Xlr8's "Flo N Gro" Hydro Multiple Strains 2011
- Thread starter Xlr8
- Start date
The only problem with blogs is that most users don't know about them or where to find them. I don't think the search tools look through blogs. I will have to bookmark your blog as wells as Xlr8's. Good work guys.
The only issue I have with that magazine is, I am pretty sure it's owned by A/N. So, any information about nutrients will be skewed towards their products and not completely unbiased.
mastershuffle
New Member
I just got a message from medicineman and he said I should use h202 instead of root zone because it oxygenates, sterilizes and perfect for a res above 69f. Ever since I flushed and switched it's picked up quite a bit
It works!
I've been using that in my Turbo Klone aerocloner over the last two sessions to keep away the dreaded black stem rot that seems to plague the Blue Cheese strain! I did manage to get TWO viable rooted clones out of the 15 cuttings this last time, even though they went into flower IN the cloner!
I know that the use of Hydrogen Peroxide is a pretty common technique in other gardening circles. You don't see it mentioned much in the Cannabis community though.
I believe you're correct, but the article is not discussing AN Nutes, per se.
It's discussing the labelling regulations nute manufacturers have to deal with that PREVENTS them from listing all of their ingredients on their labels.
Because of this, we may not really know all the ingredients in a particluar nute formula by reading the label. So, if you try to duplicate the product by what's on the label, it most likely will not be a complete duplication.
However you try to duplicate it, it may be better, or it may be worse, but because of the labelling restrictions, there's a good chance it may not be the exact duplication you were looking for.
It works!
I've been using that in my Turbo Klone aerocloner over the last two sessions to keep away the dreaded black stem rot that seems to plague the Blue Cheese strain! I did manage to get TWO viable rooted clones out of the 15 cuttings this last time, even though they went into flower IN the cloner!
I know that the use of Hydrogen Peroxide is a pretty common technique in other gardening circles. You don't see it mentioned much in the Cannabis community though.
I add H2O2 AND DM Zone on every res change. I usually add the H2O2 the night before to the water. I've been doing this as a preventative, since I run some pretty high temps. But, I've yet to see any res problems in the Waterfarms, so I'm assuming it's helping.
I finished reading the whole article, and I think he could have stopped after making his point about the antiquated procedures used by the government, but then he went on to bash two of his competitors. That's his prerogative, he does own the magazine.
I do agree that there needs to be a better labeling regulation that allows a manufacturer to list all of their ingredients, and in fact that should be required. I think that secretly though, Big Mike likes the fact they aren't required to list everything. We should just take his word they are constantly improving their line and adding things that lower cost nutrients don't. Just take his word for it that they are the most advanced nutrients available, his PhD's will back him up on that.
I refuse to buy any of his products on principle. I've been very happy with the products I have been using and looking forward to using BPN in the next few days. So I'll save the extra money and put it towards other purchases.
I do agree that there needs to be a better labeling regulation that allows a manufacturer to list all of their ingredients, and in fact that should be required. I think that secretly though, Big Mike likes the fact they aren't required to list everything. We should just take his word they are constantly improving their line and adding things that lower cost nutrients don't. Just take his word for it that they are the most advanced nutrients available, his PhD's will back him up on that.
I refuse to buy any of his products on principle. I've been very happy with the products I have been using and looking forward to using BPN in the next few days. So I'll save the extra money and put it towards other purchases.
Steve, do I sense some issues with AN?
I think you may be missing the point I was trying to make, which is that, assuming the other nute manufacturers have to abide by the same regulations (and I'm quite sure they do!), it makes it impossible for ANY of us to really know what's in our nutes.
I'm not suggesting to anyone that AN is a superior line, or that Big Mike likes, or doesn't like it.
This is about knowing what you're feeding your plants, regardless of the nute manufacturer.
By all means, stick with the nute line you like, or prefer, or whatever works best. Just know that whatever's on the label, it may not be complete, which would make it difficult to replicate!
Mr. K, I totally got your point and the article makes a good argument for the revision of labeling laws to be more inline with current technologies and practices.
I don't have an issue with A/N per se, I am sure their products produce some very nice meds and a high-yield (but not worth 3x the cost of BPN for example). I have always been a contrarian and look for the roads less traveled.
I don't have an issue with A/N per se, I am sure their products produce some very nice meds and a high-yield (but not worth 3x the cost of BPN for example). I have always been a contrarian and look for the roads less traveled.
BPN, I'm sure you're aware of these issues since you're in the industry, and maybe you can add some additional perspective, but all I can say after reading it is, "I feel for you brother!"
Hopefully things change to make it better for all of us!
Yup, I am aware of all of that. Different states have individual labeling requirements and in order to retail products in stores in each state, you must pay some fees and meet their labeling requirements. Registering products is really easy in Louisiana (where I am at).
All I can say is that what I put in my products is listed on my labels. I personally would not feel right selling anything that's not listed.
Some chemicals that may accelerate growth rates such as PGR /ALAR, could potentially be harmful to humans. Here is a good site that can possibly shed some more light on the hydroponic industry:
Flower Dragon Additive
Since I only sell online, I am not worried for now. To me, truth and transparency is very important, especially when dealing with products that are affecting something that is ingested by human beings. I am just going to keep doing what I am doing (listing all of my ingredients) and let the cards fall where they may. I have no problems staring back at myself when I look into the mirror and I make my mother proud!
Wow! Good article (a little long & technical) and now I'm worried about all the things that aren't listed on the labels!
I know there are a lot of users of BushMaster & Gravity here on 420. I don't know how old that article is, but if you're using BushMaster or Gravity, you should read it!
Aaron Quix
Well-Known Member
Heres a thread I subbed to a long time ago, forgot I had it down at the bottom of my subs....Gravity, Purple Maxx, and Bushmaster
Hi Xlr8,
It's been a while, I just caught up. Wow, lot's going on in here. Great looking plants. Keep em green...I'll keep watching.
It's been a while, I just caught up. Wow, lot's going on in here. Great looking plants. Keep em green...I'll keep watching.
Magic beans
New Member
Man Xlr8, your journal is so hard to keep up with! You got like 3 pages a day lol!! The ladies are loving the environment, it would seem. Looks like those skywalkers are dominating. Nice to see you could squeeze that last site in there. Everything looks good. What are your opinions on the oceanus thus far?
Wow! Good article (a little long & technical) and now I'm worried about all the things that aren't listed on the labels!
I know there are a lot of users of BushMaster & Gravity here on 420. I don't know how old that article is, but if you're using BushMaster or Gravity, you should read it!
Thanks! I had been using Bushmaster until the most recent group of plants I put into my Bloom Room because they were already flowering outside, so I figured that they were done stretching at that point. I was right about that. They didn't add any significant height after being moved indoors.
From what I could see with my past group that I did use it on which were my two Blueberry Kush clones, Bushmaster definitely stopped their stretch dead in its tracks. Those plants were still in veg when I brought them under the 12/12, so I am pretty sure that it helped keep them from going crazy.
It is always hard to know for sure though! It could have also been because I decided that time to mix my T5 tube temps and go with a 50% 6400k and 50% 3000k for the first two weeks of 12/12.
Still...from all I have read about what Bushmaster does, it was probably the thing responsible for the lack of stretch.
Haven't decided if I will start using it again next season. Some of the comments about it being dangerous has me a little concerned.
- Thread starter
- #397
Holy Bajeebus dood, 26 pages in three weeks!!?? I'm backed up like NewYork traffic!! Got some reading to do....
Yes! Moves fast around here, and there's been a lot of great DIY nutrient info and discussion as well. I'm really swamped around home with guests this weekend, so I can't keep up with my own journal. Yikes!
- Thread starter
- #398
It's all good brother. I know quite a bit about the few things I specialize in and very little on certain aspects of plant nutrition and I am constantly searching for new tricks that I can put in my grower's toolbox
well, I have used h2o2 in the past with good results because Personally, I want a very sterile environment when growing a hydroponic garden. I haven't ever heard of causing any harm to plants when using the weak stuff that is typically sold in a grocery store mixed at around a tablespoon/gallon. After I did my calculations for the recipe I posted, I looked back at how much copper was in the stuff and was kind of surprised once I made the connection to what I, myself typically use in hydroponics. I just opened one of my old college text books and refreshed my memory on copper nutrition. It says that copper toxicity can occur at greater than 0.1 ppm in hydroponic solutions. At 10 ml/gallon, a product with 0.1% copper would increase the copper ppm by 2.7 ppm. After I calculated that, I was a little shocked the wheels started turning.
I am definitely very curious to find out more about copper nutrition and MJ or if even my textbook is wrong or too conservative with their numbers about copper concentration in nutrient solutions. I need to know now
It's all good Blue Planet my friend. I just wanted to point out that H2o2 can be pretty harmful in too high of doses too. Believe me, I don't trust everything I read on this, but one of Dutch Masters claims is that their product is much less harsh than H2o2. I only speak highly of it because I've had verifiable root improvement with it.
Hey guys,
First, much kudos, again, to BPN for being a great member of our 420 family, in addition to being a great sponsor!
I definately trust BPN 100% on his science and abilities to not only provide a fantastic line of nutes, but also in his ability to "reverse-engineer" other products we've had success with.
That being said, for BPN or any of us to be able to effectively re-produce some of these other products, we really need to be aware of what's in them, which may NOT necessarily be the case.
I've posted the following article a couple of times before, but it's worth reading for anyone trying to duplicate the formulas of their nutes, or just understand the difference between two lines of nutes.
YOU'RE BEING ROBBED! Why States Aren't Telling You the Truth About Your Hydroponics Nutrients
BPN, I'm sure you're aware of these issues since you're in the industry, and maybe you can add some additional perspective, but all I can say after reading it is, "I feel for you brother!"
Hopefully things change to make it better for all of us!
I was thinking about this too, Mr. Krip, and I agree with you whole heartedly. In speaking with people in the industry it's clear that the laws are outdated and were intended for a different kind of "fertilizer" industry. We may not know all of what's in Zone, or many of the additives we use. Kudos to Blue Planet Nutrients for his approach in complete honesty and being so forthright.
Steve, you have a good point, and I take a lot of what's said with a grain of salt for this reason - but I've heard from others besides "Big Mike" that this is a real issue in the nutrient industry, and that fact I don't doubt a bit. Where I live they're constantly pulling product on and off shelves due to running afoul with labeling and licensing issues. It's crazy how frequent it is, honestly.
My opinion, fwiw: No doubt, that H2o2 can be a useful tool and do many good things at the right dosage and when used correctly. Some of the best growers I know use it in various ways, including some that use it as a regular additive.
Personally, I like Zone because it seems to work really well, and can be successfully "higher dosed" when problems arise. That's the only reason I wanted to comment on BPN's post - I get what he's saying with the copper, but my real world experience is that it works great even when dosed higher than what they currently recommend. I believe it to be gentle and hard to screw up, and I felt I had to give credit where credit was due to the product based on my success with it over several grows now. I believe there may be more to the product than what's shared on the label possibly for reasons that Mr. Krip highlighted.
Having said all that, it's a choice thing that I make, and Hydrogen Peroxide is great for those who want to go that way - just be careful to not over-do it as it can be harmful to healthy root tissue if dosed too high. Glad it's working out for you - it can work wonders as well, no doubt.
It works!
I've been using that in my Turbo Klone aerocloner over the last two sessions to keep away the dreaded black stem rot that seems to plague the Blue Cheese strain! I did manage to get TWO viable rooted clones out of the 15 cuttings this last time, even though they went into flower IN the cloner!
I know that the use of Hydrogen Peroxide is a pretty common technique in other gardening circles. You don't see it mentioned much in the Cannabis community though.
It's great in moderation, especially in soil emergencies and severe root problem emergencies. It's also great for sterilizing. Some people have success using it as a regular additive in small dosages.
I agree Mr. Krip, but Steve's point is well made about the way he makes his point and takes shots at his competition. This is quite a battle out in the stores, too. The 2 companies won't allow their products to be sold in the sames stores they hate each other so much.
I add H2O2 AND DM Zone on every res change. I usually add the H2O2 the night before to the water. I've been doing this as a preventative, since I run some pretty high temps. But, I've yet to see any res problems in the Waterfarms, so I'm assuming it's helping.
Interesting that you run both! Lot's of ways to skin a cat.
Great discussion everyone - in hydro it's good to help your roots, too if you can especially if you aren't running a chiller. There are many great ways to do this.
- Thread starter
- #399
Great meds have been grown with AN product, and DM, and others etc....
I'm hoping to find that:
Blue Planet nutrients produce in Bloom as well as Veg and we can all grow great meds that are realistically priced with unprecedented support. So far so good Blue Planet - loving your product so far - THANK YOU!
- Thread starter
- #400
I've been pasting little tidbits like these in my blog.
OG13:
Me too! Don't know how often it will get viewed there, but it seemed like a good spot.
