Jon705's Multi Strain HPS LED Hybrid System

re: Jon705's Multi Strain HPS LED Hybrid System

jon705 said:
Hmm...buds bigger than the plants can support...thats not a bad problem to have bro:rofl::rofl: I have the epson salts because theres not really much mag in cal mag so its just incase:)
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jon705 said:
Thanks Mcloadie:Namaste: im kinda worried worried about using RO water now...I ll add some ca/mag and epson salts to the mix just incase, these girls are alot bigger and hopefully can handle change better than the small girls that were in the system.
after about an hr the plants looked a little shocked, some of them drooped but this morning it looked like they were recovering, I hosed them down good with insecticided and then brought them into a totally different enviroment, its cooler in there than outside and obviously the light source is totally different and the co2 levels are double so I was expecting some shock, we'll see in about 3 hrs when the lights come on how bad the shock is, I think they will be fine.The only problem I forsee is they are too tall for the room, Im pretty sure theres at least 1 probably 2 male BD in there, once I confirm that and get them out there will be more room to spread them out and tie them down, hopefully thats enough:)
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Dammit! I had a big response all typed up with quotes from several pages back, then it got lost. Grrr

Sorry I've been absent Jon. I missed the problems you had. It looks like you chose a plan of action and went with it. Sounds like it may work out for you. The plants look like they fit in there fine, but then I reminded myself they had not stretched yet. :yikes:

What I typed, and lost, was I think this IS related to the RO. I have real bad tap water (450+ ppm). I get scale buildup within weeks of installing new fixtures in this house! At some point I'll install a whole house system to deal with that, but I don't want the traditional method of adding salt. In the meantime, I got an RO system for the basement.

The particulates in most hard water are predominantly Ca salts (mostly CO3 I think). Too much Ca can cause lockouts of P and Mg. If I recall correctly, your symptoms matched a P or MG def (or am I confused with another journal? lol). Adding the Epsom may have helped with the Mg, but it didn't address the high levels of Ca. IMHO, you should stick with the RO, but you seem committed to moving to soil. I'm not sure how important RO is with soil, but I'm a hydro guy.

A few pages back, you were talking about your ph with the RO. You mentioned that you were adding the same amount of ph down without checking first and it was pushing your ph too low. Before I switched to RO, I had to add a lot of ph down to get my res where I wanted it. After RO, I don't have to add any. My GH Flora, and I suspect most quality nutes, mix up right at 5.9. The nutes also contain ph buffers to try and maintain the ph. Your well water also contains compounds that are "buffering" the ph as well. That's why it took so much ph down with your well water.

With my RO, the ph of the water didn't change at all from tap. RO comes out just barely above 7, and my tap is ~7.1-7.2. The big difference is how strongly the water wants to stay there. With my tap water, it took quite a bit of ph down to get the mix down to 5.4 (since it would drift up, I mix it low). The first time I made nutes with RO, I did the same as you. I added the same amount of ph down and it went way too low. Then I got to go back and forth trying to get it back where I wanted it.

The point I was trying to make about ph and RO is this. Since there is far less 'stuff' in RO, it will not hold any ph well by itself. There is nothing to buffer ph, so tiny amounts of ph up and down can have large effects. Always add small amounts. You can always add more, but you can't remove extra :winkyface:

One last thing. Did I understand that you ph your water first?!?!?! That's a no no. I'm pretty sure every nute manufacturer says to ph last. This is specifically due to the ph buffers most nutes have in them. If you ph first, you're just 'using up' those buffers.

OK. One more last thing. :blalol: DM Zone says to add it to the res first. I read all my labels almost everytime. Granted, that's mostly because I smoke so much pot and can't remember anything for shit, but it also serves to remind me which order to mix. :rofl: I add Zone first, then the calmag and enzymes. I add my nutes last. I also mix my nutes in 5g buckets, then pour those into the larger res full of water. I mix them in 3-4 pieces, ie Zone goes directly into the res, Calmag and Hygrozyme go into first bucket, Micro, Gro, and Bloom go into the next bucket. FloraBlend and Liquid Kool Bloom (during flower) go into the last bucket. I'll also add superthrive up through stretch.

That's a bummer you had to remove plants. That's a tough call, but it's best to just move on. I'm sure it will all work out for you. Hopefully this summer will still be productive enough for you to swing the shop this fall. :Namaste:
 
re: Jon705's Multi Strain HPS LED Hybrid System

Hey Hiker,
yep its gonna be tight in there, I plan on using metal banding to mount the led's pretty much right to the 2 x 4's on the ceiling, there will still be a 1.5 inch gap big enough for the cooling fans to do they're job, so with alot of tying down and supercropping I think I ll be able to keep them contained lol
I added the ph down and zone first before I had the ro system and let it circulate in the res for a hr and then added the micro first and then everything else and the ph always stabilized at 5.5.I ve done it both was bro, wether I did it my way or added the down last it still worked out to exactly the same amount of down, I found with my way everything got mixed up quicker and I could fire the system up faster I didnt know about ro and ph so I did it the same way and the ph was 2.8 so I drained it all and filled the res then added the nutes and ph was 5.8 without adjusting.
The last res change before I pulled the plants I added epsom salt and cal mag and the next day they looked alot worse. I have no idea what was causing these issues and nobody else including Corey seemed to be able to figure it out, that was it for me...I ve been throwing around the supersoil idea in my head for months now, it just sounds so much easier and Ive always wanted a true perpetual grow.So I decided nows the time to take the plunge, im sick of having one issue after another, it seems every round theres something going wrong but never with the soil plants always with the hydro.This way I ll already be running a perpetual grow so moving everything into the new space will be easy and there wont be any down time.I already like it better bro, its so much easier to move plants around to work on the room or whatever else and I can do as many strains as I want this way, I really like to have multipal strains going and we all know how hard that can be in hydro.Its still going to be awhile before I get the supersoil going, I know very little about organic soils and finding a supplier for the base soil that will work with Sub's recipe is proving to be dificult around here, so in the meantime I ll be using promix and BPN, I had great results last round with it in soil.
I know its going to take some time and patience to dial in the soil but once I do I think its going to make my life alot easier, it will all just become routine after that, I ll be able to leave here for a few days at a time and not have to worry about water levels,ph levels or anything else.

Its not really a bummer I had to cull the plants bro,I hate trying to nurse sick plants through a grow and ending up with a shitty yeild, the chances of the outdoor girls finishing were very slim because of the climate this far north, this way im in flower indoors at least a month earlier so the indoor will come off 2 weeks after the outdoor, which means theres a much better chance of me pulling this build off without running out of money.
Im happy with the decision I made, going organic just feels right to me, im all about making things as easy and problem free as they can be and I think this is the way to do it bro:)
 
re: Jon705's Multi Strain HPS LED Hybrid System

OUTDOOR UPDATE

I think today is day 40 give or take.
I gotta say, autoflowers are definetly the answer to outdoor growing in these parts.They seem to be loving theyre enviroment and the nutes im using,theres at least 10 days of stretch left maybe more and alot of them are already over 4 feet tall and one of them is just over 5 feet!! anybody ever seen a 6 foot auto? by the time they get done stretching theres going to be a bunch of them inbetween 5 and 6 feet tall!
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this Blue hash is going to be 10 feet tall!
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that black chainlink fence is 5 feet tall
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This has got to be the easiest outdoor crop ive ever grown, no training, no defoliating, just water them and watch them grow:)
 
re: Jon705's Multi Strain HPS LED Hybrid System

Im a union carpenter bro but I choose to do this instead.I got sick of the government taking half my check every week, literally half my check, check day was always a bad day for me, the union billed me out at 65 bucks an hr and I was getting paid 32 bucks an hr minus half that the government takes + union dues and working dues ect ect, I much prefer making my own money and keeping all of it! Im Tired of lining they're pockets with my hard earned cash, they dont deserve it!!
 
re: Jon705's Multi Strain HPS LED Hybrid System

Looking so great, my autos pushed out the seed today:) Big auto gardens are certainly the way to go in the north...Mad respect over the career choice..I'm the same, been trained in many, many fields trying to be what I was told to be but it's just not for me..I need to work for me & that is the only way I can be happy...If I want to do my work at 2 am one day, all systems are go...Making my own money & using it to better my & my families life is true freedom....:Namaste:
 
re: Jon705's Multi Strain HPS LED Hybrid System

yep...thats it in a nutshell right there bro:) I work at my own pace when I feel like it and make more money than I did as a carpenter and I have a smile on my face most days, I easily put as many hours in during the summer as I did when I was working but im not dragging my ass to bed every night and waking up dreading yet another day of backbreaking work to make somebody else rich.I did what I had to do to get where I wanted to be...the union served its purpose and I still pay my dues just incase the shit hits the fan:wood:
 
re: Jon705's Multi Strain HPS LED Hybrid System

damn mate, their the biggest damn autos i have seen,

now indoors we give them as much light as possible, some 20-4 and some 24-0. clearly outside their not getting this much light and still doing much better than any indoor autos,

now ive grown a load of kc45's under 20-4 and plants ended up flowering at week 2, ended up harvesting at 1ft tall, now i grew another kc45 from same batch, but this time my grow room was on 12-12, now this auto then took 4 weeks to start flowering, it showed sex 2 weeks later than the same autos under 20-4, it took an extra 3 to 4 weeks till it was ready to harvest,
now the buds on the 20-4 kc 45's was tiny, really small buds, but on the 12-12 auto kc45 the buds are huge, i had 5 buds over 1ft in length and 2 fat to put my hand round, their nearly dry and not lost much size at all,

so here is what im thinking, outdoors they dont get anywhere near 18 hours of light per day and still they grow huge, yes outdoors you have the sun so that would amount to mots of the extra growth, but even so they still get big with less light hours,

so i was thinking this,
lets say an auto needs 240 hours of light to be ready for harvest, so if it was given 24 hours of constant light from day1 till harvest then it wil take 10 days from start to finish, its just an example not real,

now say we give the plant 12-12. this means its getting half as much light and would mean it takes twice as long to reach the same amount of light hours,

now we know plants grow in the dark, so im trying to find out if autos flower due to age in days, or due to age in light hours, so if its age in light hours then growing them under 18-6 or 16-8 or even 12-12 means the plants have actually got longer to grow so would get bigger, but under 24-0 and 20-4 the plants are reaching the flowering age soon and reaching the total light hours till harvest soon,

i could be totally wrong, but all my autos ive grown under either 20-4 or 24-0, all produced very poor, got 1/8th of one and 1/4 of a few others, the most i got was 1/2oz,
now ive grown several kc 45 autos and their was no difference in height or yield when grown under 20-4, most where under 20-4 but i did try 1 under 24-0 from start to finish and produced about the same as 20-4,

but this time round my regular plants where in flower so this kc45 auto grew under 12-12 from day 1 to harvest, it took longer to grow by nearly 4 weeks, now it was from the same batch of seeds, so why did this one produce 3 times or 4 times as much bud and size when given less hours of light,

so does anyone know if autos flower due to amount of total light hours or is it due to the plants age no matter how much light and dark in gets,

from my own experience it looks to me autos flower due to the age they are in actual light hours, so a plant under 24-0 will reach the light age a lot quicker than 12-12, so does this make them flower soon and finish sooner resulting in less yield, so does 12-12 mean it takes twice as long to grow, which mine roughly did and does it mean the plant has got twice as long to grow before harvest, all my k45 autos finished at 1ft high, the one under 12-12 was over 3ft with 5 1ft buds,

what strain are yours jon, i might try and pick some up as im trying to find a big yielding auto to make some fem autos seeds with, i wasnt going to use the kc45 due to its poor yield and small plant, but ive just planted my last 2 kc45 seeds so i can see how they grow, their regular so cant say if their both female or not, but one wll be grown under 12-12 from start to finish and the other will be 18-6, if 12-12 performs better again this time round then im going to go on the fact that autos flower and finish due to the total light hours they receive,
 
re: Jon705's Multi Strain HPS LED Hybrid System

I have Big Bhudda seeds Cheese Automatics(the really tall ones) The one I grew last round indoors under 12/12 finished at 39 inches tall from the soil and yeilded 3.3 oz, theres also Big Bang,Auto bomb,Narcotic Kush,Cream Caramel(freebie),Deisel(freebie).Personally I think autos should be grown under 12/12 indoors but I think they really shine outdoors, just about all of them are already over 3 feet tall and theres still alot of strech to go:)
 
re: Jon705's Multi Strain HPS LED Hybrid System

I read somehwere here that all plants need rest time. For example-- they only have 100% of "energy". During light hours maybe 50% i used to make food, and 50% used to grow. During dark they can go back to 100% being used to grow with 0% needed to capture light. This is a summary and not neary elequently said as the original post. But I thought it sounded like a good anology. Very intersted to hear the more experienced growers take on the dark schedule of autos...
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re: Jon705's Multi Strain HPS LED Hybrid System

My understanding was that Verm isn't organic? HMMMM I would venture a guess to start with #2 & add what's missing?!!!! You could just order this...https://tgasupersoil.com/
 
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