THC Bomb & WW/Skunk - CFL Hood/Veg HPS/Flower

[Skybound]

@ Capn, yeah I have that fan on 24/7, but the oscillator is broke so it blows straight. I usually have it pointed to go along the wall and swirl inside, but I must've bumped it. Overall, every time I open the door, I can see the plant doing the twist to Chevy Checkers so air flow is decent and I add humidity with a hanging cloth.

@ donpaul, based upon what you and AG are telling me, it appears that I need to get that ballast out of there. I was hoping I could manage, but now I think I don't want to find out. It is the plant's first 12 hour night so I will wait till this evening to poke some holes. I gotta get some CFLs in there first though as I will need to unplug the ballast to run the wiring in and out. This ballast does have a built in heat sink, but the upside down thing is what scares me the most right now.

 

[TheCapn]

@ Capn, yeah I have that fan on 24/7, but the oscillator is broke so it blows straight. I usually have it pointed to go along the wall and swirl inside, but I must've bumped it. Overall, every time I open the door, I can see the plant doing the twist to Chevy Checkers so air flow is decent and I add humidity with a hanging cloth.

"air flow" around leaves is good. Wind blowing on leaves, is bad. It dries them out and then they don't photosynthesize as well. I have a fan running 24/7 for great circulation, but it doesn't blow on leaves.

Go outside and see if you can find a bush with constant wind blowing on it.

 

[donpaul.p]

i agree, when i first started growing i was using 12v computer fans, well still do to move air around the room, but i made the mistake of having the fans blowing directly on the seedlings and growth stopped and leaves started to die as they just dried out, so now i just have a very gentle breeze running across the canopy and ill add a couple more fans or a free standing fan for flower just to stop any pm issues, so TheCpn is spot on.

with the ballast its a tough call to make, my room is 3.5ft by 3.5ft and floor to ceiling high, its a brick built cupboard in my flat/apartment so cant have vents in the walls without knocking big holes through, when i was using cfls i was using between 400 and 600 actual watts and i could keep the door closed, but with this 400 watt ballast and hood i have to have the door open about 6 inches just to vent the hot air out,

my main problem was the hood not having vents cut into the top as the bulb was just pushing the heat down towards the plants then out the sides of the hood, so im really not sure why they dont have raised vents just above the bulb in the hood, they could raise them so no light leaks upwards, im pretty sure this would keep temps down and also prolong the life of the bulb, so next time i replace the bulb ill cut some slits and hammer in some raised vents and see how that helps with the heat, having the fan mounted at the end of the hood has helped loads and i can have the light lower than i normally had it before.

with the ballast mine gets really hot to touch on the top part, but what i did was as my grow space is floor to roof high i built a small shelf in the bottom of the grow space, i use an old radiator i had as the floor for the plant pots to sit on then just below that is this space where i put my ballas, so the heat from my ballast is below the level of the pots and with the metal radiator being used as a shelf this stops the heat rising into the pots or plants, the shelf is open the side where the door is so the heat from the ballast vents out the door instead of heating up the room,

if i didnt have a shelf then my cable from ballast to hood is very long so i would of mounted the ballast outside the grow space.

my other option was to build a shelf in the top of the grow space and have the ballast in that space, that would also keep the heat out of the grow room, temps are a huge problem for me in the summer so the less heat the better,

 

[Skybound]

When I locate some stainless or some aluminum, I will cut two pieces to almost meet in the center. I figure if the reflectors are slightly parted, there will be enough gap at the apex of the 2 to allow heat to be drawn through. So whereas each angle allows for a 6" panel, i will insert a 5.75" panel of metal and leave a 0.5" gap.

 

[b.real]

plant is nice and bushy and will love that hid! good luck with the "battle of the heat" that we all face as growers

 

[Skybound]

Heat and pH are my nemesis!

 

[Skybound]

Update 12/03 Week 01 (46)/FD01,
Air Temp - 82 on the digital, 76 on the wall (both pictured) (clip on fan already dropped the temp 1° on the digi)
RH - 45%-50% (until I move the floor fan to other side, RH will drop quickly)
Res Temp - 21.6° C (not that this matters)
PPM - 572 /// pH - 6.3 (before adjusting)

It seams my res has finally found a number that it likes which is not bad at all, 6.3/6.4. I can definitely work with that and I so hope it lasts. Being as though I am sticking to the same feed schedule for a few weeks (Capn Style), I want to do something that is new to me, topping off the res. I just happen to have a gallon of water that didn't get used from my last purchase. I will add it to the res and let it all mix. Take a PPM reading and pH reading and begin repeating the schedule from the most recent update until I reach a PPM of the low 500's and try to get the pH down to 5.5. I notice all my leaf tips are pointing down which has recently been taught to me via The Capn and I think donpaul.p, but possibly S1ing, Rico Suave or KJC. Oh yeah, leaf tips, it was taught to me that this indicates too much air moving across leaves and drying out, OR, beginning stages of nute burn. This being the start of the 46th day this plant has been above ground, I'd think it mature enough to handle a higher PPM and I'm trying to find the borderline of over doing and just kiss it. Unfortunately I lack needed experience to adjust on the fly and and interpret all visible signs of problems. In an effort to grow and mature myself, if I get the pH down to 5.5, I wont adjust till at least 6.3/6.4. This I believe would be an exercise in patience. I hope topping off will be more forgiving on fluctuations. I figure there's still over a gallon in the res that has been corrected frequently, but fluctuation has subsided.

Today I hung a double light socket to build up side lighting. Still have to get some extension cords to make that work. I want a 2700k and 6500k for a good mix of spectrum, plus the 6500k is great for picture taking. The ballast has been on for 3 hours and is only lightly warm to touch. Air flow is now pretty good in that corner. This will hold me over till I finish what I have planned.

I chopped off the 2 lowest branches. They were very twiggy and never gonna go anywhere so.... Also LST'd the 4 dominant branches to open the middle some. I wanted to have a short lollipopping session, but I am wanting to meddle as little as possible. Last grow I sampled every technique, but now I want to observe growth phases. I will eventually get some kind of screen in there b/c I expect this strain to overtake this small closet and if the space gets too full, I'll prolly have to get that HID out. So for the first time in our lives, let's hope this dont get too big and bushy.

 

[AfricanGrower]

The setup has come along way Sky! Everything really seems to be coming together very well

>>>It seams my res has finally found a number that it likes which is not bad at all, 6.3/6.4

What exactly did you change in order for it to steady at that range? Not to speak to soon, but I think the CaliMagic is making a whole lot of difference in pH fluctuations in my res. In 24 hrs, the pH rose from 6.3 to 6.4, with very little foam/thin film developing on the surface in comparison to the GO CaMg.

>>>I chopped off the 2 lowest branches.

If you are trying to stunt growth, then this is okay. But if not, I'm sure you know that any form of HST a week before going into flowering, could severely stunt overall growth while in your stretch period. This is when growth can really be distributed to create more potential tops and budsites, increasing yield.

 

[Skybound]

I wasn't aware of the timing issue. I was just hoping to get some of the stress combined into other stressful events. As long as I get some bud, I'm not trying to break records with this grow, I just want to be able to keep that HPS burning in there to get some thick dense buds, but hopefully not too many b/c I feel I will lose control of my ability to maintain optimal levels of anything.

About the CaMg, I am thinking that the sugars have dissipated some how or just found equilibrium. Outside of that, I don't recall anything that I changed save for swapping out Aqua Shield with Flora Blend. I've found Floa Blend does have micro organisms and other stuff. Here is a quote from the GH site and a direct link to Flora Blend.

"FloraBlend is produced with a mixture of highly bioactive microorganisms that are fed a feast of select food sources in a hyperoxygenated environment. Beneficial microorganisms multiply rapidly, consuming the food through bioconversion processes, new organic compounds are formed. These organic compounds are enzymes, metabolites & organic acids, which energize the plant's metabolic processes."

Maybe the beneficial microorganisms consumed the sugars and made the fluctuations subside?

 

[TheCapn]

Even with your PH fluctuations, your plant really has grown vigorously in the past couple weeks. It really goes to show how resilient the plant is, and, how "forgiving" the cubes are. Like I talk about my the "how veg time affects yield" it is amazing how the plant goes into overdrive at that stage. And I think you're right, you will probably benefit from some kind of trellis, especially if you think you are going to run out of height. Can you post a picture of your plant right before you put it into flower, and then another picture, 10 days before that?

>>>I chopped off the 2 lowest branches. They were very twiggy and never gonna go anywhere so....

AG's concerns are valid, however taking off a couple lower whimpy branches as you go to flower is fine; use them for clones if you want. Auxins are mostly in the upper tops, so topping will disturb auxins more than cutting off a few lowers.

>>>Also LST'd the 4 dominant branches to open the middle some.

LST is a broad term. Did you bend them a little or tie them down?

>>>I wanted to have a short lollipopping session

X-( You mean "prune" out some lower wimpy branches and fan leaves? That's fine, but erase this "lollipopping" term from your stoner dictionary! And no "sessions". Like AG was saying, we don't want to put the plant into "heal" mode or it WILL stunt growth. Removing a lower light starved branch here and there (over a 2-3 week period) is fine. But go sparingly, you will be surprised how much some of those will stretch. You can take a couple and tie them to the main stalk to point them straight up the middle of the plant if you want. There is no reason to take off lower fan leaves, unless they are touching the grow media. (someone feel free to enlighten me if you think differently) I always cringe when I see people pulling an edward scissorhands on their plant. Fan leaves provide energy for the plant, EVEN IF they are not getting light. And the lower fan leaves are not shading any bud sites. You know those stoner smurfs who made up the rule about soaking rockwool for 24 hours, also made up the theory that plants should have lower growth cut off, so they can get more "Air circulation".

If you've ever experienced root disease, you'll know the first sign of it: lower fan leaves turning yellow. This is the plant's survival strategy. It takes stored energy from the bottom of the plant and attempts to save the tops. Enough said!

>>>I am wanting to meddle as little as possible.

+1

About the PH. I like how you've opened up your range here. In the past I've grown monsters at 6.0, then calibrate my $hitty meter and realize it was WAY off and I had been growing at 6.6 with absolutely no issues. Some strains are more forgiving than others too.
About the PPM. Same here. I like your thoughts on this. Always better to error on the side of being too low. In cubes, irrigating twice a day, I would be no higher than 600, until you start to see significant pistil growth. <<notice I am thinking positively ;-)

 

[TheCapn]

"FloraBlend is produced with a mixture of highly bioactive microorganisms that are fed a feast of select food sources in a hyperoxygenated environment. Beneficial microorganisms multiply rapidly, consuming the food through bioconversion processes, new organic compounds are formed. These organic compounds are enzymes, metabolites & organic acids, which energize the plant's metabolic processes."

Love that stuff. Been drinking it for years.

Seriously though, +1.

4-5ml/gal is a staple, seedling thru 6th week of flower.

 

[Skybound]

1ml? I just added 4ml/gal and did with last res change. I could've sworn the recipe called for 4ml/gal?

LST= tie down with gardeners wire.

Prune would have been a better term, and though a few leaves still touch the medium, I think I'm gonna wait a few days to see if the stem they're attached to streches and gets them up off the medium. When you talked about roots and pulling from those leaves, my thought if I were to take all those 'whipping boy' leaves, the plant would then just pick the next set of healthy leaves and nominate those to be the new whipping boys to take the abuse, so I'd be better served to just leave the current whipping boys on there to keep getting whipped, no?

However, if I were to find my plant in perfect health, I think in that situation I would want to remove a lot of those lower leaves b/c as you pointed out to me privately, direct wind dries leaves which is likely the case for the majority of all my lower growth. I prescribed to the train of thought that air circulation constantly replenishes CO2 around the leaves and had my fan oscillating right through the plant since it was big enough to get hit with wind and not topple over. So I am now trying to work my way back from that. My thought on that is if those leaves aren't there, air can move freely under the upper canopy and not dry those, but still circulate air in the room. Because I have such a small footprint (floor space), it is very difficult finding a happy medium with this fan. I am pretty much forced to point it straight at the wall which hinders circulation and swirl.

 

[Skybound]

Also, a further testament to use of rockwool cubes, white roots have already reached the bottom drain holes again and another transplant will be needed in the near future.

 

[TheCapn]

1ml? I just added 4ml/gal and did with last res change. I could've sworn the recipe called for 4ml/gal?

Woops! I had "silica" on the brain. Yes, Florablend I use 4-5ml/gal. Sorry! I edited my post above.

Yeah you can leave the leaves. I try to get them off the media so no mold can grow. Leaves touching the wet media could trigger mold or mildew.

I hear ya on the fan. It is always a PITA (and loud) when you're working in small spaces.

 

[Skybound]

Just a quicky, I added aluminum reflector panels to my DIY HID Hood. Also found another socket with a long cord that I am using for side lighting. I will have to work the other one in as well and get them both on a timer to coincide with the HID. Also, topped up the res with the following;

1 Gallon Distilled Water
5ml CaMg
4ml Flora Blend
3ml Flora Gro
3ml Flora Micro
3ml Flora Bloom
1ml Armor Si (silica)

PPM about 525, pH rose to about 6.8. I tried adjusting pH by adding 2 drops per 1/10th, but that barely moved the 6.8 to 6.7, so I added 1.5ml of PH down, waited about an hour or two, then checked it was 6.3. I added another 1/2ml of DOWN and that made it drop to 4.9. Waited about another hour and it climbed back to 6.1. I went back to adding drops and it weighed in @ 5.7 about 15 minutes before feeding time. My current train of thought is to add pH DOWN in milliliters next time to get it down within the optimal range (5.5-6.3) then tweak it with drops. Perhaps my crazy fluctuations stemmed from me only adding a few drops of DOWN here and there and that wasn't enough to pose as a formidable counter weight so to speak? Some pics;

Next and final mod should be in a few days, to buff the reflector panels, cut a hole on top and mount that other fan to the hood and get that other pair of CFLs burning. I decided (if budget permits me) to use ONA gel to scrub my air. After reading AG's blog entry, he makes a very compelling case and since any carbon filter would serve as an airflow restriction, I need another alternative and ONA doesn't block air at all.

 

[b.real]

that plants looking killer. do you keep the door open?

 

[Skybound]

No, I keep it closed as much as possible. Stealth first. The real test will be when I have the ballast running @ 100% power with 4 added CFLs (2 each side of plant). I do have 3 fans turning though, so that helps a lot with the heat, and after I make the final mods, there will be 4 fans total.

 

[AfricanGrower]

No, I keep it closed as much as possible. Stealth first. The real test will be when I have the ballast running @ 100% power with 4 added CFLs (2 each side of plant). I do have 3 fans turning though, so that helps a lot with the heat, and after I make the final mods, there will be 4 fans total.

I must agree with B.Real, that your lady is really looking healthy Sky! I think this is the first (maybe second) time I could clearly make out how exactly your space is setup with that 'outside closet shot'. Nice

Quick suggestion though, if you find that the heat is still quite unmanageable, try running the closet without the 4 CFLs and see how heat is distributed. I know that supplement lighting can help in SOME situations, but in your case, a 400W HPS has more lumens per square foot then you will ever need for your small footprint.

The only reason I run 3x 23W CFLs in my grow currently is for the bagseed to get light, as it is completely blocked off from direct penetration by the Bubb

 

[s1ingblade]

Sky your well on your way. Good to see ya

 

[Skybound]

Thanks for stopping by S1ing. Since you got me talking, might as well give a brief overview as I never ever stop trying to make progress and improvements. So as it turns out, I stepped the ballast to 75% for the last 3 or so hours last night and after it lit up this morning, the room gained in temp to 88º and slowly climbing. I repositioned the clip on to see if this would abate the heat to no avail. So I dropped it back to 50% and am running with the door open. Just as donpaul predicted, my ballast would get warm/hot, so I will be tasked to get the ballast out somehow. This will likely involve drilling a hole, or cutting some way, but the only hours I can do this are from 10PM to 10AM which kinda sucks. I don't have a game plan for getting the ballast out yet, but it will happen soon. I did however redesign this DIY reflector hood to take up less space, focus more rays downward and vacuum off heat from the closet through the hood. I plan to add some ducting between the fan atop the DIY reflector and the one mounted to the ceiling of the flower closet. If too much heat collects above the fan, I'll try to just build a wind guide to jettison heat at a slight angle from top of hood towards ceiling fan. This might allow ceiling fan to draw everything in it's vacuum zone which will include both hood heat and cabinet heat.

It's kinda hard to see exactly how things are going as this 2100k HPS bulb is noticeably darker in color than the 2700k, but just overall plant stature and leaf appearance suggests that this little plant really enjoys all that extra lumens. Leaves have regained some rigidity and are starting to flatten out a bit. I struggle to maintain some humidity, but once I get a little further into flower, I should be free of that burden as I've read lower RH is fine for flowering.

I recalibrated my PPM meter and it was off by as much as 90PPM which is substantial. I dialed it in and saw res PPM was up to 662. It may have been improperly dialed in yesterday when I topped up the res, but I added 750ml of water and after about 30 minutes to mix, PPM came to just above 500. pH issues have pretty much been figured out. After first mixing in nutes, I must add about 2ml of PH DOWN to counter pull against the alkalinity in the water and silica which usually holds to the low 6 range which is manageable and is fine for about an entire day.