I may have to try it thenI could be talked into a trip to Wallyworld for that.What a relief! Lol!
My next harvest will be in about a month.
Do we have guide lines for the pressure cooker processing...don't remember reading about it
SweetSue's Cannabis Oil Study Hall
- Thread starter SweetSue
- Start date
Do we have guide lines for the pressure cooker processing...don't remember reading about it
- Thread starter
- #4,342
I covered it in the fresh harvest thread. Somewhere in the first couple posts PsyCro explains his method.
Hey guys, want to join the conversation?
When I Started
Lady Dory
Well-Known Member
Hi SweetSue!
I was so totally enthralled by Dr. Sanchez presentation, I went and watched several more. I just wish they would date the vids. In watching them, out of order, it would have been nice to see the progression and research advancements in order. No matter, Dr. Sanchez is dynamic and enjoyable to watch. So much of what she said was exciting in the future of treating cancers.
Thank you for finding this vid!!! It really makes me wish I were back in the lab doing research, too. My kitchen will now become that place, and hopefully will be able to contribute along side of you and others here in a few months. Keeping good notes, is immensely helpful to pass along to members that seek how to help themselves or a loved one. It's just sad when some one comes here, to 420, to find top notch sources for information, get answers to questions, learn how to set up to grow & harvest, then make oil, is a few months away...
Tomorrow, I will continue reading studies and watching more YouTube vids... there are some really dynamic Cannabis researchers and I want to see their presentations. I find it incredible that only now there are human studies being done. I can't wait for results... just an exciting time for this retired biologist.
Crush to Dory: "Well, you never really know... but when they know, you know, y'know?"
Dory
Chew
Well-Known Member
Hey peeps,
Just attempting my first proper run of ND Sap
Im not sure how long this takes to evaporate but as soon as i'm done, i'll let you know the outcome. I used 71 grams of CBD Skunk Haze and 65 grams of pre 98 Bubba Kush, all mixed together.
Really looking forward to the outcome of this. I hope it worth the wait!
Just attempting my first proper run of ND Sap
Im not sure how long this takes to evaporate but as soon as i'm done, i'll let you know the outcome. I used 71 grams of CBD Skunk Haze and 65 grams of pre 98 Bubba Kush, all mixed together.
Really looking forward to the outcome of this. I hope it worth the wait!
Hey Chew,
I've never heard of ND Sap before. Would you consider telling me more? I tried googling it, and am guessing it's not anything to do with North Dakota sap. (or maybe it does). I like to try new things!
I've never heard of ND Sap before. Would you consider telling me more? I tried googling it, and am guessing it's not anything to do with North Dakota sap. (or maybe it does). I like to try new things!
- Thread starter
- #4,346
Hey peeps,
Just attempting my first proper run of ND Sap
Im not sure how long this takes to evaporate but as soon as i'm done, i'll let you know the outcome. I used 71 grams of CBD Skunk Haze and 65 grams of pre 98 Bubba Kush, all mixed together.
Really looking forward to the outcome of this. I hope it worth the wait!
Oh Chew, you have me all giddy with excitement.
I'll have to set an alarm on my phone. How long do you estimate it'll take? - Thread starter
- #4,347
I have this Chew.
Rso, Qwiso, Qwet, And Naturally Decarbed Sap-Tincture, Concentrates, And Other Essential Plant Oils - By: Grow Goddess
We stumbled upon Gigi at this link. For a time she joined our team, but she wasn't comfortable here, for personal reasons, and she's fixing up her own site. The information still exists on her Naturally Decarbed Sap oil. She uses no heat in the process, so there's less loss to the terpene profile. She allows the ethanol solvent to evaporate slowly and then lets the resulting oil, which resembles sap in its consistency, decarb naturally over a few month's time.
She claims the resulting product is superior in potency and medicinal values, much like my own contention about the fresh harvest infused oil, and for the same reasons, the retention of the terpenes.
KR and Chew were interested enough to start a batch of their own, so we can more throughly investigate the values of this new process.
Chew
Well-Known Member
Oh Chew, you have me all giddy with excitement.
I have this Chew.
Rso, Qwiso, Qwet, And Naturally Decarbed Sap-Tincture, Concentrates, And Other Essential Plant Oils - By: Grow Goddess
We stumbled upon Gigi at this link. For a time she joined our team, but she wasn't comfortable here, for personal reasons, and she's fixing up her own site. The information still exists on her Naturally Decarbed Sap oil. She uses no heat in the process, so there's less loss to the terpene profile. She allows the ethanol solvent to evaporate slowly and then lets the resulting oil, which resembles sap in its consistency, decarb naturally over a few month's time.
She claims the resulting product is superior in potency and medicinal values, much like my own contention about the fresh harvest infused oil, and for the same reasons, the retention of the terpenes.
KR and Chew were interested enough to start a batch of their own, so we can more throughly investigate the values of this new process.
Thanks Sue
Yeah, I'm pretty excited too. I love the colour, if it stays like that I'll be most pleased
The way its evaporating, I would think at least another 24hrs. Hopefully not too long
KingstonRabbi
Well-Known Member
Batch I made was about a third of Chew's batch. In food dehydrator without heat it took a little over 12 hours I think. Surface area seems to be biggest factor. I used 12" SS tray filled about 1 cm deep.
I may have let it evaporate too long. It ended up hard at room temp, like hard plastic. Slightly warmed it was easy to scrape off pan but still solid enough to pop off scraper without sticky remnants left behind. At about 5 months it was still decarbing, best guess about 50%. Now at 6 months it's a little stronger, ratio of THC to THCa has tipped.
I think Gigi used still, maybe not, but if she did that adds enough heat for decarb to start, which shortens decarb period. This batch seems to be on pace for a year compared to her reported 3-6 months. Batches of CCO I've made since then I've used still because grain alcohol is too expensive to evaporate away except for this one experiment. I still use dehydrator to remove last of solvent instead of oil bath and then let it decarb naturally after that.
I started out just trying to replicate Gigi's finished results but this has evolved into slightly different experiment. I like the effect of partially decarbed oil. I made it into 25 mg capsules, which fully decarbed would be a good recreational dose for me. I didn['t get the high I expected on first trial, but I felt really good, very relaxed but not sedated at all. I'm still processing the fresh infused oil I made with same strain (Black Cherry Soda). Pressure cooker probably decarbed most of it, but if not I'll keep some partially decarbed to compare with ND batch.
Edit: checked Gigi's site and she uses coffee warmer and 99% isopropyl alcohol. So not quite as much heat as still, but some heat that will have slight effect on total decarb time.
I may have let it evaporate too long. It ended up hard at room temp, like hard plastic. Slightly warmed it was easy to scrape off pan but still solid enough to pop off scraper without sticky remnants left behind. At about 5 months it was still decarbing, best guess about 50%. Now at 6 months it's a little stronger, ratio of THC to THCa has tipped.
I think Gigi used still, maybe not, but if she did that adds enough heat for decarb to start, which shortens decarb period. This batch seems to be on pace for a year compared to her reported 3-6 months. Batches of CCO I've made since then I've used still because grain alcohol is too expensive to evaporate away except for this one experiment. I still use dehydrator to remove last of solvent instead of oil bath and then let it decarb naturally after that.
I started out just trying to replicate Gigi's finished results but this has evolved into slightly different experiment. I like the effect of partially decarbed oil. I made it into 25 mg capsules, which fully decarbed would be a good recreational dose for me. I didn['t get the high I expected on first trial, but I felt really good, very relaxed but not sedated at all. I'm still processing the fresh infused oil I made with same strain (Black Cherry Soda). Pressure cooker probably decarbed most of it, but if not I'll keep some partially decarbed to compare with ND batch.
Edit: checked Gigi's site and she uses coffee warmer and 99% isopropyl alcohol. So not quite as much heat as still, but some heat that will have slight effect on total decarb time.
This is kind of off topic but I'm sure you might have some input.
Has anyone made food with cco instead of infused oil?
Does is lose the plant flavor?
Dad got some not so positive news and I only have a small amount right now for him,so I want to spread it as far as possible but suppositories are not a option at this point.
Has anyone made food with cco instead of infused oil?
Does is lose the plant flavor?
Dad got some not so positive news and I only have a small amount right now for him,so I want to spread it as far as possible but suppositories are not a option at this point.
- Thread starter
- #4,351
In answer to the first question, no. Haven't baked anything, but yes, have ingested it as a food addition. My first experience with CCO was the recipe for smoothies that Cajun shared with me. Probably the best use from a perspective of treating cancer is to try the CannaBudwig, incorporating CCO into cottage cheese and freshly-ground flax seed. This combination reportedly creates oxygenation of the cells that's a toxic environment for cancer cells.
The smoothie recipe that I used is potent as hell, and if you're interested in checking it out you'll find it here, but suppositories will always be the best way to get the cannabinoid load you want for cancer treatment. There's just no way to get those levels of THC through the gut and still be fully functional, I don't care who you are.
Chew
Well-Known Member
ND Sap update
Well, mine doesn't resemble Gigi's Sap in the slightest
After all i done to remove the moisture from the buds, I was still left with a puddle of milky liquid. Perhaps it's the humidity where i live? I don't know, but the ISO is 99.9% and the buds just crumbled they were so dry.
I made 1x 2 min wash and still yielded 10% (give or take a smidge) The ISO took around 24 hrs to evaporate with a fan to assist. To rid the remaining water, i wrapped the pan in plastic wrap (cling film over here) and added some silica packs. It seemed like all the water had gone so i added a very mild heat using a water bath so i could work with it.
It turns out there is still water in the oil, i placed 10 grams into glass vials without lids, placed them into a curing jar with a silica pack. I hope that draws out the remainder of the water.
Once the water has gone, i'll place the lids on and watch for continued decarbing. Ive knocked up some 20:1 using just coconut oil and will give it a blast later. The bud is 4.5 months old so it shouldn't be fully decarbed which i dont mind anyway
You can clearly see the water here. I took a small amount of oil and held a flame to it. it didn't burn so im guessing the ISO has gone.
20:1 mix
I'll let you know this evening how that dose works out for me
Edit: I've just messaged Gigi. Hopefully she'll be able to offer some assistance as to what's going on here...
Well, mine doesn't resemble Gigi's Sap in the slightest
After all i done to remove the moisture from the buds, I was still left with a puddle of milky liquid. Perhaps it's the humidity where i live? I don't know, but the ISO is 99.9% and the buds just crumbled they were so dry.I made 1x 2 min wash and still yielded 10% (give or take a smidge) The ISO took around 24 hrs to evaporate with a fan to assist. To rid the remaining water, i wrapped the pan in plastic wrap (cling film over here) and added some silica packs. It seemed like all the water had gone so i added a very mild heat using a water bath so i could work with it.
It turns out there is still water in the oil, i placed 10 grams into glass vials without lids, placed them into a curing jar with a silica pack. I hope that draws out the remainder of the water.
Once the water has gone, i'll place the lids on and watch for continued decarbing. Ive knocked up some 20:1 using just coconut oil and will give it a blast later. The bud is 4.5 months old so it shouldn't be fully decarbed which i dont mind anyway
You can clearly see the water here. I took a small amount of oil and held a flame to it. it didn't burn so im guessing the ISO has gone.
20:1 mix
I'll let you know this evening how that dose works out for me
Edit: I've just messaged Gigi. Hopefully she'll be able to offer some assistance as to what's going on here...
- Thread starter
- #4,353
Regimen Updates:
The BIL reports steady improvements. He's been able to walk to the store without pain, something he'd given up any hopes of ever doing again. He also reports continued sound sleep. I can't even begin to tell you how much better his mood is. This man has been belligerent and difficult to talk to the entire time I've known him, and right now you'd never believe that attitude could have come from him. It's like night and day. He's impressed with how much more positive his moods are now. It's become more peaceful living above him, I'll tell you that.
He chooses happier TV shows than he was choosing before we started working on a regimen for him. I know this because I can hear the tv through my floor.
At this point I have him taking two Dark Devil Capsules in the morning and two CBD Critical Cure capsules in the evening. He uses the pain cream on his feet morning and night and he's smoking Carnival because he can.
He finds comfort in the ceremony of smoking his pipe. I gave him a DiVinci vaporizer to play around with, and he's learning to appreciate it, although he prefers the high he gets from the pipe.
My goal with him is to get one more dose in during the day, to try for every eight hours instead of every ten, but then again, this fresh harvest infused oil is so potent that the span he works with now may be oK. We have no way of testing to check. PA hasn't progressed to the point where medical cannabis is available, much less educating doctors in working with the ECS. Most doctors still have no idea we even have endocannabinoid systems.
The daughter has found her sweet spot and it includes a steady supply of indica brownies. Unfortunately she only has one brownie left and another four months until harvest.
I wasn't expecting her to take to THC so quickly. I have two indica strains growing right now and another seed in the water as we speak, but she's looking at a dry spell that I'll do everything in my power to avoid in the future.
She had a breakthrough moment recently where she was able to stop a panic attack with rational thinking. This never happened to her before. She'd missed her capsules for a couple days, enjoying the brownies enough that she simply forgot to take all of them on schedule, so her levels were off. When she was settling the monthly bills the panic set in that they'd run out of money. Typically this cascades into a full-blown panic attack. This hadn't happened since she'd started the regimen last year, but this was the first time she'd missed so many doses.
As the panic started to spiral she said her mind suddenly went "What's going to happen? All the bills are paid, there's money for food and necessities and you even have a little extra playing money, so what are you worrying about?"
It snapped her right out of the downward spiral and brought her back to now. Now, where everything was manageable.
I take this as a sign that we're making headway in healing her confused and anxious brain, that instead of simply managing symptoms we're actually creating an environment that's healing the neurotransmitter system that's causing this anxiety.
I also learned that she was so anxious before she started using brownies for the additional THC she went to the movies, but didn't really enjoy the complete experience, losing detail and nuance to the constant anxious chatter in her brain, planning escape in case of disaster, worrying about whether the apartment would catch fire while she was gone..... the million little useless things the anxious brain tortures itself with.
Then she discovered that she enjoyed going out with a mild buzz and tried a bite of brownie before heading to the theater. It was the movie experience she'd always hoped for. Bolstered by the extra THC she's relaxed and calm, completely free of anxiety. This being "normal" when she leaves the apartment fascinates her. It's gonna be rough going without. I'm hoping she can tolerate small doses of Carnival or Dark Devil Auto, because that's all that'll be on hand for months.
We determined that the CBD Critical Cure capsules effect us so differently because she's much heavier than I am, so today we bumped her up to two capsules a dose, or eight capsules a day. She immediately felt an undercurrent of euphoria where none had been before. If we can get her balanced on these capsules the temporary loss of brownie treats won't be the concern it looks like. I have a feeling I can get her dose effects to mirror my own, and she won't need supplementation at all if I can.
She shared this video with me. It just makes you wonder what those who make the rules we're supposed to follow are thinking when they say there's no medicinal value to cannabis.
I Tried Medical Marijuana For My Chronic Pain - YouTube
The BIL reports steady improvements. He's been able to walk to the store without pain, something he'd given up any hopes of ever doing again.
He also reports continued sound sleep. I can't even begin to tell you how much better his mood is. This man has been belligerent and difficult to talk to the entire time I've known him, and right now you'd never believe that attitude could have come from him. It's like night and day. He's impressed with how much more positive his moods are now. It's become more peaceful living above him, I'll tell you that. He chooses happier TV shows than he was choosing before we started working on a regimen for him. I know this because I can hear the tv through my floor.
At this point I have him taking two Dark Devil Capsules in the morning and two CBD Critical Cure capsules in the evening. He uses the pain cream on his feet morning and night and he's smoking Carnival because he can.
He finds comfort in the ceremony of smoking his pipe. I gave him a DiVinci vaporizer to play around with, and he's learning to appreciate it, although he prefers the high he gets from the pipe. My goal with him is to get one more dose in during the day, to try for every eight hours instead of every ten, but then again, this fresh harvest infused oil is so potent that the span he works with now may be oK. We have no way of testing to check. PA hasn't progressed to the point where medical cannabis is available, much less educating doctors in working with the ECS. Most doctors still have no idea we even have endocannabinoid systems.
The daughter has found her sweet spot and it includes a steady supply of indica brownies. Unfortunately she only has one brownie left and another four months until harvest.
I wasn't expecting her to take to THC so quickly. I have two indica strains growing right now and another seed in the water as we speak, but she's looking at a dry spell that I'll do everything in my power to avoid in the future. She had a breakthrough moment recently where she was able to stop a panic attack with rational thinking. This never happened to her before. She'd missed her capsules for a couple days, enjoying the brownies enough that she simply forgot to take all of them on schedule, so her levels were off. When she was settling the monthly bills the panic set in that they'd run out of money. Typically this cascades into a full-blown panic attack. This hadn't happened since she'd started the regimen last year, but this was the first time she'd missed so many doses.
As the panic started to spiral she said her mind suddenly went "What's going to happen? All the bills are paid, there's money for food and necessities and you even have a little extra playing money, so what are you worrying about?"
It snapped her right out of the downward spiral and brought her back to now. Now, where everything was manageable.
I take this as a sign that we're making headway in healing her confused and anxious brain, that instead of simply managing symptoms we're actually creating an environment that's healing the neurotransmitter system that's causing this anxiety.
I also learned that she was so anxious before she started using brownies for the additional THC she went to the movies, but didn't really enjoy the complete experience, losing detail and nuance to the constant anxious chatter in her brain, planning escape in case of disaster, worrying about whether the apartment would catch fire while she was gone..... the million little useless things the anxious brain tortures itself with.
Then she discovered that she enjoyed going out with a mild buzz and tried a bite of brownie before heading to the theater. It was the movie experience she'd always hoped for. Bolstered by the extra THC she's relaxed and calm, completely free of anxiety. This being "normal" when she leaves the apartment fascinates her. It's gonna be rough going without. I'm hoping she can tolerate small doses of Carnival or Dark Devil Auto, because that's all that'll be on hand for months.
We determined that the CBD Critical Cure capsules effect us so differently because she's much heavier than I am, so today we bumped her up to two capsules a dose, or eight capsules a day. She immediately felt an undercurrent of euphoria where none had been before. If we can get her balanced on these capsules the temporary loss of brownie treats won't be the concern it looks like. I have a feeling I can get her dose effects to mirror my own, and she won't need supplementation at all if I can.
She shared this video with me. It just makes you wonder what those who make the rules we're supposed to follow are thinking when they say there's no medicinal value to cannabis.
I Tried Medical Marijuana For My Chronic Pain - YouTube
So reporting back I quickly gained tolerance to the fresh oil. Pretty much I put that up to being an edibles noob so any would have gotten me burnt in the beginning lol.
I redecarbed it in the oven (not optimal for sure) and as long as I stirred I got quite a few bubbles. But I know we are also degrading thc using this method. The resulting oil was much stronger. So by itself I agree the boiling water is just too low a temp to decarb effectively.
I don't want to use an oil bath because I know with my small kitchen and lack of a good stove vent it will be a mess. I also don't want to add any water if I don't have to. I have always felt water in my extractions pulls out water soluble compounds that really make the taste of the resulting oil off putting for me. So a pressure cooker is out.
The sous vide will work but only with pre decarbed bud. Which won't be useable for fresh harvest oil.
But I was thinking. I'm gonna have to see what Ziggs thinks about his nova decarb. It says it can decarb wet or dry cannabis with minimal terp loss. I could put the fresh cannabis in there and then make fresh harvest oil in the water bath. What do you think?
I love ingesting cannabis. I never thought I would like it so much. But it really helps my lower back much more than smoking. And by microdosing I can stay functional too. Makes trimming much easier on my body.
I redecarbed it in the oven (not optimal for sure) and as long as I stirred I got quite a few bubbles. But I know we are also degrading thc using this method. The resulting oil was much stronger. So by itself I agree the boiling water is just too low a temp to decarb effectively.
I don't want to use an oil bath because I know with my small kitchen and lack of a good stove vent it will be a mess. I also don't want to add any water if I don't have to. I have always felt water in my extractions pulls out water soluble compounds that really make the taste of the resulting oil off putting for me. So a pressure cooker is out.
The sous vide will work but only with pre decarbed bud. Which won't be useable for fresh harvest oil.
But I was thinking. I'm gonna have to see what Ziggs thinks about his nova decarb. It says it can decarb wet or dry cannabis with minimal terp loss. I could put the fresh cannabis in there and then make fresh harvest oil in the water bath. What do you think?
I love ingesting cannabis. I never thought I would like it so much. But it really helps my lower back much more than smoking. And by microdosing I can stay functional too. Makes trimming much easier on my body.
- Thread starter
- #4,355
Fresh harvest oil takes four time the weight in buds. The Nova will only decarb so much at once. 100 grams wet is the smallest batch I make. How long would it take to decarb that amount?
The next concern is how do you remove the water bound up in the plant? That part could be done in the water bath, as in your first attempt. Then you only need to strain and use, after the 24 hour rest in the fridge that is.
Have you considered low and slow drying, then decarb in the oven in a roasting bag? We're not sure if the bag retains the terpenes that evaporate during decarb, and that's why we toss the bag into the freezer for an hour when it comes out of the oven. But the low and slow retains the terpenes and the flavonoids, so that may offset any loss from the decarb.
It's good to hear that the capsules are working for pain management. You're close to living relatively pain free. You realize that, don't you?
Ok so how about this. I take a half gallon mason and fill it halfway with the fresh cannabis and seal it then decarb in the pressure cooker. Then I can do the water bath style extraction as before.
Hey KR, did you happen to take pictures and post your instructions for doing the natural decarb with your dehydrator? I'd be interested in seeing it if it's posted somewhere.
- Thread starter
- #4,358
I don't know if I'd tighten the lid, but I'm not familiar with pressure cookers. That might work Shiggity. it's a novel approach, but I can't think of a reason it wouldn't work.
Why not do the water extraction like you did the first time, then decarb in the pressure cooker?
- Thread starter
- #4,359
Shiggity, the original mention of the pressure cooker was to make CCO first and then decarb in the pressure cooker instead of the oil bath. The method I suggested above is the fresh oil approach to that.
You mentioned the water in the pressure cooker would make it unpalatable to you. If you're using the oil in capsules the taste isn't an issue.
You mentioned the water in the pressure cooker would make it unpalatable to you. If you're using the oil in capsules the taste isn't an issue.
My thinking is that at 15psi the temperature of boiling water goes to 250F. If I maintain 15 psi it will be a very regulated temperature of 250F the whole time. The air inside the jar would stay exactly 250 and make it a very precise decarb. The terps would stay in the jar with everything else. Then after out of the pressure cooker the jar could be cooled. Then oil can be added to the same jar for a 1 hour boil.