Fanleaf's Huge 42 COB Array Build Plus Other Builds

sleepless said:
What about the 1825s that are efficient at 100 watts.

Have you ever run them in your calculator?

I'm just curious how mine compare at 2100ma

I run 4 in a 3x3 and it seems perfect.

I don't think a HOS would compete at 400 watts but I could be totally wrong.
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I think you can get the citi cob calculator at the citiled site. It's free. Just input your info and it spits out your results.
Requires a PC.
 
sleepless said:
What about the 1825s that are efficient at 100 watts.

Have you ever run them in your calculator?

I'm just curious how mine compare at 2100ma




I run 4 in a 3x3 and it seems perfect.

I don't think a HOS would compete at 400 watts but I could be totally wrong.
Click to expand...

Running them at 100+ watts each is nowhere near as efficient as you may think. They are at 44% efficient. Slightly better than hps but very close. I think DE hps runs about 41%.
Here is what your 4 chips look like in a 3x3 for example running at 100W each.
182580cri.JPG


As you can see at 100W the chips run at about 47.82% efficient and providing a ppfd of about 1100. That's pretty darned high but you will need it that way to keep them off the canopy far enough for even par coverage.. A DE hps runs somewhere around 41%. So you are doing pretty darned good man. The thing you could do to make it blow away what you have and a DE hps is add 5 more chips and then only run them at 800mA. Then you are still getting a ppfd of over 1000 but your canopy coverage will be far more even especially on the edges and use instead of 430 Watts from the wall you would be at 348 watts. So you would be using 82 watts less which means 82 less heat watts to get rid of and your cobs will run at 50.97% efficient! This also cuts $6 or more off the power bill because there's 80w less heat to extract.
1825saver.JPG


Now heres the Cree at that same setup.

35903.JPG


61.5% efficient and only pulling 320 watts from the wall. Still about a ppfd of 1000 but now you can drop the lights way down to the canopy without burning them since they are only running 35 watts per chip.
This saves $7 per month on power instantly but you also have 110 watts less heat to extract! 110 watts of heat is quite a bit!

Hope that helps. This is why shoving a bunch of chips in a room is how you overtake hps!
 
I am very much interested in low power solutions. I cut my teeth on T5's and am ready to upgrade this fall. I want to simulate the wash of light the T5's provide but with the power and intensity of COB's.

Fanleaf, I appreciate your return given all the hardship and challenges you've been facing. You've been in our thoughts.

I hope someone continues the discussion of mid to higher level builds rather than running down the rabbit holes left by the blurple era rush to chase the cheapest solutions which many times turned out not to be the best investments.

Cheers.
 
fanleaf said:
What? Crees 3000k 80CRI does more of the 660nm spectrum than Vero does. And the 3000k 90CRI peaks at 660nm. Ive got more on this subject later as well
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I have to agree with Fan. I'm looking at both Crees & Veros color specs & @ 660nm Cree's 3000k 80 CRI is @ 40% power, the 3000k 90 CRI is at approx 70% power, while Vero runs it's 4000k @ 40% & its 3000k @ 50%. This is from crees/vero's data sheets. I'll try to upload them.
 
Yes, lets also look at it this way. If 1 chip puts out only 40% at 660nm and another chip is at 80% at 660nm you would think the 2nd chip puts out more red photons right? But what if chip#1 puts out more than twice the light per watt? Now it would look like chip#1 is actually putting out more 660nm photons even at its measly 40% 660nm wouldnt it? Yep, it would be a smaller percentage of the total spectrum but with more than twice the total output there would be more 660nm photons with it.
 
fanleaf said:
No,, It's easy in a 4X4 or 4X8 to keep them even. Look at my 4X4.5 room. I run 25 chips in there and the spread is great too.


Probably not. It's mostly about photons man. 5000k chips put out a shit ton more photons than 3500k but just don't have much red that is desired in flower hence my 3000k/5000k mix. That way the 5000k chips make up for the photon loss I have with the 3000k but the 3000k has all of the flowering reds needed.
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Thanks fan. I found a pic of your 25 cob setup on your 1g/w grow thread. I can't see it completely but I think I figured out how to get 18 cobs in a 4x4. Does this look right to you?

X = 3000K
0 = 5000K

X....X....X
...0....0 (these are spaced between the X's)
X....X....X
...0....0
X....X....X
...0....0
X....X....X



This setup spreads out the 5000k more efficiently than using 16 cobs. I'd prefer 16 cobs or less since 18 is a few buck more. :thumb:

This might be off topic, but I was watching growmou5's take on CRI and he stated the higher CRI come at a cost of producing less light. Even if it gives a higher/better spectrum. Is that why the higher CRI's are used as much? Less light? How does this does relate to photons produced by light?

I'm exhausted so forgive me if this is a stupid q's... i'm brain farting now. :sleep:
 
jr21 said:
This might be off topic, but I was watching growmou5's take on CRI and he stated the higher CRI come at a cost of producing less light. Even if it gives a higher/better spectrum. How does this does relate to photons produced by light?

I'm exhausted so forgive me if this is a stupid q's... i'm brain farting now. :sleep:
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You are exactly right and is exactly why a few posts ago I was preaching "its all about photons first" and spectrum second. I have no issues adding 1 or 2 90CRI chips in a good sized array just to add that part of the spectrum if someone really feels the need for it to be there but only a few because if 40-50% of the chips are 90+CRI or just 1750k you are giving up way too many photons.
 
fanleaf said:
You are exactly right and is exactly why a few posts ago I was preaching "its all about photons first" and spectrum second. I have no issues adding 1 or 2 90CRI chips in a good sized array just to add that part of the spectrum if someone really feels the need for it to be there but only a few because if 40-50% of the chips are 90+CRI or just 1750k you are giving up way too many photons.
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Furthermore. This is the reason I use 3000k 80CRI mixed with 5000k 70CRI vs just straight 3500k. I give up a slight bit of photon power with the 3000k vs the 3500k but I get deeper reds by far. Even a hint of 730nm IR. Like 5%. Then the huge photon advantage of the 5000k 70CRI DB bins over the 3500k chips have makes up for the slight photon loss with the 3000k's and add the blue part of the spectrum at the same time.
Basically I found that combo to be magic for me with the Crees. With Citi or Bridgelux I would do slightly different I think.
 
fanleaf said:
Furthermore. This is the reason I use 3000k 80CRI mixed with 5000k 70CRI vs just straight 3500k. I give up a bit of photon power with the 3000k vs the 3500k but I get deeper reds. Then the huge photon adbantage of the 5000k 70CRI DB bins over the 3500k chips have makes up for the slight photon loss with the 3000k's and add the blue part of the spectrum at the same time.
Basically I found that combo to be magic for me with the Crees. With Citi or Bridgelux I would do slightly different I think.
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I agree with you there. The different manufacturers definitely have different nuances to their chips. With the Vero the 4000k is very popular. Not to say it's better just very popular. I found that it was lacking in the deep reds though. I added the 1750k as a sunrise sunset simulator. It comes on 20 minutes before the "white lights" then goes off. Then again at "sunset" for the last 20 minutes.
I find I'm getting better growth and the plants wake up faster.
But So far that's about it.
Just went 12-12 today. I'll start running the 1750s 12-12 when I see bud formation.
For now it's just a "sunrise" chip.
 
jr21 said:
Thanks fan. I found a pic of your 25 cob setup on your 1g/w grow thread. I can't see it completely but I think I figured out how to get 18 cobs in a 4x4. Does this look right to you?

X = 3000K
0 = 5000K

X....X....X
...0....0 (these are spaced between the X's)
X....X....X
...0....0
X....X....X
...0....0
X....X....X



This setup spreads out the 5000k more efficiently than using 16 cobs. I'd prefer 16 cobs or less since 18 is a few buck more. :thumb:. :sleep:
Click to expand...
I will look at this with my laptop when I wake up. My phone moves the xoxo pattern wherever it wants to lol.
 
JimmyJames905 said:
I agree with you there. The different manufacturers definitely have different nuances to their chips. With the Vero the 4000k is very popular. Not to say it's better just very popular. I found that it was lacking in the deep reds though. I added the 1750k as a sunrise sunset simulator. It comes on 20 minutes before the "white lights" then goes off. Then again at "sunset" for the last 20 minutes.
I find I'm getting better growth and the plants wake up faster.
But So far that's about it.
Just went 12-12 today. I'll start running the 1750s 12-12 when I see bud formation.
For now it's just a "sunrise" chip.
Click to expand...
I bet using them as a sunrise/set simulator they kick into flower fukn fast! Using them that way I could see the possibility of cutting a full week off the flowering time just because they should start to flower immediately. If it could be done side by side to verify it cuts days/a week off a grow time that would be one helluva power saver!
 
fanleaf said:
I bet using them as a sunrise/set simulator they kick into flower fukn fast! Using them that way I could see the possibility of cutting a full week off the flowering time just because they should start to flower immediately. If it could be done side by side to verify it cuts days/a week off a grow time that would be one helluva power saver!
Click to expand...

Well let's find out.
Journal in progress.
 
I just calculated price difference between vero 29 and cxb3590 for my 25 chip array. If using CD bin 3500k, for 25 cob array, it's around $350 difference. Since basically everything else is same, ideal chip holders are little higher. I'm not sure what I've spent all together, I'm shitty at keeping records, cd bin $38, vero $24. The big difference is between citi and cree
 
Buckshot317 said:
I just calculated price difference between vero 29 and cxb3590 for my 25 chip array. If using CD bin 3500k, for 25 cob array, it's around $350 difference. Since basically everything else is same, ideal chip holders are little higher. I'm not sure what I've spent all together, I'm shitty at keeping records, cd bin $38, vero $24. The big difference is between citi and cree
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For a 25 chip array $350 isn't much at all for a difference. If it were a smaller array then yes, that would be a huge difference.
Nice to know. What size area is your array going in again? I forgot lol
 
Buckshot317 said:
Anyone know of good reading material on how cannabis uses light and what spectrums and how much? Figure I need to do some studying before I add anything else.
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:reading420magazine:
 
I am running the 730nm for 15 minutes after lights out and my Autos began a great stretch immediately as I started to use them 4 weeks into the grow but I have no way of knowing the actual effectiveness of the 730nm since I have no control plants. The plants seem to like them is merely an observation!


DSC0041911.JPG
 
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