Icemud's Organic SCROG! Grow 3.0

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Damn! You're looking real good there!

If I were you, I'd feed tea and minerals only next time. You've got large pots....lots of organic matter for them to munch on.....kick up the microherd!

Do you have some minerals you can top dress with?

what I would do is get use to a system of feeding like top dress worm poo one week, feed next, feed next, then distilled water hi brix molasas, cal mag flush, then repeat!

 

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I definitely appreciate you pointing that out Goshawk, but I would have to add to your statement, that most of the strains we grow, originated in in the tropical or temperate climate zones on earth.. At the very edges of the temperate zone, nearing the polar region is the only area's that see close to 18hours of sunlight naturally. Most of the area's that our strains originated from, (afghanistan, pakistan, mexico, columbia) are all in the 12-14 hour range for peak daylight hours.... For example, here are some max daylight hours for different part of the USA...which sunlight peaks around June 21st.

Daylight peaks around the world..

Alaska 18hrs of daylight
Washington state 16hrs
California 14 hrs
Afghanistan 12.2 hrs
Columbia 13.24
Pakistan 9.9

So as you can see, most of where cannabis naturally grows, the average Max amount of sunlight is around 14 hours of daylight, which means more than that is actually unnatural and possibly can stress your plants out...now a little about flowering...
Cannabis is a SDP or short day plant. With short day plants, the flowering is not triggered by the amount of light, but by the amount of un-interrupted dark. With a short day plant, 12 hours or more of complete darkness is needed to cause flowering hormones to form. By breaking this cycle up, you inhibit these hormones from causing the plant to stay in veg... So as you can see, the amount of light over 12 hours really doesn't matter much, its the dark that is what control's flowering...

It breaks down into photochrome PR (red) and photochrome Pfr (far red). In the short day plants red light, 660nm begins the synthesis of PR and red light converts this to PFR. Now this conversion of PR to PFR in light is a very fast process but at night, the process reverses and is slow, changing the PFR back to PR... Unless there is more PR than PFR, the plant will remain in veg..

Now by interupting the dark cycle with 1 hr of light, the PR is converted back quickly to PFR, so the plant stays in veg, because there again is more of an abundance of PFR than PR...typically this process as we know it for short day plants takes around 12+ hours of darkness to achieve a full reversion. So by breaking the cycle up, the plant will not flower.

I am still reading to confirm about less stress on the plants, but the info above is the reason that gas lamp routine works...

I am not arguing this point, but to say light plays thepart of hermie, I kinda have a mixed feeling bout that, as all mj genetics have this hermie trait for its survival, not a bad thing since we all love mj, without this trait would mean 200 times harder to grow, as if you messed up, you failed, thats it. but today the fem seeds, and off shoots from all the breeding, light is way less a problem, than heat, matter of fact mj is the only plant that can have a constant 24 light period with out bad affects. I tried all settings of light time, 16 would be good for saving energy cost, but the difference in growth is so minimal I chaulk it up to plant personalities, as some people even are tall, or short living in the same smoggy LA valley, lol either way good info, and a tool to store in data bank int he mind for all growers, we all do our best to mimic God, and quite frankly we all come up short he he...

 

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Alright everyone..... So I have placed my order for the clones and they will be here later today!!! So I went against making it easy on myself and running only 3 strains, I decided to get 5 instead...lmao...

So here is going to be the featured ladies in Icemuds Cannabeauty Pagent!! LOL

returning from last grow is Holy Grail OG... 1x ( I still have not found the exact genetics involved with Holy Grail OG) but just knowing from my last run, she is a heavy hitter. With the growth traits more similar to a bubba or master kush and a master kush taste and smell, I believe that it is an og x master kush, or an og x bubba kush, but still no for sure answers)

And new to the grow are the following..

Platinum Bubba x2 (platinum kush (purple x master kush x og kush) x bubba kush)
Sour Bubble x1 (BX3 Bubblegum)
Silverback OG x1 (silverback (supersilver haze x grape ape) x OG)
Blackberry OG x1 (afghani mother x DJ shorts blue berry)

I wonder if the holy grail og is actually larry og, because I got just a little from a shop once they only had a ounce, and were out of my usual blue spicy disco, but i get a gram get home and hate the other picks I had, decided to roll a joint of larry, and wammo just a few hits had me stuck with half a joint that went out from zoning, and I am strickly heavy indica, all else fails for me, but larry tasted, smelled, and all around great,. But since I cant find it, and researching her seems to be named after a breeder at a collective in oakland ca somewhere, but who ever larry is good job, and now I really want to check out this holy grail, the name sound masterful as well, she may be my new strain to my next list to grow along with larry. I wish I could tasteyour grows, cuz you have lots of ogs so you pretty much got em dialed in I bet, around here I want to shoot some people over passing of some junk as og! I only have afgan kush, snow white, white wid, nightshade, pakistan valley, I am caught in a pickle trying to figure out what I should do, get fem og's or reg to start breeding, and come up with some kill night night strains in the future, as night shade, and paki are hella primo foundations, as og's are, you making me lean more to just growing og's, and dancing in supreme bliss having hardy landrace, and californias best would make a great collection!

 

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Hey Doc, thanks for stopping on over

I did somewhat mineralize my soil, but when I mixed up my soil I didn't have gypsom and rock phosphate so I made due with what I had, the Bioroot and earthjuice bloom I have both have soft rock phosphate added so I was planning on using the bloom since the ratio was pretty on with the ones from aglabs... eventually I am going to do a mild topcoat of gypsum but only if its really needed, it will be in the mix for when I transplant for sure.. I also plan on getting some fish hydroslate, was looking at the neptune one cause it was a 2-3-1 which seemed also with the right range..

But what I did at was the following, copy and pasted from earlier because I couldn't remember the exact amounts..lol


2.5 pots of happy frog
2.5 pots of Fox Farm Ocean forrest
1 pot of perlite
1 pot of Ancient Forest Humus
1 pot of worm casings with volcanic rock and kelp added

There is my 8 pots of soil...

Now the amendments blended in...

Greensand... 2 cups total (16oz)
humboldt nutrients mycos maximum 1 cup (8oz)
espom salt... 3/4 a cup (6 oz)
Mexican Bat guano 2 cups (16oz)
Peruvian Seabird guano, 2 cups (16oz)
garden lime... 10 oz,



I figure with the greensand, and volcanic rock I hopefully will be covered with the remineralization along with the garden lime for Ca and Mg (even though not in right ratio, I also have enzymaticly digested cal/mag at a 5:1 liquid as well) I was light on the epsom salt because I had already added Mg with the lime, however I wanted the slight S from the epsom as well.

Not ragging on your recipe, just a note that peruvian guano is very high in p and would only use it late in flower in a tea, so you dont kill your mycorrhizae hurd, its a common and very costly mistake we all even myself have made. its better to use the myco early in rooting clones, and getting a good root colony during veg, so when you flip your plants will have a big mouth so to speak to eat, and the myco keep all the nutes in a way its used, as we all hate lock outs, and the lower yelloing of leaves, tale tell sign of nute intake problems. Simple, and sweet should be in any aproach let the plant do its thing, help your hurd, feed them, they will feed the plant! also dont use epson salts, as it does have the minerals, its not a stable, just like vinegar for ph down, and its more of one mineral than the next, its just ten bucks to have a bottle of cal mag, and to have it as a must have in any foundation of feeding, with these two things taking care of you will have way less stress over lock out, and you will notice how much more the plant eats, and grows!

 

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I like icing Thanks Doc.... I will be getting some of these this week

much easier, cheaper, and well spread if you get cal Magic ten bucks, remember if your less stressed, then so will your plants, they pick up the vibes, this mix thou may work, just adds time, and money, and weight those bags are heavy, just saying you get to feed, and enjoy looking over your girls, instead of fustrations of all the different senerios from all the other things you got going!

 

[Stoned4daze61]

Not ragging on your recipe, just a note that peruvian guano is very high in p and would only use it late in flower in a tea, so you dont kill your mycorrhizae hurd, its a common and very costly mistake we all even myself have made. its better to use the myco early in rooting clones, and getting a good root colony during veg, so when you flip your plants will have a big mouth so to speak to eat, and the myco keep all the nutes in a way its used, as we all hate lock outs, and the lower yelloing of leaves, tale tell sign of nute intake problems. Simple, and sweet should be in any aproach let the plant do its thing, help your hurd, feed them, they will feed the plant! also dont use epson salts, as it does have the minerals, its not a stable, just like vinegar for ph down, and its more of one mineral than the next, its just ten bucks to have a bottle of cal mag, and to have it as a must have in any foundation of feeding, with these two things taking care of you will have way less stress over lock out, and you will notice how much more the plant eats, and grows!

About the Peruvian bat guano

He amended it into his soil, not a tea and I'm pretty sure Icemud & Docbud only use the amended soil on the bottom 1/2 or 1/3 of the pot.

 

[Icemud]

I'm liking what im seeing so far. Can't wait to see those ladies fill up that screen of yours.
Are those Binder clips that you are using to hold the strings? If so thanks for the idea on my next round.

Hey McPuffin, Yep those are binder clips, I can't take the credit for the idea, someone on my last grow had recommended them, but they work like a charm, definitely nice because its so easy to adjust them when needed. Thanks for the compliments !!!

 

[Icemud]

Fantastic job on the journal. You are great at getting us readers the details. The shots of the packaging is so helpful in learning what this stuff is for and also for making a good shopping list for my next grow.

Plants look great too!

Thanks 70's Grower!!! much appreciate the help on quitting the cigs, going to try to knock my habit down to just 1 or 2 a day, and then gone

 

[Icemud]

looking healthy as usual ice....

Thanks Taylormade!!!! much appreciate it buddie!!!!

 

[Icemud]

I am not arguing this point, but to say light plays thepart of hermie, I kinda have a mixed feeling bout that, as all mj genetics have this hermie trait for its survival, not a bad thing since we all love mj, without this trait would mean 200 times harder to grow, as if you messed up, you failed, thats it. but today the fem seeds, and off shoots from all the breeding, light is way less a problem, than heat, matter of fact mj is the only plant that can have a constant 24 light period with out bad affects. I tried all settings of light time, 16 would be good for saving energy cost, but the difference in growth is so minimal I chaulk it up to plant personalities, as some people even are tall, or short living in the same smoggy LA valley, lol either way good info, and a tool to store in data bank int he mind for all growers, we all do our best to mimic God, and quite frankly we all come up short he he...

You might want to re-read again what I wrote, my post didn't have anything to do with hermies, and all to do with the plant physiological effects of light schedule manipulation, and photochromes and how they effect flowering. You contradict yourself my dude, by saying the best to mimic God, but yet hardly anywhere on earth plants are getting 16hrs a day of light... and your recommending that?? so which one is it? Nowhere besides the upper reaches of the temperate regions see close to 16hrs a day of light, so how is giving them more than 14 hours a day of light is actually un-natural for most of the equatorial strains that we grow... Your going off what growers have been doing for 25 years indoor...I'm going off what nature developed millions of years ago

 

[Icemud]

I wonder if the holy grail og is actually larry og, because I got just a little from a shop once they only had a ounce, and were out of my usual blue spicy disco, but i get a gram get home and hate the other picks I had, decided to roll a joint of larry, and wammo just a few hits had me stuck with half a joint that went out from zoning, and I am strickly heavy indica, all else fails for me, but larry tasted, smelled, and all around great,. But since I cant find it, and researching her seems to be named after a breeder at a collective in oakland ca somewhere, but who ever larry is good job, and now I really want to check out this holy grail, the name sound masterful as well, she may be my new strain to my next list to grow along with larry. I wish I could tasteyour grows, cuz you have lots of ogs so you pretty much got em dialed in I bet, around here I want to shoot some people over passing of some junk as og! I only have afgan kush, snow white, white wid, nightshade, pakistan valley, I am caught in a pickle trying to figure out what I should do, get fem og's or reg to start breeding, and come up with some kill night night strains in the future, as night shade, and paki are hella primo foundations, as og's are, you making me lean more to just growing og's, and dancing in supreme bliss having hardy landrace, and californias best would make a great collection!

I haven't been able to find soild evidence yet of what makes up Holy Grail OG but when I talked to the genetics lab that supplied it to me, they told me it is an OG x Master Kush, which by the characteristics of the buds, plant growth and taste I definitely can see may be possible. I also was told that it could be a bubba x OG but I don't think so because it doesn't have that bubba taste..... all I know is I love growing this strain, super high yielding OG, really really strong and seems to really be an easy plant to grow Defintiely would recommend it for ya if you can find it. I did get some seeds off my last batch of Holy Grail, would be interesting to see what come's out of them.

 

[Icemud]

Not ragging on your recipe, just a note that peruvian guano is very high in p and would only use it late in flower in a tea, so you dont kill your mycorrhizae hurd, its a common and very costly mistake we all even myself have made. its better to use the myco early in rooting clones, and getting a good root colony during veg, so when you flip your plants will have a big mouth so to speak to eat, and the myco keep all the nutes in a way its used, as we all hate lock outs, and the lower yelloing of leaves, tale tell sign of nute intake problems. Simple, and sweet should be in any aproach let the plant do its thing, help your hurd, feed them, they will feed the plant! also dont use epson salts, as it does have the minerals, its not a stable, just like vinegar for ph down, and its more of one mineral than the next, its just ten bucks to have a bottle of cal mag, and to have it as a must have in any foundation of feeding, with these two things taking care of you will have way less stress over lock out, and you will notice how much more the plant eats, and grows!

Can you post the link with evidence that high P will kill my microherds. In high brix growing, which is what I am doing, Phosphorus is one of the most important elements outside of Calcium and Magnesium... Not that I don't believe you, but I like to see proof.

Liquid CAL/MAG is not in the correct ratios to feed to my girls without amendments. For high brix growing you want at minimum a 7:1 ratio of Cal/mag and at higher levels 20:1. I am doing a grow that is quite different that most growers use, and its forgetting about the NPK and feeding the soil the proper amendment ratios to enhance the EC levels, therefore "supercharging" the breakdown and uptake process. I have removed the epsom salts and replaced this with soft rock phosphate, calcium carbonate, and gypsum.

I like your suggestions, but I am breaking away from the "accepted" concept of growing, and focusing on soil-remineralization, and creating a healthy micro population...check out my other posts and you will understand this method with greater degree. Also check out AGlabs website..tons of good information available..

 

[Icemud]

much easier, cheaper, and well spread if you get cal Magic ten bucks, remember if your less stressed, then so will your plants, they pick up the vibes, this mix thou may work, just adds time, and money, and weight those bags are heavy, just saying you get to feed, and enjoy looking over your girls, instead of fustrations of all the different senerios from all the other things you got going!

Cal Magic seems to be the same as botanicar cal/mag...and not in the right ratio's for High Brix growing, as well as it has added N. The soil microbes, nitrogen fixing bacteria grab N out of the air, so with a healthy soil, adding N is not needed. Also, Cal Magic is synthetic....definitely not good for your soil microlife, especially if it is EDTA chelated.

 

[Icemud]

what I would do is get use to a system of feeding like top dress worm poo one week, feed next, feed next, then distilled water hi brix molasas, cal mag flush, then repeat!

I have a similar program going, worm/compost tea feeding, 2nd feeding being carbons/trace minerals/carbos/sugars, and if needed I do have the earthjuice line, however now that my soil is so fortified, I shouldn't need to add much of anything besides the "lifelines" for the microbs (carbs, calcium, sugars, phosphates)

 

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I decided to dump my nutrient tea/mix from yesterday, I think I put too much epsom salt in it because I was not getting a good froth on top of the bubbling mix like usual, which I think means that a good bacterial feast is not happening. So rather than put something on my plants roots that is not harboring life, I decided to dump it and get a compost tea going...

So I mixed up 4 gallons of 0ppm R/O D/I water with:

1 nylon stuffed with my supersoil
20ml of humic acid
10ml of liquid carboload (sugars/carbs)
1tbsp of molasses
10ml of Earthjuice bloom 0-3-2 (added for soft rock phosphate) 1/2 amount
10 ml of Bioroot 1-1-1 (soft rock phosphate, brewers yeast)
1ml of bioweed (cold pressed seaweed)

1 spoonful of greensand

Immediately after mixing this up, the bubble's began to form, so I think I overdid the epsom salts.. I am going to feed the babies within the next 24-48 hours, and should be getting in the mail today my soft rock phosphate, gypsum, and lava sand so looks like they will be making it into the next feeding.

Other than taking care of my ladies, been fighting a really nasty cold/sore throat, but upped my vitamins, too some good antioxidants (garlic/ginger, astaxanthin, tumeric) and already within a day feel much better...

Most people that grow find this situation when all your thinking and concockting teas produces a fine mess, and we all know how important it is when baking and being prcise on measurements, and ingredients, or it just dont turn out so well. My word of advice is simple dechlorinated water/distilled worm castings, a humic soil at 2-2-2npk or close, alaskan has the best, and with earth juice hi-brix molasass, brew 30 hours, and feed, teas add fresh, and energize existing microbs which in turn break down to feed plant, adding high amounts of anything exspecially concentrated guanos, kelp, granuals, is like going to all you can eat buffet, and made to eat every single drop of food offered, you just cant do it and if you tried it will be unpleasant no matter how good the food. put it also this way in thinking adding more is better, if I had a fully funtioning hurd of microbs and feed with just worm poo, and you had half the hurd, and any food you can find to feed, my plant will be more better in every way, as most of your plants enegy will be fighting itself than growing, locking out of just one thing means a chain reaction of all things until problem is adressed, and if you have 20 things being added to a tea where do you start? I love this thread, lots of points every one can dig into, never talk down to people I am not doing this, this man has a awesome set up, good genetics, a innovative, and well rounded tought process, and most of allappling it to life, at this point if your not growing, he is years ahead of you, and years to go, most may think there is just one way to do things, and that its us, man who makes the plant, but after many years you find out you are the one who is learning or has learned, and in any growing enviroment, no matter how long you grow, she always pays you a reward, some big, so never look at the bad as bad, look at it as good, lessons learned!

 

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I've been reading that as well, most high brix produce will not rot, mold or start decomposing for many many months, vs a low brix food which will break down quickly..

crazy info, but still be scared to eat it after 6mo tho. lol oh has anyone seen a video called codex alimentarus, they talk about crazy food additives that make us sick, and how all our foods are purposly grown weak, or altered, this sounds like that, hi brix grow, never thought to use it for food, I will start.

 

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Well just got my Calcium Carbonate, and gave the ladies a top dressing. I gave each plant 1 shotglass of Calcium Carbonate each, plus a slight spoonful to give the proper ratio's of 6-5-3 that was recommended by Docbud. I hope that I gave the proper amount's of each, going off the label on the soft rock phosphate and improvising from there... I guess I will know after feeding them and watching the growth and leaves the next few days.

Still waiting on my lava sand which should be arriving shortly today, and then the girls will get there watering

Here are some photo's of the Calcium carbonate and top dressing

Damn i know all granulated forms of can give respitory problems if inhailed but I never saw a warning label bigger than the name brand, crazy!

 

[Grandpa Mud-P]

Hey there icemud id like to tell you i got a grow with my nephew and were gonna do a pretty crazy thing u shoudl check it out and tell everyone ull like it

 

[Icemud]

Most people that grow find this situation when all your thinking and concockting teas produces a fine mess, and we all know how important it is when baking and being prcise on measurements, and ingredients, or it just dont turn out so well. My word of advice is simple dechlorinated water/distilled worm castings, a humic soil at 2-2-2npk or close, alaskan has the best, and with earth juice hi-brix molasass, brew 30 hours, and feed, teas add fresh, and energize existing microbs which in turn break down to feed plant, adding high amounts of anything exspecially concentrated guanos, kelp, granuals, is like going to all you can eat buffet, and made to eat every single drop of food offered, you just cant do it and if you tried it will be unpleasant no matter how good the food. put it also this way in thinking adding more is better, if I had a fully funtioning hurd of microbs and feed with just worm poo, and you had half the hurd, and any food you can find to feed, my plant will be more better in every way, as most of your plants enegy will be fighting itself than growing, locking out of just one thing means a chain reaction of all things until problem is adressed, and if you have 20 things being added to a tea where do you start? I love this thread, lots of points every one can dig into, never talk down to people I am not doing this, this man has a awesome set up, good genetics, a innovative, and well rounded tought process, and most of allappling it to life, at this point if your not growing, he is years ahead of you, and years to go, most may think there is just one way to do things, and that its us, man who makes the plant, but after many years you find out you are the one who is learning or has learned, and in any growing enviroment, no matter how long you grow, she always pays you a reward, some big, so never look at the bad as bad, look at it as good, lessons learned!

I really am not understanding what your point with this post is my dude...

Are you saying that I am downtalking you? I didn't really get the point of anything in the above post.. please try to type in full sentences, It makes it very hard to interpret what you are trying to get across when your writing doesn't flow properly.

A 2-2-2 Ratio is not the right ratio for what I am trying to accomplish... Please read into High brix growing so you have a better understanding what I am doing.

 

[Icemud]

Hey there icemud id like to tell you i got a grow with my nephew and were gonna do a pretty crazy thing u shoudl check it out and tell everyone ull like it

I would love to check it out.... I'm sure I will love it with all of your expertise and many years of perfection Do you have the link in your signature?