Wild Lady is Struggling

[CBD BudMan]

Looking much improved...

very much.

I'd wash it off before spraying with anything else. The Dr B's would probably help there to emulsify the residue which you can then rinse off with a hose...at sunset.

It's been 2 weeks since I sprayed anything other than Dr B's. I don't see any residue on my Wild Lady or any of the others. But you're right, I probabaly should. Thank you.
I Love My Girls...

 

[CBD BudMan]

My thoughts on how we got here:

Today, as I measured how high my plants are getting (2 inches in 2 days!), I saw a patern that was eirilly similar to my grow in '21. My Cream & Cheese CBD girl had the very same symptoms as my current Wild Lady. Back in '21, all my plants went into premature bloom during springtime. This was because of my improper use of artifical lighting before setting them outside. To remedy this, I used urea to boost the N, thereby kicking them back into veg. But the N also spured fast growth; growth that was too fast to be strong enough to hold up during the summer heat.

This season I have much the same thing going on, but for different a reason: Instead of reveging with N like in '21, I added my normal amount of bloodmeal to my soil, not knowing just how little N my Wild Lady really needed. So now she is growing very fast, sometimes and inch a day now, and is having trouble dealing with heat, even though her genetics favor a hot environment. I believe this is due to the bloodmeal in my custom mix of soil I'm using for all my plants this season. Keep in mind, only the Wild Lady is showing symptoms of heatstress, all others have no such difficulties, even with the very same ingreadients, measured exactly the same in all the soil used for them.

To prove my theory, I'm now adding MonoSilicic acid to each watering for the Wild Lady. This will help to stiffen up the cell structure of the plant and also help her better deal with heatstress. Of course, the real proof will be next year's grow without the bloodmeal, then seeing whether she still needs the MonoSilicic Acid or not.

Anyway, those are my thoughts on the matter, at least for now.
I Love My Girls..

 

[Bill284]

My thoughts on how we got here:

Today, as I measured how high my plants are getting (2 inches in 2 days!), I saw a patern that was eirilly similar to my grow in '21. My Cream & Cheese CBD girl had the very same symptoms as my current Wild Lady. Back in '21, all my plants went into premature bloom during springtime. This was because of my improper use of artifical lighting before setting them outside. To remedy this, I used urea to boost the N, thereby kicking them back into veg. But the N also spured fast growth; growth that was too fast to be strong enough to hold up during the summer heat.

This season I have much the same thing going on, but for different a reason: Instead of reveging with N like in '21, I added my normal amount of bloodmeal to my soil, not knowing just how little N my Wild Lady really needed. So now she is growing very fast, sometimes and inch a day now, and is having trouble dealing with heat, even though her genetics favor a hot environment. I believe this is due to the bloodmeal in my custom mix of soil I'm using for all my plants this season. Keep in mind, only the Wild Lady is showing symptoms of heatstress, all others have no such difficulties, even with the very same ingreadients, measured exactly the same in all the soil used for them.

To prove my theory, I'm now adding MonoSilicic acid to each watering for the Wild Lady. This will help to stiffen up the cell structure of the plant and also help her better deal with heatstress. Of course, the real proof will be next year's grow without the bloodmeal, then seeing whether she still needs the MonoSilicic Acid or not.

Anyway, those are my thoughts on the matter, at least for now.
I Love My Girls..

300 ppm of potassium silicate in plain water once a week is what I use in the greenhouse.

Works for me in coco.
Hope your doing well today my friend.


Stay safe
Bill284

 

[CBD BudMan]

My thoughts on how we got here:

Today, as I measured how high my plants are getting (2 inches in 2 days!), I saw a patern that was eirilly similar to my grow in '21. My Cream & Cheese CBD girl had the very same symptoms as my current Wild Lady. Back in '21, all my plants went into premature bloom during springtime. This was because of my improper use of artifical lighting before setting them outside. To remedy this, I used urea to boost the N, thereby kicking them back into veg. But the N also spured fast growth; growth that was too fast to be strong enough to hold up during the summer heat.

This season I have much the same thing going on, but for different a reason: Instead of reveging with N like in '21, I added my normal amount of bloodmeal to my soil, not knowing just how little N my Wild Lady really needed. So now she is growing very fast, sometimes and inch a day now, and is having trouble dealing with heat, even though her genetics favor a hot environment. I believe this is due to the bloodmeal in my custom mix of soil I'm using for all my plants this season. Keep in mind, only the Wild Lady is showing symptoms of heatstress, all others have no such difficulties, even with the very same ingreadients, measured exactly the same in all the soil used for them.

To prove my theory, I'm now adding MonoSilicic acid to each watering for the Wild Lady. This will help to stiffen up the cell structure of the plant and also help her better deal with heatstress. Of course, the real proof will be next year's grow without the bloodmeal, then seeing whether she still needs the MonoSilicic Acid or not.

Anyway, those are my thoughts on the matter, at least for now.
I Love My Girls..

LOL... I realize I'm "replying to myself" here... My reason for doing so is to ask:
Does A-N-Y-O-N-E have any feedback on the above quoted post I made here? Basically, I'm asking if my thoughts on the matter hold muster. Does anyone have info relating to this kind of senerio? Does my theory of too much N weakening the plant and thereby causing symptoms of heat stress, hold water? Pardon the pun.

Any help would be appreciated...
I Love My Girls...

 

[InTheShed]

I've got nothing other than I'd be willing to lay money on the fact that boosting nitrogen doesn't send plants back into veg. Anyway, if they start flowering when you put them outside they'll reveg on their own once they realize the days are still getting longer.

 

[CBD BudMan]

I've got nothing other than I'd be willing to lay money on the fact that boosting nitrogen doesn't send plants back into veg. Anyway, if they start flowering when you put them outside they'll reveg on their own once they realize the days are still getting longer.

Thank you Shed. I see now that I should've clarified myself more. So, my request for more input is all around whether a plant that's experiencing high growth rates due to excessive N makes the plant structurely weaker and more prone to showing heatstress symptoms, like my Wild Lady has done recently. To me, this seems to be the case, b/c when I use MSA, the plant seems to do better. But I fully realize that there are lot's of growers here with far more knowledge than I, and I'd much rather learn from people that been where I am, rather than me continuing to bumble along.

So, what are your thoughts on this? Now that I've narrowed it down a bit. And this question is still open to all who are interested in responding. Thank you...
I Love My Girls...

 

[InTheShed]

Thank you Shed. I see now that I should've clarified myself more. So, my request for more input is all around whether a plant that's experiencing high growth rates due to excessive N makes the plant structurely weaker and more prone to showing heatstress symptoms, like my Wild Lady has done recently. To me, this seems to be the case, b/c when I use MSA, the plant seems to do better. But I fully realize that there are lot's of growers here with far more knowledge than I, and I'd much rather learn from people that been where I am, rather than me continuing to bumble along.

So, what are your thoughts on this? Now that I've narrowed it down a bit. And this question is still open to all who are interested in responding. Thank you...
I Love My Girls...

High ppm of N will create classic N tox signs like overly dark green leaves, tip clawing, and some folks believe an increase in the number of fans if it's applied in flower. It will also create deficiencies in other nutrients (potassium in particular) due to lockout.

It's traditionally thought that excess phosphorus will cause plants to stretch rather than N. You can read about that here:

What Really Causes Stretch? - Greenhouse Product News

Does ammoniacal nitrogen cause stretch in plants, or conversely, does the alternative nitrogen source, nitrate, cause compactness? What does your experience indicate? Do you have all of the facts? Because the application of high-nitrate fertilizers oftenresults in compact plants, growers’...

gpnmag.com

"the differences in plant growth were a consequence of the amount of phosphorus supplied to the plants"

and here:
https://www.420magazine.com/communi...lculate-nutrient-mixtures.490112/post-5090803
"Too much P will lead to excessive internode elongation and tall plants."

That said, silica is a good addition to the soil or feed!

 

[CBD BudMan]

High ppm of N will create classic N tox signs like overly dark green leaves, tip clawing, and some folks believe an increase in the number of fans if it's applied in flower. It will also create deficiencies in other nutrients (potassium in particular) due to lockout.

It's traditionally thought that excess phosphorus will cause plants to stretch rather than N. You can read about that here:

What Really Causes Stretch? - Greenhouse Product News

Does ammoniacal nitrogen cause stretch in plants, or conversely, does the alternative nitrogen source, nitrate, cause compactness? What does your experience indicate? Do you have all of the facts? Because the application of high-nitrate fertilizers oftenresults in compact plants, growers’...

gpnmag.com

"the differences in plant growth were a consequence of the amount of phosphorus supplied to the plants"

and here:
https://www.420magazine.com/communi...lculate-nutrient-mixtures.490112/post-5090803
"Too much P will lead to excessive internode elongation and tall plants."

That said, silica is a good addition to the soil or feed!

Thank you Shed for sharing rather interesting points of information. These sources make facinating reads for sure as I'm always eager to learn new things. However, the intent of my question is not: what's causing stretch, overly dark green leaves, tip clawing or high growth rates, but rather: the appearant symptoms of heatstress being addressed by silica/silicon. Because of the fact that the strains in my garden are well suited for hot climates, I attempted to offer an explaination as to why the observed symptoms of heatsress were being manifested, even in temps of upper 70ºf, as a background for my question, not the crux of my inquiry.

So, we can have all the discussions we want on what causes all this hyper growth, but doing so doesn't seem to directly answer my principle questions: Does hyper-growth cause plants to become stucturely weaker, regardless of whether it's caused by N, P, or space alliens... and if so, is the addition of silica/silicon a logical way to resolve this? Put another way: What is causing the positve results of addministering MSA in my particular situation? Is it that MSA helps to stiffen up or otherwise strengthen the structure of a plant that is weak due to rapid gorwth?

Please don't misunderstand me here, I'd love to know just how I got here in the 1st place. And I do infact welcome a duscussion on this very subject. But, in this moment, I'm focussing on whether my theory of "growth that's too fast can weaken plants, thereby causing symptoms of heatstress... and details on exactly how silica/silicon (MSA) remedies this, if in fact it does, and if my understanding is correct or in error (i.e. weaker growth made stronger by adding silica/silicon).
I Love My Girls...

 

[InTheShed]

my request for more input is all around whether a plant that's experiencing high growth rates due to excessive N makes the plant structurely weaker and more prone to showing heatstress symptoms,

whether my theory of "growth that's too fast can weaken plants, thereby causing symptoms of heatstress... and details on exactly how silica/silicon (MSA) remedies this, if in fact it does, and if my understanding is correct or in error (i.e. weaker growth made stronger by adding silica/silicon).

Your question has many moving parts, including your original assumption that excessive N causes high growth rates, whether high growth rates cause weaker plants, and if silica helps with the weaker plants that may or may not be weaker as a result of high growth rates.

That's a lot of variables and very hypothetical, but since you're out to prove that what you are finding is helpful, then that's really all the proof you need! If you're looking for actual scientific proof, that's probably a series of Google searches.

 

[CBD BudMan]

If you're looking for actual scientific proof, that's probably a series of Google searches.

Thank you and I have already done this. I was just hoping for something from our community.
I Love My Girls...

 

[CBD BudMan]

I Found this:

"Plants can be directly injured by the presence of excess nitrogen. Excess nitrogen can cause plants to grow excessively and develop overly succulent leaves and shoots, which promotes outbreaks of certain sucking insects and mites." Emphasis is mine.

Here's the source.

The above is certainly inline with my experiences in my garden. For many seasons now, I've been experiencing some form of this to one degree or another. I will be far more careful with the amount of N in my future grows.
I Love My Girls...

 

[favelikesdeels]

I Found this:

"Plants can be directly injured by the presence of excess nitrogen. Excess nitrogen can cause plants to grow excessively and develop overly succulent leaves and shoots, which promotes outbreaks of certain sucking insects and mites." Emphasis is mine.

Here's the source.

The above is certainly inline with my experiences in my garden. For many seasons now, I've been experiencing some form of this to one degree or another. I will be far more careful with the amount of N in my future grows.
I Love My Girls...

Hi,

I'm new here and probably a few months too late. I saw your post saying the leaves are curling up too. I've had similar issues a long time ago. For me it was because I was using bone meal, manure and garden waist that had not rotted down properly. I'm my experience the soil needs to settle for months before using it. If you are adding things that rot down before the plants can use it, the risk is the rot also gets to your plants, it did to my ones and I had similar symptoms. This is also why I stopped using fresh horse manure. I could be totally wrong, but I seem to remember Tom Hill or someone like that talking about preparing the soil months in advance of planting for this reason.

Hope this helps.

 

[Bill284]

Hi,

I'm new here and probably a few months too late. I saw your post saying the leaves are curling up too. I've had similar issues a long time ago. For me it was because I was using bone meal, manure and garden waist that had not rotted down properly. I'm my experience the soil needs to settle for months before using it. If you are adding things that rot down before the plants can use it, the risk is the rot also gets to your plants, it did to my ones and I had similar symptoms. This is also why I stopped using fresh horse manure. I could be totally wrong, but I seem to remember Tom Hill or someone like that talking about preparing the soil months in advance of planting for this reason.

Hope this helps.

Thanks for the tip @favelikesdeels
Hope your garden is doing well.
If you want to say Hi and meet everyone here is a link.

Introduce Yourself

Your opportunity to tell the 420 community a little about yourself and your interest in cannabis with a brief introduction

www.420magazine.com

Looking forward to chatting sometime.



Stay safe
Bill284

 

[favelikesdeels]

Thanks for the tip @favelikesdeels
Hope your garden is doing well.
If you want to say Hi and meet everyone here is a link.

Introduce Yourself

Your opportunity to tell the 420 community a little about yourself and your interest in cannabis with a brief introduction

www.420magazine.com

Looking forward to chatting sometime.



Stay safe
Bill284

Thank you Bill, I'll do that soon.