Magnus8's Canna Cream, Body Butter & Canna Lotion Study Hall

[InTheShed]

To your first question regarding decarbing twice, the Skunk Pharm chart shows that decarb takes a long time at 200º, so to ensure the THCa is converted to THC, I decarb it first. After decarb in the oven I use a crock pot on warm, which is in the 180-190º range.

Regarding heating pumpkin seed oil, what I've read involves "cooking" with it, which would indicate temps higher than 200º. I haven't used pumpkin seed oil yet but I have some on the way so I'll see how that goes. My last batch was fractionated coconut and grapeseed oil.

SweetSue's decarb/extraction process of 36 hours is for capsules to be ingested, not for massage oil. Additionally, I believe she has gone off that method after finding that the cannabis is still not decarbed after that time. After decarb, I did 4 hours on low in a small crock pot, 8 hours cooling, 3 more hours on low, cooled over night. I read that somewhere!

I hope this helps!

 

[keshazel]

What I'd like to add to this whole discussion is to ask this: why do we have to decarboxylate at all? Why is it necessary to have the THC vs. THCA? The cannabinoids are still present and that is what I am looking for in my treatment, not the psychoactive effect. Thanks.

 

[SweetSue]

What I'd like to add to this whole discussion is to ask this: why do we have to decarboxylate at all? Why is it necessary to have the THC vs. THCA? The cannabinoids are still present and that is what I am looking for in my treatment, not the psychoactive effect. Thanks.

keshazel, it might help if we know what you're using the cannabinoids to treat. A strong topical can do amazing things. There's a case on record of a woman shrinking a glioblastoma with applications of an extra-strength cream to her neck and shoulders. But systemic treatment may demand a more efficient delivery system. Biobomb suppositories may be your best bet with digestive issues.

I have abandoned the 36 hour oil process after discovering how inconsistent it was in doing a decent decarb. I've actually gone to using the Instant Pot pressure cooker for my infusion and decarb step. On high, pot-in-pot for 110 minutes does an almost complete job in my kitchen.

 

[SweetSue]

I use my infused olive oil and grape seed oils directly as topicals too.
One less step to do for me. ...

I do this too. I have a jar of Dave Groomer's recipe that I use for everything but my face. I use plain infused coconut oil on the face, since I have psoriatic patches that I don't want to aggravate with an oil with more than 12 chains.

I've been using that oil on my face daily for a couple months now with the expectation that in time it'll do more than quiet those patches. I anticipate that the cannabinoid application over time will actually heal the patches. When that happens I'll come dancing through these doors and yelling at the top of my lungs. I'm not a vain woman at all, but having scaly patches on my face has shown me that at some level, yes I am concerned with appearance.

If my deepest hope pans out and we discover a cannabinoid treatment for psoriasis we're gonna make noise.

 

[SweetSue]

What I'd like to add to this whole discussion is to ask this: why do we have to decarboxylate at all? Why is it necessary to have the THC vs. THCA? The cannabinoids are still present and that is what I am looking for in my treatment, not the psychoactive effect. Thanks.

THCa will positively effect inflammatory response, making it likely that future pain will thereby be diminished. THC, on the other hand, will stop the pain message transmission at the point of pain, along the nerve path to the brain, and at the brain neurons itself. If you have pain it's THC you want in your topical. The more pain you deal with the more THC value you add to your topical.

Using a topical as an administration method for systemic relief is not a common occurrence. What you suggest is a little cutting edge. We can't say it won't work, but we can say there may be more efficient and effective ways for you to medicate.

 

[Baya]

Hi Everyone,


After more research, it turns out, I was wrong. All my apologies.
It may be off topic here, but this is what I’ve found…


Pumpkin seed oil

Linoleic acid 18.1% - 62.8%

Pumpkin seed oil - Wikipedia

Hazelnut Oil

Linoleic Acid 7% - 25%

Temperature : medium – high / Heat: Low heat (conflicting info here…)
Storage : Refrigerate after opening.
Shelf life : Unopened: 24-month. Opened: best used within 6 months.

Roasted Hazelnut Oil - La Tourangelle

Walnut oil

Walnut oil is composed largely of polyunsaturated fatty acids (72% of total fats), particularly alpha-linolenic acid (14%) and linoleic acid (58%) (…)

Walnut oil, like all nut, seed and vegetable oils will undergo rancidification accelerated by heat, light, and oxygen

Walnut oil - Wikipedia

Temperature : medium – high / It is better to use walnut oil for cold or medium-high heat cooking.
Storage : Cool, dark place. Refrigerate for maximum shelf life.
Shelf life : Unopened: 24-month. Opened: best used within 6 months.

Roasted Walnut Oil - La Tourangelle

Linoleic acid

Linoleic Acid is a polyunsaturated fatty acid

Linoleic acid - Wikipedia

Types of Fat and Rancidity

(…)The more points of unsaturation a fatty acid contains the higher the risk of rancidity. This means saturated fat is the most stable and resistant to rancidity, and polyunsaturated fats are the least stable and the most prone to rancidity. Exposing fats to heat, air, and light increase the risk of rancidity.(…)

(…)Store vegetable oils in the refrigerator, especially polyunsaturated oils. They will become cloudy but allowing them to come to room temperature will clear it away. Buy oils in small amounts that you will quickly go through. It is not safe to buy in bulk and have the oil sit in the cabinet for many months.(…)


Unconventional Cooking Oils

Medium High Heat - Resource - Smart Kitchen | Online Cooking School


Again sorry…

 

[ginganinja30]

I do this too. I have a jar of Dave Groomer's recipe that I use for everything but my face. I use plain infused coconut oil on the face, since I have psoriatic patches that I don't want to aggravate with an oil with more than 12 chains.

I've been using that oil on my face daily for a couple months now with the expectation that in time it'll do more than quiet those patches. I anticipate that the cannabinoid application over time will actually heal the patches. When that happens I'll come dancing through these doors and yelling at the top of my lungs. I'm not a vain woman at all, but having scaly patches on my face has shown me that at some level, yes I am concerned with appearance.

If my deepest hope pans out and we discover a cannabinoid treatment for psoriasis we're gonna make noise.

Sue I think you better get those vocal chords warmed up ..

At Xmas with the in-laws, my mother in law has issues with psoriasis in various places.
This time she was in a lot of discomfort and pain with a patch of psoriasis on the palm of the right hand.
I had my infused coconut oil with me and convinced her to apply it to the area.
Within 20mins the soreness and angry inflammation had eased considerably and is still healing now.
It would be completely gone now however the MIL isn't the best at regular health maintenance.

I'd say along with your own administration and results we are definitely into a winner with this .

...

 

[keshazel]

I appreciate all the replies. I am having a hard time following the thread. I have poor memory and confusion in addition to other conditions. I was originally going to take the Rick Simpson cure because I felt it would address everything at once, flooding my system. But I got sick from it (diarrhea). Some said it was residual solvent; others said it was chlorophyll.

I started looking for a way around that. Some say I don't need to decarboxylate; some say I do. I personally do not care if I get high as long as I get the necessary cure.

Here is the list as I can remember it right now: open angle glaucoma, bipolar, memory loss, confusion, stage 3 chronic kidney disease, arthritis, restless legs, type 2 diabetes, cervical stenosis, some chronic itchiness. This may not be everything as I may have overlooked something.

I obviously cannot make something complicated myself, due to the memory and confusion problems. You've all been incredibly patient and kind. Thanks.

 

[Radogast]

I appreciate all the replies. I am having a hard time following the thread. I have poor memory and confusion in addition to other conditions. I was originally going to take the Rick Simpson cure because I felt it would address everything at once, flooding my system. But I got sick from it (diarrhea). Some said it was residual solvent; others said it was chlorophyll.

I started looking for a way around that. Some say I don't need to decarboxylate; some say I do. I personally do not care if I get high as long as I get the necessary cure.

Here is the list as I can remember it right now: open angle glaucoma, bipolar, memory loss, confusion, stage 3 chronic kidney disease, arthritis, restless legs, type 2 diabetes, cervical stenosis, some chronic itchiness. This may not be everything as I may have overlooked something.

I obviously cannot make something complicated myself, due to the memory and confusion problems. You've all been incredibly patient and kind. Thanks.

A thought: If you were replacing opiods with cannabis oil therapy, lowering your dosage of opiods may have been the cause for diarrhea.

 

[InTheShed]

I appreciate all the replies. I am having a hard time following the thread. I have poor memory and confusion in addition to other conditions. I was originally going to take the Rick Simpson cure because I felt it would address everything at once, flooding my system. But I got sick from it (diarrhea). Some said it was residual solvent; others said it was chlorophyll.
I started looking for a way around that. Some say I don't need to decarboxylate; some say I do. I personally do not care if I get high as long as I get the necessary cure.
Here is the list as I can remember it right now: open angle glaucoma, bipolar, memory loss, confusion, stage 3 chronic kidney disease, arthritis, restless legs, type 2 diabetes, cervical stenosis, some chronic itchiness. This may not be everything as I may have overlooked something.
I obviously cannot make something complicated myself, due to the memory and confusion problems. You've all been incredibly patient and kind. Thanks.

I'm not the one to answer all your questions, but most of your issues require cannabis in your bloodstream rather than on your skin which is the focus of this thread. I would begin by reading this thread on cannabis dosing created by SweetSue, who is leading the charge on cannabis' healing properties.

You can also post your list in SweetSue's Cannabis Oil Study Hall and someone will help you there with answers.

About the only thing canna body oil can help with would be chronic itching, which my wife uses with great success.

 

[keshazel]

Radogast, this is not the case.

 

[mangpogi]

Following up on what keshazel mentioned earlier, I also find that lotions/creams work better for me than straight up oils. They are also easier to spread and dry up quicker. It does require a bit of work getting the right consistency with the ratio of oil, emulsifier and water.

I made more than a dozen tries and have come up with different strengths of topicals for different applications and almost always find the lotion version work better than oils. Does any one here have the same observation?

I do a combination of oil tincture sublingually and topical for my chronic back pain and happy to report that it is mostly well controlled on a day to day basis.

 

[HashGirl]

I'm not the one to answer all your questions, but most of your issues require cannabis in your bloodstream rather than on your skin which is the focus of this thread. I would begin by reading this thread on cannabis dosing created by SweetSue, who is leading the charge on cannabis' healing properties.

You can also post your list in SweetSue's Cannabis Oil Study Hall and someone will help you there with answers.

About the only thing canna body oil can help with would be chronic itching, which my wife uses with great success.

Hey Shed. Can you explain the sentence in blue above? What do you mean the only thing canna body oil can help with is chronic itching? I've used cannaoil for pain relief, too.

 

[InTheShed]

Hey Rad. Can you explain the sentence in blue above? What do you mean the only thing canna body oil can help with is chronic itching? I've used cannaoil for pain relief, too.

The only thing in the original poster's list of ailments. It makes more sense in context with the original quote in my post.

 

[SweetSue]

Sue I think you better get those vocal chords warmed up ..

At Xmas with the in-laws, my mother in law has issues with psoriasis in various places.
This time she was in a lot of discomfort and pain with a patch of psoriasis on the palm of the right hand.
I had my infused coconut oil with me and convinced her to apply it to the area.
Within 20mins the soreness and angry inflammation had eased considerably and is still healing now.
It would be completely gone now however the MIL isn’t the best at regular health maintenance.

I’d say along with your own administration and results we are definitely into a winner with this .

...

I've been applying infused coconut oil to the patches of psoriasis on my face daily now for about two months, usually right after the shower. Today I forgot, and later realized that I'd done so because the patches have healed enough that I hadn't noticed them. They're still there, but they've begun to shrink in the way I'd hoped when I began.

This is a simple coconut oil and trim infusion, no buds at all in here. I'll keep using it and report back again.

Incidentally, I use Dave Groomer's pain cream recipe - I call it healing cream - and it's been keeping my feet from cracking this winter.

 

[SweetSue]

Following up on what keshazel mentioned earlier, I also find that lotions/creams work better for me than straight up oils. They are also easier to spread and dry up quicker. It does require a bit of work getting the right consistency with the ratio of oil, emulsifier and water.

I made more than a dozen tries and have come up with different strengths of topicals for different applications and almost always find the lotion version work better than oils. Does any one here have the same observation?

I do a combination of oil tincture sublingually and topical for my chronic back pain and happy to report that it is mostly well controlled on a day to day basis.

Well you wandered in the door at an opportune moment mangpogi. May I offer a hearty to our community?

We had a new member show up at the study hall just today with serious back pain that had him on opioids, so we're looking for ways to get him over the last hurdle. I'd already mentioned a strong topical, and now you've given me more anecdotal evidence to back up my claims.

Thank you for that.

My daughter was telling me today that she used a small smear of the pain cream on her lower back to get immediate relief from menstrual cramps, and it kept them at bay for a full three hours. That's the kind of news a medicine woman mom likes to hear. Now, if her partner would only let us try on him. I keep my jar nearby for any and all creaks or groans the joints may make.

Did I report here that I had a pretty nasty fall while out walking the week before Christmas? It was serious enough that my left shin is still recovering. I used the pain cream as soon as I got back home and it helped almost miraculously to keep the skin from bruising and to help the injured body parts heal faster. It was shocking how little I hurt as I was healing. Using the cream meant I wasn't restricted in my movement through the healing stage. I work sitting cross-legged on the floor, so flexibility and freedom of movement are very important to me.

When a 64-yr old woman takes a tumble on the road in the dark and it becomes almost a non-event you wonder once again why this plant is still illegal.

 

[mangpogi]

Well you wandered in the door at an opportune moment mangpogi. May I offer a hearty to our community?

Thanks for the warm welcome SweetSue!

Took me a while to get a consistent and repeatable formula (mainly due to varying strains and available THC content), but I am still experimenting and exploring tweaks to improve efficacy of the cannabis lotion.

For me it works on the following with varying degrees of effectiveness.

Back pain ( herniated disc and Episacroiliac Lipoma aka back mouse) (pretty much instant relief for sore back muscles)
Achilles tendinitis (multiple applications throughout the day)
Plantar fasciitis (multiple applications throughout the day)
Foot numbness due to pinched sciatic nerve ( Calms tingly feeling on toe to sleep comfortably)
Night time cramps ( even light strength cannabis lotion works)

Have you tried Tamanu oil for your Psoriasis? I have first hand account of it working with scars, wounds and eczema and have heard it works with psoriasis as well.

 

[SweetSue]

Thanks for the warm welcome SweetSue!

Took me a while to get a consistent and repeatable formula (mainly due to varying strains and available THC content), but I am still experimenting and exploring tweaks to improve efficacy of the cannabis lotion.

For me it works on the following with varying degrees of effectiveness.

Back pain ( herniated disc and Episacroiliac Lipoma aka back mouse) (pretty much instant relief for sore back muscles)
Achilles tendinitis (multiple applications throughout the day)
Plantar fasciitis (multiple applications throughout the day)
Foot numbness due to pinched sciatic nerve ( Calms tingly feeling on toe to sleep comfortably)
Night time cramps ( even light strength cannabis lotion works)

Have you tried Tamanu oil for your Psoriasis? I have first hand account of it working with scars, wounds and eczema and have heard it works with psoriasis as well.

I've never even heard of Tamanu oil until this very moment in time mangpogi. I'll look it up, and thanks for the reference. So far it's looking like the cannabinoids and coconut oil are doing the trick. I've lived with this for so many years now that I'm up to investigating anything that may help the membership avoid doing the same.

I haven't gone crazy looking for a solution, because I'm not vain enough that it's a real concern, other than the scalp psoriasis, and I can't seem to warm to coating my scalp with oils. I'm looking for a systemic healing of the ECS, through changing my thoughts and thereby my vibration, supplementing with copious amounts of cannabis and this delicious oil I apply to my face. It's not a conventional cannabinoid approach, to be sure, but it's the one that'll heal this girl in the end.

Looking over your list I found myself wanting to ask if you've ever looked into Feldenkrais movements? Just about everything listed, with the possible exception of the lower back pain, would respond positively to the Daily Stretch I do prior to a Callanetics session. They're based on Feldy movements. They're designed to reconnect the brain to the musculature, a series of simple, easy, instinctive movements that are powered by the breath and open the signalling of the body by reducing stress.

You awoke the medicine woman. Lol! Sometimes it's hard to turn off, most particularly when I'm speaking to someone with pain issues.

Are you taking any type of capsule regimen? Forgive me if you've already answered that earlier. It's been a busy couple days. A well-designed capsule regimen can help balance the endocannabinoid tone, accelerating healing forces.

 

[mangpogi]

I've never even heard of Tamanu oil until this very moment in time mangpogi. I'll look it up, and thanks for the reference. So far it's looking like the cannabinoids and coconut oil are doing the trick. I've lived with this for so many years now that I'm up to investigating anything that may help the membership avoid doing the same.

I haven't gone crazy looking for a solution, because I'm not vain enough that it's a real concern, other than the scalp psoriasis, and I can't seem to warm to coating my scalp with oils. I'm looking for a systemic healing of the ECS, through changing my thoughts and thereby my vibration, supplementing with copious amounts of cannabis and this delicious oil I apply to my face. It's not a conventional cannabinoid approach, to be sure, but it's the one that'll heal this girl in the end.

Looking over your list I found myself wanting to ask if you've ever looked into Feldenkrais movements? Just about everything listed, with the possible exception of the lower back pain, would respond positively to the Daily Stretch I do prior to a Callanetics session. They're based on Feldy movements. They're designed to reconnect the brain to the musculature, a series of simple, easy, instinctive movements that are powered by the breath and open the signalling of the body by reducing stress.

You awoke the medicine woman. Lol! Sometimes it's hard to turn off, most particularly when I'm speaking to someone with pain issues.

Are you taking any type of capsule regimen? Forgive me if you've already answered that earlier. It's been a busy couple days. A well-designed capsule regimen can help balance the endocannabinoid tone, accelerating healing forces.

Glad to share Tamanu oil info, I had some mixed with mid strength cannabis lotion for skin issues. It does have a bit of seedy smell and can compete with the weed smell.

I will look into the Feldenkrais movements, Ive pinpointed my chronic back pain to my quadratus Limboruim and erectus set muscles which are unfortunately not easy to stretch. When they are tight or inflamed they pull the torso to one side which aggravates the discs and pinches the sciatic nerve. The Cannabis topical works wonders in lowering the pain just enough to get my butt off the seat and move around.

Yes I take a sublingual tincture made from Cannatonic + Girl scout cookies + THCa from G13 + Lecithin in MCT oil. Took a while to get something that works well for my Chronic back pain, there will be days I can go without the topical with this tincture. Although using both will bring down pain to a 1 or 2. Amazingly I only need 0.2 ml twice a day. I have it in a treatment pump style dispenser bottle so no need to measure with a dropper(one solid pump is about 0.2 ml). Have it flavored with menthol and spearmint so its like using a breath freshener

 

[SweetSue]

Glad to share Tamanu oil info, I had some mixed with mid strength cannabis lotion for skin issues. It does have a bit of seedy smell and can compete with the weed smell.

I will look into the Feldenkrais movements, Ive pinpointed my chronic back pain to my quadratus Limboruim and erectus set muscles which are unfortunately not easy to stretch. When they are tight or inflamed they pull the torso to one side which aggravates the discs and pinches the sciatic nerve. The Cannabis topical works wonders in lowering the pain just enough to get my butt off the seat and move around.

Yes I take a sublingual tincture made from Cannatonic + Girl scout cookies + THCa from G13 + Lecithin in MCT oil. Took a while to get something that works well for my Chronic back pain, there will be days I can go without the topical with this tincture. Although using both will bring down pain to a 1 or 2. Amazingly I only need 0.2 ml twice a day. I have it in a treatment pump style dispenser bottle so no need to measure with a dropper(one solid pump is about 0.2 ml). Have it flavored with menthol and spearmint so its like using a breath freshener

We came to cannabinoid therapies thinking it was a big stick we could wield to put disease aside, but it turns out the ECS appreciates a gentler approach that allows it to work with the phytocannabinoids without being stressed. I'm developing a great respect for micro dosing and your little report made me smil broadly. It warms my heart to see so many individuals taking it upon themselves to responsibly and methodically dial in their personal sweet spots.

And topicals rock! They should be using this in emergency rooms and burn units all across our country and beyond. As more and more medical professionals come on board we'll see them used with greater frequency. I think the next ten years are going to bring an explosion of topical products infused with cannabis. Gives me goosebumps just thinking about it.