Let's Find a Mother! Hiking Through a Field of Mary Jane

[ronnie6690]

looking great hiker. nice update. portables do suck for sealed enviroment , they make commercial ones but thats not cost effective when you can get a mini spit so much cheaper

 

[Hiker]

howdy hiker the grow looks great! Oh and good weed to you
I feel you on someone having knowledge and paper work on your venture. that would bother me very much.
hope it works so you can at least recoup your time and efforts

I hope it works out too. I'm very nervous about it, but old habits die hard. I'm hoping this batch will cover the debt I incurred getting this far. Hopefully an AC upgrade will be possible with the next batch. I had some initial investment capital I set aside for this, but the project went way over budget.

My thought process went like this...

I have trouble finding good smoke reliably, if at all. At one point, I couldn't find anything for about 6 weeks. It was that dry spell that got the wheels turning. I thought, "Fuck this! Why should I have to struggle to get mediocre weed when I can grow better? It's f***ing legal here!" Then of course the ideas grew in scope following the axiom of, if I'm gonna grow a little, a lot isn't too much more work, right? Oh how wrong I was on that one! I guess my decades long hiatus romanticized some of the memories a bit. Don't get me wrong, I LOVE growing! It fills a void that I had forgotten was even there. I get way more from growing then just smoke. It's just that more plants does mean a lot more work.

looking great hiker. nice update. portables do suck for sealed enviroment , they make commercial ones but thats not cost effective when you can get a mini spit so much cheaper

Exactly! I sure wish I had listened to you when you told me that. I didn't, and still don't, have the means to get a mini split at the time. I think my efforts to seal it inside improved it a lot, but any portable that evaporates the condensation out the exhaust will have this problem. By design, there will be an opening between the 2 air spaces to allow the water to drain into the exhaust's reservoir. Mine IS keeping the room cold, but it's very inefficient. I have a NG CO2 gen, so I can make enough CO2, but that adds more heat, so more AC, so more CO2. It's a viscous cycle!

If anyone ever reads this journal and takes a single lesson away from it, it is this...

DO NOT buy a portable AC for your grow room!

Put that $$ towards a mini split. I can think of very few situations where a portable would be better than a window/wall mount equivalent. And the wall unit will cost less for higher efficiency and more BTUs!

In Mr Macky's voice...
Portable AC's are bad. Mmmkay?

 

[420GodsTrichome]

learned that lesson the hard way myself too bro...
in the ideal commercial guerilla setup, i like a dedicated "air/environment quality" control room, a seperate area that is cooled AND pre CO2 enriched and properly humidified . this air is then fed into your grow area and is much more uniform, and easy to control....

peae and God bless , GT

 

[BigIrishDoode]

good to know i have been hoping to afford an ac for the shop/grow, and was considering a portable but i think a window ac same price would kick its ass since one is 6k btu the window unit is 12k btu both are 250$, so my mind is made up im going old skool and cutting a hole in my house, i loke having reasons to use my chainsaw!

 

[Hiker]

learned that lesson the hard way myself too bro...
in the ideal commercial guerilla setup, i like a dedicated "air/environment quality" control room, a seperate area that is cooled AND pre CO2 enriched and properly humidified . this air is then fed into your grow area and is much more uniform, and easy to control....

peae and God bless , GT

Hopefully I'll save someone that lesson. I bet you wish you could convince folks too, but I realize, like me, they probably won't listen.

hmmmm I could almost do that in my space. I will have 2 flowering rooms inside the basement proper. In theory I could condition the basement outside the flowering rooms, and use that to vent the flowering rooms, but I think I like the idea of 3 separate environments. They are each small enough I can keep them pretty uniform. My ventilated floor in the flower room does a very good job of recirculating and scrubbing the air. I'm planning to buy a 3 head mini split (do they make 4 head units?). One for each flowering room and one for the main basement, but I've been considering putting that 3rd head inside the house. We have one area of the house that warms up in the summer. If I cooled it, the rest of the house stays comfortable all year.

good to know i have been hoping to afford an ac for the shop/grow, and was considering a portable but i think a window ac same price would kick its ass since one is 6k btu the window unit is 12k btu both are 250$, so my mind is made up im going old skool and cutting a hole in my house, i loke having reasons to use my chainsaw!

Hurray! I saved someone $$! Maybe

You won't regret it. There are a lot of advantages. You get more BTUs for the $$, and you don't loose any floor space. Mount that sucker way up high too! As far as the hole, you have to have holes for those exhaust hoses anyway. If you planned to use a window, just put the AC in the window. If you had to cut holes for the exhaust hoses, then you just need to cut one larger hole now.

Thanks for checking in guys.

I'm off work today, so should get some time to work on my video.

 

[shottafire]

Wow things have been rolling along and I have been to busy to pop in. Glad I did, things look flawless buddy.

Mini splits are the business in "CGE" grows.

+reps my friend

 

[JuicySoil]

if anyone ever reads this journal and takes a single lesson away from it, it is this...

DO NOT buy a portable AC for your grow room!

Put that $$ towards a mini split. I can think of very few situations where a portable would be better than a window/wall mount equivalent. And the wall unit will cost less for higher efficiency and more BTUs!

In Mr Macky's voice...
Portable AC's are bad. Mmmkay?

Thanks for the heads up bro, about to go look for some cooling myself, have heard mini-splits recommended mostly. But must admit, was a little tempted to buy a portable.. I think you just changed my mind

 

[Hiker]

Thanks for the heads up bro, about to go look for some cooling myself, have heard mini-splits recommended mostly. But must admit, was a little tempted to buy a portable.. I think you just changed my mind

My pleasure!

I get happy knowing I helped someone.

At least I can use the portable upstairs during the three weeks it gets unbearable here.

 

[TheCapn]

Hey Hiker, thanks for stopping by my grow. I thought I would check in on your set up. I haven't read the entire thing but so far I'm liking it. I'm going to go back and start from the beginning, then sub and see what happens. A farmers market for MJ. That is a crack up. I would love to go check it out!

>>>For me, bending is not a permanent solution, but it did help buy me some time until I could take enough time to tie them down properly.
I agree here. It seems you have to bend them every day, and that probably causes more stress to the fibers than just tying them down, eh?

>>it's become obvious that portable ACs suck
It seems someone could make a LOT of money if they invented a $500 portable that was sealed. In theory, it doesn't seem like it would be that difficult.

>>>a seperate area that is cooled AND pre CO2 enriched and properly humidified . this air is then fed into your grow area and is much more uniform, and easy to control
I would be interested in seeing how this works. You can't pump air into a room, without displacing air. So as you pump the good air in, you're loosing co2 that is already in the room. I like the idea but it seems you would still lose a lot of co2

I want to do co2 bad! But I have yet to find a sealed portable, I can't cut a hole in the wall for window unit, and I can't do any king of outdoor unit (mini-split) because of the location. Currently, I am exhausting hot air up a chimney.

I DO HAVE a chiller, and could run an ice box to keep the room cool, but that doesn't solve the humidity problem. Is there such a thing as a dehumidifier that doesn't leak air, or heat up the room?

 

[jlt1202]

Hey Hiker, thanks for stopping by my grow. I thought I would check in on your set up. I haven't read the entire thing but so far I'm liking it. I'm going to go back and start from the beginning, then sub and see what happens. A farmers market for MJ. That is a crack up. I would love to go check it out!

>>>For me, bending is not a permanent solution, but it did help buy me some time until I could take enough time to tie them down properly.
I agree here. It seems you have to bend them every day, and that probably causes more stress to the fibers than just tying them down, eh?

>>it's become obvious that portable ACs suck
It seems someone could make a LOT of money if they invented a $500 portable that was sealed. In theory, it doesn't seem like it would be that difficult.

>>>a seperate area that is cooled AND pre CO2 enriched and properly humidified . this air is then fed into your grow area and is much more uniform, and easy to control
I would be interested in seeing how this works. You can't pump air into a room, without displacing air. So as you pump the good air in, you're loosing co2 that is already in the room. I like the idea but it seems you would still lose a lot of co2

I want to do co2 bad! But I have yet to find a sealed portable, I can't cut a hole in the wall for window unit, and I can't do any king of outdoor unit (mini-split) because of the location. Currently, I am exhausting hot air up a chimney.

I DO HAVE a chiller, and could run an ice box to keep the room cool, but that doesn't solve the humidity problem. Is there such a thing as a dehumidifier that doesn't leak air, or heat up the room?

For a a/c option, look up a dorm approved a/c fan on you tube and you can build cheeeppppp!

For your co@ delima, you can get CO2 Exhale bags from your grow store and they are dope, they give off more co2 then buckets with pumps, last longer, and there is no work to it, just open and it does the work!
^i use in my grow and works wonders! (veg room it works great because i have it around 80° F in there almost all the time, the co2 helps them push through the rough temps i belive)

^this is a knock off brand of the exhale brand, it works almost as well but the plant i had next to the exhale bag went nuts!

 

[s1ingblade]

LOL

I'm glad you guys were entertaining yourself while I was away.

I deleted a paragraph bitching about how little sleep I've been getting, yadda yadda...

I'm always faced with the dilemma of using my limited 420mag time to update my own journal or try to catch up on a few of my subscriptions. I've always favored keeping up with subs, but I'm going to back off that preference. I've found I'm not updating my journal often enough. I've been mostly MIA since I started harvesting back in April, and that bothers me. I haven't settled on a schedule yet, but the plan is to choose one day a week for posting updates and one to catch up on subs. Any 'extra' days will be spent browsing forums for new threads or more catching up on subs.

The exciting news this week is, I'm officially flowering again! I've been tapering off the photoperiod from 18/6 to 12/12 for a week or so, and as of last night, they are on 12/12. Everything is going well. The canopy is pretty even considering there are 35 individual plants in the room.

There are a couple plants that still need a little bondage applied. I ran out of garden wire on, literally, the last plant. There are a few I didn't tie down. I was running a bending vs tethering experiment, and the bent branches are getting tied down. I think bending works if you keep bending and/or keep the plants smaller. I prefer tieing the plants down, but that takes more time. My experiment is over. For me, bending is not a permanent solution, but it did help buy me some time until I could take enough time to tie them down properly.

So other than tieing down those couple bent plants, I'm looking forward to a few weeks of relatively little maintenance in the flowering room. I'd like to say this will let me work on improvements elsewhere in the basement, but I'm lacking funds for any further investment in the basement. That issue now appears to be resolved.

Apparently there is a Cannabis Farmer's Market in Seattle! I was not aware of this until recently. I've been in contact with them and did some research into WA MMJ law. It looks like I'm going to be a provider at the market soon. I have mixed feelings though. I'm excited at the prospect of a legal venue to provide meds to patients, but after decades of living under prohibition, I'm quite nervous! While I think I'm legal under WA MMJ law, as we all know, even in the best of situations, the legality of growing is a grey area.

Assuming all goes as planned, my paperwork will be in order by next week, so hopefully I will be at the market by the end of the month.

Other then chemicals, I'm not spending anymore money on the basement until I can afford a mini split AC. I had planned to improve my veg area, but it's become obvious that portable ACs suck. I'm sorry if anyone disagrees, but we're all entitled to our opinions, and IMHO, portable ACs are not appropriate for a CGE. I can't imagine any of them being able to maintain a seal to preserve CO2 levels. The exhaust is also an issue in my situation. I can route a couple 1" freon (or whatever it's replaced with) lines much easier then an 8-10" exhaust opening! I'm hoping I will be able to do this upgrade after this next harvest in August.

That's it for this update. I regret mentioning anything about a surprise now. I'm worried it's building up a little more than is warranted. I'm just trying to post a video of my grow room. I've not worked with video much, so I'm having to work through a bit of a learning curve. I'm still evaluating software for video editing. So far, I can't find one that does everything I want. If anyone has a program they like, please share it here and I will check it out. I've shot several videos now, but as I've mentioned, I'm a little OCD, so it's taking awhile to get this first video out. The first video will include the ladies, but it's primarily a video to show off the whole basement. Future videos (assuming I learn how to do these to my satisfaction) will focus more on the plants and their flowering progress, ie like Jon's excellent videos.

Anyway, the vid is coming. I'm really trying to get it done this week, so I will be "ready" to post flowering progress vids later. You'll all just have to settle for my little canopy pic above in the meantime.

Can't wait to see your video and really looking fwd. to hearing how the "Farmers Market" does for ya cause theres one in my state also but of course I aint as legal as you are Keep us informed bro.
Oh yeah reps on that bad a$$ canopy. A+ job 4Sure

 

[fish cake]

Hope you have a great weedend Hiker

 

[jon705]

hey Hiker I know your a busy man but I'd love to see ya over in my new journal bro, heres the link.
Jon705's Multi Strain HPS LED Hybrid System
Beautiful canopy btw and im using my old portable for the exact same thing lol

 

[s1ingblade]

I am going to build a cheapo version of a 53' refer trailer aka Grow Bot type mobile grow shop next year or as soon as I can find the right buyer for my 40 acres, anyhow I am wondering if running a commercial sized chiller and using ice boxes to cool vs. a refrigerant type cooler would have any advantages? If I only knew back in 2008 when building the cabin that it wouldn't end up being my wood shop and that it would be a hydro hut how things would have been done differently. I would love to find a deal on a used 5 ton a/c unit. There are some really cool design setups on youtube where they run a big plenum down the middle of the ceiling and this one guy claims his a/c works so well he doesnt even have to use wall fans anymore? I have a hardly used 1/4hp chiller and a cool coil, I'd like to set it up and run the two 6" ice boxes and will once I get to being able to get my "Better Room" 10 by 20 finished. It will be my 1st attempt at a CGE (hope thats the right acronym?) I am thinking if I can run all the water cooling equipment off the 1/4 hp chiller I could put a ice box after each air cooled hood and instead of venting the heat and all out of the room I could keep recirculating it and keep the co2 that I will be accumulating with the propane/water cooled co2 generator. Thats another device that requires water and it's making me think all the Hydro Innovations equipment I got dirt cheap last year is going to need more like a 1.5 HP chiller what do you think??
Sorry for rambling hiker

 

[ronnie6690]

I am going to build a cheapo version of a 53' refer trailer aka Grow Bot type mobile grow shop next year or as soon as I can find the right buyer for my 40 acres, anyhow I am wondering if running a commercial sized chiller and using ice boxes to cool vs. a refrigerant type cooler would have any advantages? If I only knew back in 2008 when building the cabin that it wouldn't end up being my wood shop and that it would be a hydro hut how things would have been done differently. I would love to find a deal on a used 5 ton a/c unit. There are some really cool design setups on youtube where they run a big plenum down the middle of the ceiling and this one guy claims his a/c works so well he doesnt even have to use wall fans anymore? I have a hardly used 1/4hp chiller and a cool coil, I'd like to set it up and run the two 6" ice boxes and will once I get to being able to get my "Better Room" 10 by 20 finished. It will be my 1st attempt at a CGE (hope thats the right acronym?) I am thinking if I can run all the water cooling equipment off the 1/4 hp chiller I could put a ice box after each air cooled hood and instead of venting the heat and all out of the room I could keep recirculating it and keep the co2 that I will be accumulating with the propane/water cooled co2 generator. Thats another device that requires water and it's making me think all the Hydro Innovations equipment I got dirt cheap last year is going to need more like a 1.5 HP chiller what do you think??
Sorry for rambling hiker

i'm not sure what ice boxes are but to determine the size of water chiller you need you need to know how much water in the system and how cold of temps you wish to run. a 1/4hp chiller will cool 80 gals by 15 degrees which should work great.

a rolling grow lab sounds awesome

 

[fish cake]

good weed Hiker

 

[Hiker]

Tomorrow is update day. Today I just want to respond to some posts, and share something semi-exciting...

Yesterday I planted 2 of my 'extra' moms out in the forest.

I have a total of 6 plants I am gonna plant. I know I'm a couple weeks late, but that's fine. It just means smaller plants. That could be a good thing as it will help keep them less conspicuous. I'm looking at any harvest as total bonus anyway. I'm putting them all in a little corner of state forest I hike several times a week. This way I can tend/water them during the season.

My biggest question is whether or not the deer like to eat them. I guess I'll find out this afternoon when I go check on them.

I am going to build a cheapo version of a 53' refer trailer aka Grow Bot type mobile grow shop next year or as soon as I can find the right buyer for my 40 acres, anyhow I am wondering if running a commercial sized chiller and using ice boxes to cool vs. a refrigerant type cooler would have any advantages? If I only knew back in 2008 when building the cabin that it wouldn't end up being my wood shop and that it would be a hydro hut how things would have been done differently. I would love to find a deal on a used 5 ton a/c unit. There are some really cool design setups on youtube where they run a big plenum down the middle of the ceiling and this one guy claims his a/c works so well he doesnt even have to use wall fans anymore? I have a hardly used 1/4hp chiller and a cool coil, I'd like to set it up and run the two 6" ice boxes and will once I get to being able to get my "Better Room" 10 by 20 finished. It will be my 1st attempt at a CGE (hope thats the right acronym?) I am thinking if I can run all the water cooling equipment off the 1/4 hp chiller I could put a ice box after each air cooled hood and instead of venting the heat and all out of the room I could keep recirculating it and keep the co2 that I will be accumulating with the propane/water cooled co2 generator. Thats another device that requires water and it's making me think all the Hydro Innovations equipment I got dirt cheap last year is going to need more like a 1.5 HP chiller what do you think??
Sorry for rambling hiker

Can you post some links so I can understand this DIY AC?

If I understand correctly, you're asking if you can use your chiller to cool the airspace. First off, I've never used a chiller. Hopefully I won't need one after I get the mini split. The AC exhaust is making my basement warm, so now my res is creeping into the 70's. I started adding frozen 2L bottles, and so far it's been fine. It also cooled off a little. Once I get the mini split though, I shouldn't have res temp issues.

Unfortunately, having no experience with chillers, I'm not sure if what you're proposing will work. I'm not 100% sure I even understand what your idea is.

If I AM understanding correctly, you're basically proposing a sort of hybrid swamp cooler type of cooling. You're going to use the chiller to cool water that you use to cool the air and the CO2 gens. It could work. Ronnie probably knows better than me, but my instincts worry about the inefficiencies that occur in these energy transfers, ie thermodynamics.

Let's think about the energy that's moving around. You're generating heat energy as a byproduct of your light generation. That's the energy you're trying to remove from the CGE (Yes, that is the right acronym. Controlled Grow Environment I think it means). This heat energy will be transferred into the water. Then the chiller will remove the heat energy from the water, but adds heat to the air around itself. Also, keep in mind that it will be adding MORE heat than it's removing from the CGE. It also consumes it's own power, so that energy is also turned into more heat.

So here is the real question... How much energy does that heat represent? Perhaps we can measure in BTU and then compare that to the BTU rating of the chiller. If the chiller is rated to remove more energy than you're putting into the system (CGE), then you should be OK. If not, you're gonna need other cooling.

Of course, it's very likely I'm completely misunderstanding your question. In that case, as Roseanne Roseannadanna would say...

Nevermind

i'm not sure what ice boxes are but to determine the size of water chiller you need you need to know how much water in the system and how cold of temps you wish to run. a 1/4hp chiller will cool 80 gals by 15 degrees which should work great.

a rolling grow lab sounds awesome

Good to know about sizing chillers. Thanks for that.
And I agree... the rolling grow lab will be awesome.

Hey Ronnie, I came onto the forums specifically to run a question by you, or anyone else that has thoughts actually.

I was just in the basement thinking about my temps and ventilation. I currently have the AC exhausting into the main basement. I then have my S&P TDS-200 exhausting the basement. While it's a good fan (VERY quiet), it can't move enough air to keep the whole basement cool. If it could move enough air up the chimney on it's own to remove all the heat the lights are creating, I wouldn't have needed the AC.

So I was down there studying their relative physical locations. The way I have the AC exhaust and S&P intake directed, it's not removing the heat very efficiently. Since they both have a short amount of flexible ducting at the ends, I started playing with directing the airflows towards each other. I had the idea of directing the AC exhaust right at the intake of the other fan to help it remove more of the heat. Then the idea evolved into wondering what would happen if I just connected the two?

So that's my question... What if I duct my AC exhaust right into the basement exhaust fan's intake? If I re-position the S&P fan, the AC exhaust will point right into it. Is this a bad idea? Would it be better to have it 'sealed' or ducted into each other, or should I just have the AC exhaust pointing towards the other's intake?

good weed Hiker

and a fantabulous weed to you Fisharooniedoonie

 

[fish cake]

in answer to your first Question. yes! but if you can get some human hair and spread it around that will help deter them
now as far as the rest. I loved Gilda Radner

 

[mcloadie]

in answer to your first Question. yes! but if you can get some human hair and spread it around that will help deter them
now as far as the rest. I loved Gilda Radner

LOL, I have something that will deter them..........heat up the skillet..........fresh heart and liver, and leave a dead one hanging in the tree, they will get the point! My friends in the triangle have to fence everything.....I'm talkin 10 foot fences! They call them mountain rats and I have never seen anything they like better than weed!

 

[fish cake]

hanging dog chains on them help too but that is kind of a red flag I think