Shiggityflip - Follow The Yellow Brix Road With The Perfect Sun 1000

ShiggityFlip said:
Of course I can tell up close. Lots of leaves with browned interveinal tissue which can mean root issues or pH swings. Still they have done their best for me and some girls have outdone themselves showing more trichs than I have ever seen them put out. There is also this new girl BOGSeeds sour bubble whom is singlehandedly stealing the show. In the top picture of the one you just quoted she is the one on the bottom of the frame. Here is a closeup!

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You just demonstrated what I've been proving all along - abuse pays off in a big way with cannabis. Of course my form of abuse is ineptitude born of inexperience, not anything as critical as your adventure. My plants that had mites and terrible temperature swings offered some of the most potent oil. The plant a while back that I snapped the stalk in half midway through flowering gave me softball-sized buds near the soil surface that were knock-you-over potent. Those are just two occurances. The implications of all this didn't slip by me.

I've been trying for a while now to figure out at what points in development you could stress the plant and create more potency without going too far. The essential oils trick Cajun shared with us that's used by professional grows is one way to do it, and I have some, but I don't want to mess with the beauty of the kit by adding anything like that in.
 
It's so good to have you back. :kisstwo:
 
SweetSue said:
You just demonstrated what I've been proving all along - abuse pays off in a big way with cannabis. Of course my form of abuse is ineptitude born of inexperience, not anything as critical as your adventure. My plants that had mites and terrible temperature swings offered some of the most potent oil. The plant a while back that I snapped the stalk in half midway through flowering gave me softball-sized buds near the soil surface that were knock-you-over potent. Those are just two occurances. The implications of all this didn't slip by me.

I've been trying for a while now to figure out at what points in development you could stress the plant and create more potency without going too far. The essential oils trick Cajun shared with us that's used by professional grows is one way to do it, and I have some, but I don't want to mess with the beauty of the kit by adding anything like that in.
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I think spraying brix on the plants can accomplish a lot of what those essential oils do...the plant wonders why it suddenly got shat upon. :rofl:
In general I think a lot of the stressors that increase potency may do so at a cost of stunting the yield. I can see I won't get as much as I would have expected from a truly healthy run, so I do hope it's more potent. Still these girls saved my life basically so I have to thank them for my return to the living. And a return to my very awesome 420mag family. :yahoo:
 
Fantastic light Shiggity! Thanks for the u tube recommendation...I will be following.

As far as stressing plants for more potency, I think there's good stress and bad stress. I could be off base but it just makes sense. Exercise is good stress for our bodies......break it down to build it stronger, kinda like lst? The stress of not being able to pay bills or a sick child/family member is bad stress and not good for us at all......like powdery mildew or bad environment. I'm not sure what category pests fall in. The plant makes trichomes to defend itself so it makes sense that pest pressure could increase trichome production but at what cost to terps......maybe none, don't know.
 
neikodog said:
Fantastic light Shiggity! Thanks for the u tube recommendation...I will be following.

As far as stressing plants for more potency, I think there's good stress and bad stress. I could be off base but it just makes sense. Exercise is good stress for our bodies......break it down to build it stronger, kinda like lst? The stress of not being able to pay bills or a sick child/family member is bad stress and not good for us at all......like powdery mildew or bad environment. I'm not sure what category pests fall in. The plant makes trichomes to defend itself so it makes sense that pest pressure could increase trichome production but at what cost to terps......maybe none, don't know.
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I totally agree Neiko. You said it awesomely. I just try and make them stress free and let fate bring the stress lol. UVB is a great example of what you are talking about. So far I have been unwilling to use it though. UVA seems a much safer bet.
 
ShiggityFlip said:
I totally agree Neiko. You said it awesomely. I just try and make them stress free and let fate bring the stress lol. UVB is a great example of what you are talking about. So far I have been unwilling to use it though. UVA seems a much safer bet.
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During the health summit I watched recently there was a panel of "expert growers." I smiled all the way through their panel, because we share much more practical information here on a bad day, but what caught my attention was one contending that we pamper our plants, when it would be more beneficial to take them to the edge more often, because it's stress that ramps up trichome production. In the outdoors it's the environments on the edge that produce the most diversified terpene profiles, the areas that tend to dry out more frequently, or have visits from grazers, or get insects picking away at them.

It fired up my memories of all the "mistakes" I've made that resulted in more potency and stronger smells, indicators of improved terpene expression.
 
ShiggityFlip said:
Yeti I think the CMH lights are fantastic. I have 5 in the grow room right now, 4 eshines, and my perfect sun 1000. The CMH lights make the plants happy. 3 in a 4x8 would be pretty sweet! I am pretty much doing that with 3 of them right now. It is the foreground of these next three pictures. There are also two CMH bordering my perfect sun in the center of the back row.



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:thanks: for giving me a look at what they are capable of. I have been up in the air about whether I should go that route or LEDs. I can get the CMH setups for about 400 locally. What gives me pause is they are not air cooled hoods and the ballast is mounted on the hood. It can already get warm in the tent and part of the reason I have been wanting to go this way is to help mitigate heat issues. I worry that even with the reduced wattage they will add more heat than the air cooled 600's do. Because of this I am also debating going the LED route but i am yet to find an LED that will cover close to a 4x4 space for the same money. I know the CMH is rated for a 3x3 area but feel that it will cover a 4x4 sufficiently with a little help from a cheap led I already have. Sorry for the lengthy post and jacking your thread, I have just been looking for the opinion of someone that has real life experience with these lights before I spend the money :Namaste:
 
ShiggityFlip said:
Of course I can tell up close. Lots of leaves with browned interveinal tissue which can mean root issues or pH swings. Still they have done their best for me and some girls have outdone themselves showing more trichs than I have ever seen them put out. There is also this new girl BOGSeeds sour bubble whom is singlehandedly stealing the show. In the top picture of the one you just quoted she is the one on the bottom of the frame. Here is a closeup!

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Man Shiggs she is looking pretty! I have been looking at sour bubble seeds for a while now. I spent my seed budget on Dynasty's Blue MagooBX2 and Bluniverse recently but if I get the chance this is something else I want to run. I got some sour bubble about 6 or 7 years ago now and it was magnificent. I had quite the tolerance at the time and it still only took little amounts to get me where I wanted to be. :thumb:
 
TheGreenYeti said:
:thanks: for giving me a look at what they are capable of. I have been up in the air about whether I should go that route or LEDs. I can get the CMH setups for about 400 locally. What gives me pause is they are not air cooled hoods and the ballast is mounted on the hood. It can already get warm in the tent and part of the reason I have been wanting to go this way is to help mitigate heat issues. I worry that even with the reduced wattage they will add more heat than the air cooled 600's do. Because of this I am also debating going the LED route but i am yet to find an LED that will cover close to a 4x4 space for the same money. I know the CMH is rated for a 3x3 area but feel that it will cover a 4x4 sufficiently with a little help from a cheap led I already have. Sorry for the lengthy post and jacking your thread, I have just been looking for the opinion of someone that has real life experience with these lights before I spend the money :Namaste:
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A CMH with a little help would certainly cover a 4x4. 3 in a 4x8 would be even more amazing. I know they are not air cooled but think about a few things. The CMH are 315w. 315 x 3 = 945w if you had two 600w hps that is 1200w. The CMH is also more efficient than the 600w hps so less heat is produced per watt than hps. If you can run two 600s air cooled I would bet you won't have an issue running the 3 CMH. Put them a little higher to hit 4x4 and you would be good to go. With the energy saved by running about 250 less watts you could run a stronger exhaust fan in the tent if need be. Stage has had success running two 315w CMH in a 4x 8 with an LED in the middle but he is switching over to Cree cobs.
 
ShiggityFlip said:
A CMH with a little help would certainly cover a 4x4. 3 in a 4x8 would be even more amazing. I know they are not air cooled but think about a few things. The CMH are 315w. 315 x 3 = 945w if you had two 600w hps that is 1200w. The CMH is also more efficient than the 600w hps so less heat is produced per watt than hps. If you can run two 600s air cooled I would bet you won't have an issue running the 3 CMH. Put them a little higher to hit 4x4 and you would be good to go. With the energy saved by running about 250 less watts you could run a stronger exhaust fan in the tent if need be. Stage has had success running two 315w CMH in a 4x 8 with an LED in the middle but he is switching over to Cree cobs.
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Thanks for all of your help Shiggs. When I do switch it will be one light at a time so I can spread out the financial burden. It should help when I start saving money on my electric bill. :high-five:
 
Sunrise day 47 here is a little BOG sour bubble. No filter just CMH light so this color is real! I should finish building the light tomorrow. (Crossing fingers lol).
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So... I've been bitching allot lately about LED lights. You've probably noticed.
I'm almost to the point where I'm going to throw my hat in the ring with you and make my own panels.
I'm really heat focused. I want to build a panel implementing external power supplies (drivers... why do they call power supplies 'drivers' in the LED panel world?) and external air hookups.
There are some issues of course. I'm a little worried about wire length in the external driver configuration. Air flow direction could be a challenge too... but probably not.
Of course, we'll have to see if a lazy Tead ever gets off his ass long enough to do anything... but the plans are brewing at least.
 
Buckshot317 said:
Has some real nice colors shiggs, sour bubble, looks to be a fast finisher.
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Yeah she is supposed to finish around 55days so I will start checking the trichs. Once I start to see a hint of amber she's coming down.
Tead said:
So... I've been bitching allot lately about LED lights. You've probably noticed.
I'm almost to the point where I'm going to throw my hat in the ring with you and make my own panels.
I'm really heat focused. I want to build a panel implementing external power supplies (drivers... why do they call power supplies 'drivers' in the LED panel world?) and external air hookups.
There are some issues of course. I'm a little worried about wire length in the external driver configuration. Air flow direction could be a challenge too... but probably not.
Of course, we'll have to see if a lazy Tead ever gets off his ass long enough to do anything... but the plans are brewing at least.
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Tead high efficiency LED is the answer,especially the new board technology. The individual boards never hit over 100F as long as there is a good circulating fan in the area. So you can put them very close to your plants, even 8-12 inches. Many current manufacturers of grow lights are not as worried about efficiency and heat as we are because no one publishes Btus produced. The conscientious manufacturers do publish efficiency numbers. We want to try and make systems that will run above 60% efficiency. Currently white LEDs are the answer. Cree cxb3590 or bridgelux vero29 gen7 in the cob world, or quantum boards or sunboards in the circuit board world.

I like the sunboards for me because they run the cheapest. If I left the red diodes out of my build it would only cost me about 650 to build a 600 watt light. Pretty much a replacement for a 1000w sodium. A 60% efficiency 1000w build puts out half the heat of a high presssure sodium. But we are running it at about 600-650 watts to match the light output from an hps. Plus instead of a point source for the light we can emit light evenly over the whole grow area.

For instance my 4x4 light will output the same amount of photon flux density (average photon numbers hitting the designated area) as a 100w light. Not just directly under the bulb but also out at the edges.

So all in all think about this:
1. Hps puts out 18% of its light in the IR range so it raises the temperatures more.
2. Hps is less efficient (less than 40%) than efficient white builds (60%). This becomes significant in several ways.
A. More light at same wattage
B. Less heat at same wattage therefore less cooling needed.
C. True full spectrum of light
D. Don't need replacement for 10 years

Also not all LEDs are created equal. Some cheap colored monos can run barely more efficient than Hps! They claim more efficiency than hps but how much more efficient? 2%? Who knows without publishing relevant data. They also lack green and yellow light which are actually used by the plant for many things.

Right now white LEDs supplemented with high efficiency Cree colored LEDs (XPE, XPG), or Osrams seems like the ticket for me. Though white LEDs by themselves work amazingly. After this big light is made I am going to construct a 225w 3 board light that would be perfect for a 2x2 or 2x3 area in flower. It will cost me about about $250 to make.
 
I should have saved the rep hammer for this post. The pretty colors in the Bubblegum made my finger jump to the button first. :laughtwo: Thank you for that explaination. Geez..... this stuff is beginning to make more sense to me. :battingeyelashes:
 
I have heard great things about the Tahoe OG and have some beans from Inhouse that are Tahoe x platinum. I don't have much info on the strawberry but was thinking of adding a strawberry strain. Most likely I will get sour strawberry from BOG since his sour bubble is crazy in my garden.
 
ShiggityFlip said:
I have heard great things about the Tahoe OG and have some beans from Inhouse that are Tahoe x platinum. I don't have much info on the strawberry but was thinking of adding a strawberry strain. Most likely I will get sour strawberry from BOG since his sour bubble is crazy in my garden.
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Inhouse recommended their Switchberry OG for a super fruity strawberry strain. Fem seeds.

I got a pack and am leaning to that, Rainbow Cookies or maybe the Punch x Platinum cross for my next run.
 
Some progress on the light. Got one of the two red bars hooked up to power. 30 minute assembly from a kit on a fast led website.
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