Our Ongoing Grows

[Skybound]

I laugh but only 'cause its the sort of thing i might've tried...
That's how we know what's what, eh SB.?!
After all, somebody once said to themselves "What if I cut the head of this bush"...?!
Stay curious SB.

I'll never NOT be curious and willing to forgo a little pain to learn new things. I have the ability to tweak my nutes pretty much in any way I can imagine, so might as well put that to good use and who knows, maybe I'll find soemthing that produces a better result?

 

[Mr. Krip]

That advise is about 5 weeks late, lol. I think I would have better odds had I just dropped a gallon into the pot like you brixxers do. I mean if the only purpose of it is to trigger a defense that produces more trics, I had to try it while it was in my way of doing so. I learned the hard way that I went too far, but just because I failed the experiment, I don't think that totally disproves the theory and I do wish to retest this theory in a few more months when I'll be better prepared to suffer any loss in yield.

Failing at an experiment is succeeding in learning one way NOT to do it!

 

[Mr. Krip]

I'll never NOT be curious and willing to forgo a little pain to learn new things. I have the ability to tweak my nutes pretty much in any way I can imagine, so might as well put that to good use and who knows, maybe I'll find soemthing that produces a better result?

I agree with this 420% and am confident you'll get to a better result.

Here's the issue I see...

I think it's a "mistake" to try to emulate what Doc is doing in hydro. And I did hydro for 10 years before just starting with Doc's kit a year ago. The primary obstacle is that Doc's entire regimen is based on taking advantage of certain soil bacteria that help accelerate nutrient uptake of the plant. Even the foliars are designed to get the plants to exude substances that kick the soil bacteria into "high gear".

In hydro, you don't have that soil bacteria, so you need to supply the nutrients in a format that's immediately usable/ingestible by the plants.

This, IMHO, is why Doc in some previous posts was encouraging you to focus on the strengths of hydro (@Doc Bud, please feel free to comment! ) instead of trying to use his methods to achieve high brix without medium that's specifically designed for his formulas.

The question then becomes, how do you increase nutrient uptake in hydro? As you know, you can only up PPM's so far, so you can "lead the plants to water, but you can make them drink", so to speak!

Proper environment, especially temps & RH, will play a big factor. Foliar sprays can also help. I would think chelation would help, too, just not sure how to accomplish it unless you get the nutes in chelated form already.

You can also look at introducing beneficial bacteria into the res, which I was never personally a fan of since I've seen too many horror stories when organics get introduced into a reservoir, so I have no experience with, but here's a good article:

How Can Beneficial Bacteria Help Your Hydroponics System?
If you are truly interested in enjoying all of the speedy plant development that your hydroponics system can deliver, you have to think beyond simply setting up a good lighting system and making sure that your nutrient solution is well balanced. You also need to explore ways to increase nutrient uptake enough to increase your plants’ yield. One of the best ways to do this is through beneficial bacteria. These are certain strains of bacteria that are designed to work symbiotically with your plant to increase the nutrient uptake and health of your plants. Here are just a few of the things that these kinds of bacteria can do for you.

Fix Nitrogen – One of the most crucial elements to plant growth is nitrogen, and there is never any lack of nitrogen in the atmosphere. No matter where you live in the world, the large majority of the air you breathe is made up of Nitrogen. But for your plants, this abundant element isn’t really usable as a nutrient. It must be converted somehow into certain kinds of ions. For plants who don’t have the ability to do this on their own, the best way to make this happen is through nitrogen fixing bacteria such as Paenibacillus. These bacteria, when introduced to your nutrient solution can turn that useless N2 into much more useful NH3 or NH4.

Strengthen and Increase Root Size – One of the biggest areas that these beneficial bacteria affect is the roots. As a direct result of the increased nutrient uptake, the roots can become thicker and fuller. This can lead to even more nutrient uptake and a healthier plant overall.

Germinate Beneficial Fungi – Certain beneficial bacteria can even help create other kinds of beneficial organic material in you r root zone and reservoir. Certain kind of fungi have the ability to make your nutrient solution more usable for your plant and can fight off unwanted biological elements in your nutrient solution. Many strains of bacteria can actually help speed the germination and development of these kinds of fungi, allowing them to bring the most development to your reservoir. If you use a product that has these fungi with another hydroponic product that has the bacteria, you can be assured that these biological agents will be working to their full potential to protect and enhance your plants.

Increase Cloning Success Rate – There is nothing more frustrating than to enter your grow room and discover that the majority of the cuttings in your cloning tray have died. Many people use products that contain beneficial bacteria to create a more favorable environment for those young, vulnerable, early forming roots. Increasing the nutrient uptake during these early stages is crucial for success.

Make Foliar Sprays More Effective – Foliar sprays are a fantastic way to increase the amount of nutrients that your plants are receiving, but introducing that much moisture to your leaves can encourage the formation of mold and mildew. Certain bacterial strains, when added to foliar spray, can fight this off by giving mold and mildew less of a chance to form and harm your leaves.

The entire brix crowd is very knowledgeable and are great people to learn from. I just think you need to apply that knowledge in a different way in hydro.

 

[Skybound]

I agree with this 420% and am confident you'll get to a better result.

Here's the issue I see...

I think it's a "mistake" to try to emulate what Doc is doing in hydro. And I did hydro for 10 years before just starting with Doc's kit a year ago. The primary obstacle is that Doc's entire regimen is based on taking advantage of certain soil bacteria that help accelerate nutrient uptake of the plant. Even the foliars are designed to get the plants to exude substances that kick the soil bacteria into "high gear".

In hydro, you don't have that soil bacteria, so you need to supply the nutrients in a format that's immediately usable/ingestible by the plants.

This, IMHO, is why Doc in some previous posts was encouraging you to focus on the strengths of hydro (@Doc Bud, please feel free to comment! ) instead of trying to use his methods to achieve high brix without medium that's specifically designed for his formulas.

The question then becomes, how do you increase nutrient uptake in hydro? As you know, you can only up PPM's so far, so you can "lead the plants to water, but you can make them drink", so to speak!

Proper environment, especially temps & RH, will play a big factor. Foliar sprays can also help. I would think chelation would help, too, just not sure how to accomplish it unless you get the nutes in chelated form already.

You can also look at introducing beneficial bacteria into the res, which I was never personally a fan of since I've seen too many horror stories when organics get introduced into a reservoir, so I have no experience with, but here's a good article:



The entire brix crowd is very knowledgeable and are great people to learn from. I just think you need to apply that knowledge in a different way in hydro.

To begin with, I recently converted from bottled nutes to salts with Jack's 321. Continued study lead me to acquire individual complexed salts and build my whole entire regimen from scratch which is what I now do. I dialed in my nutes so good this way that my plants were super healthy, insect free and generally pleasing to look at. Around that time I stumbled onto one of the brixxers and I noticed the DBHBB plants are even more healthy looking than mine so I hypothesized that if I could up my brix in hydro, I would then be fine tuning my nutes in even more so, and began dissecting Doc's kit to see what's high and what's low, then ponder the whys, while also remembering the vast differences between HBB soil and my potted rockwool. When studying the kit system, I was more or less searching for for the overall understanding to help me make more informed decisions of which elements to focus on. My studies of the kit (taught?) me to focus on dialing in the K:Ca ratio, but I also consider other sources such as a Hydroponics book, Q&A with Doc or others and general web searching. I always seek information that is agreement with other information. If Doc says for example "A+B=C", I take that information and get to banging itt against the world wide web for a few days/weeks to see what kind of info I can find that concludes the same way.

All of that said, I now have a much more profound understanding of what forces are working against calcium, and how the slightest imbalance of it can spiral shit way out of control. IMO the DBHBB has some built in safe guards that can better regulate that, but in hydro it can still be done. Also, in hydro, I think it was Morglie? Maybe Graytail? can't quite remember, but generally that hydro plants lick up a shit load more water than brix plants and though they still may be very healthy, they will lack the nutrient density. So maybe both brix and hydro plants may have the same amount of nutes in the leaf, the hydro having XX% more water skews the brix.

I do have something of a micro herd in my rockwool through adding ACTs weekly, but still lacking the organic matter and most likely several other factors, my micrboes are much less reliable. FWIW, I've only ever used them as a preventative measure, but perhaps they break some colloids too, IDK.

I've adopted the practice of spraying a mild spray each week made from fish hydrol, molasses, aminos, gypsum or calcium nitrate and a pinch of kelp/fulvic/humic and a key bump of yucca. I've been running this for about 2 months now and the crop loves it. I even used it to revitalize a few blueberry bushes. It's definitely good stuff!

Here's my Gorilla Glue at 33 days. I clearly didn't kick her in the cooch with the ammonium, lol.

 

[NorCaliwood]

Welcome to my nightmare err I mean my thread there @WankirA

@Skybound live learn... die and forget it all anyway... That's what I love about soil.. It's so forgiving. Unlike hydro where if you mess up,, your fucked..........

Welcome back there @ilikemsticky Shame that you lost that. But all good.. I see some pretty plants over your ways..

I don't get too in-depth working with fertilizers myself. I figure I'll leave that to the people who have the time and space to do it and by their formulas. And not that I see anything wrong with learning a tweaking a mix. But for me,, I like easy........ And that is amending soil and watering.. If my girls get hungry,, which they tend to do later in life,, seeing the small pots they are in,, I juice mine afew time in flower with a GH regiment... But that's just me.

 

[Skybound]

Welcome to my nightmare err I mean my thread there @WankirA

@Skybound live learn... die and forget it all anyway... That's what I love about soil.. It's so forgiving. Unlike hydro where if you mess up,, your fucked..........

Welcome back there @ilikemsticky Shame that you lost that. But all good.. I see some pretty plants over your ways..

I don't get too in-depth working with fertilizers myself. I figure I'll leave that to the people who have the time and space to do it and by their formulas. And not that I see anything wrong with learning a tweaking a mix. But for me,, I like easy........ And that is amending soil and watering.. If my girls get hungry,, which they tend to do later in life,, seeing the small pots they are in,, I juice mine afew time in flower with a GH regiment... But that's just me.

It wasn't a mess up per say as I intended to push the envelope for a short period. I know with certainty that I can do the same damage to a soil plant, lol. I learned the needed lesson(s) though and from the looks of it, I'll still be able to recover the harvest. I just hope the smoke tastes alright.

 

[NorCaliwood]

GL Sky.. One thing I found about growing topshelf... It needs a perfect life to really be all it can.. Don't get me wrong,,, you can still get a good crop,,, but... not all she could've been... I'd still grow it for sure.. You should've seen what I just did with mine... I was experimenting to,,, seeing how long a plant could do without water... Didn't work out really well... Well didn't..

But I understand what your talking about,,, Ever see these fertilizers;
Nature's Nectar Plant Nutrients | Planet Natural
They say you can tweak those into whatever ya want... Well damn near... I was reading about this product back 20 years easy. In some of the first 'wishbooks' I ever got. Man, I did alot of plotting looking thru them catalogs when they came out...

 

[Dankman_420]

I'm experiencing some trial and errors too. I mixed up a crazy organic super soil recipe. I planted some clones in. They show a little bit of leaf tip burn. It's definitely hot. I'm a little nervous about putting them in flower here in couple weeks. Hopefully it works out cause I have a shit load of it mixed up. I really like the idea of water only

 

[ilikemsticky]

GL Sky.. One thing I found about growing topshelf... It needs a perfect life to really be all it can.. Don't get me wrong,,, you can still get a good crop,,, but... not all she could've been... I'd still grow it for sure.. You should've seen what I just did with mine... I was experimenting to,,, seeing how long a plant could do without water... Didn't work out really well... Well didn't..

But I understand what your talking about,,, Ever see these fertilizers;
Nature's Nectar Plant Nutrients | Planet Natural
They say you can tweak those into whatever ya want... Well damn near... I was reading about this product back 20 years easy. In some of the first 'wishbooks' I ever got. Man, I did alot of plotting looking thru them catalogs when they came out...

hey woody I sure can tell mine have only had water for two mos. I did like @Dankman_420 I beefed up my soil with added amendments but they sure miss there foliar feedings and teas I give them along the way I think these I have going now are going to be good there not going to be all they could but im trying!

 

[Skybound]

GL Sky.. One thing I found about growing topshelf... It needs a perfect life to really be all it can.. Don't get me wrong,,, you can still get a good crop,,, but... not all she could've been... I'd still grow it for sure.. You should've seen what I just did with mine... I was experimenting to,,, seeing how long a plant could do without water... Didn't work out really well... Well didn't..

But I understand what your talking about,,, Ever see these fertilizers;
Nature's Nectar Plant Nutrients | Planet Natural
They say you can tweak those into whatever ya want... Well damn near... I was reading about this product back 20 years easy. In some of the first 'wishbooks' I ever got. Man, I did alot of plotting looking thru them catalogs when they came out...

I never heard of those, but being all organic, they look like they'd be a great way to fine tune your soil with ingredients the micros would greatly appreciate. Those contents also comprise of the same stuff (more or less) I use in my foliars, fish, acids kelp or seaweed.

I'm experiencing some trial and errors too. I mixed up a crazy organic super soil recipe. I planted some clones in. They show a little bit of leaf tip burn. It's definitely hot. I'm a little nervous about putting them in flower here in couple weeks. Hopefully it works out cause I have a shit load of it mixed up. I really like the idea of water only

Same same! Well at least I think so. I just made up some Faux Mix, and amended that with salts, calcium carbonate and rock phosphate, and a little bit of organic acids with kelp and aminos. I did my best to amend to the same numbers used in Doc's kit, but not having to correct stuff, I had to add more P in salt form which might bite me in the ass down the road. All that will be done cooking at the end of August so I'll know mid Sept if I fudged up. I need to transition to soil soon, but I need to very that it won't kill my plants before I commit to it.

 

[HydroRed]

@Norcaliwood
I found my way brother......and noticed theres a lot more reading to do here than my spot lmao

 

[Conradino23]

You know what, man. I take my words back... the strain I got from @Hash Hound which is White Querkle aka. WQW is something top notch and with stunning yield: Red Diesel level actually

I dunno if he has more seeds, but that’s sth you might actually LIKE. Yeah we can always think of sth

 

[NorCaliwood]

Hey @Dankman_420 take them pots next time they are ready to get watered,, and water the hell outta them.. I mean double run-off or more.. ??? Might help cool down the soil? I have no idea. I know there are 100's of LOS 'recipes' out there. Matter a fact my exact resipe changes with every wheel barrel I mix.. A little anyways...I stick with some of the more immediate releases when growing indoors. And slower for outdoors where plants are growing for 5 months or so. .



Hopefully, the leaching will help alittle?? Just a thought.. I have no idea if it will work.

But really organic amendments are the way to go.. Even with alittle juicing along the way... Basically, you just water and feed the microbes...

I do use a packaged fertilizer when I mix soil.. Kind of an all in one called Marine Cuisine by Fox Farm. Has a bit of time-released that carry some of the nutrient values thru out the grow and helping it round out some .


My plants are transitioning now,,, and I plan on giving them alittle juice and some extra cal-mag to help them in their stretching times... I hope....


Hey, welcome @HydroRed. This here is a mellow site also.. I 'think' the average age here is abit older..

BTW congrats on the seed line up. I'll have to look into some when I decide to get some seeds again. I've always been one of them cheap SOB that get a bunch of single seeds and the freebies that come with at the Tude' But it's not beyond me to pick up a pack here and there.. Besides the price is reasonable enough.


Read? Hell,,, all I ever do is look at the pictures anyways...

I really did like that Red Desiel I grew last time. Might be in my top 15 plants.


Hope everyone gardens are doing great Keepem Green

 

[bobrown14]

I wrote and asked if there was a list of things you can't use..

Writing back:

Only thing you we cant use is ....

Still tabulating the outcomes,

Please hold for the next operator.

tap tap tap.

Lets puff. OK

 

[bobrown14]

I'm experiencing some trial and errors too. I mixed up a crazy organic super soil recipe. I planted some clones in. They show a little bit of leaf tip burn. It's definitely hot. I'm a little nervous about putting them in flower here in couple weeks. Hopefully it works out cause I have a shit load of it mixed up. I really like the idea of water only

In soil you just have to take that leap of faith and let mother nature do the heavy lifting.

It's hard for some to let loose of the control reins. I get that for sure.

By hot I guess you mean too much nitrogen?? like woody said water up.

You will be okay if the plants are still alive. In organic soil most of the nutrients are locked up in an in-soluble form until the microbes get working on them. The microbes won't over do that in a container with a mature plant in there. Its the soluble forms of Nitrogen you can worry about. Like cow poop for example.

 

[NorCaliwood]

BTW peoples,,, @HydroRed is a friend from one of them the third world grow sites I was having problems at... He's a cool dude,, one of the few I've dealt with on R-it...

He's been working with a vendor named Great Lakes Genetics... Not that I've ever grown any of them,,, but hell sooooooo many vendors I haven't tried yet......... And watching him grow out acouple,,, about makes me waht to... He's got acouple going on there under 3/13 seeds... I been looking at his MILF variant... I've watched him grow acouple out on there.. Not like his a newbie or anything. I drug his ass over this a ways for a peek....

Yea @ilikemsticky I understand,,,, but I won't iffin you don't next time.... I might even have to make a trip down to the foothills again?????? I did just get new shoes and brakes on the truck,,, and Miss J has been waiting a trip down to the
Bay Area/Sacramento area.. I want to take her down to the Alameda Rockwall at night.. BEST view I know of the City there is..........

Just got done jumping thru another hoop for these stupid ass doctors.. Isn't really the doctor's fault. They have to follow strict rules when it comes to prescribing narcotics.. Still classified Illegal as far as the feds are concerned... So I had to spend 120.00 bucks for a card.. Even if it's legal here in Oregon,, that's States rights compared to federal. Least Miss J's doctor is screaming for cards...... Cards are becoming a thing of the past.. The only reason one needs a card anymore is for doctors,,, or to be safe in the states that aren't legal yet.. My partner needs one so he has a leg to stand on in Arizona, where they only have medical which is where he winters every year...........


Don't even get me lying about Doc Kit.. I haven't researched it much myself........ So no comment.........

And @Skybound I did just that,,, but it's journaling. I figured I best stay outta them political sites.. They are about the Biggest SJW's I've seen on a pot site yet............. But life.... Not that I will loss any sleep if I get banned..............


Well one more drink and I'm outta here............ Keepem Green

 

[Skybound]

I've been tossing around the idea of getting myself a card. I live about 8 blocks from a dispensary and there's another 3 within a 10 minute drive beyond that. As a grower I can't bring myself to pay for the priviledge of being added to a database that will most likely be used against me at some point down the road in exchange for a better variety of buds. As of yet, I can't bring myself to waste the ~$250 on the process, but who knows what the future may hold?

Edit - Nice to meet ya @HydroRed

 

[Pennywise]

I can't see myself getting a card for that reason, government is way to shady for me.

 

[ilikemsticky]

Yea @ilikemsticky I understand,,,, but I won't iffin you don't next time.... I might even have to make a trip down to the foothills again?????? I did just get new shoes and brakes on the truck,,, and Miss J has been waiting a trip down to the
Bay Area/Sacramento area.. I want to take her down to the Alameda Rockwall at night.. BEST view I know of the City there is..........

come on down woody we have a small place hear but we can set you up for a couple nights on your way to alameda it would be fun bud!

 

[HydroRed]

Thanks for the warm welcome! I usually dont travel out of my little area much, but Norcaliwood made it easy for me to venture out this way. Glad I did though as theres lots of good on this site.
@Skybound
I was reluctant to get a medical card myself for years as an indoor grower/guerilla grower for decades. I figured I was already part of many of "lists" unwillingly so what was one more that I actually had a choice in haha. Not sure where everyones at, but here in MI we just went rec after years of medical so things are changing by the day pretty much. The card has already paid for itself once as the law came to my door because of a call about noise (which it was the neighbor) and when I opened the door the cops asked if we could speak about the noise call, then proceeded to harass me about the smell. I showed em my card and away they went. It felt amazing to send em off with a middle finger and a smile legally after decades of hiding haha