Antics Power Flower - Cali Jack FIM Grow

[Zabka]

Hey Antics, looking good! Sorry this reply is a little late - been pretty lazy on internet use of late. Your picture walkthrough is greatly appreciated and has worked We will either top or FIM all surviving plants...hope they get big enough! I know you started this at about 4 weeks veg. Which nodes did you FIM? Both plants now have their fourth sets of true leaves, which aren't fully developed yet. We just transplanted; should we do it as soon as they recover, or wait a bit, or does it depend on their intended final height?

Thanks again, man will be watching to see those beauties develop!

 

[MikeTbob]

Ok since MikeTBob wants me to risk a Hermy since I don't know what I'm doing, we're going to do just that lol.

This experiment is being done based on LA's writeup here: LA's Quick Guide To Simple Backbuilding Technique For Buds!

Today is day 49 of flower. The experiment will be run on Cali Jack only. Cali Jack runs a 9-11 week harvest time, which is 63-77 days.

Cali Jack has 3 main tops with similar sized branches. I decided to use the top 2 branches that are opposite each other, assuming those will give me the most reliable results to compare, and should have the most similar growth at the present time. Pots are turned every day, so all bud sits are receiving equal lighting.

Up until today (If this goes hermy, I'm blaming you Mike lol), I have had no signs of a hermy. No balls, no nanners, no bolting. Very minimal stress throughout the grow, no serious deficiencies, no wilted leaves, no over watering, and no under watering. I currently have a slight Nitrogen abundance, with slightly darker leaves, and minimal curling tips on only a few leaves.

If you get a hermie buddy, I'll personally make it up to you via snail mail.

This should be interesting. If it works out for you I'll try it on my bag seed.

Better get your scissors ready. It works.

 

[Antics]

Hey Antics, looking good! Sorry this reply is a little late - been pretty lazy on internet use of late. Your picture walkthrough is greatly appreciated and has worked We will either top or FIM all surviving plants...hope they get big enough! I know you started this at about 4 weeks veg. Which nodes did you FIM? Both plants now have their fourth sets of true leaves, which aren't fully developed yet. We just transplanted; should we do it as soon as they recover, or wait a bit, or does it depend on their intended final height?

Thanks again, man will be watching to see those beauties develop!

Only the main top was FIM'ed in my grow. I cut the FIM twice, because the first attempt failed (wasn't cut low enough) and the main top grew back like nothing happened. The rest of the work done on my plants was all LST, and occasional defoliation when I couldn't tuck leaves. I personally prefer not to remove a lot of leaves, other growers have good luck removing a lot. It's going to be something you'll need to experiment with, and find the happy medium that works best for you in your grow environment. In growing Cannabis there's a ton of methods and techniques, you just have to play around a bit and see what you like, and see what gives you the results you want. It's honestly not bad either. So far it looks like between my 1st and 2nd grow I might double my yield. Any improvement is a good thing.
If new techniques yield less, it's STILL a good thing, because you found something that doesn't work well for you, so you can try other things.
But whatever you try, I suggest doing it in moderation until you get the hang of it. Like what I'm doing in my last post from earlier today. Just testing it on one branch.
Thanks for stopping back in again, hopefully we'll see you around more!

If you get a hermie buddy, I'll personally make it up to you via snail mail.

Better get your scissors ready. It works.

Damn spaces.. I typed my reply in your quote lol

Fixed: I'm only teasing man. I know the risks, but the potential of a better yield, and a chance to learn a new technique, as well as share results of my test with everyone here is worth the risk of having to snip a few nanners for a few weeks.

I won't REALLY hold you accountable....

At least that's what I'll tell you lol ah man I'm just messing around. I could care less. It's just a plant, right?

I still have 10 more fem seeds, and another 29 regulars to grow still. I'm plenty set for a little while.

 

[lexblaze]

Back Building.. I might give mine ago next week or so

 

[Regor]

Up until today (If this goes hermy, I'm blaming you Mike lol), I have had no signs of a hermy. No balls, no nanners, no bolting. Very minimal stress throughout the grow, no serious deficiencies, no wilted leaves, no over watering, and no under watering. I currently have a slight Nitrogen abundance, with slightly darker leaves, and minimal curling tips on only a few leaves.

I have taken 3 pictures of each bud site for a comparison.

With risk come rewards, good luck to ya Antics !!!

 

[Antics]

It's time to pay the piper Mike!

Kidding..

I might have some nanners/bolting developing on Cali Jack. I noticed them just a few minutes ago, and judging from the size, they must have appeared in the last 24-48 hours.
This did not occur on the branch I nipped the bud for the back building experiment. Location-wise, this branch is right next to the backbuilding branch. This is located at the 2nd lowest node, which is on the branches that have grown the widest (And the backbuilding branch is the highest node). In my canopy pictures the two widest points you see on the left and right are where we're talking about. I only see this on the one branch. I can't find any other potential nanners anywhere else on the plant.

Pictures:

There has been no defoliation since day 30-something. I believe it was KingJohnC that suggests no more defol after day 45, so I'm good there.

While we're on the topic, can anyone explain the differences between a hermy, bolting, and nanners? I've seen all 3 terms used, but was never able to find a true comparison and explanation of all 3 problems.

And to go one step further, assuming they are in fact nanners/bolting, since these just started, Power Flower will more than likely be harvested before any pollen is released since we're at day 50 now. Cali Jack is almost finished as well, and only has 2-4 weeks to go, so Sinsimilla isn't a big problem at this point since the buds are all very well developed, and are actually bigger than the buds on PF.

Would pollination result in feminised seeds? regular seeds? seeds with a higher tendency to hermy?

Thanks for the help guys!

 

[Antics]

Ok a little new info:

I'm seeing that nanners just simply = pollen sacs Nanners what are they?

But are they male or female pollen sacs? And what would the seed sex be likely to be? Would this be considered a hermy? Or just a natural occurrence of a female trying to pollinate herself?

 

[MikeTbob]

Ok a little new info:

I'm seeing that nanners just simply = pollen sacs Nanners what are they?

But are they male or female pollen sacs? And what would the seed sex be likely to be? Would this be considered a hermy? Or just a natural occurrence of a female trying to pollinate herself?

Damn!! Not even 24 hours later? I think you found the nanners first and then typed up this whole elaborate hoax on me. You, sir, are good. LOL
From what I understand they should be female nanners only and you should get mostly females from it but the resulting seeds can be prone to getting nanners also.

 

[MaggiesFarm]

Damn!! Not even 24 hours later? I think you found the nanners first and then typed up this whole elaborate hoax on me. You, sir, are good. LOL
From what I understand they should be female nanners only and you should get mostly females from it but the resulting seeds can be prone to getting nanners also.

I've always read the same....if you get seeds in this situation they will be fem seeds.

 

[Antics]

Damn!! Not even 24 hours later? I think you found the nanners first and then typed up this whole elaborate hoax on me. You, sir, are good. LOL
From what I understand they should be female nanners only and you should get mostly females from it but the resulting seeds can be prone to getting nanners also.

Gee.. I was hoping for a hermy so you had to pay up. Now if I get a bunch of female seeds I'll end up owing you lol.

I've always read the same....if you get seeds in this situation they will be fem seeds.

Thanks for the input gents. If female seeds are more likely, at this stage of growth I'll let her self pollinate. I only have 1 Cali Jack seed left (I buy fems in 3 packs to test a strain out, and will buy larger quantities on proven strains and regulars) so if I end up with a bunch of CJ seeds I'm all for it. I love how the strain grows.

And if these are female pollen sacs, I'm assuming heavy stress or anything like that wasn't the cause?

And lastly, some people freak out a bit over things like this. Me? Not even close. I'm all for more seeds, as long as they don't have an increased risk of hermy. I'll take the risk of the increased risk of nanners on the seeds just to learn something. I welcome the chance to be familiar with all aspects of growing.

And yes, I'd like to experience a hermy at some point as well. It's all a learning experience friends. There's no price you can put on first hand experience.

 

[budstep]

As I understand this all feminized seed deal is if your Cali will pollinate herself you will end up with hermie seeds but if your Cali pollinates your Power Flower you will end up with feminized Flower Jack (PF x CJ) cross

 

[Antics]

As I understand this all feminized seed deal is if your Cali will pollinate herself you will end up with hermie seeds but if your Cali pollinates your Power Flower you will end up with feminized Flower Jack (PF x CJ) cross

Well that's a little less of a desirable situation if that's true.

MikeTbob is in trouble.

I found a few more. These are on the lowest branch, right next to the already affected branch.

These are also about 1/2 to 1/3 thinner than the others I found earlier, but similar in height.

I'm kidding Mike. I couldn't possibly express the number of fucks that I do not give about this 'problem' lol

The seriousness of this problem is somewhere between opening the wrong side of a milk carton, and having to flush twice after taco night.
I just like giving you a hard time buddy

 

[MrRandyWatson]

Awesome grow! I've seen an LST method which starts by completely bending over the top of the plant to the side of the pot and the letting the side shoots become the top of the plant. You essentially, just keep folding branches down around the pot to even your canopy. Have you seen this method I'm referencing? If so is there a reason you chose this form of LST?

The reason I am asking is because I'm trying to figure out what method works best.

 

[MaggiesFarm]

Awesome grow! I've seen an LST method which starts by completely bending over the top of the plant to the side of the pot and the letting the side shoots become the top of the plant. You essentially, just keep folding branches down around the pot to even your canopy. Have you seen this method I'm referencing? If so is there a reason you chose this form of LST?

The reason I am asking is because I'm trying to figure out what method works best.

That's what I'm doing in both of my grows going on right now. This is my FTB-02 freebie on July 3.

And here she(?) is this past weekend. This isn't a great pic, but I think it shows what has happened.

 

[Antics]

Awesome grow! I've seen an LST method which starts by completely bending over the top of the plant to the side of the pot and the letting the side shoots become the top of the plant. You essentially, just keep folding branches down around the pot to even your canopy. Have you seen this method I'm referencing? If so is there a reason you chose this form of LST?

The reason I am asking is because I'm trying to figure out what method works best.

Thank you, and thanks for stopping by. I've seen the method you're talking about.

I chose my method of LST over the one you're talking about basically to give myself experience with FIM'ing plants. I'm still learning so I want to try every method and technique available to get the best out of my grow.

I feel both methods are useful. The method I'm using works great for photo period plants since you have unlimited Veg time in which to train them. The method you're talking about is fantastic for autoflowering plants, since there will be zero stress when done correctly, and you won't lose any time when the plant recovers after topping. If you're growing an auto, and want as little stress as possible on the plant, that's definitely the way to go.

BUT... we have also had a few folks brave enough to top and FIM their autoflowers with great results.

So it really boils down to the environment, the strain, and the skill level (or braveness) of the grower. There's no single correct way to grow Cannabis, and even some far less common methods, like watering from the bottom, opposed to top watering, have worked out well for some folks.

When you ask someone how to do things, we'll answer you with what we have found to work the best for us, but never take their word for being FACT, and that it's the ONLY way you can do it. You can talk to 100 different growers, and you'll find small differences between the way each one grows their plants. And every single one can have an amazing yield.

It's up to you to find what combination works best for you

 

[Antics]

And today's update:

Day 51 of Flower.

Power Flower:

Cali Jack:

No new nanners, no watering or nutes today.

 

[rick3066]

first grape gets nanners,,now antics ?...yall' make me paranoid

 

[Antics]

first grape gets nanners,,now antics ?...yall' make me paranoid

First grape? Can you elaborate?


And I forgot to mention earlier..

Watered/nutes today.

PF Just receives water.

CJ Receives 7ml micro, 12ml grow, 20ml bloom/gallon plus 1 tbsp molasses.

 

[MrRandyWatson]

Thank you, and thanks for stopping by. I've seen the method you're talking about.

I chose my method of LST over the one you're talking about basically to give myself experience with FIM'ing plants. I'm still learning so I want to try every method and technique available to get the best out of my grow.

I feel both methods are useful. The method I'm using works great for photo period plants since you have unlimited Veg time in which to train them. The method you're talking about is fantastic for autoflowering plants, since there will be zero stress when done correctly, and you won't lose any time when the plant recovers after topping. If you're growing an auto, and want as little stress as possible on the plant, that's definitely the way to go.

BUT... we have also had a few folks brave enough to top and FIM their autoflowers with great results.

So it really boils down to the environment, the strain, and the skill level (or braveness) of the grower. There's no single correct way to grow Cannabis, and even some far less common methods, like watering from the bottom, opposed to top watering, have worked out well for some folks.

When you ask someone how to do things, we'll answer you with what we have found to work the best for us, but never take their word for being FACT, and that it's the ONLY way you can do it. You can talk to 100 different growers, and you'll find small differences between the way each one grows their plants. And every single one can have an amazing yield.

It's up to you to find what combination works best for you

Thanks, that answers my question. So with your form are you essentially just pulling every bud site outward?

 

[Antics]

Yeah, except when you start training you won't actually have bud sites.

It's really a simple process, and no laughing at my MS paint skills lol:

Here's our imaginary plant:

The first step for me was the FIM, or Topping whichever you choose.

Next we use whatever is comfortable for us, and safe for the plant to tie the branches down. I use ribbon and pipe cleaners, with paperclips on the edge of my pots. These ties usually need to be adjusted once a day or so, constantly moving it outward to keep the branch growing at a 90 degree angle to the stem. We also adjust the ties to allow the lowest branches to catch up, so all of our branches grow outward, and then curl upward at the same height.

As the branches grow, you'll see some growing higher (usually the top branches) so I tend to pull those down more, and let the lowest branches almost grow free, just with some gentle guidance to grow outwards.

When everything is finished, you want a plant that looks like this:

With this plant, you would have 20 bud sites. The difference is that all the bud sites have equal access to the light, and you'll end up growing colas, not just popcorn buds.