rep pan,
 
so with your 3rd way which sounds the best because i dont want herms you use the hermi that u mades pollen and put it on all the plants that u want seed and just trash the hermi after u get all the pollen ect

so all the plants u hook up with the hermi will be fem? fem seeds what kinda ratio do you get with them seeds? 100% fems? or 80% do you get any herms or maels at all?

you might want to use more then one male plant turning it into a hermi ect just incase to be safe
 
inferno, yup, you understand it right.


all pot strains have the ability to hermie, its in their entire gene pool as a safty net to an environmental disaster.

a female plant lacks certain male genes, kinda like women lacking a y chromosome.
when you force it to turn male, it still doesnt have these genes. that is why when you use that induced male to cross with another female, there are still no male genes to put into a seed. (two women have a baby and there is still no y chromosome)

so all the seeds - 100% - female. if your male induced plant was not going to hermie in the frist place, you seeds will prob not hermie either, unless you cross it with itslelf a few times (clones from the same mom).

p.s., i might have caled it a hermie before but the male induced plant is not really a hermephrodite. if you STS it good, and maybe hit it with a second dose, you shouldn't really get any female flowers on it. its a full on sex change, not a mix of male and female.
 
I've read that that other method of inducing male flowers on female plants can also induce female flowers on male plants. So... After you changed it to a male for feminized(sic) pollen, could you change it back?

The plant would be so confused lol.

I believe I read one of the seed banks/breeders/whatever stated that they used various forms of stress - including some light-stressing although I don't remember how extreme - and the female plants that didn't go hermie were the best candidates for sex-reversal in making feminized seed as they felt that if such plants had had any "hermie traits," they would have evidenced them during the stresses.

It made sense to me at the time.
 
i dont know about the changing them back thing, lol, but i doubt it because you have to spray them at a specific time in their life (right before flower)

yeah its true that trying to stress the plant will show you which females will resist hermie and therefore has the strongest genetic resistance to it, but thats the same as trying to breed any other trait, like thc% for instance. you just selectively choose that traits that are important to you as you cross.

this won't really effect me at all because first off, im using reliable feminized seed to start from, so this is coming from experienced breeders and should have a decent resistance to hermie. secondly, i am going to be crossing strains, so my seeds will be F1 hybrids and should show hybrid vigor. and 3rdly, i have read that autoflowers rarely hermie because they are most typically propagated through normal sex. i guess this strengthens the differences between male and female somehow.

but yeah, to start fresh, doing the stress thing to find the best females is a good idea. . . but it will only work with normal plants because you need flower it to find a good one, and then use a clone from the same mother.

and obviously, light poisoning will not stress a plant that isn't light cycle dependant.
 
so. . . sometimes when i remember, i've been pulling my lr2's and throwing them in the fridge for a bit of extra light at night. then i throw htem beck in in the morning.

2009-04-15-204245.jpg


thay very in size widely. the big one is the oldest at 22 days. the youngest ones are only 2 weeks old.

2009-04-15-204256.jpg


i think i stunted the smaller ones by giving them full flower nutes, but if they're in the wheel when it waters, thats what they get.

you can see the double size rooting cube in the big one here

2009-04-15-204313.jpg
 
close up (lol, the quality still sucks) of the big girl.

2009-04-15-204551.jpg


2009-04-15-204546.jpg


2009-04-15-204533.jpg
 
here is what the double root media looks like on the big lr2. i want to see if this makes a big difference in speed, or yield, or anything really.

i would do them all this way if it made a noticeable difference.

2009-04-15-204608.jpg


2009-04-15-204748.jpg
 
my camera sucks, and its attached to the monitor of my other laptop, so i have to hold the laptop on the right angle n shit. . . im not a bad photographer. . . aiming a laptop isn't as easy as you'd think. lol.
 
especially holding the laptop in one hand, the plant in the other, then push the mouse button on below the keyboard, without shaking.
 
no your doin great with the pics have you noticed any diff with the double rooting?

Thanks for that info about the seeds since so far my plains are going to be doin the same thing your doin just on a bigger rotor well i hope anyways i hope u will share how to exactly do the mix and do u think wally would have that in the photo place?

The light stress wont work for auto flowering will it :(

So how many fem plants have u decided to harvest for seeds
 
inferno420 said:
no your doin great with the pics have you noticed any diff with the double rooting?

Thanks for that info about the seeds since so far my plains are going to be doin the same thing your doin just on a bigger rotor well i hope anyways i hope u will share how to exactly do the mix and do u think wally would have that in the photo place?

The light stress wont work for auto flowering will it :(

So how many fem plants have u decided to harvest for seeds
Click to expand...


i havent noticed a diff yet. . .

sorry, but ill believe it when i see it, a homebuilt rotational, so far myth and heresay, urban legand lol. never seen a working one, with pot in it. . . yet. would love to though. and they (insert company name here) dont make any that are significantly bigger (more than a couple inches) that i know of. i wish someone did!

you can get the two chemicals at a real photograpy store with cameras and developing chemicals not walmart. i dont see why you couldn't order them on the internet for cheap, but i live in a city. plenty of camera stores. i will post instructions later.

nope wont work.

i think 4 or 5 of each, and all the lowryder females if i have 3 or less, if i have 4, ill not seed the second biggest female.
 
weirdest F'n thing,

when I put my lowryders back in the wheel this mornong, the second biggest one, who just showed fem, just like broke in half (at the bottom). i barely put any pressure on it, i didnt wack it or bend it or anythig, like the whole plant just fell off 1/2 inch above the rock wool.
a tiny bit of the skin was holding on but there was no way she was surviving...

weird.
rip 2nd biggest.
 
she was a weirdo any ways,

after she sprouted her leaves were missing the side to side viens, the fan leaves were flat and smooth with only major arteries.

i was hoping that she would be a freak of nature and grow big god buds the size of my. . . wheel.
 
no maxx,

why have you?

I wish I knew how, it would be a powerful tool, unfortunately i never took molecular biology in college. maybe i should go back and take a class lol, it would help with breeding for sure. i might have done something similar, i took basic biology in school and we measured respiration and stuff. I know we cultured some plant leaf in a liquid in a petre dish, but i forgot what we did with it. lol.
 
i would also like to take a class in recombinant DNA. and have some real power at my disposal. equipment is getting cheaper and cheaper.
 
then im gonna make a weeping willow tree that grows big donkey colas the size of bannanas, 50% thc. perennial.
 
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