If you have lots, keep using it. I would use it as a top dressing too. It looks like great stuff. I like the other companies philosophy that leaks into their write-ups better, but both products look fantastic.
If it's good enough to build the soil with as an amendment, it's good enough to maintain the soil as a top dressing.

Maintaining balance is vital so sticking with something that is balanced will maintain balance is what I'm trying to say.

Does the instructions on the Elemental blend have top dressing and/or tea instructions?
 
Brix question: ok, so Brix measures sugars which is also a measurement of photosynthetic efficiency. Therefore, my logic says I can measure Brix on any plant, not just fruiting plants. Is this so? All plants run on sugar and photosynthesis, no? Reason I ask is that I have the most beautiful Raven ZZ ever. A super big house plant I am pretty proud of. I can see she’s blazing healthy and not a single bug will approach her. None, zero. And I’m in Bug Central. Even the leaf miners who ruin the world won’t go near her. So if I’ve understood you correctly, that would logically mean I have a high brix plant, yes? So can I measure it?
 
Does any research exist into links between specific soil ingredients and/or blends and the production of specific terpenes? I’m wondering if in a perfect perfect world, could I make a mix that would produce more myrcene or limonene or whatever in a specific strain? Just curious.
 
Brix question: ok, so Brix measures sugars which is also a measurement of photosynthetic efficiency. Therefore, my logic says I can measure Brix on any plant, not just fruiting plants. Is this so? All plants run on sugar and photosynthesis, no? Reason I ask is that I have the most beautiful Raven ZZ ever. A super big house plant I am pretty proud of. I can see she’s blazing healthy and not a single bug will approach her. None, zero. And I’m in Bug Central. Even the leaf miners who ruin the world won’t go near her. So if I’ve understood you correctly, that would logically mean I have a high brix plant, yes? So can I measure it?
yes and yes, but synthetics wont build brix, I mean it can under expensive high maintenance conditions, but not really, you need soil biology to make it work. So if it's organic, brix is a thing, if synthetic.... not so much.
 
Ok first I admit that mushroom compost and rice hulls are foreign to me, but I think I understand them. So here goes.

EWC and Mushroom compost are both organic matter, so 25% of the mix. I would go 2 parts EWC and 1 part 'shroom dirt to make the 25%.

Used soil, I like 50% of the mix. You built those humates last grow, may as well use them again, not to mention the myco spores in it.

Coco coir I like to add 10% of the mix.

Biochar I would use 5%.

So now you are at 90%.

Rice hulls, for a practical comparison, are a combination of perlite and coco in function that slowly degrades into carbon and organic matter but it is slightly less carbony than coco and slightly less areationy than perlite. It is however diversity from both and that has immense value. So 10% rice hulls.

Toss in your ammendments, mix the daylights out of it, then add in perlite. Perlite is inert. Don't count it's volume in your mix, you add it after the mix is created. So 10 gallons of mix turns into 13 or 14 after perlite is added, then cook it.

I like 30-35% perlite overall. Used soil brings perlite in so I use a half gallon of perlite for every gallon of coco added, and a half gallon of perlite for every gallon of EWC added, and that gets it close. Then after a good mixing I add a bit more by eye to get it where I like it.

I would use all of those ammendments you listed except epsom salts. I have only experienced grief with them. Others swear by them but I cannot for how I mix my soils.

What you haven't mentioned is calcium.
You should have dolomite to properly set the CEC, gypsum for the sulfur and ph stability, and oyster shell flour for slow release.

I like 1.5 cups/10 gallons of soil of dolomite before perlite is added, .5 cups gypsum before perliting, and .5 cups oyster flour before perliting.

Here is my favorite soil recipe before perliting. It's a strong mix because Cropking Durban Poison seeds can handle it. You can lower everything by 25% if you have a light feeder, or cut it with more used soil. I mix a tub of high strength and cut it down with used soil if needed. It simplifies life.

20 gals recycled soil
2 gals coco
3 cups prilled dolomite
1 cup blood meal
.5 cup bat guano
.5 cup glacial rock dust or .5c rock phos
3 cups feather meal
3 cups bone meal
1.5 cups greensand
.3 cups SRP
2 cups organic basmati
1 cup gypsum
3 cups kelp meal
2 cups alfalfa meal
1 cup oyster shell flour

Add spikes and you can grow from seed to harvest with water and fish ferts and EWC. It is designed for zero ppm RO water. Spikes are just topdressing in a hole.

It's a high brix recipe that from what I have discussed with Doc's followers, gets higher brix on the refractometer than his foliar system, which is good, as that was my goal.

Brix consistently over 20, almost always 21 or 22, and I hit 26 once. Over 20 and brix becomes strain dependant. Some strains photosynthesize better than others, it's a DNA thing that can't be overcome.

I hate bugs, they bug me.

I also use 1tea application per grow for sure, at about 3-4 werks from sprout, and quite often a 2nd tea at flip, but not always. It depends on vigor and brix at the time of flip.

So theres some good stuff to help you figure a mix. Talk it out in here if you like, and everyone join in or stop the conversation please if you get lost. Your mix determines your outcome so this is where a good or mediocre or bad experience is created.

This is where you should speak up if you are a lurker and still unsure. We can talk about this for weeks if needed, I don't mind at all. Get the mix right and the rest gets easy.

013 spoke up. 👍😊👊.
Hey Gee, i missed a few days and now im waaay behind, still catching up.

One question comes to mind. Does high brix repel outdoor bugs like moths and grasshoppers or is it more for indoor grows with gnats etc?
 
Hey Gee, i missed a few days and now im waaay behind, still catching up.

One question comes to mind. Does high brix repel outdoor bugs like moths and grasshoppers or is it more for indoor grows with gnats etc?
Here is a brix pest chart, inside or outside. Different bugs can handle different brix levels.
Leaf-Brix-Chart-with-insect-groups (1).jpg
 
So 1 more thing about top dressing. I use mineral mixes BECAUSE I combine it with EWC. EWC already has meals and proteins in it. I see bonemeal as a mineral. Mineral mixes alone, without EWC and bone meal aren't that effective.

Also, Gees mixes and top dressings are much more effective because of his EWC and his microbes. His EWC, microbes, and the soils he uses are all part of a system he has been building for years. That means when he top dresses his mineral mix, his microbes have evolved and adapted to specialize processing those specific mixes in his environment.

When you run a controlled environment with the same inputs that you recycle yourself you create a grow with highly efficient and highly evolved microbes. This is why I am so insistent organic growers compost or vermicompost. You’ll never reach the highest levels otherwise


Beauty Keff! Those are leggy ladies🥰😊.
You know I got a weakness for tall chicks😍.

Your leaves are awesome solar panels. They should flower really well!

Thats a cool pic, thanks for sharing it👊

How did the chiropractics go? They all twisted over now?


I’ve got half of em done and the other half will be done tonight. As long as the buds stay under 3 feet long we should be okay

IMG_8650.jpeg


IMG_8651.jpeg
 
Hey Gee, i missed a few days and now im waaay behind, still catching up.

One question comes to mind. Does high brix repel outdoor bugs like moths and grasshoppers or is it more for indoor grows with gnats etc?

Brix does not repel pests/bugs. Brix is a measurement of a plants health/nutrient density. It has no direct impact itself.

The way it works against bugs is, Pests/bugs can detect unhealthy plants, or those under a certain Brix level. Under a certain Brix level the plant is giving off various chemicals/signals that it’s struggling to compete in its environment and the bugs can sense those signals. Once the plant has achieved a healthy Brix level it no longer is producing those stress responses the bugs sense and it becomes invisible to the bugs.

So Brix itself isn’t actually doing anything, it’s just measuring the plants health, and once the plant crosses the 12 threshold it is no longer visible. This is why even with a high brix plant you’ll still see light pest damage if there are unhealthy plants around it. Light collateral damage before the high sugar kills the pest.
 
Does the instructions on the Elemental blend have top dressing and/or tea instructions?
No but I've sent Jamie, the manufacturer a message and hopefully he'll get back to me soon.
Mineral mixes alone, without EWC and bone meal aren't that effective.
Should I add bone meal?
Also, Gees mixes and top dressings are much more effective because of his EWC and his microbes. His EWC, microbes, and the soils he uses are all part of a system he has been building for years. That means when he top dresses his mineral mix, his microbes have evolved and adapted to specialize processing those specific mixes in his environment.
Thanks Kefka. I'm assuming my revitalized living soil will be teaming with microbes already as it has been sitting these 6 months. Is that correct? I'm also assuming myco as I left root matter in the soil to break down. Should I still sprinkle myco when I plant, and should I recharge the soil with microbes from a bottle, or do you think it is good to go?
 
Gee man, this is the response I got from Freedom Farms, re soil. What shall I say to him?

"We use gypsum. Unfortunately I can't disclose the quantities we use. If you let me know why you need the quantities, I can probably assist you in another way".

Shall I say that I am rebuilding used soil, I want to optimize my calcium component and am considering adding dolomite?
 
Gee man, this is the response I got from Freedom Farms, re soil. What shall I say to him?

"We use gypsum. Unfortunately I can't disclose the quantities we use. If you let me know why you need the quantities, I can probably assist you in another way".

Shall I say that I am rebuilding used soil, I want to optimize my calcium component and am considering adding dolomite?
Exactly, tell him you need to know how much dolomite to add. If its legal, tell him its for cannabis.
 
No but I've sent Jamie, the manufacturer a message and hopefully he'll get back to me soon.

Should I add bone meal?
It depends if there is any in it or not, and whats in it in bone meals place if bone meal isn't in it. It's cheap and effective so I would guess there is some in it.
 
Here it is Carmen, in the writeup on Elemental Blend.
Screenshot_20240524_141253_Chrome.jpg

It says 10 liters per sq meter, but what it really says is it's a top dress. Use my formula to match the strength you put into your mix. If it puzzles you, tell me how many gallons of soil you rebuilt and how much Elemental you put in, and I can match it for you. In a 5gal I would guess 3.75tbsp/week, but lets run the math to see.
 
It depends if there is any in it or not, and whats in it in bone meals place if bone meal isn't in it. It's cheap and effective so I would guess there is some in it.
I take this back @Carmen Ray , I looked it up. It has lots of P in it already. I would trust the mix and see how it goes, then adjust next grow if you aren't happy with it.
 
Now that your soil is homogenous and brix (photosynthesis) is accelerating, you are running out of calcium in your mix. You need regular calmag. Dolo water is best here. 75ppm is a great mix. But commercial calmag with a low nitrogen number will work great too. It needs to be cal and mag like dolomite.
Ok. Thanks. I'll have a reread of The Rev's recipe since it sounds like I'm going to be making it a lot.

Is this an every water type thing, an every top water thing if I do that once per week, once every other or third, other?
 
Back
Top Bottom