Carcass' $150 Low Budget Grow 2019

[Carcass]

Extract it into RSO?

I don't know how to do that, but I can learn!

Massage oil uses up loads! Like 2 oz weed/16 oz oil.

That's the ratio I use for the oil I make gummies with- what kind of oil do you use for massage oil?

I also thought about just burning it in the fireplace to give the neighbors something to talk about...
"Somebody around here is smokin a  lot of weed..."

 

[Azimuth]

How to Make Concentrated Cannabis Oil

Instant Pot Infused Oil

And grape seed oil is supposed to be a good massage oil. Absorbs into the skin well without leaving an oily residue. Or so I hear. I've not done that one yet.

 

[HashGirl]

How to Make Concentrated Cannabis Oil

Instant Pot Infused Oil

And grape seed oil is supposed to be a good massage oil. Absorbs into the skin well without leaving an oily residue. Or so I hear. I've not done that one yet.

I use apricot seed oil and pumpkin seed oil in my topicals but they tend to be more expensive than grapeseed or coconut.

 

[InTheShed]

That's the ratio I use for the oil I make gummies with- what kind of oil do you use for massage oil?

I find that grapeseed gets absorbed really quickly, so for a real "massage" oil I use a 50/50 blend with pumpkin seed, which makes it more spreadable.

My CBD topical is just grapeseed since that goes on 10 minutes before the THC topical, which is the 50/50 mix.

Don't use regular coconut or olive for topicals as they sit on top of the skin and don't sink in with the THC. Fractionated coconut will work for topicals but I don't think it's worth the money.

 

[Trala]

Yes, you'll need to keep an eye out for the ones that want to get taller than the others, and tie them down
before they do- you may need to add hooks, or just adjust the ones that are already on there.

I just look her over every morning, and tie the ones down that need it.
Also, if you catch them early, the stems are real soft, and they bend easily...

You could probably do this every 2 or 3 days- but you don't want to let the canopy get too far out of whack before you tie the tall ones down- it's easier to maintain an already flat canopy than it is to have to make it flat again every few days...

*We usually want to tie them down on the fatter part of the branch- but when they're stretching, we tie the skinny part of the branch down because we need a sharp bend in the branch, instead of a gradual
curve like we've been getting up till now...this seems like a small detail, but it really pays off in the end..

I hope this answered the question- but, if it didn't, don't be afraid to ask me more about it!

Good morning C Supercrop!

Thank you

I think you did. Cleo is at noodle stage now.

Like you I have a fiddle every day.

She is coming along. Still looks nothing like yours tho lol.

 

[Heavenly Hybrid]

Once again I am astounded at your grow in the Carcass-box(TM). What a beautiful plant!! Outdoor gals are comin along nicely too. Well done C!!

 

[Carcass]

And grape seed oil is supposed to be a good massage oil. Absorbs into the skin well

Thanks, Azi!, and thanks for the links! I made my first batch of gummies with Grapeseed oil, but it made them a bit "greasy", so I've still got a bunch of it left

I use apricot seed oil and pumpkin seed oil in my topicals but they tend to be more expensive

Thank you, HashGirl!
I'll have to shop around for both of those- I don't recall ever seeing them at the store, but I wasn't really looking for them either...

I find that grapeseed gets absorbed really quickly, so for a real "massage" oil I use a 50/50 blend with pumpkin seed, which makes it more spreadable.

Thanks for that,Shed!
If I can find some pumpkinseed oil, I'll make some up this weekend...this is probably a dumb question, but does the thc massage oil get you high? And do you decarb the weed for the massage oil?

She is coming along. Still looks nothing like yours tho lol.

From the top view, she looks pretty close, she's just a little taller, although she's not that much taller anymore. She looks great, T!

Once again I am astounded at your grow in the Carcass-box(TM). What a beautiful plant!! Outdoor gals are comin along nicely too. Well done C!!

Thanks so much for the kind words, HH
That ugly old box just keeps crankin' out the weed!
The 3 outdoor ones in the ground are nothing special, but I'm using @BooWho2 's auto method on the 2 in the potslove, and they're doing very well...

 

[Grand Daddy Black]

One of my doctors recently told me that I need to do more to moisturize my skin. I doubt that weed-infused massage oils is what she had in mind! But it's now what I've got in mind!

 

[InTheShed]

does the thc massage oil get you high? And do you decarb the weed for the massage oil?

No and yes. The THC doesn't make it into the bloodstream but you do want the flowers decarbed first.

 

[Azimuth]

.this is probably a dumb question, but does the thc massage oil get you high? And do you decarb the weed for the massage oil?

The oil will get absorbed into your skin and some of it will make it to your blood stream, so not the same effect as smoking to be sure, but there is a bit of noticable effect.

And the bud will decarb in the oil as part of the extraction process. Some people feel it is less efficient because they say that the oil coats the trichomes and somehow protects them leading to less than total decarb, in which case you can certainly decarb them first.

But, seems to me that people put oil in a "water" bath to raise the temp above the boiling point of water so, if trichomes are dissolvable in oil (they are) and oil heats up to a point above that needed for decarb (it does) then it would seem to follow that decarbing as part of the extraction process does happen.

 

[HashGirl]

Thanks for that,Shed!
If I can find some pumpkinseed oil, I'll make some up this weekend...this is probably a dumb question, but does the thc massage oil get you high? And do you decarb the weed for the massage oil?

No and yes. The THC doesn't make it into the bloodstream but you do want the flowers decarbed first.

I have to disagree with your "No" answer, Shed. If you decarb the cannabis you use in a topical, it will get you high. Is it advisable to eat your topicals? No. Of course not. But, yes, you can get high from them if you do.

The reason I know this is because I was visiting my sister one day and had pain cream on my knee and her dog licked it all off. I told my sister that her dog would probably get high but she said she didn't care.

When dinner came and we were all seated at the table, my sister's husband said "Where's Piper?" She always lies at my feet during dinner. And, I laughed and said "She's high and sleeping it off in the family room."

 

[Azimuth]

The reason I know this is because I was visiting my sister one day and had pain cream on my knee and her dog licked it all off. I

In that case the dog ingested it orally so the topical question wouldn't apply, but people I've given tropicals to have noticed the dry mouth, and some residual psychoactive effect. No where near ingesting it of course, but noticeable for a non-user at least.

 

[Carcass]

Sorry I haven't been around much lately- I'm getting my Mom's money pit house ready to rent to my daughter, and it's been taking up a lot of my time- Last week it was the plumbing, Installed a new furnace today, next week's a new water heater and a new back door, which, of course, isn't going to fit without major modifications...so that's where I've been. I will be doing my usual Monday stuff on time, though-the rest of the week, I'll just have to play it by ear....

I doubt that weed-infused massage oils is what she had in mind! But it's now what I've got in mind!

Doctors may not even know there's such a thing as thc massage oil...

The THC doesn't make it into the bloodstream but you do want the flowers decarbed first.

Thank You, Shed- I figured it had to be dcarbed first, but I wasn't sure...

so not the same effect as smoking to be sure, but there is a bit of noticable effect.

As long as it's a real mild buzz, Mrs.C. would be ok with it...(she'll be the main one using it)

Is it advisable to eat your topicals? No. Of course not.

Well, if you're out of everything else, that oil might start looking pretty good....

No where near ingesting it of course, but noticeable for a non-user at least.

Mrs.C. eats quite a few gummies, so her tolerance is pretty high-she may not even notice any mild effects...

 

[InTheShed]

I have seen no actual evidence that THC is absorbed through the skin with the oils we use for topicals. Of course they will get you (or your poor dog) high if taken internally. They're the exact same thing that's in edibles.

I am a THC virgin and feel absolutely no effect from topicals. It seems the only folks who feel it are ones who have been told there's cannabis in the oil, which makes the effect psychological. There was even a criminal case where they tested whether THC is absorbed from topicals, and it's isn't using our carrier oils. With something like DMSO it most likely is.

And THC does not completely decarb at infusion times/temperatures we use. Additionally, oil acts as an insulator, making it more difficult to break off the acid molecule from the THCa at our standard infusion times and temps.

 

[farside05]

Of course they will get you (or your poor dog) high if taken internally. They're the exact same thing that's in edibles.

Or dogs seem to like getting high, particularly the mutt. We make .6g dog treats for thunderstorms or times when we want them more chill (ie cutting toe nails). They'll beg for those things all day. The mutt will even get in your face when you're smoking to try to get a contact high. The son and all his friends call her "stoner dog".

 

[Azimuth]

It seems the only folks who feel it are ones who have been told there's cannabis in the oil, which makes the effect psychological.

I suppose that's possible, but the recipient was my wife who noted the dry, cotton mouth and that's not something she would likely have even been aware of. But she did know there was thc in the oil (coconut in this case), so maybe.

And THC does not completely decarb at infusion times/temperatures we use. Additionally, oil acts as an insulator, making it more difficult to break off the acid molecule from the THCa at our standard infusion times and temps.

So then, why even decarb it at all if it won't get into the bloodstream? Thc-a has plenty of great medical properties, and some like Dr. William Courtney argue that the non-decarbed version has more of them since some get destroyed in the heating process (think terpines that are volatile at very low temperatures).

I get that heating the herb in the oil helps the oil absorb the goodies easier and faster but seems to me that the point of stripping off the carbon atom through decarb is so that the thc-a turned into thc can bind with the Type 1 receptors in the brain. If it's not going to make it there anyway when using as a topical, why bother with the decarb step at all?

 

[InTheShed]

I suppose that's possible, but the recipient was my wife who noted the dry, cotton mouth and that's not something she would likely have even been aware of. But she did know there was thc in the oil (coconut in this case), so maybe.

This is one of the studies done:

Topical application of THC containing products is not able to cause positive cannabinoid finding in blood or urine - PubMed

A male driver was checked during a traffic stop. A blood sample was collected 35min later and contained 7.3ng/mL THC, 3.5ng/mL 11-hydroxy-THC and 44.6ng/mL 11-nor-9-carboxy-THC. The subject claimed to have used two commercially produced products topically that contained 1.7ng and 102ng THC per...

pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

Here was their conclusion:

"According to our studies and further literature research on in vitro testing of transdermal uptake of THC, the exclusive application of (these two) topically applied products did not produce cannabinoid findings in blood or urine."

And here is what it took to get CBD absorbed through the skin of rats in a study on topically applied CBD for arthritis:

"All gels, including vehicle controls, were prepared by weighing the desired amount of CBD (gift from NIDA) and dissolving it in ethanol (72.5% w/w). Once dissolved, nanopure water (Barntead NANOpure® Diamond™ ultrapure filtration system, Dubuque, IA, USA) was added followed by isopropyl myristate (Fisher Scientific, Fairlawn, NJ, USA). Carbopol® 980 polymere (Noveon Inc., Cleveland, OH, USA) was added (0.9% w/w) and the solution sonicated for 10 min to ensure complete incorporation of the Carbopol® 980. Polymerization of Carbopol ® 980 to form the hydroalcoholic gel was initiated by adding sodium hydroxide (0.1 N). Gels were then sonicated for 10 min, loaded into 1 mL syringes and sealed. Gels made just prior to the initial dosing were used for the entire week since no degradation was observed and plasma CBD concentration remained constant."

Source

This is well beyond what we are doing at home!

So then, why even decarb it at all if it won't get into the bloodstream? Thc-a has plenty of great medical properties, and some like Dr. William Courtney argue that the non-decarbed version has more of them since some get destroyed in the heating process (think terpines that are volatile at very low temperatures).
I get that heating the herb in the oil helps the oil absorb the goodies easier and faster but seems to me that the point of stripping off the carbon atom through decarb is so that the thc-a turned into thc can bind with the Type 1 receptors in the brain. If it's not going to make it there anyway when using as a topical, why bother with the decarb step at all?

I know you are a big proponent of the acid form of cannabinoids, but from everything I've read and videos I've watched on the Green Flower network (as well as from personal experience), it's the decarbed flower that is effective, and 10mg/ml seems to be the minimum (I aim for at least 15mg/ml). I have not seen any mention of terpenes being important or that one terpene is better than another.

I have seen research on the best area to apply topical THC oil and that it to the MDR. The THC reaches the nerve endings in the skin (rather than the bloodstream) and affects the unmyelinated fibers carrying the pain signals to the brain. Rubbing it on the painful area always feels good though.

In my house, we find that applying high CBD oil, followed 10 minutes later by high THC oil provides the best relief for pain.

Anyone working on making this is certainly welcome to try THCa vs THC oil, and it would be easy to do because THCa will not decarb at oil infusion temperatures.

 

[Trala]

*checks watch*

*waits impatiently*

 

[Azimuth]

I know you are a big proponent of the acid form of cannabinoids, but from everything I've read and videos I've watched on the Green Flower network (as well as from personal experience), it's the decarbed flower that is effective, and 10mg/ml seems to be the minimum (I aim for at least 15mg/ml).

Yes, this is true, but I'm ingesting them, not using them topically. Also my main use is for inflammation, not pain and the cannabinoids in their acidic form treat my issues quite well. For pain, I'd agree that THC from decarbed flower is the ticket.

I don't think you're saying the acidic forms are not effective, just not effective for pain, correct? If so, I'd agree.

I guess I'm curious if the acidic forms would work for inflammation issues like arthritis if used in a topical. Since it is federally illegal in this country, most universities won't touch it with research since that could put their funding in jeopardy. That is unless they want to get the government's version of sub-par material grown on the controlled farm down south (Mississippi maybe?)

I have seen research on the best area to apply topical THC oil and that it to the MDR. The THC reaches the nerve endings in the skin (rather than the bloodstream) and affects the unmyelinated fibers carrying the pain signals to the brain. Rubbing it on the painful area always feels good though.

I'm in the middle of reading through that thread. Thanks for the link.
The MDR, as you call it, seems like an interesting target. I'll have to do more reading on that.

Anyone working on making this is certainly welcome to try THCa vs THC oil, and it would be easy to do because THCa will not decarb at oil infusion temperatures.

I would agree with you that if you are treating pain, THC is clearly the one you want. Adding a small amount of CBD is supposed to enhance the THC effect and your strategy of using one then the other seems like a great approach.

So what is it about trying to decarb in oil that doesn't work so effectively? The oil would heat up to a temperature higher than that of water, and decarbing in water via a sous vide approach is quite a viable one. And we know that it is a combination of time and temperature that do it. So, lower temps mean longer time and vice versa.

So, if oil can reach decarb temperatures above that of water, and your trichomes are surrounded by hot oil, it would seem to reason that the temp would be sufficient.

So it must be something else. Perhaps the oil coats the molecule making it harder for the extra carbon atom to escape? Because it can't be the oil insulating the molecule from the heat as the oil would be relatively uniform at a high temp.

 

[Carcass]

Well, here it is Monday once again...time for a little Update on the 6 plants I've got going...

First up is the GSC- 58 days old, flipped to 12/12 last Sunday, and not really flowering yet... she's close, though..

The SaugaView®:

She's 14.5 inches tall now, so she's grown 5" this week...remarkably, she's stretching very evenly- no crazy tall branches, so the canopy is still pretty flat. The main branches are the only thing tied down right now-that may change in the coming days, but for now, they're all that needs tying down.

She's trying to flower, but it's not happening quite yet...

She's being fed 5g/mc/gal.,4ml silica, 1/2 g aloe vera powder, and she's real happy with that...
Her canopy is a little "bumpy" but still flat for the most part..

And then there's the outdoor girls- first up, the 36 day old Wookiees auto-21" tall now, and very healthy- she's being fed the same as the GSC. No real training for these girls, except for the topping.

She's flowering pretty good now...really stinky,too...

Next up, the DDa- 36 days old- she's also real healthy, she's 14 inches tall, so 7" shorter than the Wookiees...She's being fed the same as the GSC and Wookiees- She's a little pale, so I may bump her feed up half a gram or so, but if that doesn't fix her, I'm just going to assume she's just a paler plant than most, and let her stay that way...

Looks like she's going to have a little color in them buds, so that's pretty cool!

Lastly, there's the 3 out there in the ground...not much to say about them, except that they're doing pretty well out there. They're being fed @GeoFlora Nutrients "Bloom" every ten days or so
The runt and the KxW are 8" tall, the White Chem is 16" tall, and, if you ask me, she's pretty darn ugly...
She's the one the whiteflies are interested in, but they're not enough of a problem to worry about. Not yet, anyway...

Same plants, different angle...these just aren't going to amount to much, but I guess they can't all be gems...

And that's about all there is about them!
Thanks for looking, I appreciate the support

The training update will be along in a few minutes..stay tuned