Icemud's Organic SCROG! Grow 3.0

[Mr Mud-Pie]

its on his sig i think but its on the main page 1st or 4th one

 

[Icemud]

Damn i know all granulated forms of can give respitory problems if inhailed but I never saw a warning label bigger than the name brand, crazy!

You would be surprised at how many nutrients/additives/rock powders are not good for human inhalation. I stopped using superthrive because of this reason. When mixing soils and amendments, I always wear a respirator, dust mask or even a bandana will help keep this stuff out of the lungs, especially when you have powders that contain silica.

I also read some articles in the past that pathogens can be transmitted through bat and bird guano's, some pretty nasty stuff if inhaled..

 

[narrowpath]

Looking good!

Don't waste your time with pH. It's completely pointless and can only hurt you!

The tea is living, and the microbes will adjust the pH just the way they want it! Also, you've got a huge buffer with all that soil and all those minerals.

I highly recommend you just stop checking pH from here on out. It won't be the problem, if you have any.

I only agree if all amendments were 100percent organic, but without a cooked, and well established soil ph can and will be a factor, most think just setting up a all organic grow automatically make no use of ph-ing but truth is just like a brand new fish tank, you have to allow the natural ph spike with minimal fish in it before adding more fish, or the ph will sky rocket to fast, and kill the fish even if you started the tank the day before. you must let things go at thier pace, and in their time, more products, and amendments, means more fluxiuation, and time spent for microbs to adapt, so what should be said is if you have all your amendments, and soil, and your feed dialed in, then you never need the ph unless issues arise, and that being done as trouble shooting! oh and only in organic grows, one amendment thats not WILL altar, or kill, or sky rocket ph, this is why fox farms is not used in organic grows, even when it reads organic! confussing yes this is why I am so thuro on explaining for those who just dont get it maybe my mistakes can open some eyes!

 

[narrowpath]

About the Peruvian bat guano

He amended it into his soil, not a tea and I'm pretty sure Icemud & Docbud only use the amended soil on the bottom 1/2 or 1/3 of the pot.

alot better that way, it has time to be broken down by the hurd at thier pace, but the paruvian guano is very hot, and works way better in a salt synthetic grow in my oppinion, the stuff goes along way its super strong. And whats sad is me uncluded I just read something about the companies who gather the guano's world wide, these guys are seeming to be no different as oil tycoons, seems they are killing off the bat populations by damaging thier enviroments, and damaging there eco systems, just like rain forest. It sucks ppl cant just be real, and honest and respectful, when money is at hand horrible things happen! worth to look up for those who care, and use guano, me myself try not to partake in other peoples evil if I can help it, and I found other alternatives, that work with my situation, some may not, to each is own.

 

[Stoned4daze61]

I think you need to check out Docbuds journal narrowpath. Icemud isn't technically flying blind, we have already seen what high brix can do and were so impressed we decided to test matters ourselves. This method has been used to grow food crops for many years and is already producing top quality buds in Docbuds journal.

Keep it up Icemud, can't wait until until I see your Scrog full of primo nugs like your last grow.

And it can only get better

 

[narrowpath]

Hey redeyes!!! thanks for stopping by my journal, and happy to see another Organic grower Check amazon for soil amendments and nutrients, I have found they have the best prices when it comes to things you can't find locally. Also, I have never used, but have seen many successful grows with Blue Planet Nutrients, one of our sponsors. I definitely would suggest looking into BPN, there are ton's of growers on this site which have used them to a great success. With organics, none of your nutrients should be that strong, since most are in unavailable form or only a small percentage is readily available for the plants, usually the rest takes time to break down to something that your plant can use.... Earthjuice is another brand that I have used and had great luck with..

couldnt said it better, and earth juice is the bomb, and if you like them, you must try sugar peak cane molasass, makes organics insainlly tasty!

 

[Icemud]

DAy 15 of Veg, Happy Easter everyone!

Sprayed the girls with my compost tea/foliar spray about 10 mins before the lights came on which gave the mix time to evaporate off the leaves before the HID light's came on. The girls are showing tons of new bright green growth, seems that overnight they just exploded into new tops and fans everywhere

Here's today's photo's

Full Tent views

Sour Bubble

Holy Grail OG

Blackberry Kush

Platinum Bubba

Silverback OG

Platinum Bubba

 

[Stoned4daze61]

I only agree if all amendments were 100percent organic, but without a cooked, and well established soil ph can and will be a factor, most think just setting up a all organic grow automatically make no use of ph-ing but truth is just like a brand new fish tank, you have to allow the natural ph spike with minimal fish in it before adding more fish, or the ph will sky rocket to fast, and kill the fish even if you started the tank the day before. you must let things go at thier pace, and in their time, more products, and amendments, means more fluxiuation, and time spent for microbs to adapt, so what should be said is if you have all your amendments, and soil, and your feed dialed in, then you never need the ph unless issues arise, and that being done as trouble shooting! oh and only in organic grows, one amendment thats not WILL altar, or kill, or sky rocket ph, this is why fox farms is not used in organic grows, even when it reads organic! confussing yes this is why I am so thuro on explaining for those who just dont get it maybe my mistakes can open some eyes!

That is why Docbud adopted TGA's supersoil and spent the time to rework it to his needs/likings. We understand things can go wrong if things aren't properly set up, which is why so much time went into the soil recipe, and teas/foliars. Icemud is pretty close to Duplicating Docbuds methods and his grows have been flawless so I don't think he needs to worry

Even though Fox farms lineup reads organic on the label, not all the products are organic. Kind of misleading in my opinion

Sorry for jacking your thread bro

 

[Icemud]

That is why Docbud adopted TGA's supersoil and spent the time to rework it to his needs/likings. We understand things can go wrong if things aren't properly set up, which is why so much time went into the soil recipe, and teas/foliars. Icemud is pretty close to Duplicating Docbuds methods and his grows have been flawless so I don't think he needs to worry

Even though Fox farms lineup reads organic on the label, not all the products are organic. Kind of misleading in my opinion

Sorry for jacking your thread bro

Very much appreciate your support Stoned4daze, not at all jacking my thread at all ...your saving me from having to type the same thing... lol... I don't think dude understands what I am trying to do here, and I have a suspicion that he is just trying to get his posts up, because out of all 13 posts he has on the site, 11 of them are on my journal, and none of them really adding much to what research and trials that we have already done.. Thanks buddie!!

 

[narrowpath]

Bro....lemon juice won't change a damn thing! You've got all that soil and all those minerals!

Adding the limestone will bring your pH up, I don't care if you add a quart of lemon juice! Just re-dress the minerals once......or do nothing if using the kit.

Your medium's pH won't change with lemon juice....but you will kill microlife on a small scale with it.

Also, quit adding all the humic acids and stuff. Minerals, tea, ferts.....just watch what happens.

yes I would agree, tho lemon juice, vinegar, are acidic, they break down, and fast, best way to say what he just said is because you have your lime it is constant 7.0 and nothing can change it unless it breaks down naturally, which take long, and micro life can adapt to sudule changes, but adding any change in ph 1., or even .1 is a drastic change not to say 7.0 to 6.0 thats 100 times differance in ph, so when lemon is added it swings fast in one direction then quickly swings back, this is why people have shot glasses cuz tiny, tiny sips get you nice and toasty, the whole bottle being tossed up, mean loving on the porcelen God and sleeping in the tub. He is right stop the amendments, let it break down, and cook, I spent way way too much cash, and got way to much stuff my first grows, matter of fact I still got half the crap I never finished using before having problems, it amazes me how many companies are out for just money, and in the mj market their are tons to try to capitalize on us growers because there aint a public way to know what works, and what does not other than thes threads, and older cats who been there done that, like I said not ragging, or saying your dumb or anything of the sort, just friendly tap on a young bucks shoulder to help him see the promise land! good work non the less eventually you will see what we are saying nature has its way of say ive been doing this before you were born!

 

[Icemud]

deleted this comment

 

[narrowpath]

Thanks for stopping by GMP!!! As of the last photo, they are only 2 weeks from clone transplant, day 14 veg.

what is stem training? never heard of it before?

LST is working great, each of the girls now has between 3-5 tops and I will continue LST for the next few weeks until the ladies overgrow these little 2 gallon pots, then they will be transplanted into smartpots #4 and I will continue LST until the girls hit about 20". At that point I have a V shaped Scrog screen that I will continue training until the screen is full, then flip to 10-14 to induce flowering (im running the gas lamp routine so my flowering daylight schedule is different than most).

As far as fans, I have one at pot/root level circulating air below the foliage and I have one overhead circulation fan blowing downwards towards the girls...right now its set to medium and once the girls get a little larger I will turn it up to full, but I didn't want to wind burn the little clones until they had build up a little more foliage

Really appreciate you stopping through my journal and for the advice.... your plants look fantastic !

Here is a photo from my last grow of what my V-Scrog should end up like when its all done

now thats whats up nice looks like crusty the clown fro made of buds! that take talent, I never get scroggy with it, I have no room, and have a hard time being patient so i do micro mini's perpetual sog, alot forgiving, if one has issues I dont lose the whole thing, plus I get to sample and taste new strains, but wow thats a one time reward worth it, you make me want to try this I need a whole set up thought as my Idea is to veg and scrog all year in a 55 gallon then set her lose outside in mid aug, and just see how much I can get but hey we all start at dreams baby! nice job dude!

 

[narrowpath]

You might want to re-read again what I wrote, my post didn't have anything to do with hermies, and all to do with the plant physiological effects of light schedule manipulation, and photochromes and how they effect flowering. You contradict yourself my dude, by saying the best to mimic God, but yet hardly anywhere on earth plants are getting 16hrs a day of light... and your recommending that?? so which one is it? Nowhere besides the upper reaches of the temperate regions see close to 16hrs a day of light, so how is giving them more than 14 hours a day of light is actually un-natural for most of the equatorial strains that we grow... Your going off what growers have been doing for 25 years indoor...I'm going off what nature developed millions of years ago

Fair enough, but yes I was talking about your research into light spectrum, and how many hours needed for best results in any given senerio, my only point to how light will play minimal part in hermi, vs heat, and for ppl like me who read others and learn will read to much into the light science, instead of just knowing lumens, watts, and color spectrum, as well as amount of light times wether being 16 hours to 24 hour for veg. some ppl will get to confused on your broader sorts of research thats all, when like I said it all adds up to very minimal differences. Oh and as far a contradicting myself about us meaning man try to mimic God my friend, we all do. We try to creat the best possible living enviroment for our ladies, and we all come short to Gods work, now if I am wrong then so be it, God made weed, not me, and god grows where ever out doors, Well me got to stay indoors, and I cant make the sun come into my house, or rain, so I copy nature learning along the bro. but all in all I have nothing to hold on to with pride to back down from a situation of not agreeing to disagree, once again I aplaud your works, you gots good skill, and its all good, matter of fact out of all the negative you may have gotten from me by mere mistake, I really cant say any buds i would rather taste than yours first, well the og strains I love, that has something to do with it, lol but continue my friend I would love to see some flower shots of this grow, I will stay tuned!

 

[narrowpath]

You might want to re-read again what I wrote, my post didn't have anything to do with hermies, and all to do with the plant physiological effects of light schedule manipulation, and photochromes and how they effect flowering. You contradict yourself my dude, by saying the best to mimic God, but yet hardly anywhere on earth plants are getting 16hrs a day of light... and your recommending that?? so which one is it? Nowhere besides the upper reaches of the temperate regions see close to 16hrs a day of light, so how is giving them more than 14 hours a day of light is actually un-natural for most of the equatorial strains that we grow... Your going off what growers have been doing for 25 years indoor...I'm going off what nature developed millions of years ago

oh and yes You did not say anything about hermies, but you were talking about plant stress to light, I included it because light does cause hermies, in the same way your talking on 5.5 then hour on then 5.5, all I was saying is for our readers to know if their genetics are not all that this could stress thier plant to hermie, but am I right hell I dont claim to be, just stating what someone mite happen to get if doing an advance scientifc scenerio as you, I just sit and watch cause I havent gotten to the points of putting it in action like you are doing. trust me bro when I first started I was a nob, and reading as post as your doing I would of tried to start there, and I know you got to much time spent to get where you are today, and being a nob would fall under my own ignorance trying to do it anothers way not knowing anything about hermies even! so I am behind in your thread, reading bits when I have time, sometimes I spatter stuf not to be taken as an insult, just nobs like myself can read my nobby comments, and maybe get all of what you are saying! I was bummed when I got my first hermie, or a lady gagas is what i call em, and it was all over my power strip light, so small so innocent frickin sent me thru the roof, so indeed tread lightly begginers with messing with photoperiod, and weak gens it can pop a nanner!

 

[narrowpath]

I haven't been able to find soild evidence yet of what makes up Holy Grail OG but when I talked to the genetics lab that supplied it to me, they told me it is an OG x Master Kush, which by the characteristics of the buds, plant growth and taste I definitely can see may be possible. I also was told that it could be a bubba x OG but I don't think so because it doesn't have that bubba taste..... all I know is I love growing this strain, super high yielding OG, really really strong and seems to really be an easy plant to grow Defintiely would recommend it for ya if you can find it. I did get some seeds off my last batch of Holy Grail, would be interesting to see what come's out of them.

wow thanks for the response, master huh I think it was the first lab genes to be put out it was called hi rise I think could be wrong, but yes a heavy inica for sure, all og's pretty much are, now that there are so many I cant choose one, so I made my mind up to just make a set up for them in the future, and will definatly keep holy up there, I have three that I really really want now, larry, skywalker/og, and now I want to try holy, but space is not my friend at the present, waiting on my lease to move to bigger and better, and I got 6 months, so I am making due with night shade, and pakistan valley both very heavy, but well all love variety! lol

 

[Icemud]

Fair enough, but yes I was talking about your research into light spectrum, and how many hours needed for best results in any given senerio, my only point to how light will play minimal part in hermi, vs heat, and for ppl like me who read others and learn will read to much into the light science, instead of just knowing lumens, watts, and color spectrum, as well as amount of light times wether being 16 hours to 24 hour for veg. some ppl will get to confused on your broader sorts of research thats all, when like I said it all adds up to very minimal differences. Oh and as far a contradicting myself about us meaning man try to mimic God my friend, we all do. We try to creat the best possible living enviroment for our ladies, and we all come short to Gods work, now if I am wrong then so be it, God made weed, not me, and god grows where ever out doors, Well me got to stay indoors, and I cant make the sun come into my house, or rain, so I copy nature learning along the bro. but all in all I have nothing to hold on to with pride to back down from a situation of not agreeing to disagree, once again I aplaud your works, you gots good skill, and its all good, matter of fact out of all the negative you may have gotten from me by mere mistake, I really cant say any buds i would rather taste than yours first, well the og strains I love, that has something to do with it, lol but continue my friend I would love to see some flower shots of this grow, I will stay tuned!

Man, I feel like a d!ck now... sorry for coming off a little rude man. I guess I wasn't prepared to go back into my journal and re-confirm a lot of the information that I had already posted in detail, but I forgot about myself being in that position, also wanting to learn, and reading others journals....and having questions.

It just seemed to me like you were trying to correct my grow techniques which have been formulated over extensive research and planning, but now I see, I overlooked your want to understand and learn..(I'm sorry bro)

You have come to a great place to learn and contribute to the growing knowledge of cannabis, and I hope that we all can better our ways with sharing of ideas, techniques, experiences and research through our connection at 420magazine..

You actually taught me a very valuable lesson without knowing it...that is I need to look outside of my pride and confidence sometimes and see other's views for what they are, and not as negativity, but as a hand on the shoulder to learn or become interested... I hope you do stay tuned and I will try to learn to be more patient, and understanding towards those that would like to learn

 

[Icemud]

oh and yes You did not say anything about hermies, but you were talking about plant stress to light, I included it because light does cause hermies, in the same way your talking on 5.5 then hour on then 5.5, all I was saying is for our readers to know if their genetics are not all that this could stress thier plant to hermie, but am I right hell I dont claim to be, just stating what someone mite happen to get if doing an advance scientifc scenerio as you, I just sit and watch cause I havent gotten to the points of putting it in action like you are doing. trust me bro when I first started I was a nob, and reading as post as your doing I would of tried to start there, and I know you got to much time spent to get where you are today, and being a nob would fall under my own ignorance trying to do it anothers way not knowing anything about hermies even! so I am behind in your thread, reading bits when I have time, sometimes I spatter stuf not to be taken as an insult, just nobs like myself can read my nobby comments, and maybe get all of what you are saying! I was bummed when I got my first hermie, or a lady gagas is what i call em, and it was all over my power strip light, so small so innocent frickin sent me thru the roof, so indeed tread lightly begginers with messing with photoperiod, and weak gens it can pop a nanner!

Here is a really good read, this page specifically for a better understanding of the lighting approach that I am doing with the Gas Lamp Routine... Also, if you go to the 2nd link, it has tons of information about plant physiology to learn. I picked up a ton from this site... its actually a 400 level course at a college.

Photoperiodism

Plant Physiology Spring 2012

 

[Icemud]

And for learning about the High Brix gardening, DocBud has outdone himself with amazing grows, you can learn a ton by reading his journals. Also check out this link and all the sublinks, there is a ton of info about High Brix growing available.

Understanding Your Soil

 

[narrowpath]

Can you post the link with evidence that high P will kill my microherds. In high brix growing, which is what I am doing, Phosphorus is one of the most important elements outside of Calcium and Magnesium... Not that I don't believe you, but I like to see proof.

Liquid CAL/MAG is not in the correct ratios to feed to my girls without amendments. For high brix growing you want at minimum a 7:1 ratio of Cal/mag and at higher levels 20:1. I am doing a grow that is quite different that most growers use, and its forgetting about the NPK and feeding the soil the proper amendment ratios to enhance the EC levels, therefore "supercharging" the breakdown and uptake process. I have removed the epsom salts and replaced this with soft rock phosphate, calcium carbonate, and gypsum.

I like your suggestions, but I am breaking away from the "accepted" concept of growing, and focusing on soil-remineralization, and creating a healthy micro population...check out my other posts and you will understand this method with greater degree. Also check out AGlabs website..tons of good information available..

yes I would say you got a grow going most would run from, lots of respect to have to balls to push the envalope, most of my responses were mainly for 100percent organic grows, nothing on the level of manipilation that your at, yes very interesting. As far as the site of where I found high p kills the hurd, well I can try and find it it may take time, but it was a lab rat college students mid term paper of research on not only mycorrhizea fungus, but tons others as there are thousands, but his base conclusion was that of what I relayed, and have been appling to my grow, and so far, he is correct, as you will know high p is skating on disaster without the knowledge, or know how as you are doing, I just remember the nightmares of chem ferts, now its so simple, and in reality it makes sense what he said as I cant re quote his 20 page results but I took the understanding of happy mycorrhizae happy plant, happy plant no worries, no worries happy smoke! again bro Im close to a nob as one can get reading some of your stuff your ahead of the curb, yes cal magic has just enough to get you a good healthy plant, to stop the yellowing in some cases, my nightshade is extreamly a mineral hog, with out call mag she looks as if she is dead with a nice fat bid, but with happy as can be, so once I really have her dialed in I may look into these minerals to maybe add to my soil, but I use Just right Extra, all I add is vermic, and a tad more zho mycorrizae from botanicare, so I am not sur if itt will work as this soil is hot out the bag, and is all you need, just feed after 2 weeks, plus I deal with way less soil only 20 to 32 ounce cups per plant, you have a wider deeper herd to live, so all factors could change from my grow to yours, oh I believe that post about mycorrhizae was on ----- under organic grows look for a thread called mycorrhizae????? someone dropped the link there bout the high p

 

[narrowpath]

I have a similar program going, worm/compost tea feeding, 2nd feeding being carbons/trace minerals/carbos/sugars, and if needed I do have the earthjuice line, however now that my soil is so fortified, I shouldn't need to add much of anything besides the "lifelines" for the microbs (carbs, calcium, sugars, phosphates)

yes your soil is hot thats for sure lol I run my own business so tending to your type of grow will kill me with stress like i had a ph lock out, and yes my cal magic is organic non cleating, and I have yet to master the computer as I am even more a nob at that to even post pics of just the simple results of my skeem. put it this way just working on my mycorrhizae population, just from clones, my new set of clones are bigger, healthy, way way healthy, and seem to take off from jump in flower. See I put clone straight in 12/12 after rooted well no veg, and if I do just a week, so my root system must be tip top to see any goodness later, before it would take almost 3 weeks to root clones, and at that pace they need veg, now I see feet at 10 days just by putting myco on the clipping, so the herd get started right then, now I can average 12 grams in 45-50 days of flower on my paki valley per plant before maybe 8gs, but still a nob, just saying what works for me, and I went thru months and months, and products after product, to finally see some true results make me want to tell the world! your rewriting the game, making the bar higher for me to climb lol,