CFL Light Tutorial

Myzz617 said:
Seems like i should go with the 42W since 20 plus something 26's is a bit too much for me. If i go with 42W with my min 48000 lumens i could get away with about 20 CFL 42W bulbs right? I made a post last night but i didnt go through. My closet has a 8 foot plank 5 feet high for my rack inside of it. I was thinking put about a 6 foot long plank 7 feet high. The current plank is about 3 1/3 inches wide 1 1/2 inches thick. Putting similar planks at 7 feet and topping that off with some plywood and create a ventilation system from thar, anyone think that would work? Also any suggestions on strain? I like Sativa. Also other than these DIY stores is there a specific place i can get the 42W dual spectrum CFL's? I think i might use HID or MH-HPS for flowering :)
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I bet 12 42s would get them going. With 100% CFLs, you won't need all that expensive venting, an oscilating fan or two will do the trick. With HID and MH-HSP, you will need the venting.

Sativa will take about 20 weeks, (I said about) and Indica will take ABOUT 13 weeks, for maturity. You can cut off some vEGGING weks, but the Sativa takes 3 to 6 wekes longer to Flower, depending on a strain. Some strains, like my favorite Northern Lights, is a blen fo the two....adn takes 13 weeks total. AND Sativa needs a lot more height space than Indica.

Cheapest place for the 42s is Lowes, Walmart, Home Depot, or the Internet. Shop and compare prices.

READ, READ READ, Bro.
 
Roseman said:
I bet 12 42s would get them going. With 100% CFLs, you won't need all that expensive venting, an oscilating fan or two will do the trick. With HID and MH-HSP, you will need the venting.

Sativa will take about 20 weeks, (I said about) and Indica will take ABOUT 13 weeks, for maturity. You can cut off some vEGGING weks, but the Sativa takes 3 to 6 wekes longer to Flower, depending on a strain. Some strains, like my favorite Northern Lights, is a blen fo the two....adn takes 13 weeks total. AND Sativa needs a lot more height space than Indica.

Cheapest place for the 42s is Lowes, Walmart, Home Depot, or the Internet. Shop and compare prices.

READ, READ READ, Bro.
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Thats what i have been doing, which produces me with so many questions. What do you think of these CFL bulbs? Feit Electric 42 Watt Twist Compact Fluorescent Bulbs 12 Pack White (E)* - ESL40TN/D/12 at The Home Depot would those be suitable for vegging? I know the two spectrums are blue and red that i need so how do i make sure the bulbs im buying have one or the other?
 
Myzz617 said:
Thats what i have been doing, which produces me with so many questions. What do you think of these CFL bulbs? Feit Electric 42 Watt Twist Compact Fluorescent Bulbs 12 Pack White (E)* - ESL40TN/D/12 at The Home Depot would those be suitable for vegging? I know the two spectrums are blue and red that i need so how do i make sure the bulbs im buying have one or the other?
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Vegging bulbs are usually labeled "natural light" but look for the Kelvin rating or "K" - veg should be 5000K and up, flower should be 2800K or so, usually labeled "soft white", but make sure you find the K rating.

It's also a good idea to have both spectrums going at the same time - it makes the absorption of the needed spectrum more efficient, just more 5000K bulbs for vegging, and more 2800K bulbs for flowering.

I have to say though, if you're thinking of dropping much over a hundred on lighting... go check out HTGsupply - the cheap 400 and 600 HPS systems work great. While it's true that they "throw" more heat than CFLs, over all, a watt is a watt, and 600 watts of HPS will heat up a space exactly as much as 600 watts of CFLs.

Venting requirements depend on total wattage and ambient air temps, not type of light.
 
Hey Myzz, those bulbs are good, I know a couple of people who use them and get good results. The Feit lights are: daylight (like in your pic) for veg and soft white for flower. The kelvin rating is on the box, there's a little gauge looking thing with an arrow pointing and I think a k rating in the arrow. Daylight is 6500k and soft white is 2700k. They also have bright white, I think they are 4100k. They probably work ok but they are not the spectrum that you need. Some people use all 6500k for veg and all 2700k for flower,but it is a good idea to mix them a little. I am not sure of the best ratio but I'm sure Roseman or one of the other knowledgeable people here can fill in the blanks that I have left. :peace:
 
The HD near me only carries the 2700K 42W Feits, would be nice to have a choice. I know what you mean about reading creating questions and more questions...sometimes when I start something new I have no idea what to ask to even answer my questions lol. Lucky for you there are some great people here who love helping others with their MMJ grows!

As obx mentioned mixed spectrum is considered a good idea especially during veg but if you dig a bit more you'll find most people are running about a 1:3 (or 4) ratio of red to blue...usually not 1:1.

One thing I wish every manufacturer would put on the box of their CFL's is the Kelvin rating...I run across a lot of bulbs that don't specify, they just state "daylight", "soft white", "mashed potatos white", etc. I just try to remember green/yellow packages are usually 2700K and the blue/white packages are usually 6500K.
 
Hey obx, I looked a little and can't find anything that relates watts to temp. A watt is a unit that measures how much power a device uses, not what it puts out. For example, a 600 watt heater would put out more heat than a 600 watt HPS. So although you are right that "a watt is a watt", it doesn't necessarily generate the same amount of heat. :peace:
 
obxgardener said:
While it's true that they "throw" more heat than CFLs, over all, a watt is a watt, and 600 watts of HPS will heat up a space exactly as much as 600 watts of CFLs.
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Is this from experience? I would put the caveat that although this may be true for 600W it is definitely not true of lower wattage CFL setups say up through 300W.

420warrior, I think you misunderstood what he was implying...or maybe I did. But you are correct that watts do not correlate directly to heat, faaaaaaaar from it however I don't think that's what obx was insinuating. I think he was saying that for higher wattage CFL installations that they don't run any cooler...the question is at what wattage are you going to run roughly equivalent in heat? 400W? 600W? Granted it really depends on ventilation and all...I know that putting the hood on my CFL's has raised my temps a good 3-5F with the door completely closed so now I"m trying to figure out how I'm going to address that. Drilling holes in it would defeat the purpose...may have to rework my intake/exhaust positions. blah blah :)
 
Hey lil N, when you don't see a k rating on the box look at the base of the bulb. Many manufacturers print it around the ballast at the base of the bulb. I'm sure they don't all do this but it may be helpful. Also a lot of the manufacturers web sites have all the tech data. :peace:
 
Sometimes home improvement stores have good info as well. You just have to dig around and figure out how to navigate their sites. But as you mentoined, some are more helpful than others!
 
Myzz617 said:
Thats what i have been doing, which produces me with so many questions. What do you think of these CFL bulbs? Feit Electric 42 Watt Twist Compact Fluorescent Bulbs 12 Pack White (E)* - ESL40TN/D/12 at The Home Depot would those be suitable for vegging? I know the two spectrums are blue and red that i need so how do i make sure the bulbs im buying have one or the other?
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THose are great for Vegging. $9 each is a great price too. As previously posted in this thread, COOL WHITE and DAY LIGHT are HIGH Kelvin bulbs for VEGGING, and WARM WHITE are LOW Kelvin bulbs for Flowering.
Those are the Blue Spectrum for Vegging.
 
This is what I get with CFLs:



2009_Grow_00711.jpg


one plant here:
2009_Grow_011.jpg
 
420warrior said:
Hey obx, I looked a little and can't find anything that relates watts to temp. A watt is a unit that measures how much power a device uses, not what it puts out. For example, a 600 watt heater would put out more heat than a 600 watt HPS. So although you are right that "a watt is a watt", it doesn't necessarily generate the same amount of heat. :peace:
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Lil Neutrino said:
Is this from experience? I would put the caveat that although this may be true for 600W it is definitely not true of lower wattage CFL setups say up through 300W.

420warrior, I think you misunderstood what he was implying...or maybe I did. But you are correct that watts do not correlate directly to heat, faaaaaaaar from it however I don't think that's what obx was insinuating. I think he was saying that for higher wattage CFL installations that they don't run any cooler...the question is at what wattage are you going to run roughly equivalent in heat? 400W? 600W? Granted it really depends on ventilation and all...I know that putting the hood on my CFL's has raised my temps a good 3-5F with the door completely closed so now I"m trying to figure out how I'm going to address that. Drilling holes in it would defeat the purpose...may have to rework my intake/exhaust positions. blah blah :)
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Yes, I know from experience as I used CFLs prior to upgrading to a HPS...

But I also know from my physics background, and the principle of conservation of energy. A watt is a unit of work, something like what it takes to exert a force of one newton over a distance of one meter, (a joule), per second.

Everything you put into a system must come out, so if 100 watts is going in, you must account for every bit of it. Some will go into growing the plant, some will cause water in the room to evaporate... but overall very little net loss of energy difference between lights - most is either emitted as heat from the light itself, or from warming the plant and walls after the light strikes it. So, in effect, if you put a hundred watts of ANYTHING into a room, it will heat it up just the same - though the rates of air temp change might be different depending on the object radiating the energy.

Which leads to why there might be a misconception - I actually believe a HPS can heat the air in a space faster than CFLs since they are more efficient radiators... but over a few hours, the temp should be exactly the same. If anything, a remote ballasted HID would put less heat into a grow space per watt.
 
Drilling a few heat escape holes at the top of the reflector won't affect it's reflective properties very much.

Venting the hood with a couple or three 1/2" holes will help, as will setting up a circulation fan to blow straight up at the light from below, if your setup and grow style allows that.
 
I think i wasted some cash because i just bought 8 42W 2700K cfl GE bulbs, and these would be used for flowering. I think im going to get a MH light and some more cfls for vegging and rig something. figures the cfls i wanted from HD were online only lol. This is not a MMJ grow though i must say, its more just for me so i can save money rather than waste it on smoking. I am feeling a MH light with the different bulbs for vegging and flowering and thinking of adding some CFL's to it. Not completely sure yet. Also i just got 3 buckets :)

Edit-The are SW not the daylight. Think im going to order the 12 pack and buy a MH perhaps this one? https://www.htgsupply.com/viewproduct.asp?productID=49333 or something similar?
 
Myzz617 said:
I think i wasted some cash because i just bought 8 42W 2700K cfl GE bulbs, and these would be used for flowering. I think im going to get a MH light and some more cfls for vegging and rig something. figures the cfls i wanted from HD were online only lol. This is not a MMJ grow though i must say, its more just for me so i can save money rather than waste it on smoking. I am feeling a MH light with the different bulbs for vegging and flowering and thinking of adding some CFL's to it. Not completely sure yet. Also i just got 3 buckets :)

Edit-The are SW not the daylight. Think im going to order the 12 pack and buy a MH perhaps this one? High Tech Garden Supply or something similar?
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I just picked up some lighting and wanted shair what I found,
bestgrowlights.com
gardeningsupplies.net Free shipping..
I see you were checking out the Built-in-ballast. Will heat be an issue ?:peacetwo:
 
Lil Neutrino said:
Good idea! Get a foothold for your brain to start digesting all this info you've read by applying it to real-world experience and THEN kick it in to high gear...plus you'll have an idea of what you like/don't like so you're not spending money on stuff you won't use.



Depends what you call an average sized plant...average indica or sativa height? ;) Let me ask you this before we really go that direction...are you planning to let your plants grow naturally or are you intending to do some height training/restriction ala LST? I'm guessing you'd like to utilize the nine feet you have but I'll explain my take on both situations. If you're going to let them grow natural I'd lean towards HID on both veg and flower IF you're going to let them veg for a couple of months since HID's have much better penetrating power than CFL. If you're only going to veg for a month then you can get away with CFL's for sure and then switch to HID for flowering.

On the other hand if you're planning on LST'ing (doubt it) CFL for sure during veg. As I mentioned I had 260W of CFL power (17k lumens) on my plant for my first grow and did ok. With a 2 week veg period and a 20/4 light cycle and then in to 12/12 after that I had a plant that was 13" tall (no LST, just let it grow) and yielded a little over an ounce dry of some rock hard buds. If you check towards the end of my first journal you'll see I did get a bit creative with the lights as I basically surrounded the little plant (cone shape) with CFL's. Six on top, two to the left of the plant down low, and two more on the right hand side down low. But since I doubt you're going this route I'll stop...TMI, don't want to confuse you.



Yeah, the red spectrum is more suited to flowering as the sunlight in the fall is more towards that end of the spectrum.


I used to be like that...until my employer laid most of us off. Keep spending that money! We're not going to get out of this recession if nobody spends!



That's actually an easy question to answer but I can't be specific without knowing how much you pay per kwh. Figuring roughly 10 cents per kwh let's make an educated wild ass guess assuming 400W of lighting (doesn't matter what kind, 400W is 400W) and a 20/4 schedule (20 is a nice round number to do math with) for veg.

400W X 20 hours = 8000 watt-hours = 8kwh

8kwh * 31 days in a month = 248kwh

248kwh X 0.10 (10 cents) = $24.80/month

Now with an 18/6 schedule:

400 X 18 = 7.2kwh * 31 = 223 X 0.10 = $22.30

You should be able to recalculate this for whatever light schedule you want, whatever wattage, and whatever your utility company charges you fo electricity...have fun! :)



Yeah, I LOVE the planning stage. As for the wall just get some 9' 2X4 studs (dirt cheap) and use them to frame it up and layer the sheetrock over it with insulation in between if you want/need. You'll have a couple of 2X4's to mount the sheetrock on but what do you fix the 2X4's to? I'm not a carpenter but going by memory of what I have seen in houses as they are built is they will lay a 2X4 (or whatever thickness the walls are to be) flat on the ground and attach the studs to it. The key here is to check your lumber and make sure it is straight and flat before you buy it...warped studs are mostly useless. How to attach that to the ground? Not sure, probably blast some little holes in to the foundation with those .26 caliber (or whatever) charges and put some masonry/concrete bolts through the 2X4 in to the concrete.



You're welcome!
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I think it is national grid on the east coast and on their site it says 10c per KWH damn near. Well from reading up on the LEO or PIGS as i like to say lol, how can they suspect anything just from a 30$ jump in bill per mon?:ganjamon:

EDIT-12 cents per residential KWH i stand corrected but till, does not seem like a sufficient amount of an increase...or am i missing something?
 
Myzz617 said:
I think i wasted some cash because i just bought 8 42W 2700K cfl GE bulbs, and these would be used for flowering. I think im going to get a MH light and some more cfls for vegging and rig something. figures the cfls i wanted from HD were online only lol. This is not a MMJ grow though i must say, its more just for me so i can save money rather than waste it on smoking. I am feeling a MH light with the different bulbs for vegging and flowering and thinking of adding some CFL's to it. Not completely sure yet. Also i just got 3 buckets :)

Edit-The are SW not the daylight. Think im going to order the 12 pack and buy a MH perhaps this one? High Tech Garden Supply or something similar?
Click to expand...


Truth is, you are not going to have 16 sq feet of plants. Just because the room is 16 sq ft, that doesn't mean every square foot will be covered with plants. If you had two plants in a 5 gallon bucket, or 4 plants in a ten gallon reservoir, then you'd need less than half of what we previously calculated.

Those 8 42 watt 2700 K are excellent for Flowering 4 plants, maybe even 6 crowded together. . Now get about 160 to 200 watts of 6500 Kelvin bulbs and you will do just fine.
 
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