Folks add water at different times. Maybe by waiting it gives roots a chance to build up higher in the pot for a bigger mass?
Cbdhemp808's Comparison Grow - HI-BISCUS SIP Bucket Vs. Nursery Pot
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- #22
cbdhemp808
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DAY 8
My dip stick showed no water in the rez by late afternoon today. Interesting. There was 3/8" yesterday afternoon. Wicking, or are roots already in the rez?
The first time you put water in the res it will get absorbed up into the soil. Once you have water in the res that carries for a few days you'll have a better idea of how much she is drinking each day.DAY 8
My dip stick showed no water in the rez by late afternoon today. Interesting. There was 3/8" yesterday afternoon. Wicking, or are roots already in the rez?
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- #24
cbdhemp808
Well-Known Member
DAY 9
I just went out and measured. When I up-potted from 1 gal into the SIP, the distance from the bottom of the root ball to the bottom of the bucket was 6.5", and just 2" to the top of the domes—i.e. the top of the "R" zone. And, just 3-1/4" to the standing water in the rez, if the rez was full. This is starting to make sense.
So, after one week of growth, the roots surely had reached the "R" zone. Which means that now on DAY 9, there's really no reason not to add water to the rez, because the roots are going to drink as much as they want, and thus begins the accelerating curve of water consumed per day.
So the answer to "did the water wick back up, or did roots drink it up?" ... I think both. Water collected in the bottom of the bucket, and either the roots had already reached the bottom of the bucket, or they were somewhere in the R zone. Either way, the water was consumed.
Going out to fill the rez now!
Hmm, so far I have watered the soil only, and just 1/2 gal on Friday. 3/8" of water appeared in the rez, then was gone by Saturday. Did it wick back up, or did roots drink it up? I think I know the answer...
I just went out and measured. When I up-potted from 1 gal into the SIP, the distance from the bottom of the root ball to the bottom of the bucket was 6.5", and just 2" to the top of the domes—i.e. the top of the "R" zone. And, just 3-1/4" to the standing water in the rez, if the rez was full. This is starting to make sense.
So, after one week of growth, the roots surely had reached the "R" zone. Which means that now on DAY 9, there's really no reason not to add water to the rez, because the roots are going to drink as much as they want, and thus begins the accelerating curve of water consumed per day.
So the answer to "did the water wick back up, or did roots drink it up?" ... I think both. Water collected in the bottom of the bucket, and either the roots had already reached the bottom of the bucket, or they were somewhere in the R zone. Either way, the water was consumed.
Going out to fill the rez now!
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- #25
cbdhemp808
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DAY 9
I filled the reservoir of the SIP, via the fill tube! It took a bit less than a gallon to see runoff coming out the drain tube.
Dip stick says 3-3/8".
I decided not to water the nursery pot yet, since I gave it 1/2 gal on Friday. I'll water it again tomorrow and continue on a 3-day cycle. In a week or two I'll start watering the whole pot to runoff, and then do the wet/dry cycle.
HEIGHT: SIP - 21", POT - 22"
I filled the reservoir of the SIP, via the fill tube! It took a bit less than a gallon to see runoff coming out the drain tube.
Dip stick says 3-3/8".
I decided not to water the nursery pot yet, since I gave it 1/2 gal on Friday. I'll water it again tomorrow and continue on a 3-day cycle. In a week or two I'll start watering the whole pot to runoff, and then do the wet/dry cycle.
HEIGHT: SIP - 21", POT - 22"
When you top water, especially if you're not trying to saturate the medium, the weight of the water will cause some of it to drop out of the bottom (into the reservoir in this case) well before saturation. Then as it sits in the reservoir the wicking action will pull it back up into the soil.
Now, with a full reservoir and a couple of days you'll be better able to tell how much she's drinking.
Both for sure, but I think it's more the soil that's absorbing most of what you saw as a difference. But in a couple of days the soil will absorb what it wants and your dipstick readings will give you a true test of how much she's drinking.
Now, with a full reservoir and a couple of days you'll be better able to tell how much she's drinking.
Both for sure, but I think it's more the soil that's absorbing most of what you saw as a difference. But in a couple of days the soil will absorb what it wants and your dipstick readings will give you a true test of how much she's drinking.
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- #27
cbdhemp808
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DAY 10 (morning)
approx. 24 hrs since DAY 9 report.
SIP rez level is down to 2" from 3-3/8" yesterday (full rez).
I gave the nursery POT a full gallon of water and got some runoff. This was not a complete saturation of the POT soil.
HEIGHT: SIP - 22.5", POT - 23"
approx. 24 hrs since DAY 9 report.
SIP rez level is down to 2" from 3-3/8" yesterday (full rez).
I gave the nursery POT a full gallon of water and got some runoff. This was not a complete saturation of the POT soil.
HEIGHT: SIP - 22.5", POT - 23"
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- #28
cbdhemp808
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DAY 11
SIP rez level is down to 1.5" from 2" yesterday.
HEIGHT... SIP - 23.25", POT - 23.5", Δ -0.25
WIDTH.... SIP - 27.50", POT - 25.5", Δ +2.00
Width is leaf tip to leaf tip at widest point. Delta (Δ) is the difference between SIP and POT.
SIP rez level is down to 1.5" from 2" yesterday.
HEIGHT... SIP - 23.25", POT - 23.5", Δ -0.25
WIDTH.... SIP - 27.50", POT - 25.5", Δ +2.00
Width is leaf tip to leaf tip at widest point. Delta (Δ) is the difference between SIP and POT.
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- #29
cbdhemp808
Well-Known Member
Both plants are 2 ft tall as of this morning. SIP rez is 1.25".
I'd bet things have stabilized now and the readings you get are true.
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- #31
cbdhemp808
Well-Known Member
On Sunday I added about 0.8 gal to an empty rez, and that put the level at 3-3/8".
What I'm having a hard time wrapping my head around is... what does it actually mean when the water disappears out of the rez in a few days? Does it mainly mean a slow wicking upward, regardless of the rate that the plant is drinking? Or does it mainly mean the plant is drinking it? Or is it impossible to know? Ah... it is indeed possible to know, by weighing the container!
Original weight at planting, including 1 quart of water added = 26.6 lb.
Today's weight, 30.3 lb. Difference is 3.7 lbs, which is mostly the weight of the water currently in the SIP, so 0.44 gal.
So, I can safely say that since I added 0.80 gal of water on DAY 9, Sunday, the plant has consumed about 0.36 gal of water. This is a bit less than half of what I added, or about 1-1/2 quarts in 3 days. Cool!
SIP rez is at about 1" now, so about 30% of what it was on Sunday. So around 0.24 gal (1 qt) is now in the rez. So that means 0.2 gal wicked upward into the medium, or about 0.8 quart. That's not a whole lot.
Consumption vs. wicking ratio: 0.36/0.2 or 1.8/1
So, close to twice as much water consumed by the roots as wicked up and not consumed. Of course, this is just a snapshot... I would love to see the curve over time, but alas, that's above my pay grade.
Current consumption rate: about 0.36 gal in 4 days -or- 0.36 quart per day.
Wow, this is a rabbit hole! So, with 1 qt currently in the rez, and about 0.8 qt in the medium, when will the rez go dry, and when should I refill it full again?
Just by feel, 1" in the rez and less that 1 qt in the medium seems like the low end of where water should be in this system. I'm feeling like topping up the rez tomorrow. Better yet, just top water until overflow. I'm feeling like the whole medium is very much on the dry side right now... especially the top layer.
I will water the nursery pot as well tomorrow to saturate the container and start the wet/dry cycle. I checked the weight difference on the pot as well, and it looks like it also has about 1 qt in the medium!
OK... one last rabbit hole nugget... the SIP plant roots currently have access to 1 more quart of water than the POT plant roots.
The soil will hold a certain amount of water and will top itself up from the reservoir which is why you get accelerated usage rates initially until the medium has what it wants. Once it does, the difference in water height will be what the plant uses.
I usually add only as much as the plant will drink in a day or two. I figure there's no sense giving it more than that since it won't use it any way and all the excess does is increase the perched water table which lowers the amount of air in the soil, not optimal in an organic grow.
The soil acts as a water bank so when I drought at the end of the grow, it takes several days for the plant to use that reserve up before the droughting effect can take place.
I usually add only as much as the plant will drink in a day or two. I figure there's no sense giving it more than that since it won't use it any way and all the excess does is increase the perched water table which lowers the amount of air in the soil, not optimal in an organic grow.
The soil acts as a water bank so when I drought at the end of the grow, it takes several days for the plant to use that reserve up before the droughting effect can take place.
Gee64
Well-Known Member
You could always add your measured amount via top watering instead of thru the fill tube, and let the reservoir catch the excess.
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- #34
cbdhemp808
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Do you add that when the rez is empty?
My plan today is to top water evenly until I get runoff. Would it be better to top water and shoot for maybe 1" in the rez? The medium is very porous... water just sinks right in immediately.
Yes, or nearly so with less than 1 day's worth in there. But, once the soil has absorbed what it wants there's a pretty broad window to get more water in there so even if it's a day later the plant won't even notice.
So, if your plant is drinking 1/2" a day I'd put whatever than amounts to in water in when the water level dropped below 1/2" in the reservoir. Or 1" and plan on every other day. Depends how attentive you want to be to your plants. I look at them every day so it's easy for me to dial it in.
If your medium is very porous and also dry up top, it might be difficult to thoroughly water your mix so maybe add a wetting agent like aloe or yucca or even a few drops of soap to your water might help.
I'd just give it what you'd normally give it in the reservoir like Gee said. Some will drain onto the reservoir and you can resume directly to the reservoir when the level tells you it's time. In an organic grow it's probably best to do a periodic top watering anyway. I do at least weekly with calcium up top when I'm using the reservoir.
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- #36
cbdhemp808
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I'll top water and shoot for 1" in the rez.
I think the coir content is very good at distributing the water... no problem there.
Sounds good. I will evenly top water today, then I'll have some in the rez, and see how it goes. Next water will be via the tube. I'm also going to top water some horsetail tea soon.
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- #37
cbdhemp808
Well-Known Member
DAY 13
I top watered the SIP and POT with 1 gal each. That felt like the right amount to completely wet the whole medium.
The SIP rez is now full, so it looks like most of the gallon went right through. Good deal of runoff for the POT.
Plants are now both about 25" tall.
SIP
Nursery POT
I top watered the SIP and POT with 1 gal each. That felt like the right amount to completely wet the whole medium.
The SIP rez is now full, so it looks like most of the gallon went right through. Good deal of runoff for the POT.
Plants are now both about 25" tall.
SIP
Nursery POT
Plants look happy. 
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- #39
cbdhemp808
Well-Known Member
Hi Azi
I take it this means a surfactant would help the water stick to the soil particles. With the current result of most of a gallon going straight to the reservoir, what do you think the addition of aloe juice to the water would have done? How much aloe juice? I just happen to have some fairly good size aloe in pots right now.- Thread starter
- #40
cbdhemp808
Well-Known Member
I did a top-view overlay using Photoshop just for fun. Green is the POT and purple is the SIP. Where you see a tan or pale pink color, that's a combination of the green and purple—i.e. leaves from both plants occupying the same visual space. I see a slight predominance of the SIP plant inside the center ring. The outer ring and beyond looks about equal.
