AfricanGrower's 1st Hydro Journal - Ebb&Flow - Bubblelicious 2013

This is just a thought, but I think part of the reason why the Capn's program is so successful might be due to those fluctuations. The way I perceive it is my res is always wanting to climb in PH. When I add the tea (which will now be twice a week), the 4.6-4.8 tea I add pulls the medium PH way down allowing the roots to feed on nutes that were not previously available due to high ph. Then after the tea begins to mix with the elements still in the medium, the PH slowly climbs again giving the roots an open salad bar for the time it takes for the PH to once again climb nearly out of range of everything. What's your take on this whole process? Do you (or Capn') think there may be some truth to my hypothesis?
 
I think the whole HPS - LED comparison is based to say the least. I've seen some comparisons where they stack like a 200 watt LED to a 600 watt HPS and get similar results. So would 600 watts of LED be comparable to 1800 watts HPS?
 
Skybound said:
This is just a thought, but I think part of the reason why the Capn's program is so successful might be due to those fluctuations. The way I perceive it is my res is always wanting to climb in PH. When I add the tea (which will now be twice a week), the 4.6-4.8 tea I add pulls the medium PH way down allowing the roots to feed on nutes that were not previously available due to high ph. Then after the tea begins to mix with the elements still in the medium, the PH slowly climbs again giving the roots an open salad bar for the time it takes for the PH to once again climb nearly out of range of everything. What's your take on this whole process? Do you (or Capn') think there may be some truth to my hypothesis?
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After some thinking, that may be true Sky. I will need to reconsider my choice in not purchasing Ancient Forest, and brewing my Tea for 24-48hrs, as I just use GW, Aquashield, and distilled water.

However, I don't think I can comment on the uptake process at the moment as I am now questioning my own understanding of it.
 
AfricanGrower said:
Okay, After reading that, I am taking a BIG step backwards and reassessing my setup.

I just took a pH reading from some waste I collected from yesterday's watering, and it is at 7.2.

>>> Your PH is more stable now? How do you know what the PH is in the medium? It's difficult to measure accurately. If the PH was rising in your res, it's rising in your medium too.

So what you are saying is that, even if the nutrient solution going in is at steady 5.8, the runoff should also read the same as well. correct. I had the notion that the pH being fed to the plant is what is important, but obviously I need to rethink that.

Dammit, I am really getting overwhelmed with this. I am just hoping for a moment of clarity as I process all this info. I have been tgoing about this the wrong way in my head.
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You're right. The PH of the water being fed to the plant IS important. But we already know your PH drifts up rapidly, so you know that's happening withing your medium. By recirculating, we have a better shot at equalizing the PH in your medium. After recirculating for 15 minutes, you should feel comfortable that the medium is well flushed and the PH of the medium is the same as what is in the res. Then, no need to measure PH of the run off (cumbersome and inaccurate). Just measure the PH of the res. If it's high, adjust it down to 5.7, then relax. Check it in another day. Resist the urge to check it 5x a day. That's usually when we over-correct.

Skybound said:
This is just a thought, but I think part of the reason why the Capn's program is so successful might be due to those fluctuations. The way I perceive it is my res is always wanting to climb in PH. When I add the tea (which will now be twice a week), the 4.6-4.8 tea I add pulls the medium PH way down allowing the roots to feed on nutes that were not previously available due to high ph. Then after the tea begins to mix with the elements still in the medium, the PH slowly climbs again giving the roots an open salad bar for the time it takes for the PH to once again climb nearly out of range of everything. What's your take on this whole process? Do you (or Capn') think there may be some truth to my hypothesis?
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Sky, Yes what you are saying is mostly true. PH drift between 5.5-6.8 is fine. Certain elements are more available at different PH levels. If you come home from work and your PH is 6.5, yes you will want to adjust, but no need to freak out. As I was saying before, we want to add as few PH adjusting chemicals as possible.

However, since I got my R.O. unit, my PH is pretty solid. I adjust my nutrient solution and let it bubble for 30 minutes, BEFORE I add it to the reservoir. This way I know everything is dissolved and stable. Until you get RO water, you'll have to play the PH game. When PH rises slowly, that is a good sign of a healthy system. If it's dropping, BAD things are happening (roots dying). I believe you will find a routine where you can manage PH, even if that means adding a dash of PH down daily, to your top off water. When I mix up my recipe, my PH comes to 5.4, before adding silica. So if I notice my res is 6.3, I can add a couple gallons of freshly mixed nutrient solution (with no silica) to help even it out around 6.0. Perfect!

I am a long time reef aquarium keeper. I learned back then, how easy it is to over-correct, and how bad that is for fish and corals. Plants, are definitely more tolerant, but I still like to think of my plant as if it were a fish. I try not to change too many things at one time. I don't like chemicals dissolving in the reservoir. I try to adjust PH without using chemicals (but I still use PH up / down when necessary).

Since we are using beneficial bacteria, it is even more important to use as few chemicals as possible, and try not to SHOCK the system by changing the pH too drastically, or dissolving nutrients in the root zone.

AfricanGrower said:
After some thinking, that may be true Sky. I will need to reconsider my choice in not purchasing Ancient Forest, and brewing my Tea for 24-48hrs, as I just use GW, Aquashield, and distilled water.

However, I don't think I can comment on the uptake process at the moment as I am now questioning my own understanding of it.
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AG, the A.F. is beneficial, but your roots are beautiful, there is no need to change your tea recipe. Whatever you are doing, keep doing it.
 
Capn, is there any good acidic nutrients available, preferably GH? I know I can use the silica in place of PH up so long as PPMs are in the safe range. Is there a nutrient or amendment I can use in place of PH down? For the record, I am yet to need a PH up so I didn't have to use the silica that way, but I know I have the option. I just want an option to go down that involves something that I'd use in the recipe anyway.
 
Mini Update

Okay so after a good 6 hours of quality time spent in my closet, I have finally got everything in order.

-I ran my flowering nutrient schedule at 510PPM, recirculating it through the Bubb for 15min.

-I transplanted the Bubb into her final 5 gallon bucket.

-I replaced the trellis.

-I have adopted a recirculation line for my top-feed system.

-I have mixed my new nutrient solution at 880PPM, and will sit until tomorrow morning, when I go back to my regular feed schedule.

I will have pics up and possible a video of my efforts in the next few hours, as I have not eaten all day...I am starving :yummy:
 
AfricanGrower said:
as I have not eaten all day...I am starving :yummy:
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You should've come here AG. I just made some chicken and taters that are so good, it make me wanna smack my momma!
 
MINI UPDATE PT.2

Okay so I FINALLY received my 5 gallon pots and a restock on some Grow Cubes as I had run out. Can you believe it said 'Priority 2-Day Express Mail' on the label sticker.....my A$$....it took over 2 weeks.

I went with a mesh-bottom, to give the roots the most space to grow out and through without getting too restricted.

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It still is not the right circumference as advertised, but it sits in pretty well with little movement so it will have to do.

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Here is a short video of my venture throughout the day. Enjoy ;)

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And for those who STILL don't believe in the power of a 'Live' environment over a sterile one, here is a pic of what my roots look like...PEARLY WHITE :)

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Looks like fine angel hair. Awesome roots Bubb, way to go!
 
Cool video. Looks great to me. You will be pulling in some weight with that set up.

Hey can I get a picture with a lighter so I can size things up? Just kidding buddy. I added a pic just for you in my thread :)

+reps
 
root structure is out of this world like usual. roots before shoots. I always check my root mass after the grows over, always looking of ways to get more roots haha. I think keeping my plants full at all times is gonna do it :)

I wish I could add more light but I cant :(
 
AG, how's bubb doing?

I can't remember if it was you or sky, but someone asked me if there was a nutrient that brought PH down, similar to the way silica raises PH. Today I checked. My RO water is 15ppm and PH 6.9. I took two gallons of RO water, and added 10ml of florablend. This brought the PH up to 100ppm, and the PH down to 6.1. That's a significant drop, at the expense of 100ppm. Obviously if your PH is climbing, you can't keep adding florablend daily, but it's worth more experimenting.

I'm having the same PH issue in my aero plant right now, due to the rapid vegetative growth.
 
TheCapn said:
AG, how's bubb doing?

I can't remember if it was you or sky, but someone asked me if there was a nutrient that brought PH down, similar to the way silica raises PH. Today I checked. My RO water is 15ppm and PH 6.9. I took two gallons of RO water, and added 10ml of florablend. This brought the PH up to 100ppm, and the PH down to 6.1. That's a significant drop, at the expense of 100ppm. Obviously if your PH is climbing, you can't keep adding florablend daily, but it's worth more experimenting.

I'm having the same PH issue in my aero plant right now, due to the rapid vegetative growth.
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Hey Capn, she is doing wonderfully. A full recovery from the flush, and leaves have stopped worsening in appearance. Leaf tips are a bit droopy though, but I'm sure it will subside in the next few days.

I have to say, I am glad I decided to take a clone from the bagseed as well. This plant has been so resilient through everything that has been going on. It has shown no signs of stress whatsoever, as to which the Bubb was. And mind you the bagseed is a full month less mature than the Bubb, and is taking the 880 PPM feed like a champ. It never has showed signs of nutrient burns since I connected it to the same feed line as the Bubb. Like I said, I have high hopes for this one.

>>>I took two gallons of RO water, and added 10ml of florablend. This brought the PH (you mean PPM ;))up to 100ppm, and the PH down to 6.1.

That is good info to know, however I am slowly running out of FloraBlend from my starter kit so I will need to be using for more wisely. For now, I will stick with a mix and match of citric acid and pH down solution to control pH.

Sling said:
High There AfricanGrower
Wanted to stop by and personally invite you and your subscribers to my new journal
4000 Watt Top-Feed Rec. Grow Cubes Cap'n Style OG Kush
Hope to see you all there
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Thanks for the formal invite there bud. I'll be stopping by right after I post this up ;)
 
TheCapn said:
AG, how's bubb doing?

I can't remember if it was you or sky, but someone asked me if there was a nutrient that brought PH down, similar to the way silica raises PH. Today I checked. My RO water is 15ppm and PH 6.9. I took two gallons of RO water, and added 10ml of florablend. This brought the PH up to 100ppm, and the PH down to 6.1. That's a significant drop, at the expense of 100ppm. Obviously if your PH is climbing, you can't keep adding florablend daily, but it's worth more experimenting.

I'm having the same PH issue in my aero plant right now, due to the rapid vegetative growth.
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That's already on my list. Someone shared on the Flux thread a product called Crystal Burst (0-15-15 +B1) by Humboldt County Own and said it was also pretty acidic. LA said he used lemon juice and after a bit of research, it turns out that lemon juice is also a good source of K. I thought that was good to know for possible potassium deficiencies. Using it might even help to prevent a K def.
 
19/11/13

FLOWER DAY 20

Hey all, I thought it was time for another update. As you have noticed, I have not been updating as frequently as I was towards the beginning of this grow (you can thank Sky for those frequent updates ;)). BUT this is only because I am at the point where I can grab a chair and just sit back from here. Almost everything is going smoothly, including my pH. It is starting to stabilize more and more now. It now only shifts by a factor of .3 in 24 hours instead of a factor of .6-.7 as it used to do!

I also am realizing that the high pH swings was more than likely due to my plants eating more than they are drinking. I was a complete idiot in not taking PPM readings after my pH swings and comparing the results. Well, before yesterday's res change I did and this is what I noticed:

My pH was at a high 6.7-6.8, and my PPM was at 750. When I first mixed this res, the PPM was at 950, so the uptake of nutrients was much larger than the uptake of water. This definitely would increase my pH by reducing the amount of acidic based nutrients that started off in the res where it was at a pH of 5.9!

After yesterdays res change, I brought my PPM to 1150, and a pH of 6.0. Now today after about 3 feeding cycles, the PPM has dropped to 1040, and the pH has risen to 6.3. So this is just going to be a matter of time before everything will stabilize and the plant will 'drink' and 'eat' in equal proportions. The only reason I don't want to increase the PPM too drastically is because the bagseed is still a full month behind in overall maturity compared to the Bubb, and at the rate of increase that I am going by, the bagseed shows acceptable amounts of nutrient burn (1 millimeter of burnt leaf tips) while the Bubb is eating like a champ :MoreNutes:

Now speaking of the bagseed, I will start off with her. She is really showing off, wanting me to give her more light penetration than what is already available :) I honestly am thinking of getting a T4 or T5 to add onto the 72 watts of CFL that she is already using.

Trichomes are just ALL over the leaves, and she is really starting to show her 'Stars'! Once again, a very overwhelming, skunk scent, and I now I just smell it every time I open the tent. She completely overpowers any bubblegum smell that exists in the tent :)

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How's that for some schwag weed that I bought at $60 an oz :high-five:

Now, the Bubb...as expected she really is concentrating on building those nodes up, and filling them in with buds. Trichome production won't start for another 2-3 weeks, I suspect, but the pistils are highly resinous. I hope to get at least 14 grams per MAIN top, and at least 8 grams per every other top! (So to do the math: 12 main tops x 14g = 168g; an estimated 23 sub-tops x 8g = 184g; so my estimated realistic goal ~ 12.5oz)

Not quite the 1lb mark I was hoping for, but based on my research and results from other Bubblelicious grows with similar setups, these numbers are the best I can hope for. Really anything past 10oz I will be happy with :)

Now for some Bubb pics:

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So that is what is going on currently in my world. Hope you all enjoyed the update as much as I enjoy writing them up for you guys. I swear I come up with new ideas every time I do :)

From the AG tent....Peace:hippy::peace:

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And goodnight....:sleep:

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