Xlr8's Quest For The Best - 2012

GiGaBaNE said:
yeah im thinking this is the way i want to go.
if it had 2 'buckets' top one releases its payload, which fills the trough faster than it can drain away. it drains into the bottom bucket which pumps it back to the top one, the top one remains off until the volume reaches a certain level (mechanicaly i would use weight as a trigger, electronically i would use a wetness sensor or something.)

you could get away with a pretty puny pump and if goin mechanical you could make the water release just using scrap lying around to achieve it.

i would love to have a system like this that only needs me once a week. i could spend the week with the family and come home to work at weekends, lol. missus doesnt need to know i could do all my work in an hour or two...want some time to play =D

diagram came from a hydro PDF from the phostrogen web site
Click to expand...

The way my DIY veg system works, could work similarly for a flood table ebb and flow system like you're talking about. Basically, there would be a reservoir underneath the tray. In the tray, you'd want to install flood/drain fittings similar to this:
DIY_hydro_1.jpg


The shorter fitting is attached to a hose underneath that goes to a pump in the reservoir. A timer is used to turn the pump on, which pumps nutrients in through that shorter fitting.

The taller fitting is your "overflow" fitting. It also connects to a hose underneath which simply dumps back into the reservoir. When the pump is triggered via the timer, nutrient solution will fill to the height set by the taller fitting and then start draining back into the reservoir, even while the pump is still running and pumping solution through the shorter one. This keeps you from over-flooding and sets a height parameter for the solution.

Once the pump kicks off (it should be timed to stop shortly after the entire tray is saturated evenly at the highest point, again set by the taller fitting) the remaining nutrient solution will drain back out through the shorter fitting, and back to the reservoir through the pump.

These fittings are cheap (10-20$ I believe), sold as a kit, and easy to install. The pump is also cheap (in U.S only about $25 or so) so for a small investment a lot more automation can be had...

Ebb & Flow fittings kit:
botanicare_fittings.jpg
 
Billy420 said:
.... The dwc/flood veg system x, does not have any important ph changes ?
You check (and ph down) every couple of days, or something , m I right ?
Click to expand...

Hi Billy -

At the beginning, when the plants were young, I checked the PH daily. Now that the plants are at this phase they're pretty consistent and the PH only needs adjusting about once every 3 days or so. I change the nutrients out completely about once a week, which is the biggest task with this type of hydro. For me, a reservoir change takes about 30-45 minutes the way I do it.
 
Ms.Fox said:
Awww that is so very sweet. Thank you! I'm glad to have to come back to see some familiar faces! I'm just hanging out, helping where I can. ;-) Thank you again.

Yeah, I'm loving the color of your girls. They look great. The roots are very healthy. As far as defoliating, I don't see why you shouldn't as long as you don't go overboard. A lot of times I don't recommend it, because some don't know when to stop, and the plants end up looking like toothpicks. ;-) I'm not to sure about the spilt. Does it appear to be hindering the growth of the plant? Some of those PH meters are very finicky. Sounds like you have one on your hands. They are almost more of a pain than what they're worth.
Click to expand...

Thanks Ms. Fox -

Yes, these damned PH meters can be finicky. This one seems especially so! I think some of the old school logic on defoliating has been debunked - "toothpicks" in an indoor grow can be quite effective bud producers, with much less "fluff" due to better light penetration. The topic always stir debate, but the recent results being had by some of the more aggressive defoliators on this site seem to speak for themselves. I was a reluctant convert, and still don't defoliate as heavy as some, but I must admit I do believe it's the way to go indoors, when done correctly. I love how you are jumping right back into helpful mode - good having you back around! :thumb:
 
Xlr8 said:
Thanks Ms. Fox -

Yes, these damned PH meters can be finicky. This one seems especially so! I think some of the old school logic on defoliating has been debunked - "toothpicks" in an indoor grow can be quite effective bud producers, with much less "fluff" due to better light penetration. The topic always stir debate, but the recent results being had by some of the more aggressive defoliators on this site seem to speak for themselves. I was a reluctant convert, and still don't defoliate as heavy as some, but I must admit I do believe it's the way to go indoors, when done correctly. I love how you are jumping right back into helpful mode - good having you back around! :thumb:
Click to expand...


Xlr8, I can only rep you so much and you just keep spittn' great info out.
 
Xlr8 said:
The way my DIY veg system works, could work similarly for a flood table ebb and flow system like you're talking about. Basically, there would be a reservoir underneath the tray. In the tray, you'd want to install flood/drain fittings similar to this:
DIY_hydro_1.jpg


The shorter fitting is attached to a hose underneath that goes to a pump in the reservoir. A timer is used to turn the pump on, which pumps nutrients in through that shorter fitting.

The taller fitting is your "overflow" fitting. It also connects to a hose underneath which simply dumps back into the reservoir. When the pump is triggered via the timer, nutrient solution will fill to the height set by the taller fitting and then start draining back into the reservoir, even while the pump is still running and pumping solution through the shorter one. This keeps you from over-flooding and sets a height parameter for the solution.

Once the pump kicks off (it should be timed to stop shortly after the entire tray is saturated evenly at the highest point, again set by the taller fitting) the remaining nutrient solution will drain back out through the shorter fitting, and back to the reservoir through the pump.

These fittings are cheap (10-20$ I believe), sold as a kit, and easy to install. The pump is also cheap (in U.S only about $25 or so) so for a small investment a lot more automation can be had...

Ebb & Flow fittings kit:
botanicare_fittings.jpg
Click to expand...

i love you man =D

so basicly with a few pipes, a decent pump, a timer and two swimming pools (plastic kiddy paddling pools) i could rig up a 32 plant flood and drain (32 in square pots is what i worked out the pool i found would fit nicely)

im assuming you would need bubblers in the res?, what about a dripper for PH down for extended automation...doable?
 
HomeMedGrower said:
Xlr8, I can only rep you so much and you just keep spittn' great info out.
Click to expand...

Thanks man, I sure appreciate that! :high-five:

I've been sitting here feeling über guilty for getting hung up in my own journal and not getting out more to other people journals (I do, but I'm subbed to so many I'm forever feeling guilty for the ones I don't get to). Thanks for putting a smile back on my face! :)
 
GiGaBaNE said:
i love you man =D

so basicly with a few pipes, a decent pump, a timer and two swimming pools (plastic kiddy paddling pools) i could rig up a 32 plant flood and drain (32 in square pots is what i worked out the pool i found would fit nicely)

im assuming you would need bubblers in the res?, what about a dripper for PH down for extended automation...doable?
Click to expand...

Cool - glad it was helpful! Haha, love you too brotha! :circle-of-love:
I think that would work great, but I'm guessing you'd want to make sure that you have a good frame for built for them (the kiddy pools). Instead of pipe, it would probably be cheaper and easier to use flexible vinyl tubing of some kind. These attach to the pumps and barbed fittings pretty nicely, and the fittings are designed to be used with the tubing by default. Bubblers in the res aren't necessary, but I do believe they help keep things recirculated and fresh - I do have an airstone in my reservoirs now. A small airpump is pretty inexpensive too, as are airstones. (in US both can be had for under $25) :)

Dosers for adjusting PH would be really cool, but they're not cheap at all. However, there are some DIY versions out there for 100-200$ or so, but I'm not sure how well they work. The off-the-shelf, purchased ones are really spendy!

If I really had to, I could probably go 5-7 days without adjusting PH and suffer no permanent, negative consequences (hell longer than that with a little luck).
 
Hi X,

Nice continuation... I think it's good that you break a long journal up. Same for OMM. Exactly for the reasons you stated.... I for one hate to jump into the end of a long ongoing journal, it's like interupting a conversation or something...and at the same time, sooo much reading to catch up is just too time consuming sometimes...just can't do it. Anyway thanks... and I agree with the suggestion about starting the new one with a link to the old one. (sorry, forgot who mentioned this)

Wow...those girls are just exploding with flowers...I'm so excited to see this as I'm also using BPN and just flipped to flower cycle yesterday. I'm very interested in Corey's new products too...so I'll be watching closely.

I love the veg room too...wow those girls look like they need daily attention...so do mine, they seem to need a clip/trim, or bend every single day. It's those wonderful BPN goodies we're feeding. :)

btw, what ppm's are you feeding? both veg and flower? how many ml's of each? Do you follow the online nute schedule? or have you adjusted it to your girls?

About the split in the stem...I split my NLxBB right at the point of being topped, very early on and she seems to have developed just fine. I taped her when I did it but that didn't hold for long, she hardened up at the break point and has survived the mishap despite me. here's a photo from way back when it happened...I'll make a point to take another for tomorrow's journal update (lights are out, or I'd go take one for you now)
DSCN25812.JPG

On defoliating...I'm new to growing, maybe that's why it was easy for me to give it a try...I don't have any long held beliefs on things when it comes to growing our favorite herb. I think everything you said about it being THE way to go for indoor grows in true, for all the reasons you gave. Very nicely explained.

I love your journaling style and the way you take extra care to explain things to us newbies. thanks again X for all your hard work. +reps to ya buddy.

And that PE...I'm gonna have to grow another soon...that one you have is making my mouth water. I loved the smell and the taste...but it doesn't taste anything like it smells so don't be surprised. Hope you enjoy it.

:peace:
Sq
 
Geez, Brother! I thought I made it here pretty quick, all things considered, and you're at 7 pages in only two days! I guess I'll have to wait for someone in front to take a bio break, then I can steal their front-row seat! :)

Your girls look great! Somebody please throw X some +REPS for me and I'll hit you back, since I need to spread mine around first!

Great job, Bro! :bravo:
 
Mr. Krip said:
Geez, Brother! I thought I made it here pretty quick, all things considered, and you're at 7 pages in only two days! I guess I'll have to wait for someone in front to take a bio break, then I can steal their front-row seat! :)

Your girls look great! Somebody please throw X some +REPS for me and I'll hit you back, since I need to spread mine around first!

Great job, Bro! :bravo:
Click to expand...

would love to, but im all out of reps for X too :rofl:
 
Sorry...I tried too. Said I had to spread the love...so I rated this thread 5 stars.

:circle-of-love:
Sq
 
xlr8 said:
Dosers for adjusting PH would be really cool, but they're not cheap at all. However, there are some DIY versions out there for 100-200$ or so, but I'm not sure how well they work. The off-the-shelf, purchased ones are really spendy!
Click to expand...

Milwaukee SMS 122 comes at 113.47$ .
(Im not sure if I can post a link to a non sponsored site)

You need also either a peristaltic pump (which is expensive), or a submersible pump with a Y at the output and a valve , which adjust the flow (one edge goes to the res, the other one with the valve returns solution-ph down, back to bucket - simply reduces the flow...)

As xlr said said in a previous journal , Its just too much trouble unless it needs to be out of home for weeks ..
 
Billy420 said:
Milwaukee SMS 122 comes at 113.47$ .
(Im not sure if I can post a link to a non sponsored site)

You need also either a peristaltic pump (which is expensive), or a submersible pump with a Y at the output and a valve , which adjust the flow (one edge goes to the res, the other one with the valve returns solution-ph down, back to bucket - simply reduces the flow...)

As xlr said said in a previous journal , Its just too much trouble unless it needs to be out of home for weeks ..
Click to expand...

<<needs to be out of the home for weeks...hell i need to be able to make a real stealth grow that i only need to visit once a month if possible, lol.
 
I love my HM pH-200 BUT....I calibrate it every time I use it. I have found that it is HIGHLY accurate but needs calibration too often. I have used so many different meters and have found that some hold calibration really well but the electrode will go bad after a few months. The jury is still out on the pH-200 because I have only had mine just over a year but unless the electrode goes out, I am happy.
What I really like is the +/- 0.02 accuracy for the cost. I have spent upwards of $500 on a couple of meters for +/- .01 accuracy and it just isn't worth it. Most meters in the price range as the pH-200 have accuracies of +/- 0.05 which is not enough for me... just my 2 cents.... If you know of a better one that is just as cost effective, let me know. Also, I only try and buy "pen" type meters...more versatile.
 
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