SweetSue's Cannabis Oil Study Hall

[gbauto]

It's been awhile since I've posted in this thread- had to endure a reverse total shoulder replacement in March. Just more wreckage of the past... Biggest challenge has been pain management- to much to do it on CCO alone. Here is where things get tricky- Ga. apparently won't allow MD's to prescribe narcotics if you have cannabinoid present. Talk about being between a rock and a hard place. Any advice???

 

[Canyon]

gbauto,

Could you lineup a doctor or NP in a nearby state to right a script? You could show up at an ER or Urgent care facility and say you were traveling. You probably would not need more than a 30 day supply. If you do go out of state for a script, get it filled in the state you have it written in. I learned the hard way that not all class one scripts are good in other states.

Gook luck!

 

[SweetSue]

My thinking is that at 15psi the temperature of boiling water goes to 250F. If I maintain 15 psi it will be a very regulated temperature of 250F the whole time. The air inside the jar would stay exactly 250 and make it a very precise decarb. The terps would stay in the jar with everything else. Then after out of the pressure cooker the jar could be cooled. Then oil can be added to the same jar for a 1 hour boil.

Sounds like a plan Shiggity. Take pictures.

 

[SweetSue]

It's been awhile since I've posted in this thread- had to endure a reverse total shoulder replacement in March. Just more wreckage of the past... Biggest challenge has been pain management- to much to do it on CCO alone. Here is where things get tricky- Ga. apparently won't allow MD's to prescribe narcotics if you have cannabinoid present. Talk about being between a rock and a hard place. Any advice???

Georgia can't seem to let go of the reefer madness mentality, but it's not only Georgia. This is a national embarrassment, and I'm sorry you're caught in it. The ultimate irony is that cannabinoids potentiate the opioids, so you'd be able to get better results with a lower opiod dose. How long do you plan to be needing the pharma pain meds?

Is your problem that you now have THC in your system and won't pass their mandatory test or that you know you'll need cannabis and won't pass the next test? Canyon has offered the best solution if it's that first choice.

 

[SweetSue]

Christina Sanchez - Cannabinoids as antitumorial agents: from bench to bedside (Cannafest Prague, 2015)

Cannabinoids as antitumoral agents: from bench to bedside | Ch. Sánchez, Cannafest 2015 - YouTube

Notes on the video:

Cancer is the uncontrolled proliferation of mutant cells.
- aided by angiogenesis (growth of new blood vessels to irrigate the tumor cells
- later stages the tumor cells metastasize through the blood stream, settling in distant tissues

Patients deal with pain from tumor growth and suffer side effects from chemo and radiation

Criteria to have anti-cancer drugs accepted by the medical community
1. Are they effective? Will they kill cancer cells?
2. Are they safe? Will there be no toxic effects on healthy cells?
- With cannabinoids there is special consideration that they be nonpsychoactive (? - explained below)

Pre-clinical and clinical evidence show THC
- kills cancer cells
- reduces tumor growth
- blocks angiogenesis
- activates apoptosis (cellular suicide)

Cannabinoids activate cell apoptosis by deactivating the protein AKT
- the master regulator of cell survival and cell proliferation

Their study of HER2+ mice showed that THC
- slowed tumor growth

- reduced tumor generation (fewer tumors expressed)
* mice have ten breasts
* in control mice, 41% had 4 tumors or more
* in THC-treated mice 50% had 1 tumor and no mice had 4 tumors

- reduced lung metastasis (from ~65 in control mice to ~15 with THC mice)

These results have been duplicated in human cancer cell line studies


Cannabinoids are safe

THC doesn't impact HMEC viability (it has nontoxic effects in healthy cells)
- Healthy cells don't behave the same way in the presence of cannabinoids.

THC doesn't impact the HMEC cell cycle
- treat a tumor cell with THC and changes occur
* tumor cell death accelerates
* proliferation rates decline

THC doesn't impact JunD levels
- to initiate apoptosis levels of the protein JunD must increase

Evidence shows that the effects of cannabinoids are selectively expressed on tumor cells

They have never found any evidence of THC toxicity to any organs or tissue.

The medical community insists on no psychoactivity
- psychoactivity brings with it the benefits of euphoria, feelings of wellbeing, relaxation - all things that can enhance your life

You can control psychoactivity by activating CB2 receptors
- THC activates CB1 receptors in the brain, causing the high
- CBD is as effective as THC in killing cancer cells (THC is stronger, but not by much)
- you lose the antitumorial effects of THC by not making use of it
*We now know THC and CBD work best together.

She believes cancer should be treated systemically, through the blood stream.
- recommends oral administration (get it into the blood)

In human studies of glioblastomas THC
- showed no psychoactive effects
- reduced tumor growth in some patients
- increased length of survival in some patients
- modulates the same molecular mechanisms and was as effective as prescribed pharma drugs

THC was as effective as the most commonly used drug
- reduced cell proliferation
- reduced angiogenesis
- increased cell apoptosis

 

[gbauto]

Georgia can't seem to let go of the reefer madness mentality, but it's not only Georgia. This is a national embarrassment, and I'm sorry you're caught in it. The ultimate irony is that cannabinoids potentiate the opioids, so you'd be able to get better results with a lower opiod dose. How long do you plan to be needing the pharma pain meds?

Is your problem that you now have THC in your system and won't pass their mandatory test or that you know you'll need cannabis and won't pass the next test? Canyon has offered the best solution if it's that first choice.

Hell, I've corresponded with ALL of my elected representatives and they ALL say that 'good people don't use marijuana'- can't even refer to it by it's proper name...
My body has been subjected to severe trauma as the result of a deer/motorcycle accident 2 years ago-lost my rt leg and I now have plates and bolts piecing all of my remaining limbs together. I had been able to use the CCO to get off of the 90mg of methadone along with 16mg of hydromorphone they had me on but the shoulder just broke me. I tried to resolve it with more surgery but it hasn't helped so now I'm at an impasse-go back down the rabbit hole with the opiates or just suffer until I die-really infuriates me. I found a paper from the CDC asking docs to NOT test for cannabinoids in pain management because they realize the benefits when used as an adjunct to opiates-seems that the DEA has a strangle hold on the docs and they WILL lose their ability to prescribe controlled substances. It's a really F-ed up situation. I have not used the CCO for the last month trying to endure on the 15mg of hydrocodone he was willing to prescribe and it's been HELL...Rock and a hard place

 

[SweetSue]

Hell, I've corresponded with ALL of my elected representatives and they ALL say that 'good people don't use marijuana'- can't even refer to it by it's proper name...
My body has been subjected to severe trauma as the result of a deer/motorcycle accident 2 years ago-lost my rt leg and I now have plates and bolts piecing all of my remaining limbs together. I had been able to use the CCO to get off of the 90mg of methadone along with 16mg of hydromorphone they had me on but the shoulder just broke me. I tried to resolve it with more surgery but it hasn't helped so now I'm at an impasse-go back down the rabbit hole with the opiates or just suffer until I die-really infuriates me. I found a paper from the CDC asking docs to NOT test for cannabinoids in pain management because they realize the benefits when used as an adjunct to opiates-seems that the DEA has a strangle hold on the docs and they WILL lose their ability to prescribe controlled substances. It's a really F-ed up situation. I have not used the CCO for the last month trying to endure on the 15mg of hydrocodone he was willing to prescribe and it's been HELL...Rock and a hard place

Good Lord Baby.....

I wish to God I had an answer. I hear this too frequently and it breaks my heart. Had a member last year forced to go without for a month in advance of the appointment, with a doctor that forced him in every three months and then neglected to test, so all that suffering was for naught. Haven't heard from him since Thanksgiving, and I'm hoping he didn't drive that motorcycle into a tree like he fantasizes about.

No one should be forced to live in pain like that. We should be able to sue their asses into the ground. May life become extremely uncomfortable for those pulling these strings. May they live with your pain.

 

[SweetSue]

gbauto, have you tried CCO processed into BioBombs? If so, have you tried them as suppositories? Do you have access to topicals? If you're forced to do so, do you have an adequate supply of cannabis to work with?

The rock he's throwing your way has no therapeutic weight, in my opinion. There should be a way to come up with a formulation that'll get you through the pain. How can we expect the body to overcome the inflammatory response without additional CBD? Your believe your pain levels are above cannabis at this point, and that may not be true. It may be a matter of formulation and administration.

 

[SweetSue]

I'm totally wiped, despite my response to this situation. I have to go to bed guys. I feel bad leaving you hanging here, but my eyes won't stay open anymore.

Until morning then

 

[AKgramma]

Ok so how about this. I take a half gallon mason and fill it halfway with the fresh cannabis and seal it then decarb in the pressure cooker. Then I can do the water bath style extraction as before.

You don't fully tighten the lids until after they are removed from the heat. Then as they cool, you'll hear the seal go POP, and you know you have a true air-tight seal that will last for years.

If you tighten the lids before you remove them from the heat, they might explode. Air pressure building up inside the jars needs to escape while they are cooking.

 

[rikvasen]

I still have to finish my book "Healing Hemp" The Dutch version from Wernard Bruining. In that book he interviews patients with certain illneses and how it got almost cured with Cannabis oil.

 

[SweetSue]

You don't fully tighten the lids until after they are removed from the heat. Then as they cool, you'll hear the seal go POP, and you know you have a true air-tight seal that will last for years.

If you tighten the lids before you remove them from the heat, they might explode. Air pressure building up inside the jars needs to escape while they are cooking.

This was my concern. We don't want the lids to seal here. The contents will need strained. This step is simply to decarb the fresh buds.

 

[gbauto]

gbauto, have you tried CCO processed into BioBombs? If so, have you tried them as suppositories?

The rock he's throwing your way has no therapeutic weight, in my opinion. There should be a way to come up with a formulation that'll get you through the pain. How can we expect the body to overcome the inflammatory response without additional CBD? Your believe your pain levels are above cannabis at this point, and that may not be true. It may be a matter of formulation and administration.

I wish I was able to endure with the cannabis-the pain has been to much at times. Unfortunately, all of my neighboring state's are just as backward as GA. I hope that I'll be able to find a compassionate MD who will help me... And I can really relate to plowing into a tree...

 

[SweetSue]

I wish I was able to endure with the cannabis-the pain has been to much at times. Unfortunately, all of my neighboring state's are just as backward as GA. I hope that I'll be able to find a compassionate MD who will help me... And I can really relate to plowing into a tree...

I'll have a word with cosmic forces and anticipate your finding that compassionate MD. Find one that understands the synergy of cannabis and opioids.

 

[SweetSue]

Topicals leave no trace and can be surprisingly effective for quick relief.

 

[Oldbear]

You don't fully tighten the lids until after they are removed from the heat. Then as they cool, you'll hear the seal go POP, and you know you have a true air-tight seal that will last for years.

If you tighten the lids before you remove them from the heat, they might explode. Air pressure building up inside the jars needs to escape while they are cooking.

Hole hell AKGramma is soooo right.

With lid sealed, you would have a pressure cooker inside a pressure cooker. That's bad because of explosion risk. Perhaps worse is the temperature inside the jar would be higher still because of the pressure. That messes up the entire time and temperature equation.

 

[gbauto]

Just got back from the ortho surgeon for a follow up-I told her of my concerns with going back on the opiates. I also asked why or who is preventing MD's in GA from not testing for THC-turns out it's both the DEA(who woulda thunk?) and GA Composite Medical Board. I have examined the GCMB regs and all it says for testing is to verify compliance that the patient IS taking the med prescribed. So it looks like the doc is the one with a thorn in his ass...

 

[Oldbear]

Gbauto I'm troubled by your situation.

I'm wondering who does these tests and what's the process? Is your doc going to request additional tests or is it just a bluff?

Also CBD from hemp is legal in Georgia. Have you tried that?

 

[SweetSue]

Just got back from the ortho surgeon for a follow up-I told her of my concerns with going back on the opiates. I also asked why or who is preventing MD's in GA from not testing for THC-turns out it's both the DEA(who woulda thunk?) and GA Composite Medical Board. I have examined the GCMB regs and all it says for testing is to verify compliance that the patient IS taking the med prescribed. So it looks like the doc is the one with a thorn in his ass...

My friend's problem last year was that the cannabis was so much more effective that he didn't have any of the prescribed meds in his system when they tested. Those drugs exit the system in less time. Instead of being happy that a better management drug was available in a legal state, the doctor determined the patient was dealing drugs. At that point it became nasty and he began testing for cannabis and insisting there be no residue or no opioids would be prescribed. You can't simply stop taking these drugs.

Problem was the opioids and the cannabis were working together when pain spiked. The doctor didn't care about that. So my friend would go off cannabis for a month ahead, take opioids for the two days before the visit and suffer during the time between.

It's a power play in too many cases that ignores established science.

How do we make the change in perception? Take the control back to the patient and listen to the science? They don't know about the ECS, and this makes all the difference in the conversation. But if you refuse to hear truth because it challenges your preconceived ideas, no progress can be made, and in this case people suffer needlessly.

There're too many people caught in this "pain management " madness. There has to be a way through this to relief.

 

[kelticBlue]

Pets respond well to cannabinoid therapies. Research carefully on doses. Like humans, the rule is start at a sub-therapeutic level to give the ECS time to adjust. keltic has been treating his cat for over a year now, I believe. He may have some pointers to share with you.

I got some size 0 caps, but now I'm wondering if I want to cut down on a dose I enjoy this much. To be honest, the smaller caps were really for the daughter. Lol! I'm hoping to ease her into the DDA oil. We'll be running out of her Candy Cane brownies this week, and I don't want her to have to go without the larger dose of THC. If the DDA suits her she can supplement with a couple capsules throughout the day.

She says it's not a big deal if we run out, but we all know better, don't we?

SHIVER

Listening to the Q&A I caught something that slipped past me last time. Samantha's company markets their Vape pens with controlled doses. Great idea. I was thrilled to hear it was finally being presented to doctors.

Then she described the consistent response of the doctors to her presentation. "You know, this is the first thing I can feel comfortable prescribing for my patients. I can tell them the number of doses and get consistent results."

Doctors love "consistent results."

I am so far behind here. so sorry.

Doctors love "consistent results."

"if it cannot be measured = it will not be funded"

My kitten, 15 years and still with us, attitude and all. He was having seizures, kidney failure, hyper thyroid, and small slow growth intestinal cancer. One year later still going and no seizures.

We dont want to get the pet high with thc, so it is my preference to use fresh trim leaves and small in mature bud and do a coconut infusion at low temperature for 36 hours for a CBD benefit. There are now multiple commercial pet CBD oils and such legal in the 50 us.

side question?
How do you know when a sponsor is no longer one? I dont want to mess with the karma here.

So someone has has some 'cannawell pet blend oil'. I have seen it from alaska cannabis exchange with full spectrum cbd oil for pets. I have also recently seen doggie chews.
My little cat is maybe 6-8 pounds, he gets 3-5 drops of the end of a spoon once a day. it seems to mellow him but that is the only thing I notice. he doesn't sleep any more than normal and is very active jumping and prancing like always has.
Against my advice, wife mentioned it to our Vet, Vet was not happy about it. Possible counter interactions I understand, blah blah.

I think there are some others here who treat their dogs, but cannot think of one right now.
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