Weffalo's West Coast O.G. First Time Grow: Indoor, Soil, SIP, Auto

And then here's a pic of the little ladies today, 24 hours after the saucer was dry I have refilled it:

I promise I'll get better at having the leaves in focus lol:
11125.jpg
11126.jpg
11124.jpg
 
From a fellow newbie and tech minded person its mega frustrating when its not working "it should be so simple" - yeah not so much!

I'm aiming for 3 electric sensors of different brands and have an old fashioned mercury type thermometer on order becasue I don't really trust any of them. its about 29c's here in my study area with just a ceiling fan and the tent is cooler to the skin when I walk in yet one sensor is reporting 38c's :rolleyes: RH all seems consistent at ~45% though (these are in flower)

DeeBeeBee
Yeah you definitely want an accurate number and I agree one sensor just offers no piece of mind lol. The controller 69 is meant to be really good so I'd hope that's accurate but I can compare it to my wifi temp/hygro and make sure :)

If only one sensor is reporting 38c then it's probably ballocks, my light causes my tent to be about 5-6c hotter than the room/area but I'm only running one 4" extraction and one 6" clip on fan.

Definitely agree with the frustration part but I realise this is as much an art as a science and I've never been much of an artist, lots to learn :D
 
No mate it's soft water where I am but good guess :D I added thrive and dnynomyco to the soil so I imagine it's something to do with one of those, it's probably normal but when you see some jelly-looking stuff in the water it makes sense to double check lol
 
No mate it's soft water where I am but good guess :D I added thrive and dnynomyco to the soil so I imagine it's something to do with one of those, it's probably normal but when you see some jelly-looking stuff in the water it makes sense to double check lol
My ice machine here always gets bunged up with a similar white gel as that when the water filter is getting old, its gross. but same as you soft water. apparently harmless to humans (breaks my ice machine, though) but plants no idea!
 
Looking good from here Weffalo! (cool screen name. Just thought I'd take it for a spin back there:high-five: )
Definitely agree with the frustration part but I realise this is as much an art as a science and I've never been much of an artist, lots to learn :D
Ha, look who learned to quote!

Weffalo now just makes me think of "Buffalo Soldier - Bob Marley" so having a willing daughter I thought I'd get this done for you for a bit of good luck for your grow! My handwriting and design, the sketch is my daughter's. A bit of art to go with the science.

 
Ha, look who learned to quote!

Weffalo now just makes me think of "Buffalo Soldier - Bob Marley" so having a willing daughter I thought I'd get this done for you for a bit of good luck for your grow! My handwrriting and design, the sketch is my daughter's. A bit of art to go with the science.

That's the best thing ever.
 
I agree with this ^^.

I use the back of a small fork that I press lightly on the crust to break it up while it's wet which helps air penetration into that top layer.
Ok I'll give it a misting then try this when the soil isn't as bone dry thanks as always mate!

@DeeBeeBee Lol!! I love that song and I love this!! I'll definitely print that out for my tent when I can. Some good vibes for my ladies, you legend! Your daughter definitely doesn't seem to suffer from a lack of artistic talent, nice one it made me smile!!

Got some work to do today, need to switch out the extraction fan and filter with the Controller 69/6inch fan combo and set that bad boy up, I will now have two different monitors where I can track temp and humidity via graph so I should always be able to maintain the correct environment and double check accuracy. I'm switching my heater to a much smaller oil rad that I can fit in the tent and I'm finally gonna get around to setting the webcam up for monitoring, then it's time for a big spliff and relax... or maybe it's big spliff time now <3
 
Ok I'll give it a misting then try this when the soil isn't as bone dry thanks as always mate!

@DeeBeeBee Lol!! I love that song and I love this!! I'll definitely print that out for my tent when I can. Some good vibes for my ladies, you legend! Your daughter definitely doesn't seem to suffer from a lack of artistic talent, nice one it made me smile!!

Got some work to do today, need to switch out the extraction fan and filter with the Controller 69/6inch fan combo and set that bad boy up, I will now have two different monitors where I can track temp and humidity via graph so I should always be able to maintain the correct environment and double check accuracy. I'm switching my heater to a much smaller oil rad that I can fit in the tent and I'm finally gonna get around to setting the webcam up for monitoring, then it's time for a big spliff and relax... or maybe it's big spliff time now <3
Enjoy your friday night mate!
 
For real, this is not the time in its life that your plant needs a strident, doctrinal support-human! One day, but not now. Don't let the top go dry, dry- anymore. Once she's been transplanted into the bucket, (a little while) and showing comfort, then there's time and energy reserves, and you can get medieval on her ass then, not now. Remember also, that transplanting into a Grobucket that's been properly pre-moistened and prepared is important.

How I do it... not to 'Growbuckets' but to very similar SIPs, in fact, all SIPs, is the following steps in this order... (I'm not an authority, but neither can I point you to one, so I share this until I can) Fill an assembled but empty Grobucket (no water in reservoir) with already dampened* ( with light sprayed water and surfactant - last paragraph will detail more) grow matrix and pack lightly, then place an empty copy of your seedling pot in the place you wish to plant as a placeholder. Fill reservoir through fill tube and then allow 24hrs for SIP to absorb rez contents. In the meantime, if soil level drops as gravity compacts, fill with new premoistened soil*. Drop your seedling in the empty space along with whatever ritualistic majicks you feel appropriate at the time, then, tuck her in with a nice top watering (less than 2 litres/quarts aka a half gallon). Make sure there's some room in the rez before you top water this "last" time, much of it should have already been soaked up into the soil, so its not currently at capacity. It is probably best to keep rez level under 2/3-3/4 full for the first 2 weeks in order to avoid the small chance of system-over-wetness for the plant's given maturity level. This is purely precautionary, so time could be saved here in future after evidence for confidence is collected the first time around.

PS, it's not really the last time you will top water, the idea is that it is just the last time until a new state of growth has been reached in the near future, like 1-2 weeks on. My simple mind's chronically flawed yet dog-eared logic goes something like, "because I can recognize no change in a plant inside a time resolution of one week, it must take one week's worth of change, to make change." See, I told you, flawed. And yet dog-eared because thinking it has often stopped me from making multiple mistakes in quick succession. So while I know it not to be true I paradoxically believe in its power to help me grow better.

Let's pump the brakes here, however, and go back to not having transplanted yet. If you plant a too-small seedling into an overwet bucket it could set you back, or worse. Thankfully your SIP's design range suits the needs of the plant 99% of the time, and that stability allows for new efficiencies to develop. And yet because it is your first time, to innocently err out of an abundance of caution is your target result. Young plants don't do well with too much moisture, but big plants need it. Given the absence of a dry-wet "dial" on your SIP, the reservoir's state of fullness is almost the only trick up your sleeve and certainly the most effective one. Learn to use it to the best of your abilities. Meaning: Transplant into a well soaked-in planter, but one that has limited capability to make itself more so after transplant until you've stabilized the new houseguest and begun the growing trend well and for sure.

* When pre-moistening my promix (peat/perlite) I use water that has a tiny drop of dish soap to act as a surfactant, to actively reduce water's surface tension - allowing it faster, easier access into smaller spaces. Soilless mixes especially (coco or peat-based) have a chance of portions becoming hydrophobic, whereby it becomes easier for water to completely bypass large groups of particles rather than soak them. Permitting this leads to dry spots and, at best, impeded growth. Just use surfactant for pre-wetting, not for reservoir fills as the water surface tension plays an important role in the 'capillary action' and osmotic pressures crucial to making water seep upward against gravity. Surfactants do, however, make foliar sprays more effective, whether for fertilization, irrigation or pathogen control so use them there no probs, just not drip incessantly back down into soil. Some is fine, just watch for a lot of excess, a drip cloth would prevent. There are better (more easy to control/apply) surfactants than soap, brief research will point them out pretty quickly. Soap is to-hand, cheap, but requires only a tiny amount compared to normal soap uses. Be careful, suds are not desirable. Remember, only for initial dampening, and likely on recommended if you have a high peat content. Do not treat reservoir water with surfactants.
 
For real, this is not the time in its life that your plant needs a strident, doctrinal support-human! One day, but not now. Don't let the top go dry, dry- anymore. Once she's been transplanted into the bucket, (a little while) and showing comfort, then there's time and energy reserves, and you can get medieval on her ass then, not now. Remember also, that transplanting into a Grobucket that's been properly pre-moistened and prepared is important.

How I do it... not to 'Growbuckets' but to very similar SIPs, in fact, all SIPs, is the following steps in this order... (I'm not an authority, but neither can I point you to one, so I share this until I can) Fill an assembled but empty Grobucket (no water in reservoir) with already dampened* ( with light sprayed water and surfactant - last paragraph will detail more) grow matrix and pack lightly, then place an empty copy of your seedling pot in the place you wish to plant as a placeholder. Fill reservoir through fill tube and then allow 24hrs for SIP to absorb rez contents. In the meantime, if soil level drops as gravity compacts, fill with new premoistened soil*. Drop your seedling in the empty space along with whatever ritualistic majicks you feel appropriate at the time, then, tuck her in with a nice top watering (less than 2 litres/quarts aka a half gallon). Make sure there's some room in the rez before you top water this "last" time, much of it should have already been soaked up into the soil, so its not currently at capacity. It is probably best to keep rez level under 2/3-3/4 full for the first 2 weeks in order to avoid the small chance of system-over-wetness for the plant's given maturity level. This is purely precautionary, so time could be saved here in future after evidence for confidence is collected the first time around.

PS, it's not really the last time you will top water, the idea is that it is just the last time until a new state of growth has been reached in the near future, like 1-2 weeks on. My simple mind's chronically flawed yet dog-eared logic goes something like, "because I can recognize no change in a plant inside a time resolution of one week, it must take one week's worth of change, to make change." See, I told you, flawed. And yet dog-eared because thinking it has often stopped me from making multiple mistakes in quick succession. So while I know it not to be true I paradoxically believe in its power to help me grow better.

Let's pump the brakes here, however, and go back to not having transplanted yet. If you plant a too-small seedling into an overwet bucket it could set you back, or worse. Thankfully your SIP's design range suits the needs of the plant 99% of the time, and that stability allows for new efficiencies to develop. And yet because it is your first time, to innocently err out of an abundance of caution is your target result. Young plants don't do well with too much moisture, but big plants need it. Given the absence of a dry-wet "dial" on your SIP, the reservoir's state of fullness is almost the only trick up your sleeve and certainly the most effective one. Learn to use it to the best of your abilities. Meaning: Transplant into a well soaked-in planter, but one that has limited capability to make itself more so after transplant until you've stabilized the new houseguest and begun the growing trend well and for sure.

* When pre-moistening my promix (peat/perlite) I use water that has a tiny drop of dish soap to act as a surfactant, to actively reduce water's surface tension - allowing it faster, easier access into smaller spaces. Soilless mixes especially (coco or peat-based) have a chance of portions becoming hydrophobic, whereby it becomes easier for water to completely bypass large groups of particles rather than soak them. Permitting this leads to dry spots and, at best, impeded growth. Just use surfactant for pre-wetting, not for reservoir fills as the water surface tension plays an important role in the 'capillary action' and osmotic pressures crucial to making water seep upward against gravity. Surfactants do, however, make foliar sprays more effective, whether for fertilization, irrigation or pathogen control so use them there no probs, just not drip incessantly back down into soil. Some is fine, just watch for a lot of excess, a drip cloth would prevent. There are better (more easy to control/apply) surfactants than soap, brief research will point them out pretty quickly. Soap is to-hand, cheap, but requires only a tiny amount compared to normal soap uses. Be careful, suds are not desirable. Remember, only for initial dampening, and likely on recommended if you have a high peat content. Do not treat reservoir water with surfactants.
I'm just heading out, I wanted to post a pic of how the girls are looking today but you've left me a very thorough response that deserves my full attention. Thank you very much for your time and insight mate, as soon as I get home I will take the time to properly absorb your words and advice, it is appreciated a LOT <33

Regarding not letting the top dry out, I did a good misting and light watering of the top soil last night, as well as disturbing the very top layer so the part underneath could receive some moisture. Because it's been many many days since I gave the top water (over a week) I found the top very dry again this morning (but better than it was).
So this morning I gave the soil a light misting again in the hopes I can reduce the dryness without overwatering my babies, fingers crossed :)

Here are some pics from this morning but I will return this evening to read this reply again and fully take in all the advice on offer, thanks a lot @ReservoirDog !!!

11130.jpg
11131.jpg
11132.jpg

(Third plant seems to have drained it's saucer way quicker than the others, less than 24 hours this time)
 
For real, this is not the time in its life that your plant needs a strident, doctrinal support-human! One day, but not now. Don't let the top go dry, dry- anymore. Once she's been transplanted into the bucket, (a little while) and showing comfort, then there's time and energy reserves, and you can get medieval on her ass then, not now. Remember also, that transplanting into a Grobucket that's been properly pre-moistened and prepared is important.

How I do it... not to 'Growbuckets' but to very similar SIPs, in fact, all SIPs, is the following steps in this order... (I'm not an authority, but neither can I point you to one, so I share this until I can) Fill an assembled but empty Grobucket (no water in reservoir) with already dampened* ( with light sprayed water and surfactant - last paragraph will detail more) grow matrix and pack lightly, then place an empty copy of your seedling pot in the place you wish to plant as a placeholder. Fill reservoir through fill tube and then allow 24hrs for SIP to absorb rez contents. In the meantime, if soil level drops as gravity compacts, fill with new premoistened soil*. Drop your seedling in the empty space along with whatever ritualistic majicks you feel appropriate at the time, then, tuck her in with a nice top watering (less than 2 litres/quarts aka a half gallon). Make sure there's some room in the rez before you top water this "last" time, much of it should have already been soaked up into the soil, so its not currently at capacity. It is probably best to keep rez level under 2/3-3/4 full for the first 2 weeks in order to avoid the small chance of system-over-wetness for the plant's given maturity level. This is purely precautionary, so time could be saved here in future after evidence for confidence is collected the first time around.

PS, it's not really the last time you will top water, the idea is that it is just the last time until a new state of growth has been reached in the near future, like 1-2 weeks on. My simple mind's chronically flawed yet dog-eared logic goes something like, "because I can recognize no change in a plant inside a time resolution of one week, it must take one week's worth of change, to make change." See, I told you, flawed. And yet dog-eared because thinking it has often stopped me from making multiple mistakes in quick succession. So while I know it not to be true I paradoxically believe in its power to help me grow better.

Let's pump the brakes here, however, and go back to not having transplanted yet. If you plant a too-small seedling into an overwet bucket it could set you back, or worse. Thankfully your SIP's design range suits the needs of the plant 99% of the time, and that stability allows for new efficiencies to develop. And yet because it is your first time, to innocently err out of an abundance of caution is your target result. Young plants don't do well with too much moisture, but big plants need it. Given the absence of a dry-wet "dial" on your SIP, the reservoir's state of fullness is almost the only trick up your sleeve and certainly the most effective one. Learn to use it to the best of your abilities. Meaning: Transplant into a well soaked-in planter, but one that has limited capability to make itself more so after transplant until you've stabilized the new houseguest and begun the growing trend well and for sure.

* When pre-moistening my promix (peat/perlite) I use water that has a tiny drop of dish soap to act as a surfactant, to actively reduce water's surface tension - allowing it faster, easier access into smaller spaces. Soilless mixes especially (coco or peat-based) have a chance of portions becoming hydrophobic, whereby it becomes easier for water to completely bypass large groups of particles rather than soak them. Permitting this leads to dry spots and, at best, impeded growth. Just use surfactant for pre-wetting, not for reservoir fills as the water surface tension plays an important role in the 'capillary action' and osmotic pressures crucial to making water seep upward against gravity. Surfactants do, however, make foliar sprays more effective, whether for fertilization, irrigation or pathogen control so use them there no probs, just not drip incessantly back down into soil. Some is fine, just watch for a lot of excess, a drip cloth would prevent. There are better (more easy to control/apply) surfactants than soap, brief research will point them out pretty quickly. Soap is to-hand, cheap, but requires only a tiny amount compared to normal soap uses. Be careful, suds are not desirable. Remember, only for initial dampening, and likely on recommended if you have a high peat content. Do not treat reservoir water with surfactants.
Great write-up Dog. I know you've posted similar thoughts around but this would make a great cross post over in #SIP Club if you would. :thanks:
 
I'd like to change the 'last top watering', that is, the one you give right after transplant, down to under a litre from the two initially described. Given the 5-gallon size and likely small stature (temp) of your seedling transplant and the potential wetness of media already after 24hr soak-in, minimizing the "settle in" transplant watering is important.

In fact, You might even consider only adding 1/2 of a reservoir after filling the bucket with soil for the soak-in period. Thing is, I don't know your soil and its ability to hold moisture so these numbers and ideas are cautious. The key takeaway here is that asap after transplant the plant has to perceive a moisture gradient, and that's a challenge we need to do certain things to help them achieve.

To make it more obvious to our plants in which direction the water lies, I wait to observe that, after filling the rez for the initial soak-in period, the surface has already started to dryback a little bit before transplanting. It may well be worth adding another "24hr wait step" here. The first one being the 24hrs after rez fill to permit soak-in. Add this second 24hrs right after the first one, during which we're simply letting the soaked-in water begin to actually evaporate, especially off the top. (you could run a fan nearby, or put under a hot light to help surface evap a bit.) Make sure that the rez isn't over half full for this period. Almost empty is fine, will help our cause. Refill after

After transplant, remember, for first week anyway, don't let reservoir be over half full, so the more exaggerated moisture gradient is maintained to point plant in right direction.
 
After transplant, remember, for first week anyway, don't let reservoir be over half full, so the more exaggerated moisture gradient is maintained to point plant in right direction.
I agree. In fact, I check my reservoir with a dipstick to make sure there's still water down there but I don't even start refilling until I see strong new growth kicking in. At that point I'm confident the new SIP roots have formed and from then on I just top off the reservoir daily and make a note of how much it took to do so.
 
For real, this is not the time in its life that your plant needs a strident, doctrinal support-human! One day, but not now. Don't let the top go dry, dry- anymore. Once she's been transplanted into the bucket, (a little while) and showing comfort, then there's time and energy reserves, and you can get medieval on her ass then, not now. Remember also, that transplanting into a Grobucket that's been properly pre-moistened and prepared is important.

How I do it... not to 'Growbuckets' but to very similar SIPs, in fact, all SIPs, is the following steps in this order... (I'm not an authority, but neither can I point you to one, so I share this until I can) Fill an assembled but empty Grobucket (no water in reservoir) with already dampened* ( with light sprayed water and surfactant - last paragraph will detail more) grow matrix and pack lightly, then place an empty copy of your seedling pot in the place you wish to plant as a placeholder. Fill reservoir through fill tube and then allow 24hrs for SIP to absorb rez contents. In the meantime, if soil level drops as gravity compacts, fill with new premoistened soil*. Drop your seedling in the empty space along with whatever ritualistic majicks you feel appropriate at the time, then, tuck her in with a nice top watering (less than 2 litres/quarts aka a half gallon). Make sure there's some room in the rez before you top water this "last" time, much of it should have already been soaked up into the soil, so its not currently at capacity. It is probably best to keep rez level under 2/3-3/4 full for the first 2 weeks in order to avoid the small chance of system-over-wetness for the plant's given maturity level. This is purely precautionary, so time could be saved here in future after evidence for confidence is collected the first time around.

PS, it's not really the last time you will top water, the idea is that it is just the last time until a new state of growth has been reached in the near future, like 1-2 weeks on. My simple mind's chronically flawed yet dog-eared logic goes something like, "because I can recognize no change in a plant inside a time resolution of one week, it must take one week's worth of change, to make change." See, I told you, flawed. And yet dog-eared because thinking it has often stopped me from making multiple mistakes in quick succession. So while I know it not to be true I paradoxically believe in its power to help me grow better.

Let's pump the brakes here, however, and go back to not having transplanted yet. If you plant a too-small seedling into an overwet bucket it could set you back, or worse. Thankfully your SIP's design range suits the needs of the plant 99% of the time, and that stability allows for new efficiencies to develop. And yet because it is your first time, to innocently err out of an abundance of caution is your target result. Young plants don't do well with too much moisture, but big plants need it. Given the absence of a dry-wet "dial" on your SIP, the reservoir's state of fullness is almost the only trick up your sleeve and certainly the most effective one. Learn to use it to the best of your abilities. Meaning: Transplant into a well soaked-in planter, but one that has limited capability to make itself more so after transplant until you've stabilized the new houseguest and begun the growing trend well and for sure.

* When pre-moistening my promix (peat/perlite) I use water that has a tiny drop of dish soap to act as a surfactant, to actively reduce water's surface tension - allowing it faster, easier access into smaller spaces. Soilless mixes especially (coco or peat-based) have a chance of portions becoming hydrophobic, whereby it becomes easier for water to completely bypass large groups of particles rather than soak them. Permitting this leads to dry spots and, at best, impeded growth. Just use surfactant for pre-wetting, not for reservoir fills as the water surface tension plays an important role in the 'capillary action' and osmotic pressures crucial to making water seep upward against gravity. Surfactants do, however, make foliar sprays more effective, whether for fertilization, irrigation or pathogen control so use them there no probs, just not drip incessantly back down into soil. Some is fine, just watch for a lot of excess, a drip cloth would prevent. There are better (more easy to control/apply) surfactants than soap, brief research will point them out pretty quickly. Soap is to-hand, cheap, but requires only a tiny amount compared to normal soap uses. Be careful, suds are not desirable. Remember, only for initial dampening, and likely on recommended if you have a high peat content. Do not treat reservoir water with surfactants.
A very informative and also amusing write up, thanks @ReservoirDog - I believe I have a good understanding of what (and why) to do when I get to the transplant stage now!

My soil/compost is a non-peat based one, I will be mixing 40% perlite into it as advised by you in your other reply on the SIP post but I think this should mean I don't need to bother with the surftacant and soaking should do an okay job? I guess it's hard to say without direct experience with this soil lol.

I've been following the advice to no longer allow the dry-dry top, only a light misting once a day but that seems to be doing the job.

The saucers have all been drained completely, the plants definitely seem to be getting more thirsty as time goes on, checking out my notes I can see that we are actually on day 10 right now, so in 4 more days I should be looking to increase DLI again and start looking/waiting for the 2nd node.

Takes around 24 hours for the water to be absorbed right now so I plant to refill it this evening after they've had around 12 hours of dry saucers as last thing I want is the seedlings damping off this close to veg :D

I have no idea when the 2nd node will appear so my plan is to soak/wetten and sort my GroBuckets as soon as I see the 2nd node and then properly pre-moisten my soil before transplanting 24 or 48 hours later.

I will be referring back to your posts when the time comes, thanks again for such a detailed reply and thanks to everyone following, helping and offering advice it's really appreciated ! <3
 
Back
Top Bottom