Landrace Genetics 101

We have guerilla growers here who have strains that they have worked since the early 80’s. The aroma and taste have remained pretty much the same but potency has increased by a considerable margin. These strains have maintained their vigor with only 1 or 2 out crosses. Plant selection has been very meticulous. They will pollinate select plants from multiple pit sites then the seeds are combined and planted the following season.
 
Guerilla breeding is very interesting. These strains have their strongest traits enhanced with inbreeding, so they'll show much more adaptability with good selection.
 
The secret is knowing what you’re looking for, the old strains down home are mostly a cross of Skunk x Hawaiian. Very sweet and floral and very potent, the last I smoked was a very strong cerebral high that ends up with couch lock for me. I’m sure an Afghan has been bred in at some point.
 
I think picking on one particular attribute like color might be too broad, so that's why I picked on Girl Scout Cookies as a strain since that's a little more narrow, but a perfect example of what I mean. There's like a faux-variety that's created by all these GSC crosses and derivatives, and they're all slightly nuanced enough to provide variety, but are all mostly the same.


To reply to the GSC diss... I'm currently growing a strain called Buffalato. It's several iterations downstream but has some GSC in it. VERY VERY good cannabis. I never tried GSC but I can say for an Indica - she's got a lot to bring to the table. Taste, smell, bag apeal, easy to grow and no mold/PM. She will never make it to the consumer market because of low yields. I can probably coax 5 zips from a plant but it takes special prep.

I'm not an Indica fan either, I prefer landrace Sativa with a good long cure. So for me to go out and say it's worth it, is saying something.

I get what you're saying tho... I just cant see GSC being anything that's going to last very long due to the yield issue.

What I see coming is 2 things driven by the consumer market:

#1) Yields with least amount of time grown
#2) Watered down genetics to get us to #1

Hopefully this will create a "niche" market of actual "quality" high end cannabis similar to say a Cuban Cigar. Not for everyone but for the folks that can pony up the coin, they will gladly do it. This is good for the hobbyist grower that focuses on quality over quantity and will do what it takes to grow the best of the best. Many growers like this are present in this convo, the way I see it.

My biggest yielders BY FAR have been the Landrace stains.

Best by a fair margin too. Just way more vigor out of the gate all the way to harvest and clones too.


Re: Corn Blight...
That right there should have been a sign of peril to come. We did not read the writing on the wall.

Our society should not be relying on corn crop for survival or fuel for machines.

Not sustainable.


Conrad - on wheat my point was exactly your point. We humans will breed plants for as mentioned

Yield: period.

Our society as a whole should have access to a wide veriety of wheat strains. Instead of the genetically modified versions. Polytaxy sellected and bred at the expense of the the landrace verities is not good long term. I'm allergic to wheat.. the current versions.

There are likely millions out there like me (there are, they just don't know it). Blame your next bout of diarrhea on the eggs. How could bread cause me to have diarrhea??

It comes down to bacteria. This has a profound effect on not only us humans but also the plants we grow for food. The bacteria in the soil also has a profound effect on plant and human genetics.

Why did the wheat we eat today become a polyploid/polytaxy = genetic freak? It's not "natural selection". That takes far too long.

Bacteria are at play. In our guts and in the soil. Changing the world we live in every day.

The things we cannot see, cannot have any influence in society. <-- this is modern day thinking.

I disagree.
 
My biggest yielders BY FAR have been the Landrace

Try growing true f1 hybrids, on that 'yeild' point only... if 'yeild' if of importance to your needs :):passitleft:
 
Bacteria are at play. In our guts and in the soil. Changing the world we live in every day.

The things we cannot see, cannot have any influence in society. <-- this is modern day thinking.

I disagree.

Well-stated!
 
To reply to the GSC diss... I'm currently growing a strain called Buffalato. It's several iterations downstream but has some GSC in it. VERY VERY good cannabis. I never tried GSC but I can say for an Indica - she's got a lot to bring to the table. Taste, smell, bag apeal, easy to grow and no mold/PM. She will never make it to the consumer market because of low yields. I can probably coax 5 zips from a plant but it takes special prep.

I'm not an Indica fan either, I prefer landrace Sativa with a good long cure. So for me to go out and say it's worth it, is saying something.

I get what you're saying tho... I just cant see GSC being anything that's going to last very long due to the yield issue.

What I see coming is 2 things driven by the consumer market:

#1) Yields with least amount of time grown
#2) Watered down genetics to get us to #1

Hopefully this will create a "niche" market of actual "quality" high end cannabis similar to say a Cuban Cigar. Not for everyone but for the folks that can pony up the coin, they will gladly do it. This is good for the hobbyist grower that focuses on quality over quantity and will do what it takes to grow the best of the best. Many growers like this are present in this convo, the way I see it.

My biggest yielders BY FAR have been the Landrace stains.

Best by a fair margin too. Just way more vigor out of the gate all the way to harvest and clones too.


Re: Corn Blight...
That right there should have been a sign of peril to come. We did not read the writing on the wall.

Our society should not be relying on corn crop for survival or fuel for machines.

Not sustainable.


Conrad - on wheat my point was exactly your point. We humans will breed plants for as mentioned

Yield: period.

Our society as a whole should have access to a wide veriety of wheat strains. Instead of the genetically modified versions. Polytaxy sellected and bred at the expense of the the landrace verities is not good long term. I'm allergic to wheat.. the current versions.

There are likely millions out there like me (there are, they just don't know it). Blame your next bout of diarrhea on the eggs. How could bread cause me to have diarrhea??

It comes down to bacteria. This has a profound effect on not only us humans but also the plants we grow for food. The bacteria in the soil also has a profound effect on plant and human genetics.

Why did the wheat we eat today become a polyploid/polytaxy = genetic freak? It's not "natural selection". That takes far too long.

Bacteria are at play. In our guts and in the soil. Changing the world we live in every day.

The things we cannot see, cannot have any influence in society. <-- this is modern day thinking.

I disagree.

Well I don't mean to hate on GSC, it's just very easy to point out how it's been the victim of pollen-chuckers galore. I'm sure it's not the only strain to recieve that treatment, but with the Phylos Galaxy it's very easy to show how prevalent the problem of "renaming" is, but then also how the genetics create that pseudo-diversification. There's all these names and "strains", but in reality they're just crosses or close relatives. There's only a few different strains this is true for, at least in a way that's clearly demonstrable on Phylos. I mean, OG Kush we all know is guilty of it, but since there's SFV, Tahoe, Ghost, etc. and so on then the samples on Phylos aren't typically as uniform to show it to the same degree. However, you click on the GAL3000 clone-group, and it will have 27 supposedly "unique" strains that are actually identifical with each other. My main point is that while GSC is easy to see this with, just imagine how many other strains it remains true for, but less obvious.

I mean shoot I have my own cookies cross too. I was just trying to preserve it since I got the seeds from someone who didn't keep ahold of his stock. Anyway, I wonder how many people make cookies crosses just trying to get something similar but with better yield, and I wonder how much that contributes to the problem. I mean, they're not going to just NOT sell the seeds that don't work out.

Put it this way, I feel like saying "Platinum Girl Scout Cookies x Cherry OG" for my cross is a real mouthful, and I don't know how accurate it really is anyway. I could call it "Just Another Cookies Cross" and it would probably be as meaningful.
 
With wheat they went with genetic mutants and replicated that for the best tasting bread. Apparently not for health of the folks that eat it tho!

Nah - ease of harvesting, longevity when stored (/trucked to market/shelf-time/etc.) and the like have been far more relevant to those who make such selections than anything as... unimportant as taste. Looks like it was only relatively recently that taste became a factor (in large commercial crops). Look at corn - su, se, etc. genes. I had some awesome "heirloom" corn when I was a kid, and it was pretty sweet - if you had the water boiling before you even picked the corn.

Food for thought. Maybe the selection was done when humans only ate 1 pc of bread a day and it got moldy and we ate it again the next day. hmmmm.... why do these people not get sick? No we throw moldy bread in the garbage. More FFT. Just throwing that out there.

Last time I used penicillin, I almost died. Among other things, my airway "closed up shop." Which surprised the <BLEEP> out of me, since I'd had many doses over the years prior to that little adventure.

Not exactly the same thing as moldy bread, I'll admit. But I have since stopped buying the (way past "day-old") loaves that are priced at 15 cents each "for my livestock" and scraping the blue mold off and, instead, gone back to the fancy 55 to 75 cents per loaf stuff. With my vision, I'd probably miss some of the mold.

Wait, people used to eat only one piece of bread per day? Must have been rich folks, lol. Seems like bread has always been consumed as part of the non-wealthy person's diet. (If they were real lucky, they actually had something to put on that bread.) Even these days... Bread is one of the very, very few products that, when the price goes UP... so do sales. That's because poor people who (collectively) purchase large amounts of it end up not being able to purchase other things due to the price increase - so they buy more bread and related products. This can become a bit of a vicious cycle.

I know bread has molded since... well, probably since the stuff was first made, way back when it was more like petrified crackers. But I think the frequency(?) or maybe likelihood of bread molding is more a modern thing. Lots more moisture in modern versions of bread, methinks.

I still dumpster-dive from time to time (not by choice). But it makes me nervous for reasons other than just the possibility of getting bitten by rats, these days. Kind of p!sses me off that grocery stores and restaurants throw (more or less) good food into dumpsters and then pour cans of actual garbage on top of it on a regular basis instead of diverting the food to a big cardboard box or something. It's not like any of it would still be there when the business reopened the next day (at least around here). And then they manage to claim such things as "loss" on their financials. B@stards - they should all be sentenced to getting every meal from trash cans and dumpsters for about a month - and have someone assigned to each and every one of them, sneaking ahead on their routes and dumping little "presents" right in the middle of otherwise edible food.

Sorry, rambling. Err... ranting?

I think it's fair to say that commercial growers do not want & would not tolerate high level of genetic diversity, which would result in a high variety of phenotypes, including highly variable flowering times, height, nutrient uptake, water use, yield, quality, etc.

That must really suck for them, then, since half - or more - seeds sold today seem to produce that kind of situation. Thankfully, most all of those people are aware of the concept of mother plants.

Those commercial growers that are growing from seed?

;)

For shits and giggles:

What would your preferred Cannabis traits be?

My #1 would probably be: Terpine Profile then Pest Resistance.

Wow, that's a tough one, really. Right now, lofl? Ability to thrive at temperatures approaching (and, occasionally, exceeding) 100°F. STABLE SEX!!! Seeds are great - when I'm planting them. Other than that, I don't want to see the things. One of my top three strains, ever was a "shim line." And it was great, too... At that point, I was also consuming other things, and some of that greenery made a nice prologue to... the main event, so to speak. But the hermies, man! Tried to get rid of that over successive generations, but never seemed to achieve my goal. Seems like the closer I came, the less the effect resembled the original. Might be a "moral" in there somewhere, IDK. That one came directly from Asia - and not via a seedbank intermediary, either. I still don't know whether or not I made the right decision, abandoning it. Oh well, right?

Pest resistance would be awesome, I agree - but we've got tools available for insects and such, so that's less of a priority for me. I cannot help but think that some unwanted traits are genetically-linked to some wanted ones.

Flowering times haven't really been an issue for me. Yeah, back in my teens and early 20s when I was trying to grow outdoors, it'd have been nice to see a plant that had the... qualities I was looking for in my bud finish locally before then hunters invaded the woods - or at least before the snow did, lol. But I knew even back then that it was possible to manipulate the environment to force flowering (albeit, a RPITA to do so - and generally a trade-off with stealth/security, but...).

Be nice to find something that didn't stretch for the first 40% of its LONG flowering period, though. Maybe even something that didn't stretch at all, lol - merely filled in all the existing branches with flowers when you switched to a flowering light schedule.

For outdoor growing, maybe something that looked absolutely nothing like a cannabis plant? Frisian Duck - or even the Duck's Foot it was bred from - is a nice attempt, but... <SHRUGS> Still looks like cannabis to me. How about one that looks like a rose bush (complete with thorns ;) )?

I'll tell you what I'd really like, now that I think about it. How about a strain that's in the mid-high 20% THC(a) range - before it ever even starts flowering? Plant it, grow it for a while - then simply strip all the leaves off and proceed to 65,000'. Grow it in (just about) any climate. Only have a month of decent weather? No problem, chop 'em when it gets cold again and know that you haven't just wasted your really short Summer.

Yep - still rambling. . . .
 
But then "our" civilization is dead set on self annihilation. We are practicing this process every day.

Just be thankful that cetaceans don't have hand-analogues and mobility on land. If they did, we'd be "extinct in the wild." Oh, there'd most likely be "Homo sapiens preserves," but we'd be an extremely restricted species - cut off from so much of what makes us human.

They definitely seem to be smarter than we are. More developed brains. (Some even have larger ones.) And they think faster, with better decision making skills. They even "sleep" with only part of their brain at a time - can't sneak up on a dolphin when it always has one eye open - and part of its brain conscious.

Thankfully cannabis is actually and could possibly be a "cure" for violence

You could "cure" syphilis by making sex a crime for which the death penalty was the only punishment - but should you, lol? That would also remove something integral to our humanity.

very similar to a "cure" for opiate addition.

You really want to cure addiction? Make every single substance, natural AND synthetic... completely legal. That whole "addiction" issue would sort itself out within a generation, lol. If by no other mechanism, then by the same one that bacteria use to solve that whole "killer medicine" problem - by the few resistant survivors repopulating the species :rofl:. Got a her0in problem? Let the f*ckers have all they want, and for next to nothing. They'll stop thieving and whoring overnight - because they won't need to any longer. And pretty soon, those who cannot handle their sh!t will no longer be around to breed - problem solved. To accelerate the process, remove "modern medicine" from the picture. That's one of the factors that's sending the species down the rabbit hole, anyway, IMHO. People still having kids like only one in five will make it to adulthood and their life expectancy is 30 years or less... Fine, grant them the conditions they seem to be expecting. Current world population, 7,624,846,860. No, wait... 7,624,847,114. And still going up. Not even sundown yet and we've already had almost 313,000 people born today - and only 129,500 deaths, WtF? Poor dolphins (and whales) - on behalf of my species, I hereby apologize for being well on the way to taking you out with us (if not before) when we expire.

If we saw insane population growth like that in rats, parakeets, rabbits (any Australians in the audience, LMFAO?), et cetera, there'd be a f*cking bounty on them. But people? Oh, perish the thought.

Yeah... We don't deserve to exist as a species. Some individuals - perhaps even a great many of them - sure. But collectively? Not a chance. Even cockroaches self-regulate their own population; it's undoubtedly how they've managed to exist for over 300 million years. Us, lol? We won't make it a fraction of a fraction as long.

...and cockroaches will still be here, long after we have passed, gone and forgotten. Because they don't allow unchecked overpopulation of the species.
 
Phylos Galaxy

That thing is lacking something of significant importance - every strain that I looked up (those that actually had a report available) shows who submitted the sample - but not "whose strain" it actually is.

For example: I just typed in "Bubble Gum." Got one result. Among other things, the report informs me that "Bubble Gum has a high level of genetic variation (red indicator line)." Well, shucks, and it's the only IBL that Simon (Serious Seeds) has. Is he lying about the whole "IBL" thing? Well... maybe. On the other hand, I've grown it in the past and there wasn't much in the way of variation. I only bought three packs - 33 seeds or so? - back then, though. Now this was... wow, where did the time go, lol? 18+ years ago, and I had more resources to devote to such things back then, so I did do some seed production - and, like their (multiple sets of) parents, there wasn't much observable variation in that generation, either.

Phylos said:
A low level of genetic variation indicates a stabilized or true breeding line that will produce seeds (offspring) with consistent physical characteristics (phenotypes); varieties with higher levels of genetic variation are not true-breeding, and will produce seeds with very different physical characteristics.

Hmm... And "Bubble Gum" has its genetic variation line just a tiny distance from the far right (maximum variation) on the chart.

I had a point. Seem to have dropped it - oh, there it is ;) . There's approximately a googol of different "Bubble Gum" strains in existence. Well, okay, in actuality the number is significantly less 10¹⁰⁰ - but there's a bunch of them. Why is this significant, here? Because I have no f*cking idea WHICH of those strains this report is about!!!

I won't say this makes the thing useless. Rather...
This is useless: *
This is Phylos: %
*%
See? It's merely next to useless.

It probably works great for those strains of which there are no knockoffs/imitations/counterfeits/other strains that coincidentally have the same name. Anyone know if there are any of those left, lol :rolleyes: ?
 
WtF? Poor dolphins (and whales) - on behalf of my species, I hereby apologize for being well on the way to taking you out with us (if not before) when we expire.

Nah bro, at the rate the polar ice caps are melting, it's going to be a water world. I wonder how many generations of humans it would take for US to have webbed feet and webbed hands, then we don't need arms and legs ... our brothers and sisters that already adapted will help us thru?

After we stop eating GMO corn, we may taste a lot better tho. Food for thought.

Then there's the other ... ICE WORLD.

If it can rain 20" in 4 hours, it can snow 20" x 7 (snow factor) = 140" of snow in 4 hrs.
"Houston, we have a problem", just sayin.

Learnt that one from Bear, the guy that built the Wall of Sound.


Wow we got side-tracked. My bad. Sorry sorry sorry.. love the convo tho. We should have a 420magazine growers forum - LIVE.

I'm still interested in the question of best landrace strain qualities to choose from? Asking for a pollen chucker friend!

And HI A/F - that Kookies shit is the sha-diggles. Ready to walk the dogs.
 
You really want to cure addiction?

Ah, yes. All the addictions created with chemicals fed to humans in the name of "health".

The cure was deamed illegal by the US government. More FFT.
 
Nah bro, at the rate the polar ice caps are melting, it's going to be a water world.

Well... no. If all the ice in the Arctic, Antarctic, and Greenland ice sheets melt, it'll only raise sea level about 216 feet. There'll still be LOTS of land left. Florida would be gone, but that's not exactly a glowing recommendation for halting the process, lol. My property would still be "a few" hundred feet above sea level. California would still exist, more or less (San Francisco's hills would become islands). The bulk of North America, South America, etc. would still be land (current coastal areas would be under water, of course, and the Amazon Basin and... that other one (lol) in the southern part of the continent would become Atlantic inlets). Africa wouldn't change greatly, although Alexandria and Cairo would be under the Mediterranean Sea. Much of the African continent would be uninhabitable due to the temperature increase, but that's a different thing. Speaking of temperature increases, the bulk of the current food-production areas on the planet probably won't be (and well before the polar icecaps melt in their entirety) any longer. Even with the massive death toll due to famine, disease, war, et cetera, population density will still be hellish.

But I wouldn't consider Terra an ocean planet even then. We've, what, just under 30% land now? We'll certainly have less in a few decades - but not that much less. And certainly not anywhere near the conditions one might (even in their dreams) expect:

US to have webbed feet and webbed hands

After we stop eating GMO corn, we may taste a lot better tho.

I'm a certified meat-eater, lol, but even I draw the line at cannabilism. At least... you know... while I can still get cow, rabbit, squirrel, et cetera. Maybe I'll reconsider that if/when it's down to people and poultry.

Then there's the other ... ICE WORLD.

In 2015 they observed temperatures in Antarctica to be an astounding 63.5°F (17.5°C). Ice world... aint happening here.

If it can rain 20" in 4 hours, it can snow 20" x 7 (snow factor) = 140" of snow in 4 hrs.

No again, lol. (Snowfall amounts greater than ½" per minute - and for a sustained amount of time, at that - is, for all intents and purposes, patently impossible.

About 90 years or so ago, Japan got something like 7½ feet of snow in 24 hours - but that's "only" 3¾ inches per hour. Last year, a place in Alaska reported one of the most extreme snowfall amounts (per time period) on record. They got - at peak - about 1.7 inches of snow per ten-minute period. And that was at peak.

Now, if you have some way to change the planet's orbit (distance from Sol), that orbit's eccentricity, and the planet's inclination... Then I'd be willing to consider the possibility.

Or you could whip up a handy dandy device for retarding Sol's fusion, I suppose. But that'd only cool the planet. At which point, you've simply locked up a good chunk of the available water. We've had ice ages, sure. But not snowfalls like you suggested. They're pretty much mutually exclusive. Extreme fantastic rates of snow... That's not how it works. 'Twas an ice age because the average temperatures were 12, maybe 18 degrees cooler than they are now. In extreme northern (and extreme southern) parts of the planet, the snow that does fall sticks around longer. Rinse/lather/repeat and, eventually, you end up with snow that doesn't melt during the Summer. Continue and you end up with larger and larger portions of the planet covered with a blanket of snow. Keep it up and, eventually, you have ice sheets (aka glaciers). That's a gross oversimplification, but I suppose it'll do for this discussion.

It doesn't happen in a day. Or a season. Or a year (or even decade). THAT kind of climate change was gradual enough that some animals adapted to it. I'm talking evolution here - which obviously takes some time.

BtW, the planet still had Summer during its ice ages. Temperatures during those Summers would have been pleasant in many areas. Again, that just wasn't enough to melt the ice each year; you'll have that when you've got a two to two and a half mile ice sheet below your feet - which is why we still have ice sheets now. You get some melt, but... It's when this kind of thing stops being considered an anomaly and becomes a trend that there's something to worry about.

There is something to worry about :rolleyes: .

Learnt that one from Bear, the guy that built the Wall of Sound.

Your friend might have been great at building walls(?) - but a climatologist, he wasn't.

Wow we got side-tracked.

Hey, you're right :eek:. Err... Whoops.

How about those Cubbies? I mean... landraces... landraces...

Hmm... Climate change... Disappearing ice sheets... landrace cannabis...

I know! Do you suppose there's evidence of ancient cannabis strains under the Antarctic ice sheet, lofl?

Realistically, it'll take quite some time for all of that ice to melt. Even on that first warm Spring day (week, even), it takes a while for those giant pile of ice/snow that the plows create in grocery store and mall parking lots by repeatedly shoving it all together in one spot to melt. And the Antarctic ice sheet is BIG. Not "gee, school pictures are tomorrow and that pimple is big," big, lol - well over seven million cubic miles of ice. (Maybe this is what confuses those who breathe through their mouths about climate change? IDK...)

So we won't be finding out any time soon. And the weight of all that ice has actually depressed the ground underneath; it'll always be under water (if and when the ice all melts), so diving equipment would be required. And, as much as I like cannabis, I cannot really see this kind of research ever being a priority. But we can speculate ;) .

Speaking of landraces (and I clearly should be, lol): Anyone have any sexually-stable Thai sativa?

love the convo tho

That's something, at least. But... yeah, temporary off-topic train wreck in progress, huh?

We should have a 420magazine growers forum - LIVE.

Like a forum shoutbox? I actually requested that (before thinking) once. Thankfully, wiser heads than mine knew why this is a BAD idea on a forum dealing with a subject matter like cannabis.

I'm still interested in the question of best landrace strain qualities to choose from? Asking for a pollen chucker friend!

Amateur pollen-chuckers are cool. It's when they have professional aspirations that I begin to b!tch and moan.

Are you looking to fix traits, or is this expected to be more of a quick cross and hope for the best kind of thing?

And HI A/F - that Kookies shit is the sha-diggles. Ready to walk the dogs.

Smoke one for me while you're at it, please. I had a couple shots a while back when someone was kind enough to dump out what was left in their bowl for me. But it was a while back, lol.
 
Great conversation. You guys are cool.... :passitleft:
Life keeps interfering with my reply plans.

Very large and tempting conversational side door to hell you opened there also, BB. I just went on an unplanned medical trip through BC, including 2500 km by road. It’s been a few years since I left my little nook and what I saw really made my heart sink. 2500 km of cheaply built tacky shit, vinyl sided generic crap suburbia with no trace of good taste or sustainability. Mass clearcuts, fast food, big barn retail, and general ugliness. What I’ve seen happen to my home in the last 50 years is just sad.
Sorry for the pessimism. Hope springs eternal and it’s natural to try and rationalize a half decent future in spite of the obvious, but I have to agree- if this is what ‘we’ want as a people, apparently, we are f&$ked.

As for what qualities I like in a landrace, this answer probably isn’t going to help your friend any, but I just like that connection to nature. Knowing the plant I’m growing is the same (or close to) the genetics that have existed in an area for hundreds of years- gives a direct line to the human and natural history and culture of that area. Not even sure why I appreciate that so much. Maybe it’s verging on spiritual hippy values or something silly like that. It just seems like there’s a huge value in that connection. Knowing where your seeds come from, where your food and medicine comes from, is a golden starting point.
Also in general the highs I like the most happen to be from African and Thai sativas- so I guess the more blended and bred a strain is, the less likely it is to have the high I like, since pure sativas are much more likely to be mixed with indicas than not. Ultimately it’s the high that I grow the stuff for. Convenient if it doesn’t grow 12’ tall and take 20 weeks to flower, but in the end I don’t care about those frills as much as I care about the herb the plant produces.



Anyone have any sexually-stable Thai sativa?

Yeah I grew Mama Thai from Seedsman for a number of years and it’s stable. A great IBL Thai strain. Just taking a break because my stash jars got full of it. But I’ll be sprouting more soon.
 
Also in general the highs I like the most happen to be from African and Thai sativas

:thumb:

Yeah I grew Mama Thai from Seedsman for a number of years and it’s stable. A great IBL Thai strain.

Thank you. Does it...

grow 12’ tall and take 20 weeks to flower
?

Not a show-stopper, of course - but it'd probably be best to know before growing it.

Mama Thai, huh? I'll definitely stick that one on my wish list.

EDIT: Just did a quick web-search on it and their forum rep - somewhere else - stated that he heard from the breeder that provides that particular strain to Seedsman (as they don't breed their own) stated it's a cross between a Thai and Skunk #1. Does it smell skunky when growing? I'm kind of hoping not.
 
My understanding has always been that Seedsman does breed their own. I thought that’s how their business started out- as the usual argument between breeders that resulted in a split and then they ran different directions with armloads of weed strains, proceeded to argue more and rename strains to better claim ownership. Not that I know much about this stuff. Maybe the situation changed. @GrizzWald will know the story.

Anyway, no skunk in the Mama Thai I’ve grown. It’s straight up Thai. Though definitely selected for size and flowering time.

Edit- a quick search and all I see is sites listing it as a pure sativa. I’d know if it had any skunk in it and wouldn’t be growing it.
 
My understanding has always been that Seedsman does breed their own.

Your understanding... is a misunderstanding;) .

Seedsman Website said:
Our initial concept was to help expert breeders package, market and sell their cannabis seeds. We are not - and have never claimed to be - breeders ourselves, but we do work very closely with our suppliers in order to maximise the exposure of{...}

One of the reasons that I've generally avoided the company is that they've used "Sam the Skunkman" as a supplier in the past (and, I assume, still do). But that's not the only supplier they use.

J TricH said:
Hi DrKing, as we reported in our website Seedsman is not a breeder as such, all our crosses are provided by different breeders, some famous and others anonymous. About this gene in particular, I have not tried, for reasons of space and time, info I have from different growers are somewhat longer times, 11-16 weeks (I guess in indoor many factors come into play) also we know it is a hard variety from the fastest phenotypes Thai. The info we offer are available from the breeder himself, some provide much information, and others less. In the coming days I will try to share all information as possible about this.

J TricH said:
Hi Dr.King.. i have new details from breeder...
Parents are an early thai mother and a skunk no.1 father.
Mostly sativa
Flowering 70 days
Indoor 9-11 wks.
Outdoor Nov
High yield

J TricH is a Seedsman forum rep.

BtW, someone reminded me about Phylos Galaxy yesterday, so it was still fresh in my mind. I just checked it for Mama Thai. No hits, so I did a search for Thai. There's a submission from David Watson, lol (aka "Sam the Skunkman") - and, lo & behold, the report states that "Thailand has heritage similar to varieties in Landrace, with a smaller component of genetic variation similar to varieties in Skunk, CBD." Therefore, I'm guessing he's the breeder of Mama Thai for Seedsman.
 
Depends strain to breeder they use.. can get some well priced genetics, assuming breeders use same parent plants, for their 'wholesale commercial seed sales...
 
I wasn't intending any disrespect towards the company. They're not the only "brand" that doesn't produce their own wares. It isn't necessarily a statement of quality or lack of same. And at least some of the "bred by someone else" business is actually carried out by breeders who also sell their own strains under their own brand. Kind of like those grocery store brand pickles that come out of the same factory where Vlassic (whatever) are jarred up. Just slap a different label on the jar...

As far as that goes, price isn't always a sign of quality (or lack of same), either. KC Brains is one of the cheapest ones out there - and always has been, and they've been around for decades now (AfaIK, they still do their own breeding). They've won a few awards for some of their strains along the way. So I guess you never know about a strain - or the company that sells it - until you grow it out and then sample it. And by "cheap," I mean CHEAP. Like $11US for a pack of their Leda Uno (one of their strains that's won awards (including a Highlife Cup back in the late '90s, IIRC).
 
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