Humid Temperate Colombian Andes Greenhouse Organic Grow

[CBDMed]

Tech Industries says you are right. He says they do not adapt (so they will always need night additional lighting here).
+1 for CBDHemp808!

>> "It would not have adaptability even with the passage of time, it would have to be crossed with native genes, and go from generation to generation looking for that genetic variable or adaptable individual that behaves under said sowing times..."

So you were right!
I hope you slept well.

 

[420]

@420 how about inviting Oregon CBD/GTR seeds to be sponsors? They are masters of chemotype 3 CBD genetics.

Send me a link and I'll send them an offering

 

[CBDMed]

Send me a link and I'll send them an offering

Thank you Rob!
They have large, delectable Chemotype 3 seeds, which are very helpful for autistic people with lots of bodily injuries. For example:

Sour Hawaiian Haze

Sour Hawaiian Haze feminized CBD seeds offer exotic tropical flavors with a high CBD kick! A best selling CBD strain with an incredible terpene profile.

gtrseeds.com

Sour Lifter

Order Sour Lifter feminized CBD seeds from Oregon CBD. Award winning, certified Organic, high CBD Sour Lifter seeds for biomass or smokeable flower.

gtrseeds.com

Here is their contact page:
Contact

Thanks for this forum. It is great!

 

[InTheShed]

As you know, my go to is neem oil mixed with Bronner's peppermint soap and water,

I don't know if Colombian neem is any different from ours in the States but ours does better just mixed with water. Adding surfactants makes it more likely to burn the leaves. I go with either neem or Dr B's but not mixed.

 

[CBDMed]

I don't know if Colombian neem is any different from ours in the States but ours does better just mixed with water. Adding surfactants makes it more likely to burn the leaves. I go with either neem or Dr B's but not mixed.

Thanks, Shed.
But how do you get oil to mix with water without a soap or surfactant?

 

[InTheShed]

Thanks, Shed.
But how do you get oil to mix with water without a soap or surfactant?

You don't get it to emulsify so it's shake spray shake spray. With a pump sprayer I usually shake every minute or so. Not a huge agitation but enough to get the contents mixed again.

Pour some in a glass bottle after you mix it, shake it up, and see how long it takes to separate.

 

[Lady Cannafan]

You don't get it to emulsify so it's shake spray shake spray. With a pump sprayer I usually shake every minute or so. Not a huge agitation but enough to get the contents mixed again.

Pour some in a glass bottle after you mix it, shake it up, and see how long it takes to separate.

Keep it in a warm place too. That neem oil solidifies a bit if it gets cold.

 

[cbdhemp808]

I don't know if Colombian neem is any different from ours in the States but ours does better just mixed with water. Adding surfactants makes it more likely to burn the leaves. I go with either neem or Dr B's but not mixed.

That was actually me, not Med. I've been using it for years without any leaf burn whatsoever. I use 2 tbs pure neem oil and 2 tbs Bronner's peppermint in 1 gal water, in the pump sprayer. I shake it very well before applying. If I want a bit more kill power, I add like 12 drops of pure orange oil (limonene) which is a potent insecticide.

 

[cbdhemp808]

Ok, I see two hits:

I think that search is returning "adaptation".

Try this search "everywhere" and you'll find a lot more results...

 

[InTheShed]

That was actually me, not Med.

What was you? I replied to CBDMed's post.

I've been using it for years without any leaf burn whatsoever. I use 2 tbs pure neem oil and 2 tbs Bronner's peppermint in 1 gal water, in the pump sprayer. I shake it very well before applying. If I want a bit more kill power, I add like 12 drops of pure orange oil (limonene) which is a potent insecticide.

I'm glad to hear that it's working for you without a problem! I know that the only folks I've seen that do have a problem with neem oil have added surfactants to it, I've never found a need to add anything to it whether I'm using it for pests or PM in veg.

 

[CBDMed]

What was you? I replied to CBDMed's post.

I'm glad to hear that it's working for you without a problem! I know that the only folks I've seen that do have a problem with neem oil have added surfactants to it, I've never found a need to add anything to it whether I'm using it for pests or PM in veg.

I have been copying Hemp's recommendation, 2 tsp neem and 2 tsp Bronners and I have not had a problem with burn. (Your mileage may vary.)

 

[cbdhemp808]

What was you? I replied to CBDMed's post.

He re-posted one of my posts. ...didn't provide a link to it, but actually copied and pasted my post into this thread.

I'm glad to hear that it's working for you without a problem! I know that the only folks I've seen that do have a problem with neem oil have added surfactants to it, I've never found a need to add anything to it whether I'm using it for pests or PM in veg.

I have always thought of the liquid Bronner's as an ideal foliar against insects, since it's completely organic and non-toxic (except to insects!) I mean, this is a well known thing... soap solution to kill insects on plants. So, combining it with neem makes total sense to me, because you can then emulsify the neem. Another aspect is that the soap allows better sticking of the neem to the leaves, and neem is absorbed into the plant and goes systemic.

 

[InTheShed]

He re-posted one of my posts. ...didn't provide a link to it, but actually copied and pasted my post into this thread.


I have always thought of the liquid Bronner's as an ideal foliar against insects, since it's completely organic and non-toxic (except to insects!) I mean, this is a well known thing... soap solution to kill insects on plants. So, combining it with neem makes total sense to me, because you can then emulsify the neem. Another aspect is that the soap allows better sticking of the neem to the leaves, and neem is absorbed into the plant and goes systemic.

Gotcha. And I use Dr B's unscented all through flower for pests.

 

[CBDMed]

I think that search is returning "adaptation".

Try this search "everywhere" and you'll find a lot more results...

Thanks. I hope to look that up sometime, but right now I am on deadline again.
However, I get the idea that European genetics don't just "adapt" to the tropics in a few years--but rather it would probably take an act of intentional cross-breeding and gene splicing, and then a big pheno chase.
Sounds like a ton of work!

If the European genetics definitely need night lighting, then probably the easiest thing is just to run evening party lights for the girls, so they can be social well into the night, and not flower.
And we can run tropical sativas alongside the others.

They say tropical sativas go hermie a lot, but we will just have to patrol for flowers.

 

[cbdhemp808]

Thanks. I hope to look that up sometime, but right now I am on deadline again.
However, I get the idea that European genetics don't just "adapt" to the tropics in a few years--but rather it would probably take an act of intentional cross-breeding and gene splicing, and then a big pheno chase.
Sounds like a ton of work!

Yes, I recall we discussed all that before. Yes, cross breeding and pheno hunting, to adapt to the high elevation and climate. Coming up with a new strain that matches the same photoperiod adaptations as the landrace tropical sativas, to me is pretty much a lost cause. What you would end up with is a variation of a tropical sativa, and it's hard to imagine that being better than the landraces which took a long time to evolve w/ the help of humans.

All chemotype 1, 2, 3 cannabis everywhere, except for some tropical sativa landraces, will need night interruption lighting if grown in the tropics. If you don't use it, then the plants will likely be small because they will immediately go into flowering as soon as they are mature enough. The reason is that the night length is sufficiently long year round to cause them to go into flower.

If the European genetics definitely need night lighting, then probably the easiest thing is just to run evening party lights for the girls, so they can be social well into the night, and not flower.
And we can run tropical sativas alongside the others.

It would be OK to run the party lights from dusk to some point in the night, but I don't think all night is a good idea. For example, dusk to 12 midnight. Whatever you do, you need to get the dark period down to 9 or 9.5 hours. 10 is probably not enough.

As I said before, if you are running the Mango Biche in the same greenhouse w/ the others, then the lighting should be stopped before the Mango Biche reaches its normal, seasonal flowering period. Otherwise the lighting will prevent it from flowering. This implies that when the lights stop, everything in the greenhouse will go into flower.

They say tropical sativas go hermie a lot, but we will just have to patrol for flowers.

I'd say that's probably strain specific. Irregular lighting can cause that.

 

[CBDMed]

Yes, I recall we discussed all that before. Yes, cross breeding and pheno hunting, to adapt to the high elevation and climate. Coming up with a new strain that matches the same photoperiod adaptations as the landrace tropical sativas, to me is pretty much a lost cause. What you would end up with is a variation of a tropical sativa, and it's hard to imagine that being better than the landraces which took a long time to evolve w/ the help of humans.

All chemotype 1, 2, 3 cannabis everywhere, except for some tropical sativa landraces, will need night interruption lighting if grown in the tropics. If you don't use it, then the plants will likely be small because they will immediately go into flowering as soon as they are mature enough. The reason is that the night length is sufficiently long year round to cause them to go into flower.


It would be OK to run the party lights from dusk to some point in the night, but I don't think all night is a good idea. For example, dusk to 12 midnight. Whatever you do, you need to get the dark period down to 9 or 9.5 hours. 10 is probably not enough.

As I said before, if you are running the Mango Biche in the same greenhouse w/ the others, then the lighting should be stopped before the Mango Biche reaches its normal, seasonal flowering period. Otherwise the lighting will prevent it from flowering. This implies that when the lights stop, everything in the greenhouse will go into flower.


I'd say that's probably strain specific. Irregular lighting can cause that.

Wow, super thanks for rehashing that for me. That was super helpful!



Yes, I remember that you and others were telling me how it was a bad idea to try crossing a tropical with a non-tropical, but I don't think it registered. I don't think I understood that the photo flip mechanism is completely different.

I wonder if anyone makes a tropical Chemotype 2 or 3. Punto Rojo (Red Point) is a balanced Colombian tropical Chemotype 2, it just has a rather low cannabinoid content. I think it has something like 3% THC and 3% CBD, which isn't very much.
I wonder if anyone has worked with Punto Rojo to boost the cannabinoid percentages, or if there are any other tropical Chemotype 2 strains that could be adapted to this altitude.

I am just guessing the party lights will run from sunset and then they will start to run out of juice around maybe 11PM or midnight.

If all that is the case, then I think the plan is to run the party lights until the plants get big enough, and then to take the party lights away. In the future it will be nice to run the party lights in the winter and then take them away at the start of summer (say, October 1 or something). And then the European genetics can take two or three months to flower, and the tropical genetics can take three or four months to flower--but then they can flower during summer.

I guess I need to do a deep dive for tropical Chemotypes 2 and 3.

Thanks again Hemp! I think that time I got what you were trying to tell me before.

 

[cbdhemp808]

I guess I need to do a deep dive for tropical Chemotypes 2 and 3.

I think we also had this conversation before, and we were talking about strains from tropical mountain regions, for example Laos**. I think I probably directed you to The Real Seed Company who specialize in various landraces. Perhaps you have already contacted them. If you did, I don't remember the outcome of that. (**I think Hmong Hemp probably doesn't have much CBD, or maybe it would be a pheno hunt.)

I think any landraces with significant amounts of CBD are probably not tropical but more northern. I think your best bet is to contact GTR Seeds and ask if they have any type 2 or 3 strains that would work in your mountain location. Maybe I already recommended this... I dunno.

 

[CBDMed]

I think we also had this conversation before, and we were talking about strains from tropical mountain regions, for example Laos**. I think I probably directed you to The Real Seed Company who specialize in various landraces. Perhaps you have already contacted them. If you did, I don't remember the outcome of that. (**I think Hmong Hemp probably doesn't have much CBD, or maybe it would be a pheno hunt.)

I think any landraces with significant amounts of CBD are probably not tropical but more northern. I think your best bet is to contact GTR Seeds and ask if they have any type 2 or 3 strains that would work in your mountain location. Maybe I already recommended this... I dunno.

Man, you are miles and miles ahead of me. Sorry, no, I did not catch all that on the first bounce.
(Hahaha, so THAT is what you were trying to say? )

Angus of the Real Seed Company said the only landraces that could be called "CBD landraces" were hemp landraces.
He said that they do have a tropical hemp landrace from Laos, but that no, it had not been worked for high CBD, and he could make no guarantees at all about CBD content.

Hmong Hemp - The Real Seed Company - Cannabis Landrace Seeds

Genetics: Hmong Cannabis Landrace – Hemp Sourcing: The Real Seed Company, Laos, Southeast Asia, 2023 Purpose: Fibre and seed Latitude: 20° N Regional Harvest: Seed to harvest = 5 to 6 months Height: Up to c. 4 metres Characteristics: High bast...Read more

therealseedcompany.com

He says their focus is biodiversity. He did not want me to buy his Hmong seed. (I think he only wants Hmong to buy it??) He encouraged me to focus on in-situ preservation of Colombian landraces. (So I guess he only wants people in Colombia to buy Colombian landraces??)

GTR seemed unconcerned about the altitude. I am not either. I have been growing European seeds indoors under LED and a couple on the roof, and they grow just fine here. Mold has been a huge problem, but thanks to your thread I am doing much better on selecting mold-resistant genetics. (You never really know until you successfully complete the grow, but I think I am in much better shape now that you helped me to understand how to pick seeds for here.)
I still have some Dr. Seedsman 30:1, and I have Charlotte's Dream and Harlequin CBD (18% CBD) on the way. That should cover me for this next grow, but I want to try GTR after that. I think Lifter, Sour Lifter and Sour Hawaiian Haze sound superb!
(But we will see what happens...)

 

[CBDMed]

Keep it in a warm place too. That neem oil solidifies a bit if it gets cold.

Thanks Shed, Lady Cannafan!

 

[CBDMed]

GTR seemed unconcerned about the altitude.

PS I should probably add that I told them I would be growing in a greenhouse. But they did not seem to think that part would be an issue.